Jump to content


Italian Tanks and Military Vehicles

italian tank tree heavy medium light tank destroyer artillery semovente carro armato

  • Please log in to reply
8525 replies to this topic

RanLSX #8501 Posted Oct 12 2019 - 00:09

    Captain

  • -Players-
  • 563 battles
  • 1,065
  • Member since:
    02-04-2016

View PostRanLSX, on Oct 04 2019 - 10:30, said:

Armor training in Qatar:

zPgfHNB.jpg?1


 

The timing of the training exercise seems...


 

Anyway a lot of shat flying around in that region made me wonder about the AA capabilities of the unit above. I think I see 3 at the top left of the 1st row next to some MLRS. I don't know, it's too hard to see.  I think they should have a Draco too just for extra measure. The Chinese have one, why not Italy?  .



Spidergrenadier #8502 Posted Oct 12 2019 - 00:32

    Corporal

  • -Players-
  • 21 battles
  • 94
  • Member since:
    05-13-2017

 

Hi guys, i'm back to ask some more info about Ansoldo GL design - here it had been mentioned as a different versions programm and one of it was declared as similar one to a Soviet T-39 superheavy tank. So, the next thing i'd do is probably an adapting a redeveloped 3d version of T-39 for an Italian technical assets, such as swinging those 45mm turrets onto the 47mm, etc.

Here's the latest result:



RanLSX #8503 Posted Oct 12 2019 - 17:32

    Captain

  • -Players-
  • 563 battles
  • 1,065
  • Member since:
    02-04-2016

I wish I had more info to give. All I know is the suspension went on to influence soviet designs for years to come(probably T39-T28), the T-39 is based on the Ansaldo 70t, and there's an old list of 4 vehicles translated by Ensign Expendable posted earlier in this thread. There's an old FTR article which mentions 152 & 203mm guns & the old list of 4 mentions another 107mm 70 ton tank along with a 7000 ton Halloween monster (possibly the Autofortezza)..

 

Here's the pages I have listed:

GL-1(32 ton similar to 71 ton)...34/672,335
GL-2 or GL-E1 700 ton with two heavy guns...37/724,242,335
Gl-3 71 ton with 107mm...36/705,335
GL-4 ...1/5,8/143,8/144,15/292,36/711,37/724,189/3775,190/3782,335,337

I think one's missing,IIRC

 

BTW, I've seen the T-39s front track design on an old British design, so I'm sure there was some influence there as well.

 

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------

Paintings of Askari from Warspot:

https://warspot.ru/3346-vesyolye-kartinki-warspot-polosatoe-na-chyornom

 

 



RanLSX #8504 Posted Oct 15 2019 - 16:39

    Captain

  • -Players-
  • 563 battles
  • 1,065
  • Member since:
    02-04-2016

View PostRanLSX, on Oct 03 2019 - 11:15, said:

Corni half-track from Tank Encyclopedia:

http://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/ww2-italy-corni-half-track/

 

Autoprotetto S.37 APC:

http://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/ww2/italy/Fiat_SPA_Autoprotetto_S-37.php



RanLSX #8505 Posted Oct 15 2019 - 18:20

    Captain

  • -Players-
  • 563 battles
  • 1,065
  • Member since:
    02-04-2016

New book about the L6:

https://comandosupre...s.164/post-1600

 

Also there appears to be a new Italian tank specialist who visits Sturgeon's house:

http://sturgeonshous...&comment=160879

 

I'm currently looking over his posts to ensure I don't miss anything worthy of the pastaboo roll call.

 

Scanning.........

 

Scanning........

 

Target acquired.....

 

all managed by an Intel 8086 derived processor (+ 8087 coprocessor, gotta give it that)"

 

Splash!

 

Now It's time to put this into a workable sentence:

 

"Not only is the Ariete the only NATO tank that's never been penetrated but it enjoys a superior Intel +8087 coprocessor!"

 

Now that's what I call pastaboo worthy!



VooDooKobra #8506 Posted Oct 16 2019 - 02:08

    Major

  • Players
  • 10035 battles
  • 5,959
  • [MOVE] MOVE
  • Member since:
    04-23-2011

https://twotankersandcat.podbean.com/

 

two tankers and a cat, latest episode on Italian tank destroyer Semovente L40 DA 47/32



RanLSX #8507 Posted Oct 16 2019 - 18:17

    Captain

  • -Players-
  • 563 battles
  • 1,065
  • Member since:
    02-04-2016

View PostVooDooKobra, on Oct 15 2019 - 20:08, said:

https://twotankersandcat.podbean.com/

 

two tankers and a cat, latest episode on Italian tank destroyer Semovente L40 DA 47/32

Thanks. I usually sit on the side of the debate that's against the production of the Semovente 47/32. By 42-43 I don't think the Italians could afford to use limited raw materials to make a 47/32 more mobile. It would have been much better spent on Moar Semovente 75-90/53 and P26.


 

That being said, the Ran used the Semovente 47/32 quite successfully on PS1s Panzer General.  I played the Husky scenario and showered the entire island with them (and a few truck mounted 90s). The scared little enemy computer didn't know what to do and I reigned victorious.


 


 

Here's the Ariete- Centauro 2 from Sturgeon's house:

I suppose it would be useful to swap out turrets that have been damaged in battle. Compatibility is usually a good thing.



VooDooKobra #8508 Posted Oct 17 2019 - 02:22

    Major

  • Players
  • 10035 battles
  • 5,959
  • [MOVE] MOVE
  • Member since:
    04-23-2011

View PostRanLSX, on Oct 16 2019 - 10:17, said:

Thanks. I usually sit on the side of the debate that's against the production of the Semovente 47/32. By 42-43 I don't think the Italians could afford to use limited raw materials to make a 47/32 more mobile. It would have been much better spent on Moar Semovente 75-90/53 and P26.


 

That being said, the Ran used the Semovente 47/32 quite successfully on PS1s Panzer General.  I played the Husky scenario and showered the entire island with them (and a few truck mounted 90s). The scared little enemy computer didn't know what to do and I reigned victorious.


 


 

Here's the Ariete- Centauro 2 from Sturgeon's house:

I suppose it would be useful to swap out turrets that have been damaged in battle. Compatibility is usually a good thing.

glad i could point you to their podcast



RanLSX #8509 Posted Oct 22 2019 - 23:01

    Captain

  • -Players-
  • 563 battles
  • 1,065
  • Member since:
    02-04-2016

More pics from Qatar:

https://www.analisidifesa.it/2019/10/nasr-19-la-brigata-garibaldi-in-addestramento-in-qatar/

 



RanLSX #8510 Posted Oct 23 2019 - 21:44

    Captain

  • -Players-
  • 563 battles
  • 1,065
  • Member since:
    02-04-2016

A nice photo album of the Fiat 2000's progress:

https://www.facebook.com/groups/Fiat2000/permalink/452150168840231/



RanLSX #8511 Posted Oct 23 2019 - 21:58

    Captain

  • -Players-
  • 563 battles
  • 1,065
  • Member since:
    02-04-2016

Oh Boy! Fiat returned my call. Someone link this to the Fiat 2000 facebook page for me. I don't use facebook so I need your HALP!

We'll get that Fiat 2000 finished in no time.

 

J4fB31z.png?1

 

Copy paste above or link to this facebook page:

https://www.facebook.com/groups/141146503273934/?ref=pages_group_cta

 

 

Halp me WOT lurks, UR my only hope! 


Edited by RanLSX, Oct 23 2019 - 21:59.


RanLSX #8512 Posted Oct 26 2019 - 21:36

    Captain

  • -Players-
  • 563 battles
  • 1,065
  • Member since:
    02-04-2016

View PostRanLSX, on Oct 23 2019 - 15:58, said:

 

Halp me WOT lurks, UR my only hope! 

Lol, what a bunch a lurking a**holes.

 

Anyway, Samp-T  battery withdraws from Turkey:

RuME5P1.jpg?1

 

Meanwhile,

http://forum.worldoftanks.com/index.php?/topic/351597-best-mbt/page__st__180__pid__12294736#entry12294736

 


Edited by RanLSX, Oct 26 2019 - 21:39.


RanLSX #8513 Posted Oct 27 2019 - 22:09

    Captain

  • -Players-
  • 563 battles
  • 1,065
  • Member since:
    02-04-2016

From page 38-39

https://issuu.com/rivista.militare1/docs/5rm-1986



RanLSX #8514 Posted Oct 28 2019 - 23:09

    Captain

  • -Players-
  • 563 battles
  • 1,065
  • Member since:
    02-04-2016

Warspot article covers a little from Bir El Gobi:

https://warspot.ru/15735-krestonosets-v-tonkih-latah

 

"The tanks again went into battle in the duly named Operation Cruzader. On November 18, both brigades suffered only technical losses, but the next day they had to clash with Italian troops.

On the morning of November 19 near Bir al-Gubi, the 22nd brigade launched an attack on the Italian Ariete division. The battle was not an easy one: the tanks were thrown into battle without the support of infantry and practically without artillery, since the brigade had only one battery of 25-pound guns. Under the shelling of Italian tanks from the flank, the brigade was forced to withdraw, having lost 25 vehicles, while the Italians claimed 50, and themselves lost 34. The 7th brigade was more fortunate and did not have to fight with enemy tanks."

British authors such as Correlli Barnett claim 50 as well.

As far as I know the number 25 comes from members of the South African Division that arrived 2 or 3 days later and counted up the British tanks. Some knocked out tanks were removed during the night, so you can't have it both ways. 

Some other stories about the battle:

https://www.soldiersofglos.com/announcement/operation-crusader/

"Operation Crusader began on 18th November 1941. 22nd Armoured Brigade’s advance was slower than had been hoped for because their crews and their new Crusader tanks had not had sufficient time to work up to full operational efficiency for desert warfare. The unreliability of the new tanks was to be a constant thorn in the side during the coming months. On 19th November the brigade ran into the Italian “Ariete” Armoured Division well dug-in at Bir el Gubi. Second-Lieutenant Gordon-Creed had a track shot off his tank. Stuart Pitman, in his book “Second Royal Gloucestershire Hussars, Libya-Egypt 1914-1942”, wrote of Gordon-Creed:-

“. . . He continued, however, to circle on the other track and knocked out two Italian tanks at point blank range. His own tank was then hit again through the turret, and his gunner and wireless operator wounded. When the action died down he and his driver, Trooper Parker, got out the injured men and dressed their wounds, staying with them until the Medical officer picked them up. They then returned to the tank and began repairing it under heavy fire. By working all through the night, in close proximity to the enemy, and with every chance of being captured, they were ready by dawn and brought the tank back to the Regiment; 2nd Lieutenant Gordon-Creed was awarded the M.C.”

Trooper Eric Johnson’s Crusader was called upon to rescue the crew of another Crusader belonging to 4th County of London Yeomanry, which had been knocked on Gubi ridge. No sooner had they got there, when their own tank was knocked out, and both crews hid behind their burning tanks while being sprayed by enemy machine gun fire. Suddenly, someone saw another Crusader approaching at speed. Eric Johnson recalled:-

“. . . There it was, moving flat out over good going. It came onto the ridge trailing its long sausage of dust behind. In the lurid glow of the great fireball on the horizon it caught the enemy’s concentrated fire, turning sharp left and came to a halt in the lee of our two burning hulks. It was Ken Greaves of “F” Sqdn. He said, “right then you lot, take your time, there’s no hurry, two men up on the engine covers, the rest of you pass the wounded up. Easy now, we’ve all the time in the world.” In a few minutes that seemed like hours we were on the back of Ken’s tank, sheltering the wounded and hanging onto each other as though our lives depended on it, as indeed they probably did. All the while Ken sat calmly on the turret watching the enemy and our escape route. At last we were able to tap his arm to let him know we were ready. Through his microphone he checked with each of his crew, gunner, operator, driver, then he turned to us and said, “Right then you lot, hold your hats on.” We came off that ridge faster than any Crusader had travelled before or since. Behind us the burning hulks spewed their exploding ammo into the sky in a farewell salute. Then, at a gentler pace, we found elements of the R.G.H. some 6 miles away forming leaguer in the gathering gloom. We trundled to a halt looking like a bunch of diddicoys on the back of a farm cart.”

22nd Armoured Brigade’s initial successes were very short lived. With no infantry support to consolidate any of the gains they had made, they were forced to withdraw, leaving the powerful “Ariete” Division still dug in."


Edited by RanLSX, Oct 28 2019 - 23:13.


RanLSX #8515 Posted Oct 29 2019 - 16:18

    Captain

  • -Players-
  • 563 battles
  • 1,065
  • Member since:
    02-04-2016

Rossini CV.3 prototype:

http://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/rossini-cv-3-light-tank-prototype/

SfJJREv.png



RanLSX #8516 Posted Nov 02 2019 - 22:41

    Captain

  • -Players-
  • 563 battles
  • 1,065
  • Member since:
    02-04-2016

In case you have trouble with the google translation stuff the Tank Archives features a fully translated version of the Italian heavy tank article:

Heavy Tank, Italian Style:

http://tankarchives.blogspot.com/2019/11/heavy-tank-italian-style.html

 

"On December 12th, 1941, the tank received a 32-caliber gun, thanks to which its firepower increased. The characteristics of this gun were close to those of the Soviet F-32 or American M2, and the penetration was even higher."

 

^My God, that never gets old^   Superior penetration.

 

 *Sniff* if only we could've built enough of them to counter the endless onslaught of inferior tanks. 

 

I wonder how many the Spathi could've built?

4eJAcTk.png?2

Another highly misunderstood army.

 

More from the article:

"Only the USSR managed to begin T-35 production in this period, but there were many issues with this tank. The tank was suitable for parades more than service, and was only built in tiny batches. Meanwhile, the RKKA wanted an even heavier tank. The T-39 ended up way too heavy, and the cost of 3 million roubles scared them off building even one prototype. Incidentally, this tank had Italian roots. It was based on a 65 ton tank project designed for the USSR by the Ansaldo company."

 

I don't see how it's suspension influenced soviet designs for years to come. At most it sounds like it influenced the T-39. The T28 and T-35 are accounted for in this article:

 https://warspot.ru/15759-teoriya-bronetankovyh-zabluzhdeniy

 

wth?  Will Wargaming/Warspot ever explain the mysteries of the Ansaldo 65-70 ton monsters? Italian tank building history will never be complete without them.


Edited by RanLSX, Nov 02 2019 - 22:48.


RanLSX #8517 Posted Nov 03 2019 - 22:56

    Captain

  • -Players-
  • 563 battles
  • 1,065
  • Member since:
    02-04-2016

Another penetration listed from this old Warspot article translated on Tank Archives:

Workhorse of the Italian Army:

"Tanks were often used alongside SPGs. The Germans valued the Italian SPGs higher than their tanks. 278 SPGs and special vehicles were built on the M 15-42 chassis for the Germans, 10 times as many vehicles as the tanks. Even the 18 caliber 75 mm gun could penetrate 70 mm of armour from 500 meters. Other guns used on the SPGs were even more powerful, which allowed them to successfully combat Allied vehicles."

 

That must be the EP for 70mm. The other warspot articles mention 50mm pen for the 75/18 which I believe is the AP.

 

http://tankarchives....alian-army.html

 

More info about the 2 pounder:
https://rommelsripos...e-rounds-again/

 

"15. The 2-pr H.E. has been used most effectively against soft vehicles but it is doubtful if there is much more in the country."

 

I'm also looking for the link to some recent comments about the 2 pounder originally only having APHE shells. 

 


Edited by RanLSX, Nov 03 2019 - 22:59.


Spidergrenadier #8518 Posted Nov 04 2019 - 01:14

    Corporal

  • -Players-
  • 21 battles
  • 94
  • Member since:
    05-13-2017

Another sample had been done. However, it still looks too bulky and large - 85 tons at the lowest variant weight point vs the 65 tons for Ansaldo design (probably it's the GL-4 65-70t) that was mentioned before. The GL-4 project originally should be moderately smaller and armed with less weaponry, of course. Next samples would be a GL-3 (or GL-4 with 32 tons load, i don't know how to differ their names actually), and p75 in different compositions. This should be enough for a HT video series.

 

1.

2.


Edited by Spidergrenadier, Nov 04 2019 - 01:36.


RanLSX #8519 Posted Nov 04 2019 - 17:32

    Captain

  • -Players-
  • 563 battles
  • 1,065
  • Member since:
    02-04-2016

My god it's beautiful.

 

For the record, I never took the 65-70 ton weight seriously. That was probably the original preliminary weight for the 107mm and they never got back to increasing its weight as the other versions were unleashed.  The Russians had their T-39 107mm @ estimated 90 tons so I'm thinking this probably all started with the Ansaldo Magrini Mobile Fortress @ 65-70 tons and increased from there.That's my speculation. We won't really know for sure until the Gracious Russians write a damn article about the incredible lost Ansaldo GL designs. Still waiting... 



Spidergrenadier #8520 Posted Nov 04 2019 - 20:18

    Corporal

  • -Players-
  • 21 battles
  • 94
  • Member since:
    05-13-2017

I'd appreciate if someone presents a screenshots for OF-40 armor scheme from WarThunder, i'm curious about its turret:

 






11 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 11 guests, 0 anonymous users