How China Armed Up for War
Content_WG
Jan 20 2013
mrasianman2
Jan 20 2013
So in a nutshell, they got tanks from other countries, then moved on to building their own tanks.
PTwr
Jan 20 2013
I wonder, will WG one day embed a video in a way allowing to go into full screen without need to jump to YouTube? Ability to pick quality would be cool to. So yeah, please embed it in standard mode. :>
SULOMON
Jan 20 2013
I'm going to guess before watching the video, they got tanks from other countries then based their tank designs off the ones they got.
MotorizedPatriot
Jan 20 2013
A very interesting video, however I still want historical pictures or information on the T-34-1 and T-34-2...
Tank50us
Jan 20 2013
ok, quick review of the vid... the Chinese started interest late compared to other nations, but quickly modernized in the post WW2 period to keep pace with the development of Western Tanks.
But, being the military nut I am... I can point out one flaw in the vid... Chinese Tanks are not considered to be among the best tanks in the world. American, German, English, and Russian tanks are usually either at the top, or tying for the other spots, as pure Russian tanks (those in service with the Russian Army, not the watered down ones sold to Warsaw Pact Nations) are actually very capable vehicles, and have good survivability. The Chinese on the other hand, have had very little concern for the safety of the crew, and are only recently incorporating Reactive Armor to their tanks, and the guns that their tanks use are actually pretty weak compared to their nearest Russian counterparts.
The Chinese military industrial complex is actually not allowed to innovate very much, only developing what those in Beijing tell them to, and nothing else. While the Type-99, J-20, and J-35 are certainly impressive to look at (a modern MBT, and two stealth fighters), they are coming into an era where both might be at the end of the line, and the rest of the world pulls ahead in development once again.
But, being the military nut I am... I can point out one flaw in the vid... Chinese Tanks are not considered to be among the best tanks in the world. American, German, English, and Russian tanks are usually either at the top, or tying for the other spots, as pure Russian tanks (those in service with the Russian Army, not the watered down ones sold to Warsaw Pact Nations) are actually very capable vehicles, and have good survivability. The Chinese on the other hand, have had very little concern for the safety of the crew, and are only recently incorporating Reactive Armor to their tanks, and the guns that their tanks use are actually pretty weak compared to their nearest Russian counterparts.
The Chinese military industrial complex is actually not allowed to innovate very much, only developing what those in Beijing tell them to, and nothing else. While the Type-99, J-20, and J-35 are certainly impressive to look at (a modern MBT, and two stealth fighters), they are coming into an era where both might be at the end of the line, and the rest of the world pulls ahead in development once again.
Hirumaru
Jan 20 2013
Propaganda for the Chinese server?
Edit: Considering you never did this for any other nation. And the fact that you called Chinese armor "some of the best in the world".
Edited by Hirumaru, Jan 20 2013 - 18:51.
Edit: Considering you never did this for any other nation. And the fact that you called Chinese armor "some of the best in the world".
Edited by Hirumaru, Jan 20 2013 - 18:51.
Celebrim
Jan 20 2013
Thekebecer, on Jan 20 2013 - 18:19, said:
Is WG trying to justify the implantation of Chinese tech tree?
Yes. And it's generally designed to make the decision appear to be rationally motivated and the generally very high quality level of the tanks in the game at every tier be justified on the basis of the historical qualities of the tanks.
It is also however a peice of tripe. It's pure propaganda designed to be appealing to Chinese nationalists and to mitigate the concerns of players from other countries. China continuess to lag behind the other great powers in tank development to this day. China at no point in the entire WoT era had a true indigenous tank design. There development was always so slow, and the quality of their vehicles so bad, that before any of their tank projects came to frutation, it just became easier to either purchase directly from the Soviets newer tanks or else purchase a license to produce the Soviet tank and - with Soviet technical assistance - begin building the tank indigenously. This has actually been recently a source of a lot of friction between Russia and China, as China has begun lately straight out stealing designs from the Russians without paying them royalties. All of the recent Chinese fighters for example, are straight up stolen designs and the production of Chinese espinauge and reverse engineering plans bought from the Soviets.
What's worse, is that "Chinese Tanks are not considered to be among the best tanks in the world" is just laugh out loud funny. Chinese is in the midst of developing a modern tank, but its still not out yet and doesn't hold a candle to the Japanese and Korean designs that are either in production or in the final stages of testing before production. Even India has leapt ahead of China in that regard.
If you really want to get a sense of what Chineses tanks are really like, a really interesting study can be made of comparing the PT-76 - Russia's current Amphibious tank - to the Chinese derivative of the design the Type 63 (WZ221). That study could be an essay on its own, but really we can some it up with this one critical central observation - it's basically unarmored. The Chinese halved the mimimal armor of the PT-76. It's a floating/rolling coffin. It's a suicide tank, as it is operational history whereever it has been exported has fully demonstrated.
Mieter
Jan 20 2013
Hirumaru, on Jan 20 2013 - 18:46, said:
Propaganda for the Chinese server?
Edit: Considering you never did this for any other nation. And the fact that you called Chinese armor "some of the best in the world".
Edit: Considering you never did this for any other nation. And the fact that you called Chinese armor "some of the best in the world".
They actually did a video about british tanking history after they inserted their tree in the game.
elQuanto
Jan 20 2013
Lets face it, the Chinese market is huge, and they want to break into it by producing Chinese tanks for the game, I just wish they would simply say so rather than pretend that the PRC somehow has any ability to innovate.
At least the ROC(Taiwan) has actually been able to create their own indigenous (fighter) designs from scratch. Chaing Kai-Shek should have won the Civil War. The whole world would have been better off.
At least the ROC(Taiwan) has actually been able to create their own indigenous (fighter) designs from scratch. Chaing Kai-Shek should have won the Civil War. The whole world would have been better off.
Mieter
Jan 20 2013
elQuanto: +1 for the correct spelling of "would have". It's a rare thing to see these days.
Lafiel
Jan 20 2013
Celebrim, on Jan 20 2013 - 18:55, said:
Yes. And it's generally designed to make the decision appear to be rationally motivated and the generally very high quality level of the tanks in the game at every tier be justified on the basis of the historical qualities of the tanks.
It is also however a peice of tripe. It's pure propaganda designed to be appealing to Chinese nationalists and to mitigate the concerns of players from other countries. China continuess to lag behind the other great powers in tank development to this day. China at no point in the entire WoT era had a true indigenous tank design. There development was always so slow, and the quality of their vehicles so bad, that before any of their tank projects came to frutation, it just became easier to either purchase directly from the Soviets newer tanks or else purchase a license to produce the Soviet tank and - with Soviet technical assistance - begin building the tank indigenously. This has actually been recently a source of a lot of friction between Russia and China, as China has begun lately straight out stealing designs from the Russians without paying them royalties. All of the recent Chinese fighters for example, are straight up stolen designs and the production of Chinese espinauge and reverse engineering plans bought from the Soviets.
What's worse, is that "Chinese Tanks are not considered to be among the best tanks in the world" is just laugh out loud funny. Chinese is in the midst of developing a modern tank, but its still not out yet and doesn't hold a candle to the Japanese and Korean designs that are either in production or in the final stages of testing before production. Even India has leapt ahead of China in that regard.
If you really want to get a sense of what Chineses tanks are really like, a really interesting study can be made of comparing the PT-76 - Russia's current Amphibious tank - to the Chinese derivative of the design the Type 63 (WZ221). That study could be an essay on its own, but really we can some it up with this one critical central observation - it's basically unarmored. The Chinese halved the mimimal armor of the PT-76. It's a floating/rolling coffin. It's a suicide tank, as it is operational history whereever it has been exported has fully demonstrated.
It is also however a peice of tripe. It's pure propaganda designed to be appealing to Chinese nationalists and to mitigate the concerns of players from other countries. China continuess to lag behind the other great powers in tank development to this day. China at no point in the entire WoT era had a true indigenous tank design. There development was always so slow, and the quality of their vehicles so bad, that before any of their tank projects came to frutation, it just became easier to either purchase directly from the Soviets newer tanks or else purchase a license to produce the Soviet tank and - with Soviet technical assistance - begin building the tank indigenously. This has actually been recently a source of a lot of friction between Russia and China, as China has begun lately straight out stealing designs from the Russians without paying them royalties. All of the recent Chinese fighters for example, are straight up stolen designs and the production of Chinese espinauge and reverse engineering plans bought from the Soviets.
What's worse, is that "Chinese Tanks are not considered to be among the best tanks in the world" is just laugh out loud funny. Chinese is in the midst of developing a modern tank, but its still not out yet and doesn't hold a candle to the Japanese and Korean designs that are either in production or in the final stages of testing before production. Even India has leapt ahead of China in that regard.
If you really want to get a sense of what Chineses tanks are really like, a really interesting study can be made of comparing the PT-76 - Russia's current Amphibious tank - to the Chinese derivative of the design the Type 63 (WZ221). That study could be an essay on its own, but really we can some it up with this one critical central observation - it's basically unarmored. The Chinese halved the mimimal armor of the PT-76. It's a floating/rolling coffin. It's a suicide tank, as it is operational history whereever it has been exported has fully demonstrated.
Wow, you are the China expert here. The comments on Korean and India are just too funny to read. Korean tank design is based on M1. And please don't even mention India, remember the mighty "Arjun"?
Donald_Rumsfeld
Jan 20 2013
Great Video W.G. Although some here have pointed out a few flaws in accuracy its all good. After all people make mistakes and I dont think cyborgs have started running W.G. yet, or have they? 
Still a impressive video and well put together and very imformative, thanks W.G. Staff!
One thing though, if a Dev happens to read this or it gets passed along to the main website team. Could the Video section be cleaned up a bit. Put training videos in a section all by themselves. Then the rest in other catagories such as a ASAP section along with update release vid section, and so on. This would really help your players find information faster plus easier, but more so for the newer players.
Great work, keep it coming!
Edited by Donald_Rumsfeld, Jan 20 2013 - 19:24.
Still a impressive video and well put together and very imformative, thanks W.G. Staff!
One thing though, if a Dev happens to read this or it gets passed along to the main website team. Could the Video section be cleaned up a bit. Put training videos in a section all by themselves. Then the rest in other catagories such as a ASAP section along with update release vid section, and so on. This would really help your players find information faster plus easier, but more so for the newer players.
Great work, keep it coming!
Edited by Donald_Rumsfeld, Jan 20 2013 - 19:24.
nicodeimous
Jan 20 2013
Hirumaru, on Jan 20 2013 - 18:46, said:
Propaganda for the Chinese server?
Edit: Considering you never did this for any other nation. And the fact that you called Chinese armor "some of the best in the world".
Edit: Considering you never did this for any other nation. And the fact that you called Chinese armor "some of the best in the world".
Buttering up the money machine. They have never been some of the best in any but the Chinese's imagination. Most if not all of the vehicles have innovations [as with so many other technologies] copied from Western sources. Any hows off to play tanks
TheHammerMan
Jan 20 2013
elQuanto, on Jan 20 2013 - 19:04, said:
Lets face it, the Chinese market is huge, and they want to break into it by producing Chinese tanks for the game, I just wish they would simply say so rather than pretend that the PRC somehow has any ability to innovate.
At least the ROC(Taiwan) has actually been able to create their own indigenous (fighter) designs from scratch. Chaing Kai-Shek should have won the Civil War. The whole world would have been better off.
At least the ROC(Taiwan) has actually been able to create their own indigenous (fighter) designs from scratch. Chaing Kai-Shek should have won the Civil War. The whole world would have been better off.
1. LOL, this is complete garbage comment, first, they put this video on NA server, and everything is in english? for the CHINESE? makes no sense at all, not to mention most people here are either racist, or grow up on anti-china propaganda feed to them by western news, there is no point for WG even trying.
2. ROC (Taiwan) did not design their own fighter jet, U.S gave them the design, and building plant for the F16, and that's how they came up with their current indigious fight, it looks like a F-16 but was under-powered due to restriction on engine design.
On the other hand, China has 2 stelth fighter design, and by all accounts does not cost $160 million (navy version) $130 million (air force version) a pop like the U.S TURKEY F35.
3. When WG says they make one of the best tank in the world they are talking about the TYPE 99, it is by all account one of the most advanced MBT in the world, you are welcome to "READ" about it, it has all the advance feature of any U.S and EUROPEAN MBT, and some those tanks don't.
Maus123
Jan 20 2013
Hirumaru, on Jan 20 2013 - 18:46, said:
Chinese armor "some of the best in the world".
Considering the fact that most Chinese tanks are based off Russian tanks... RUSSIAN BIAS!!!!!!!
