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Vk4502(P) Ausf B Vs Is-4


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ramp4ge #21 Posted Nov 02 2010 - 21:28

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In all honesty, I think they should:

Remove IS-7

Place Russian vehicles in the following tiers.

KV = Tier 5

KV-1S = Tier 6

KV-3 = Tier 7

IS = Tier 8

IS-3 = Tier 9

IS-4 = Tier 10

Stats line up a hell of a lot better this way.

So what you'd get at tier 9..

IS-3: Less health, less damage, a bit less penetration
Faster reload, much more mobile tank, better all around armor scheme because of slopes, better dogfighter.

vs

VK4502: Slower (much), less mobile (much), slower turret (much), worse all around armor.
Better gun (Which Germans are supposed to have anyway), more health.

Sounds fair to me...

Condemned #22 Posted Nov 04 2010 - 17:06

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View Postramp4ge, on Nov 02 2010 - 21:28, said:

In all honesty, I think they should:

Remove IS-7

Place Russian vehicles in the following tiers.

KV = Tier 5

KV-1S = Tier 6

KV-3 = Tier 7

IS = Tier 8

IS-3 = Tier 9

IS-4 = Tier 10

Stats line up a hell of a lot better this way.

So what you'd get at tier 9..

IS-3: Less health, less damage, a bit less penetration
Faster reload, much more mobile tank, better all around armor scheme because of slopes, better dogfighter.

vs

VK4502: Slower (much), less mobile (much), slower turret (much), worse all around armor.
Better gun (Which Germans are supposed to have anyway), more health.

Sounds fair to me...

I believe theories like these are counterproductive as they first of all would be impossible to implement, secondly you dont really want to withdraw content and thirdly its a bit uncalled for, yes there are imbalance issues atm regarding T9-T10, I am sure their are others as well but lets focus on the one at hand, the VK4502 then once it has been taken care of we can move onto other tanks.

(Also comparing the VK4502 to an IS-3 ingame I would have np taking out 2-3 of them depending on situation, after all I usually gets them on 2-3 shots)

Meatons #23 Posted Nov 08 2010 - 22:10

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View Posttanitha, on Nov 01 2010 - 23:11, said:

.....if nothing changes I'll swap to the IS's on release.
+1, Ive got a tiger 1 (350 games) and a tiger 2 (250 games), please someone shoot me for going up the wrong tree and failing that I need another softwipe so next time I go up the right tree.

MARMIST #24 Posted Nov 08 2010 - 22:25

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View PostMeatons, on Nov 08 2010 - 22:10, said:

View Posttanitha, on Nov 01 2010 - 23:11, said:

.....if nothing changes I'll swap to the IS's on release.
+1, Ive got a tiger 1 (350 games) and a tiger 2 (250 games), please someone shoot me for going up the wrong tree and failing that I need another softwipe so next time I go up the right tree.


OK that's it.  :angry:  When I get to 50 msg I post all these thread united right in the devs corner. Tanitha are you with me ?

Hyena #25 Posted Nov 08 2010 - 23:05

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The sad thing is that, unbalanced as some of the German/Russian tanks still are (like the ausf B vs IS-4, Maus vs IS-7 etc), things are only going to get much much worse with the addition of the American lines.

It'll sound very critical but I honestly don't know what the devs are thinking, releasing a brand new Nation while the two they have are still unbalanced. All it'll do is further dilute and complicate the problem. I wouldn't be surprised that if, once the American tanks are released, the devs ignore the German/Russian balance issues and move onto the American ones right away instead.

It's slightly off-topic but as someone mentioned I still can't believe that they did nerf the Maus' armour (and several other German tanks in the process), it's now the biggest waste of credits/xp in the game and is 100% out-classed in every field by the IS-7. Reaching the end of a line, you want to give your players something great, something they can be proud of (like the IS-7), not something that makes them feel as though they picked the wrong nation. >_>

MARMIST #26 Posted Nov 08 2010 - 23:23

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View PostWhiteHyena, on Nov 08 2010 - 23:05, said:

The sad thing is that, unbalanced as some of the German/Russian tanks still are (like the ausf B vs IS-4, Maus vs IS-7 etc), things are only going to get much much worse with the addition of the American lines.

It'll sound very critical but I honestly don't know what the devs are thinking, releasing a brand new Nation while the two they have are still unbalanced. All it'll do is further dilute and complicate the problem. I wouldn't be surprised that if, once the American tanks are released, the devs ignore the German/Russian balance issues and move onto the American ones right away instead.

It's slightly off-topic but as someone mentioned I still can't believe that they did nerf the Maus' armour (and several other German tanks in the process), it's now the biggest waste of credits/xp in the game and is 100% out-classed in every field by the IS-7. Reaching the end of a line, you want to give your players something great, something they can be proud of (like the IS-7), not something that makes them feel as though they picked the wrong nation. >_>

I want you too to post there when I do it. Remember.

n0z3k1ll3r #27 Posted Nov 09 2010 - 05:56

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Quote

IS = Tier 8

IS-3 = Tier 9
No. Just... no. The Kingtiger is already a bit better than the IS3, matching it up against the IS would just be cruel.

NeverGoFT #28 Posted Nov 09 2010 - 08:51

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The IS series bouncinium is getting annoying. They need a nerf to their armor and more module/crew damage, since it's so cramped.

MARMIST #29 Posted Nov 09 2010 - 09:18

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View Postn0z3k1ll3r, on Nov 09 2010 - 05:56, said:

Quote

IS = Tier 8

IS-3 = Tier 9
No. Just... no. The Kingtiger is already a bit better than the IS3,


Bad troll is bad 0/10

or read the forum before writing blasphemies  :Smile_great:

vs125r #30 Posted Nov 09 2010 - 10:50

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1 vs 1, in an open field, w/o arty support VK45 wins againts IS4, why? front armor capable of deflecting 130mm of the IS4. Also IS4 has lower HP and trying to flank it is a suicide, showing your weak side armor (VK just reverse and maintain facing its front armor). I found it hard to fight a VK 1-on-1, on open map that is.

NeverGoFT #31 Posted Nov 09 2010 - 10:53

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Can't the IS-3 track the VK and just keep it tracked and circling faster than the turret turns ?

Hyena #32 Posted Nov 09 2010 - 13:21

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View PostNeverGoFT, on Nov 09 2010 - 10:53, said:

Can't the IS-3 track the VK and just keep it tracked and circling faster than the turret turns ?

Wouldn't even have to do that. The IS tanks are so low profile that all they actually have to do is get alongside whoever they're fighting. They are low enough that typically the other tank will only then be able to aim at the turret.. and as we all know it's 99.9% impossible to penetrate an Is tank turret thanks to the insane sloped armour bonus.

PandaMarine #33 Posted Nov 09 2010 - 14:12

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n0z3k1ll3r,

Please let me know what you are smoking for I would like to try some, would like to find a fantasy world of my own. :mellow:

FootballFan #34 Posted Nov 09 2010 - 16:04

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Bought and played about 20 battles with vk4502, for now i have only 105 long and one engine upgrade. For me this tank is just an OUTRAGE. Its slow, we know that but why nobody writes about traverse speed ?!? How can it be slow slow ?!?

This tank is the most unballanced tank of all tiers. Developers use the word "ballance" all the time and what do they have to say about vk4502 ballancing ? NOTHING

Hornet331 #35 Posted Nov 09 2010 - 16:41

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View Postvs125r, on Nov 09 2010 - 10:50, said:

1 vs 1, in an open field, w/o arty support VK45 wins againts IS4, why? front armor capable of deflecting 130mm of the IS4. Also IS4 has lower HP and trying to flank it is a suicide, showing your weak side armor (VK just reverse and maintain facing its front armor). I found it hard to fight a VK 1-on-1, on open map that is.

Only if the Vk isn't set on fire... i was bored so i bought the Vk and till now 2/3 of my games i died from buring.

Condemned #36 Posted Nov 09 2010 - 16:48

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View PostFootballFan, on Nov 09 2010 - 16:04, said:

Bought and played about 20 battles with vk4502, for now i have only 105 long and one engine upgrade. For me this tank is just an OUTRAGE. Its slow, we know that but why nobody writes about traverse speed ?!? How can it be slow slow ?!?

This tank is the most unballanced tank of all tiers. Developers use the word "ballance" all the time and what do they have to say about vk4502 ballancing ? NOTHING

Once you get the upgraded engine speed becomes less of an issue.. but in the beginning with its stock gear, its crap beyond belief, slow to turn and ontop of that you get a piece of crap cannon (worse then the KTs). But after about 100-150 battles it gets decent, still at its best its vastly inferior to the IS-4 sadly.

View PostHornet331, on Nov 09 2010 - 16:41, said:

View Postvs125r, on Nov 09 2010 - 10:50, said:

1 vs 1, in an open field, w/o arty support VK45 wins againts IS4, why? front armor capable of deflecting 130mm of the IS4. Also IS4 has lower HP and trying to flank it is a suicide, showing your weak side armor (VK just reverse and maintain facing its front armor). I found it hard to fight a VK 1-on-1, on open map that is.

Only if the Vk isn't set on fire... i was bored so i bought the Vk and till now 2/3 of my games i died from buring.

Cant say Ive had much of an issue with fire, maybe one in ten battles.. perhaps. Then again I always try to stay at range and I know that hits to the top of the front/side hits often cause the engine to break.

Hornet331 #37 Posted Nov 09 2010 - 16:54

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View PostCondemned, on Nov 09 2010 - 16:48, said:


Cant say Ive had much of an issue with fire, maybe one in ten battles.. perhaps. Then again I always try to stay at range and I know that hits to the top of the front/side hits often cause the engine to break.

I know, thats why i try to keep front in direction of fire... but still HE hits form T5/6 tanks with HE at a angle of 10/20° are anough to set the tank on fire wich is beyoned retarted -_-

Good thing we get a diesel engien with the update...

MARMIST #38 Posted Nov 09 2010 - 16:58

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View Postvs125r, on Nov 09 2010 - 10:50, said:

1 vs 1, in an open field, w/o arty support VK45 wins againts IS4, why? front armor capable of deflecting 130mm of the IS4. Also IS4 has lower HP and trying to flank it is a suicide, showing your weak side armor (VK just reverse and maintain facing its front armor). I found it hard to fight a VK 1-on-1, on open map that is.

The IS.4 will track you. The IS.4 will then circle you while you ding on his armor. The iS.4 will then shoot in in the side and the back. The IS.4 will kill you.

GOOD JOB DEVELOPERS !  :Smile_great:Hail Bielorussia ! Russia is better !

View PostPandaMarine, on Nov 09 2010 - 14:12, said:

n0z3k1ll3r,

Please let me know what you are smoking for I would like to try some, would like to find a fantasy world of my own. :mellow:

I really roflted  :D:D:D:D

View PostFootballFan, on Nov 09 2010 - 16:04, said:

Bought and played about 20 battles with vk4502, for now i have only 105 long and one engine upgrade. For me this tank is just an OUTRAGE. Its slow, we know that but why nobody writes about traverse speed ?!? How can it be slow slow ?!?

This tank is the most unballanced tank of all tiers. Developers use the word "ballance" all the time and what do they have to say about vk4502 ballancing ? NOTHING

Wait to play the Maus. You'll be actually even SLOWER. And with the same gun.  :D:D   Please Pm OVERLORD, I already did it. It's awesome. We must FILL his mail box maybe he'll at least have to delete the messages. So at least we'll have his attention for a second. They say this is a beta. It's been more than 4 months now til the beta started. Still the vk4502 is a gigantic piece of  :Smile_great: .

No, they're trollin us. They can't say "It's a beta". FOUR MONTHS. !!!!!!

FootballFan #39 Posted Nov 09 2010 - 18:53

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It has been writen thousands of times maybe but maybe if we really spam the forum about it someone will wake UP and do something !

max traverse speed for vk 20deg for is4 27. Max speed vk 30km/h is4 35km/h. Superior acceleration for is4 than even new engine for vk WONT CHANGE. Better armor for is4, better turret traverse for is4. Only gun is comparable and turret traverse is worse too. You can write and write about this

I ask again this is BALLANCE ? Why cant we get a real answer ? We are betatesting, we write our impressions, concerns and dont see anyone doing anything about it

Hornet331 #40 Posted Nov 09 2010 - 19:06

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just give us better hull travers speed... if they want to give us crap side and rare armor at least let us have the ability to use the frontal armor... give us something in the range of 30...




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