200 replies to this topic

[ComeAndSee]

teamoldmill, on Apr 09 2012 - 15:32, said:

Once you learn to play heavies and mediums, you won't have complaints at all. They do everything better than TDs.

Eh, Mediums play much differently and they get screwed over if they can't use your mobility. It's very hard to take down an equal tier heavy tank unless you gang up on them with another medium.

[Jovialmadness]

Jadgtiger.  Death to every other tank it's same tier and class.  I love me some jadgtiger.

[mp31b30q9]

drewivy, on Apr 09 2012 - 15:28, said:

when you have learned to play tds you will not have these kind of complaints

Says the guy with the following stats for the following TDs in the Tiers addressed by OP:

Stug III 128/66 wins
Hetzer 91/37 wins
M36 Slugger 55/26 wins
M10 Wolverine 21/8 wins
Su-85 11/4 wins

[Steeltrap]

If you're interested in a discussion of TDs and their strengths, weaknesses and how well balanced they are, try THIS thread.

Cheers

[ComeAndSee]

IMHO invest into Sixth Sense. It helps you so much as a TD!!

[KozmicBlues]

Interesting, My stats are also better in td's, Ferd, j-panther, than heavies. I'm not a better player. So how
are players stats better in an inferior platform that clans completely over look when it comes to competitive
matches.  

And one thing, Td's came about because of money, supplies and manufacturing,  not to be the end all of destroying tanks. it was
cheaper and easier to build a td vs a tank per unit. They could be used to support infantry , freeing up tanks.
There really were no historical advantages of td's. td's mounted larger weapons  because it was easier to design and
with the technology of the day, easier to produce. Even the likes of say the J-tiger, easier to build. large weapon, heavily
armored box, throw it on a chassis already in or near production.

[teamoldmill]

ComeAndSee, on Apr 09 2012 - 15:39, said:

Eh, Mediums play much differently and they get screwed over if they can't use your mobility. It's very hard to take down an equal tier heavy tank unless you gang up on them with another medium.

Not really, just sit back, let someone else fight while you snipe. E-50 has .29 accuracy. Patton has more DPM and view range than an Object or a T95.

That is the argument people make about TDs. Let everyone else do the work, sit back and snipe. Any tank can do that. Now with the 110, the French tanks, the S-70, is there any reason not to snipe? When you are done sniping, you can go and wreck face.

This is the entire point I am trying to make. TDs don't do well because they are snipers, they do decent because they only snipe. You would probably do better in any tank if you just sniped. TDs let other tanks engage, take damage, spot, while they plink away with guns that are a hair better than other vehicles. To then say your Jagdtiger can kill an IS-7 head to head if simply false. You can kill an IS-7 if it is kept at extreme range, you are out of his view, and you have enough time to get some lucky shots in. That is a two to one situation, and any tank has an advantage with that.

How is that IS-7 going to treat you if another tank is engaging you? Three shot you, boom.

[teamoldmill]

Would be cool if avg experience was displayed on the web profile so you don't have to look people up. The exceptional TD players (and there are some) almost always are great at all tanks, and have higher avg exp in their heavies and mediums. It is extremely rare to find someone who does great in a TD, but poor in heavies or mediums.

I am a pretty good TD player. Yet I still do better in other tanks. It is just easier to do well in other vehicles. You have more options.

Would love to see a global breakdown of avg exp per vehicle.

[VladimirsRevenge]

My Su 152 is dead. I used to be a pretty dangerous man. Now, all my shells bounce, when I hit I do very little if any damage, and even when I win I lose money. Oh well. It was fun while it lasted.

[teamoldmill]

KozmicBlues, on Apr 09 2012 - 16:18, said:

Interesting, My stats are also better in td's, Ferd, j-panther, than heavies. I'm not a better player. So how
are players stats better in an inferior platform that clans completely over look when it comes to competitive
matches.  

And one thing, Td's came about because of money, supplies and manufacturing,  not to be the end all of destroying tanks. it was
cheaper and easier to build a td vs a tank per unit. They could be used to support infantry , freeing up tanks.
There really were no historical advantages of td's. td's mounted larger weapons  because it was easier to design and
with the technology of the day, easier to produce. Even the likes of say the J-tiger, easier to build. large weapon, heavily
armored box, throw it on a chassis already in or near production.

Ferdi, Jagdpanther are great vehicles. Ferdi is one of my best. Things change at T9, and most people still do better even at T7 and T8 with heavies and mediums. There are anomalies. Personally I think most of the tiers are fine. There just is such gun creep at higher tiers that it renders TDs not particularly good at what they are supposed to do, and completely unable to take over other tank's roles.

My feeling on the lower tiers is what a TD should be. Boy you can wreck some tanks pretty quick, but you get wrecked pretty quick. Camo values are much better in lower tiers (Ferdi exception) so you can ambush. At T9, you can wreck people slowly over time, but they can wreck you quickly. You stop having that fear factor and start becoming an annoying itch. Even with every shot penetrating, it will take you 30 seconds to almost a minute to kill any high tier vehicle with a T9 TD. If you are seen you die within seconds.

[Nasdaq]

I think the marder needs a boost. it's very difficult to kill people with it and its armor is paper thin. It should have a boost of HP as well.

[Xtreme1234]

I love my T28 Tank Destroyer. I loved my T-25 AT. The Hetzer is my favorite Tier 4 tank. I did not like the JagdpzIV back in Beta, and I haven't really focused on my SU-100 since I'm working for my T95.

I use my T28 in a very unorthodox way: a battering ram. I do not sit back and snipe with it, I push forward with it and am very aggresive. It only goes 18 k/m if I'm lucky, so I have plenty of my team mates around to support my sides usually. Sometimes I'll be stupid and push by myself, which usually results in me dying.

The jist of this post is this: I would not trade my T29 for a T32, IS-3, Tiger II, or any other Tier 8. I love my T28s slow and sexy arse. So I see no problem with it.

[Unholy_dude]

Oh really

[Herr_Klug]

Nasdaq, on Apr 09 2012 - 17:34, said:

I think the marder needs a boost. it's very difficult to kill people with it and its armor is paper thin. It should have a boost of HP as well.

Nothing wrong with the Marder. The armor was designed to protect the crew from small arms fire, not tanks, therefore it's thin by design.

[dvang]

eolsunder, on Apr 09 2012 - 08:33, said:

Well they aren't handicapped much. Sure having no turret makes them a bit harder, but they get their TD camo bonus which makes up for it. As it says, TD are suppose to be ambushers, not front line bruisers.

Now, this is bad for people like me with basic graphic cards, which makes aiming through trees/bushes a lagfest, making playing a TD impossible to be played for what it is meant to be used for, but those with great graphic cards can use TD excellent. So, they aren't handicapped too much in my opinion. They are meant to attack from ambush which they do very well if you have the cards to do it. Me, i can't shoot through 1 bush much less multiple ones. They have good guns, strong front armor and hide very well. They are weak vs arti and side/flank shots, but what isn't.

To make the most advantage, you need a good graphic card, high camo bonus and vision to see what your shooting at. Thats your TD in an nutshell. I enjoy my TD's often more than my tanks because my TD's are usually faster, have better guns. My current TD is faster than my topped off Chaffee. Sad i know. Of course it has 200 less hps, but still, faster than a high end light tank? Plus its low outline and slight camo bonus really seem to pay off in many places. If only i could actually use it for shooting through bushes/trees like its made to do.

Err camo bonus on TDs is mostly a joke.  Since they get matched higher, generally higher tier tanks have enough increased view range that they offset whatever camo bonus the TD gets. In addition, TDs generally have pretty crappy view range themselves.  Thus, while they potentially can stay hidden, they cannot usually see the enemy (in order to shoot) until the enemy gets close enough to be seen themselves.

Really, TDs need a boost to both camo and view range so they can actually become "ambushers".

That said, I personally do well with most TDs, with my ISU as my best and most enjoyable tank to play.

[Blizzard36]

Nasdaq, on Apr 09 2012 - 17:34, said:

I think the marder needs a boost. it's very difficult to kill people with it and its armor is paper thin. It should have a boost of HP as well.

lolwhut?

Marder II is an absolute beast once fully upgraded and crewed. It has one of the best guns in its tier spread (high pen, accuracy, damage, AND RoF!) as well as being near the top in spotting range period. Add on some Binocs and camo net, set up in a well positioned bush, and you can kill 1/3 of the enemy team before they even illuminate you. Yes, it dies quick once spotted, but that's why the whole idea is to kill them before they get that close. And it can do it in the matches it gets. German TD's don't get that good again until the fully upgraded Ferdi, though the JPanther can come close in a tier 7 tops match.

EDIT: *Checks stats* Ah, good one dude, got me.

[Look_its_Rain]

They just need to upgrade the guns and hp on the tds then it would be better balanced.

Low tier German tds besides the marder are underpowered.

[fsjd]

you get in front of an SU/ISU 152, you are for a world of pain with that BL10 monster. monster damage, average/low armor all across the board.
T95 bounces nearly everything from the front. american TDs are a mixed bag.
JT (and the rest of german line) snipes you and you get the invisitank rages. decent, sloped armor. Hetzer is exception- derps.
only TDs i would say need work is the jpz4- its top gun underperforms against its targets, and the stock SU76- always on bottom of MM, only 160 HP, and 25mm armor. in short, a 1-2 shot for nearly everything is sees. fast and agile though.

[teamoldmill]

fsjd, on Apr 09 2012 - 22:30, said:

you get in front of an SU/ISU 152, you are for a world of pain with that BL10 monster. monster damage, average/low armor all across the board.
T95 bounces nearly everything from the front. american TDs are a mixed bag.
JT (and the rest of german line) snipes you and you get the invisitank rages. decent, sloped armor. Hetzer is exception- derps.
only TDs i would say need work is the jpz4- its top gun underperforms against its targets, and the stock SU76- always on bottom of MM, only 160 HP, and 25mm armor. in short, a 1-2 shot for nearly everything is sees. fast and agile though.

Invisitank? German? Snipe? Slopes?

I hope you are kidding by including those in the same post about German TDs.

[fsjd]

teamoldmill, on Apr 09 2012 - 22:35, said:

Invisitank? German? Snipe? Slopes?

I hope you are kidding by including those in the same post about TDs.

german line, excluding hetzer, are 3-400m snipers. and the armors sloped pretty well. look at the hetz. 60mm actual armor is more along the lines of 70-80 with that massive slope on it. TDs also have the highest camo rating in-game, aside from scouts.