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How view range and radio works


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@immanio #1 Posted Jul 15 2010 - 17:21

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Ok, here's a quick explanation I wrote. Hopefully it's somewhat understandable.

How radio communications in WoT work (or: How to "see" opponents outside your own visual range):

In World of Tanks, your vehicle has a limited view range at which it can spot other vehicles (friendly or enemy). This view range is affected by your turret, the other vehicle's profile, camouflage, whether it's moving or firing, etc. However, an important mechanism is the use of radio to send and receive information on the location of other vehicles, allowing for situational awareness beyond your own visual range.

As an example, you can be looking down a long street from your tank destroyer and not see any enemies. However, when a friendly tank moves down the street, it spots an enemy tank that was there all along. You will then see the tank just as if you spotted it yourself, as long as the friendly tank can see it, and is within radio range of you.

The game mechanics of radio communications:
All vehicles have a radio module. The primary characteristic of this module is its range. Two friendly vehicles can communicate if they are closer to each other than the sum of their respective radio ranges. Thus a tank with a 300m range radio and a tank with 500m range can communicate up to 800m away.

All communication is thus a 2-way relation between two vehicles: If you can communicate with a friendly vehicle, then you will know about any vehicles that he can see directly (including himself), and he will know about any vehicles you see directly. However, there is no chaining, or relaying of information - he can only tell you about any vehicles that he has spotted himself, not any that he knows about from radio communications with others.

In total, then, you will know the location of
1) Any vehicles within your visual range, friend or foe.
2) Any friendly vehicles within your radio range to them (for each vehicle this range is the sum of your respective radio ranges).
3) Any vehicles (friend or foe) within the visual range of the vehicles in 2), friend or foe.

An example figure to show how it works:
        

Attached Files



arkanjuca #2 Posted Jul 15 2010 - 20:42

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View PostImmanio, on Jul 15 2010 - 17:21, said:

Ok, here's a quick explanation I wrote. Hopefully it's somewhat understandable...

Cool, very nice explanation.

Now, how do we know about the ranges on the game? what are the sizes of each sector? 100m?

merig00 #3 Posted Jul 15 2010 - 21:09

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View Postarkanjuca, on Jul 15 2010 - 20:42, said:

Cool, very nice explanation.

Now, how do we know about the ranges on the game? what are the sizes of each sector? 100m?
View range - in the stats of your turret
Signal range - in the stats of your radio

ErwinRommel #4 Posted Jul 15 2010 - 21:15

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this game should have a limit to see the changes in the map = to the view range.(like destroyed buildings and etc.)

dotalchemy #5 Posted Jul 15 2010 - 22:10

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Quote

Thus a tank with a 300m range radio and a tank with 500m range can communicate up to 800m away.

Erm, that may indeed be how it works in the game, but surely that should be a bug?

The maximum range for communication should be equal to that of the lowest participant in the communication. For example...

If Bob has a radio with a range of 300m, and Mary has a radio with a range of 500m, they can both communicate with each other (bidirectionally) providing they're within 300m of each other (as radio ranges aren't cumulative in the real world)

If Bob see's a tank, then he can tell anyone within 300m of him where it is and what it is. If Mary sees a tank also, then she can tell anyone within 500m of her where it is and what it is. Realistically though, Bob having a 300m range and Mary having a 500m range shouldn't mean that they can talk 800m away. That would suggest that they both actually have 800m range.

@immanio #6 Posted Jul 15 2010 - 23:21

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Eww, you've got real world in my game. Honestly, just accept it, it's the way they've made it. And to be honest, it does make some sense. Better radio doesn't just mean better signal strength, it can also mean more sensitive antenna/better at low S/N-ratios.

Moskau50 #7 Posted Jul 16 2010 - 05:59

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View Postmerig00, on Jul 15 2010 - 21:09, said:

View range - in the stats of your turret
Signal range - in the stats of your radio
I think arkanjunca meant the size of the battlefields themselves
ex, how long is the edge of each sector on the map, how long is the battlefield in total, etc.

Diedel #8 Posted Jul 16 2010 - 07:03

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View PostMoskau50, on Jul 16 2010 - 05:59, said:

I think arkanjunca meant the size of the battlefields themselves
ex, how long is the edge of each sector on the map, how long is the battlefield in total, etc.


1000m x 1000m, so 100m x 100m for each sector

@barmaglot_ #9 Posted Jul 16 2010 - 07:25

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View PostDiedel, on Jul 16 2010 - 07:03, said:

1000m x 1000m, so 100m x 100m for each sector

Incorrect. Maps have different sizes. Karelia and Murovanka are largest at slightly bigger than 1km square (less than 1100m), while Ensk is smallest at about 600m. I can't find the thread right now, but someone was testing the range on different SPGs and incidentally calculated map size. You can test it yourself - take a low-level SPG such as SU-26 or SU-5, and in Himmelsdorf, you can shoot from base to base, while in Karelia you can hardly reach halfway across the map.

rolly #10 Posted Jul 16 2010 - 19:05

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View PostBarmaglot_, on Jul 16 2010 - 07:25, said:

Incorrect. Maps have different sizes. Karelia and Murovanka are largest at slightly bigger than 1km square (less than 1100m), while Ensk is smallest at about 600m. I can't find the thread right now, but someone was testing the range on different SPGs and incidentally calculated map size. You can test it yourself - take a low-level SPG such as SU-26 or SU-5, and in Himmelsdorf, you can shoot from base to base, while in Karelia you can hardly reach halfway across the map.


A question in regards to view range:

Do optics come into play as well as visibility when it comes to spotting?  German Tank optics was really developed, especially for their TD's, where as I believe early Russian tanks had next to nothing.  Alternately would say a Marder have a wider visibility over a StuG which is lower to the ground?  

Or does it simply not matter, every tank has the same spotting radius that is not affected by ground clutter?

@immanio #11 Posted Jul 16 2010 - 20:07

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Take a look at your turret, it will have a "View range" stat.

rolly #12 Posted Jul 17 2010 - 22:53

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View PostImmanio, on Jul 16 2010 - 20:07, said:

Take a look at your turret, it will have a "View range" stat.

Yes there is a view range, but that doesn't answer fully what I'm asking.  Tanks and TD's have different view arcs, its not circular.  A TD should have better view if its open topped.  Where as the Hetzer is just poor visibility.  On top of that, German tanks actually had optics.  TD's had focused bi-optic telescopes that were long range but very narrow.  Is this reflected in the game?

@immanio #13 Posted Jul 17 2010 - 23:21

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As far as I can tell (but this is solely based on my impression while playing, haven't done any tests), view range is 360 degrees. Should be easy enough to test in a training battle, just drive towards someone forwards and see when you spot them, then back up towards them and see if it makes a difference.

andyjdc1 #14 Posted Aug 03 2010 - 14:33

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Cheers for this it answered most of my questions :D

CareerKnight #15 Posted Aug 07 2010 - 02:20

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I had assumed that you could relay visuals between tanks in a chain, thanks for the clarification.

Twilightling #16 Posted Aug 10 2010 - 14:13

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View PostImmanio, on Jul 15 2010 - 23:21, said:

Eww, you've got real world in my game. Honestly, just accept it, it's the way they've made it. And to be honest, it does make some sense. Better radio doesn't just mean better signal strength, it can also mean more sensitive antenna/better at low S/N-ratios.

Does anyone actually tested those number so we can be sure which of the two modes is used in the game?
Real - the lesser range apply.
Unreal - the sum of both ranges apply.

@immanio #17 Posted Aug 10 2010 - 14:56

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It's the sum of both ranges that applies. Just read the original post, everything in it was confirmed by Overlord, the community manager. Whether you think this is realistic or not, well, that's up to you.

Twilightling #18 Posted Aug 10 2010 - 15:10

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View PostImmanio, on Aug 10 2010 - 14:56, said:

It's the sum of both ranges that applies. Just read the original post, everything in it was confirmed by Overlord, the community manager. Whether you think this is realistic or not, well, that's up to you.
I did not see a post by anyone official confirming this, hence my original question. Now thanks to your information I can see better the usefulness of upgraded radio:>

@ramla #19 Posted Aug 11 2010 - 11:46

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The radio doesn't work the same for minimap as it does for 3D target indicators. I see dots on the minimap that I cannot see in 3D HUD. Is there a chain of 1 for the minimap but not for 3D HUD? Or is this a graphics thing. I got graphics on low setting.

Overlord #20 Posted Aug 11 2010 - 15:59

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View Postramla, on Aug 11 2010 - 11:46, said:

The radio doesn't work the same for minimap as it does for 3D target indicators. I see dots on the minimap that I cannot see in 3D HUD. Is there a chain of 1 for the minimap but not for 3D HUD? Or is this a graphics thing. I got graphics on low setting.

You are quite right, usually you see more targets on the minimap than in "3D HUD", that's because of some technical restrictions of the game engine. Will be fixed in one of the upcoming patches.