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Please improve the Maus


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ramp4ge #21 Posted Sep 29 2010 - 23:58

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You'll always, always get one or two "hardcores" that say "Shut up and stop QQing and L2P!!!", no matter how shitty the tank is.

Oh, look at the sig..

Some of us forget that this is a beta, I think, and discussion of balance issues is not "QQing" and is not attributed to lack of gameplay knowledge..

It's the same in every game, really..But as was mentioned above, the fact that you see 10 IS-7s for every Maus is somewhat proof-positive..

The German Heavy line stops being viable after KT. There's just no point anymore.

slicker #22 Posted Sep 30 2010 - 02:42

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I wish i had a Maus instead my IS7 . Better armor, better looks , same gun . I manual aim at front Maus with IS7 i get DING ! I manual aim at the gun  DING !Auto aim , guess what DING ! I manual aim the 3rd time and finaly i get a shot in .I try to get behind him ? Oh wait a T6 is behind my back and shoting my cool IS7 with that awesome rear armor of 60 ! I have to waste a rotation and 14-28 seconds of reloading time to kill that pest ( depending on its hp) who cant even scrath a Maus but can hurt my uber ( lol) IS7 . The speed of 50 is pure garbage , my brothers IS3 can keep with me all the time and he is caped at 30ish . I never get pass 30 kph unless im roling downhill .

My point is : The grass is always greener :) IS4 is even better than the IS7 .

Ziltoid #23 Posted Sep 30 2010 - 03:24

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Quote

lol at telling Halfik to "try" the Maus.

Stop trolling and and dont say you enjoy your Maus you just played 10 times with it.

I think the main Problem is the Maus is ******* huge and slow. Its alot easier to "hit" the Maus then a IS7 or any other IS (vk4502 and KT are also bigger compared to the IS line). Make the Maus a little bit faster perhaps 25 km/h. If the Maus gets the other 75mm cannon the Maus and IS-7 are equal.

Gun 12,8cm KwK44 L/55 (Maus + VK4502)
4,58-4,62 (4,6)
246 Pen
470 DMG (102,17 dps)
2,5 Aiming time

Gun 130mm S-70 (IS-7/4)
4,44-5 (4,72)
260
490 DMG (103,81 dps)
3 Aiming time

The guns are equal but the Penetration should be changed the IS line is more sloped and dont need that much penetration (perhaps against an Jagdtiger). And splash dmg makes more fun than dps :)

EDIT:
@ Gabriel Because you are off topic and whats the point of this post? You dont have said anything thats worth to read, btw i like the vk4502. Why should i whine. A T10 can kill everything on the battlefield its not one on one, but it would be fair to have a equal chance to win thats all.

__SNIPER__74 #24 Posted Sep 30 2010 - 03:47

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View PostZiltoid, on Sep 30 2010 - 03:24, said:

Stop trolling and and dont say you enjoy your Maus you just played 10 times with it.


That's 10 more games then you have.
And I do enjoy it. I just prefer lower tier vehicles like Pz IV and KV, etc.

You mad?

Halfik has something like 300+ games, he likes it, why not quote him too?

You are pre-whining about the Maus because you think it's going to play just like the horrible VK4502. Understandable, but come back once you've actually used the real thing perhaps and not the gimped version with 100m side armor.

What I think is pretty funny is that people without a single round in the Maus are the ones complaining the hardest...

/continue whine

halfik #25 Posted Sep 30 2010 - 04:04

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View PostTigerTr, on Sep 29 2010 - 18:06, said:

yaya always underpowered tier users are not skilled. Are you come from NF??
I have both is4 and vk4502 and is4 is much better then vk... Because weapons and armor slope....
Even with manual aim directly to is4 or is7 hull you really have low change to give dmg...
This isnt about weapon this about slope @ armor... So maus or wk dont have this protection
@ total with powerfull gun and faster turret move speed is7 & is4 domine entire iter9-10 heavy tanks...

i agree that is4 is a way better tank than vk45.

but is7 is not better than maus. they are a different tanks but equal.

i dont agree that 128mm vk45 and maus are using, have problems with pen front armor of is4/7 - if u aim manualy and i know where to aim its like 95% to pen.

ps. MadGel0: i drived both tanks. did 600+ (300 before wipe, 300 after) battles using maus and maybe 40-50 using friend IS7.

Ziltoid #26 Posted Sep 30 2010 - 04:29

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View Posthalfik, on Sep 30 2010 - 04:04, said:

i dont agree that 128mm vk45 and maus are using, have problems with pen front armor of is4/7 - if u aim manualy and i know where to aim its like 95% to pen.

so please tell us where we have to aim.

Battledragon #27 Posted Sep 30 2010 - 05:06

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To be fair, the MAUS was a failure, it was far to slow and awkward, that is why the post war development of tanks followed the russian model not the German one.  I'm interested in the E100 when it arrives, this should be the answer, it's a lower, faster, more overall usefull super-heavy option I think.  Only thing I like about the MAUS is it looks like a Bolo!  ;)

sharpeh #28 Posted Sep 30 2010 - 05:13

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View PostBattledragon, on Sep 30 2010 - 05:06, said:

To be fair, the MAUS was a failure, it was far to slow and awkward, that is why the post war development of tanks followed the russian model not the German one.  I'm interested in the E100 when it arrives, this should be the answer, it's a lower, faster, more overall usefull super-heavy option I think.  Only thing I like about the MAUS is it looks like a Bolo!  ;)

They shoulda just put a jet engine in the MAUS. Remember the IS has 10 years of development on the MAUS. Development.

leopard1a #29 Posted Sep 30 2010 - 08:26

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View Postgabriel, on Sep 30 2010 - 03:47, said:

That's 10 more games then you have.


Where can you see this ?

bubbs #30 Posted Sep 30 2010 - 09:00

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Every time I've been involved in killing a Maus, my team has been swarming down on it for at least a two minutes. The ratio usually seems to be 2-3 tanks around it and a few others from afar, and maybe some arty. I'm always one of the tanks swarming in close quarters because if my shots don't penetrate I'm losing money. So I usually circle around it and put a few into its flat backside. Even then my 122mm BL9 shells pick off a maximum of 10-12% per hit. In about half of these instances I've been killed because the Maus chose to train its gun on me. At those points it doesn't matter which side of my armor is turned towards him, he always penetrates. This is all in an IS3 of course, dunno how my new IS4 will handle those hits.

Any other time I've met a Maus in one on one, I've died pretty fast. Although I play smart so that rarely happens. Also, as it's been said a few times here, Maus drivers generally suck and are often in some corner of the map chasing a Leo while the entire team is capping his base.

In one single instance I've killed a Maus in one on one with my IS3. He rushed past me near my base in Himmelsdorf, chasing a Wespe. He then had about 35% hp left and his back towards me. I spent five premium shells and came out with 40% hp, but I killed him.

These examples show that Maus is indeed a superior tank in one on one, so as long as drivers avoid getting gangbanged they are very powerful.

No need for a buff.

ramp4ge #31 Posted Sep 30 2010 - 09:06

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The IS-7 was a failure too. Only 3 were ever built. The Heavy Tank in general was a failure, with the IS/T-10 being the last heavy tank ever fielded. And it was just a small redesign of the IS-3, and is actually represented in this game by the IS-3 with the T-10 turret..

jondoe #32 Posted Sep 30 2010 - 10:44

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They need to to something with the VK4502 and the Maus, when the E-series will be out think this two tanks will be forgotten :Smile-hiding: . Im more concerned when I face an IS-7 then a Maus in my IS-4 :)

halfik #33 Posted Sep 30 2010 - 12:52

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View PostMadGel0, on Sep 30 2010 - 08:58, said:

so you are telling me maus is just as powerfull and usefull as IS7

I dont care if you like it or not, but maus is just nowhere near is7 in that regard

is4 is easy


but dont tell me you can reliable penitrate IS7 from medium range because thats a like

vurnable spots are so small, you need to be in its face

while even TIGER I can penitrate your mous from good range


oh and every artillery ****s just loves to shoot you


one o one - IS7 vs Maus - 100% vs 100% hp - i never lose with IS7.

I told they are a different types of tanks. Maus is rlly good in defence so if u have one in team, use it. Its hard to attack with maus couse his speed. But in defence maus with few other tanks support can stop enemy from caping base for a long time - depends who is supporting maus and how many tanks attacked bs.

I cant teach u how to play that tank. u have to feel it. If u feel that tank u will do a good game using it. If u dont - they u should buy urself IS4/7.

Dark_MadMax #34 Posted Sep 30 2010 - 16:18

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View Postramp4ge, on Sep 30 2010 - 09:06, said:

The IS-7 was a failure too. Only 3 were ever built. The Heavy Tank in general was a failure, with the IS/T-10 being the last heavy tank ever fielded. And it was just a small redesign of the IS-3, and is actually represented in this game by the IS-3 with the T-10 turret..

It was never a failure .IS7 was very advanced tank and many of improvements in it were later implemented in other tanks. It was canceled cause soviet war doctrine changed that no tank should be heavier than 35 ton, so all the heavy tanks were scrapped. Russian tank engineers were quite good, russian bureaucrats and politics  on the other hand  were always a detriment and a disaster for Russia.


p.s. Since halfik sold his IS7 any good maus drivers wanting to prove maus has the advantage 1vs1? I am the IS 7 driver with maus trap medal :)

CommissionerJan #35 Posted Sep 30 2010 - 17:06

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View Postramp4ge, on Sep 29 2010 - 19:28, said:

That Maus would be back if they'd roll back the armor nerf.
This.

Just this one thing and (most) balancing problems would be solved.


The Tiger/King Tiger might still need a speed buff, the Panther still needs increaseed turn and turret travers speed. . .but at least it would lift the Tier 9 and 10 German tanks from loltarget status to something that people in an IS-4 or 7 actually have to think about in order to win.

And in today's WoT, where everybody and his dog has at least a 100mm cannon (OK, except those German models that are stuck with the 8,8), penetrating the somewhat stronger armour wouldn't be a problem.

theta0123 #36 Posted Sep 30 2010 - 18:00

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View Postramp4ge, on Sep 29 2010 - 18:56, said:

Maus' biggest issues are it's lack of mobility and it's turret traverse speeds.

People can say "Maus is equal to IS-7!" all day long, but if an IS-7 got within range to circle the Maus, it's lights out.

Even at range, the IS-7 is at least equal. Maus has very well known holes in it's armor, and IS-7's 130mm is a vastly superior gun to Maus' 128mm. More damage, more penetration, faster reload, equal accuracy.

The IS-7 is just an all around better tank. Maus' biggest advantage is it's fear-factor. "OMG IT'S A MAUS!" But as more people realize how horrible it is, that's going to go away.

German heavy route's viability ends at KT.
Then again, the Maus was a prototype, while the IS7 was a tank with lessons learned from the IS, IS2, IS3 and IS4

Its like tiger tankers who say that the IS is better then tiger, yet they must understand that the IS has lower DPS no matter what, has less health, armor And was designed in 1943, while the tiger in 1941.

I think however, when they can get the coaxial 75mm to work, things will drasticly change.

alm80 #37 Posted Sep 30 2010 - 22:57

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Why does it matter how good real Maus was? We are talking about a game loosely based on some WWII tanks designs. Yes. Real Maus was an engineering disaster - it was so heavy, it could not go over bridges, it couldn't even move on every surface, getting stuck a lot. The Germans tried to make it cross rivers by moving on the river bed, but had to work on life support systems for the crew. Eventually the whole concept was scrapped. But that was history, in a GAME top German tank should be balanced against top Russian tank. You see dozens of IS-7's and Maus is a rarity - that means something. In many cases Maus is not a killing machine a T10 tank should be, but a convenient target for enemy heavies and arty of course.

sharpeh #38 Posted Sep 30 2010 - 23:10

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View Posttheta0123, on Sep 30 2010 - 18:00, said:

Its like tiger tankers who say that the IS is better then tiger, yet they must understand that the IS has lower DPS no matter what, has less health, armor And was designed in 1943, while the tiger in 1941.

So what if the IS has a slower DPS if the long 88's every 3rd round fails to hit (the short only pens maybe 1/3) and health and armor still don't matter when the IS cannon will tear up a tiger, the tiger can't pen the IS and the IS can out maneuver the tiger either way. Only thing the tiger has on the IS is range and that really doesn't matter much in this game especially with the tiger's module damage. I especially don't care if the IS came out 2 years after the tiger, balance > realism.

ramp4ge #39 Posted Oct 01 2010 - 08:03

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The IS-7 may have used lessons learned from the IS-3 and IS-4, but those lessons didn't mean much when the tank's history ended with 3 prototypes, and the next tank, the IS-10/T-10 being essentially a slightly stretched IS-3 with a new turret..So much for all those lessons..

Tiger's DPS advantage doesn't mean much with the rate that even the L/71 bounces on the IS. A bounced shot = 0 DPS (Unless it bugs and does damage anyway)..It doesn't matter if the tank was designed later. They're equal tier heavy tanks. They should be comparable.

Maus and IS-7 aren't even comparable. The IS-7 is so much more flexible, so vastly superior in all of the categories that actually matter, that it's just silly..

And what is adding the 75mm coax going to do? Give it a gun that bounces on everything bigger then a Panzer III? Lol.

Belrick #40 Posted Oct 01 2010 - 08:09

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I drive a IS-7. Along with most other players we all recognised it as a superior tank to the maus.

If they add the coax 75mm we might actually see the maus == is-7.




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