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Please improve the Maus


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Raketensegler #221 Posted Dec 29 2010 - 12:36

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The equivalent of the Russian 130mm S-70 is the 12,8/l55 not the 10,5/l68.

nemo82 #222 Posted Dec 29 2010 - 15:59

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just tested maus, maus vs under tier 8 works good, but normally maus fight vs tier 8+.... its slow, armor is pearced also in top by tier 9-10, turret is slow, gun its same of ausfb( in really maus have 150mm... ). The power of maus in teory is the armor, but vs tier 9-10 is vain.

Zoijar #223 Posted Dec 29 2010 - 16:19

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View PostRaketensegler, on Dec 29 2010 - 12:35, said:

The equivalent of the Russian 130mm S-70 is the 12,8/l55 not the 10,5/l68.
I said tier 9; i.e., the BC-9. The S-70 is tier 10.

kongman #224 Posted Dec 29 2010 - 16:31

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the main reason every1 thinks the maus sucks is no one uses it properly.............it should be the tip of an armour thrust........not camping or sniping

Mastoras #225 Posted Dec 29 2010 - 18:06

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Ya but the majority arent gonna do the angle tricks if they are spearheading the thrust, and it gets raped like that. Yes if played right, it can be a force to reckon with, but it still cant excuse some major flaws it does possess in its frontal armor at the moment.

Hyena #226 Posted Dec 29 2010 - 19:58

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View Postkongman, on Dec 29 2010 - 16:31, said:

the main reason every1 thinks the maus sucks is no one uses it properly.............it should be the tip of an armour thrust........not camping or sniping


No offense but I've seen a Maus try to be at the front of a rush. To date I've yet to see it actually work :P (with the exception of on Himmelsdorf once or twice, although I'd say that's more due to the enemy team's lack of communication). The Maus' armour, slow speed and lack of any real sloping mean that, typically, it will get utterly torn up before it's even halfway. Campinovka is a good example here, I've never once seen a Maus make it from one side of the map (at the start of the game) to the other, ever. It either gets destroyed by arty because it's so slow they can't miss or it just gets chewed up by tanks sniping it.

I'm sorry but the 'Not playing it right' card dosen't work here. Anything the Maus can do, the IS-7 can do better.

As for the Tiger Fibel angle tricks, they work to a point, but only if the enemy your facing is lower than tier 8 and a very inexperienced player. Even when the mudguards get fixed, the Maus has so many horribly obvious and easy to hit weakspots, at the end of the day it's just a very easy tank to kill. Again I'm not for a second saying that a Maus can't perform well, I'm just saying that an IS-7 will perform better. When inexperienced drivers come up against a Maus it looks like the most invincible tank ever created, when experienced players face it, however, they can dismantle it in no time.

Noccy #227 Posted Dec 29 2010 - 20:03

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View Postkongman, on Dec 29 2010 - 16:31, said:

the main reason every1 thinks the maus sucks is no one uses it properly.............it should be the tip of an armour thrust........not camping or sniping


I can tell you why noone uses it as a spearhead, it's because if you do that you'll die horribly 9 times out of 10 and lose 30-40k each game (heck even if you want to spearhead most of the time you can't due to it's speed anyway). The maus is so high it will be spotted early and every ISU,object,IS4-7 and SPG will focus fire on you and you'll be dead within seconds with hardly having fired a shot.
IS-7 is much much better at this role since it bounces more shots ,has speed and most important of all can stay hidden till almost on top of whatever it's driving towards. Only way to make money(or at least lose only 10-20k) in the maus is to hang back and play heavy support for the scouting mediums who speed ahead of you, and only then push ahead and face the fireworks. Preferrably with gold ammo loaded once you close in to stand a chance against your main adversaries ...if they loaded gold too you're almost certain to die once again.

Zoijar #228 Posted Dec 29 2010 - 20:28

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View PostWhiteHyena, on Dec 29 2010 - 19:58, said:

To date I've yet to see it actually work :P  Campinovka is a good example here, I've never once seen a Maus make it from one side of the map (at the start of the game) to the other, ever. It either gets destroyed by arty because it's so slow they can't miss or it just gets chewed up by tanks sniping it.
Then you haven't played with me :) That's my preferred tactic on campinovka. I go from map-edge side and almost always make it to the other side (i.e. taking cover behind the houses). The amount of damage varies. Sometimes I still have, say, 2000 HPs left; sometimes I'm at 900. It mostly depends on the artillery. The problem is that once you're there nobody does anything, and nobody has followed you... the times they do it's a big win though...

---

Anyway, let's no go into this whole "you have to know how to use the Maus" thing... it's getting old. I know how to use it well, I know its weak spots, I know how to turn my gun away, I know how to angle it. An IS-7 driver who doesn't know how to use his tank will also end up dead.

painless #229 Posted Dec 30 2010 - 08:29

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View PostZoijar, on Dec 29 2010 - 20:28, said:

Then you haven't played with me :) That's my preferred tactic on campinovka. I go from map-edge side and almost always make it to the other side (i.e. taking cover behind the houses). The amount of damage varies. Sometimes I still have, say, 2000 HPs left; sometimes I'm at 900. It mostly depends on the artillery. The problem is that once you're there nobody does anything, and nobody has followed you... the times they do it's a big win though...

---

Anyway, let's no go into this whole "you have to know how to use the Maus" thing... it's getting old. I know how to use it well, I know its weak spots, I know how to turn my gun away, I know how to angle it. An IS-7 driver who doesn't know how to use his tank will also end up dead.

mine campinovka tactics too, and i make it there, where i die, because no one follows me. but it 's worth those few times it works....

about "you have to learn to play it properly" argument it usually comes from either is7 drivers or (most of the time) from people that don't have maus or any other t10, but they "know" maus is ok, just all maus drivers suck big time.  :Smile_great:

i wait for mudguard fix , hope will not take too long.. ant then we hope mantlet area gets patched too...

sharpeh #230 Posted Dec 30 2010 - 09:16

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I feel like I'm playing navy field all over again. I pick the nation with the best armor (and in NV strongest guns) and love it, then they get nerfed and I don't wanna play no more :( I remember in NV I used to tank for the last dying ally and I'd be taking hits from both of them and still end up both living and winning. IMO the coax won't do much for the MAUS, I'll be jumping ship to E series if I even choose to stay german when the time comes. sad days :(

cardgame #231 Posted Dec 30 2010 - 09:22

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Maus really shines when properly supported, and with no enemy arty to sodomize it. Played an arty-free round in Karelia with it today, supporting in my KT and someone else helping in a T44 I think. We took out IS-7, IS-3, IS, Ausf B, some other tanks... ended with him at 64% and me dead from enemy sniper fire behind the main fray. This was on the east flank, the plateau.

painless #232 Posted Dec 30 2010 - 12:04

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Properly supported, or not, maus has huge front armor bugs (or holes, to be precise).
What gives me some hope is that for the first time, devs actually said they are going to fix portion of those holes(mudguards). Fixing mudguards could be the start of the long path that leads to fixed maus.  I will keep fingers and toes crossed for that! :Smile_honoring:

Working coaxial gun will mainly improve fun aspect of maus gameplay, being able to spam 75mm he everywhere,  i simply can't see l~40 coaxial 75mm doing any damage to heavies except maybe tracking them.

destruya #233 Posted Dec 30 2010 - 12:09

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View Postpainless, on Dec 30 2010 - 12:04, said:

Properly supported, or not, maus has huge front armor bugs (or holes, to be precise).
What gives me some hope is that for the first time, devs actually said they are going to fix portion of those holes(mudguards). Fixing mudguards could be the start of the long path that leads to fixed maus.  I will keep fingers and toes crossed for that! :Smile_honoring:
Funny how the general idea for the "fixed" Maus seems to be to make it a wholly impenetrable 360-degree-coverage brick of armor that can only be slowly whittled down 5-7% at a time with high-caliber HE or gold ammo fired from multiple barrels aimed at specific points, enabling any Maus driver to singlehandedly ruin a match for the other team by forcing them, even if they're competent enough to know to ignore him until necessary, to make him the primary target lest they find themselves undermanned and/or undergunned when it comes time to deal with him.

painless #234 Posted Dec 30 2010 - 12:53

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View Postdestruya, on Dec 30 2010 - 12:09, said:

Funny how the general idea for the "fixed" Maus seems to be to make it a wholly impenetrable 360-degree-coverage brick of armor that can only be slowly whittled down 5-7% at a time with high-caliber HE or gold ammo fired from multiple barrels aimed at specific points, enabling any Maus driver to singlehandedly ruin a match for the other team by forcing them, even if they're competent enough to know to ignore him until necessary, to make him the primary target lest they find themselves undermanned and/or undergunned when it comes time to deal with him.

How  you managed to draw that conclusion from my post i have no idea. I guess it's funny to troll around as you did here, and as you do on other german vehicles threads, but if you make an effort to read my post, or entire thread, really slowly, maybe you will manage to understand what i, and other people in this thread want is huge front armor holes fixed. Nothing more, nothing less. Gun mantlet+ armor behind it of total ~460mm thickness shouldn't be easy to penetrate.

Imagine 30-40% of your beloved is7 turret front penetrable by 88+ guns. You wouldn't be happily trolling around if that was possible, but reporting the bug and asking for solution, would you?  :blink:

destruya #235 Posted Dec 30 2010 - 13:19

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View Postpainless, on Dec 30 2010 - 12:53, said:

How  you managed to draw that conclusion from my post i have no idea. I guess it's funny to troll around as you did here, and as you do on other german vehicles threads, but if you make an effort to read my post, or entire thread, really slowly, maybe you will manage to understand what i, and other people in this thread want is huge front armor holes fixed. Nothing more, nothing less. Gun mantlet+ armor behind it of total ~460mm thickness shouldn't be easy to penetrate.

Imagine 30-40% of your beloved is7 turret front penetrable by 88+ guns. You wouldn't be happily trolling around if that was possible, but reporting the bug and asking for solution, would you?  :blink:
I actually die quite frequently in the IS-7 I hardly ever play, stats-diver, because I find it un-fun.  You'd have seen this if you'd looked closer at my owned/used list.  And I think the gun gets damaged and destroyed way too often, but don't complain about that.  I deal with it despite it being frustrating as hell and typically quite costly.  Whereas, it seems unless *your* specific Tier 10 Gottenwagen becomes, as I said before, a 360-degree-full-coverage armor brick, I guess it's because the devs favor Russian tanks over German and US because of some nationalistic expatriate zeal.

It's nothing new in any MMO for a group of "the privileged" to try and BS their way into an overpowered boomstick that'll make everyone without it envious and/or jealous of *your* shiny thing - you Google-dive to find statistics and schematics to prove your point, conveniently making this game accurate to "real life" standards when it benefits you, and the moment it doesn't (or god forbid, benefits someone else's shiny thing), you claim "it's only a game" and that *that* realism would hurt *your* fun.  You're not going to stop at the "mudflaps" - it's the Tiger whines all over again.  :P

Zoijar #236 Posted Dec 30 2010 - 13:35

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View Postcardgame, on Dec 30 2010 - 09:22, said:

Maus really shines when properly supported,
I never understood what that means: to support a Maus. I hear it all the time from my team, "Support the Maus!". I appreciate the effort, but I'm dumbstruck as to what they are supposed to do then. Position their weaker tanks in front of my mud guards, perhaps? A Maus doesn't need support; a Maus supports. Unless they mean things like, draw artillery fire away from the Maus, or spot targets for the Maus; those things I can appreciate. Other than that... I have no clue what it means.  ;) (You're actually better off "supporting" a JagdTiger as it is weaker and has a bigger gun)


View Postdestruya, on Dec 30 2010 - 13:19, said:

It's nothing new in any MMO for a group of "the privileged" to try and BS their way into an overpowered boomstick that'll make everyone without it envious and/or jealous of *your* shiny thing - you Google-dive to find statistics and schematics to prove your point, conveniently making this game accurate to "real life" standards when it benefits you, and the moment it doesn't (or god forbid, benefits someone else's shiny thing), you claim "it's only a game" and that *that* realism would hurt *your* fun.
You're talking about the IS-4 here, surely? :) Obvious troll is obvious hehe ;)

painless #237 Posted Dec 30 2010 - 13:48

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View Postdestruya, on Dec 30 2010 - 13:19, said:



It's nothing new in any MMO for a group of "the privileged" to try and BS their way into an overpowered boomstick that'll make everyone without it envious and/or jealous of *your* shiny thing - you Google-dive to find statistics and schematics to prove your point, conveniently making this game accurate to "real life" standards when it benefits you, and the moment it doesn't (or god forbid, benefits someone else's shiny thing), you claim "it's only a game" and that *that* realism would hurt *your* fun.  You're not going to stop at the "mudflaps" - it's the Tiger whines all over again.  :P

I try not to feed the trolls, but this part is so entertaining i had to react. Again, if you trolled less, and read with understanding more, you would have noticed that:

1) Devs, or at least dev that interacts with beta community, Overlord recognised there is indeed problem with maus being considerably worse then is7, part of that problem being mudguards bug, and decided to fix it. we still wait solution for paper mantlet area.

2)rl stat vs nerfing for gameplay is hardly aplicable in case of community complaining on maus bugs. I have seen that routine pulled off in explaining tiger 1/2  speed& mantlet nerf and is4 buff, but i dont see what it has to do with maus front armor bug.

3) you would have seen the image with weak zones on is7 front and bugged maus armor front size, and wouldn't write such quasi-argument in first part of your troll post

What i, and most of the people here want, is front armor without bugs. I can hardly see how that makes us "privileged", wanting "gottenwagen" or fit other names you treated me and others here in your name-calling trollfest. But, please, carry on. Name-calling and childish trollposts of yours will sure make us conclude it's ok to have t10 vehicle front armor 50% made of holes, and we will all go soviet line, and end-up in is7, trolling threads where people ask for bug fixes into oblivion..
So, just keep on trollin' and all of us won't believe in what we see, but what troll tells us. :Smile_great:

destruya #238 Posted Dec 30 2010 - 14:25

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Actually, it's not a troll post when a tank gets a nearly 500hp bonus, fixed "mudflaps," and still people claim it's not good enough.  Odd that whenever something gets buffed, especially in an MMO in beta, no one ever claims "hey, this might be *too* much."  The motivation there isn't to balance the game, it's to pad their K/D ratios.

And I've seen the images with the weak spots.  And they're invalid against long-range shots.  "Tightening" the Mauses' weak spots to the point where the only reliable damage point for tanks with less than a 200mm penetration gun will be the WoT equivalent of a Death Star exhaust port isn't the wisest course of action.  That's not troll logic, that's logic for the preservation of fun for everyone else, not "expend your entire ammo magazine to maybe take 15% health off a mobile bunker."

As it stands the only way a mid-tier tank even has a CHANCE of damaging a Maus is by pissing away dozens of HE shells at it, or using gold ammo, the latter of which will be unsustainable once the game hits retail.  *I'm* thinking in the long term, whereas most of the people I've seen in these threads seem to be thinking "I want to get my tanks buffed as best I can so I can pwn noobs CS-style because I'm *never* gonna pay real money for this game."

Zoijar #239 Posted Dec 30 2010 - 14:44

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View Postdestruya, on Dec 30 2010 - 14:25, said:

fixed "mudflaps,"
Weren't fixed. That's what this thread is about, among other things.

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Odd that whenever something gets buffed, especially in an MMO in beta, no one ever claims "hey, this might be *too* much."
Everybody said that about the IS-4's front armor buff.

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The motivation there isn't to balance the game, it's to pad their K/D ratios.
Maus statistically under-performs with a significantly lower win rate and lower average experience. Overlord posted these stats. Corresponding tier tanks of different nations ought to have roughly similar stats; that's balance, not this.

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"Tightening" the Mauses' weak spots to the point where the only reliable damage point for tanks with less than a 200mm penetration gun will be the WoT equivalent of a Death Star exhaust port isn't the wisest course of action.
And yet the IS-7 behaves in that fashion, but then it's suddenly alright.

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As it stands the only way a mid-tier tank even has a CHANCE of damaging a Maus is by pissing away dozens of HE shells at it
How's this different from the corresponding IS-7? Even though it's not true because, as we tested, the Tiger's 88 gun can get consistent penetration and damage with AP shells on the mud guards.

Your posts are just ironic.

destruya #240 Posted Dec 30 2010 - 14:49

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View PostZoijar, on Dec 30 2010 - 14:44, said:

Weren't fixed. That's what this thread is about, among other things.

Everybody said that about the IS-4's front armor buff.

Maus statistically under-performs with a significantly lower win rate and lower average experience. Overlord posted these stats. Corresponding tier tanks of different nations ought to have roughly similar stats; that's balance, not this.

And yet the IS-7 behaves in that fashion, but then it's suddenly alright.

Your posts are just ironic.
Odd you claim the IS-4/7 seem to be such unstoppable juggernauts when they seem to die with the same regularity as Mauses.

I can see this is like trying to get the choir to take up woodwind instruments - see you all again when the E-100 doesn't provide you with Top Gun and Steel Wall awards every round because "it would've been the best tank evar had it been built."   <_<




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