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IS-2 -- what is it, what it isn't

IS-2 IS2 blunderbuss

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ArmoredCorps #1 Posted Jan 25 2013 - 21:50

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I'll give the short version: the IS-2 is a tier 7 KV-1S. The turret is virtually the same, with a machine gun added for flair, and the hull likewise, only being a clean sloped glacis, not stepped.
(which is inferior TBH; all stepped-glacis tanks, even the Tiger H, benefit from that sliver of the upper hull being an auto-bounce angle and a hit-point-eating source of ricochets)
edit: gameplay & discussion thread I started during Chinese test server era

On to the forte:
*very agile for a heavy tank
*Quick to accelerate for a heavy and a good top speed of 37kmh
*300mm-pen HEAT shell
*DPS -- 4.88 works out close to 5.4 with %100 crew, vent & rammer, which works out to a ballpark ~2100 DPM in a real life situation. Combined with a huge HEAT shell and close-range fighting, you're talking a tank which can seriously tear down opposing tanks.
*Very, very little boost from the base to top engine -- aka very mobile with a stock engine
*Interim 122mm also boasts 300mm-pen HEAT round (even derpier)
*forward-mounted turret, rear sprocket; peek-a-boom friendly
*14kmh back-up speed, and it hits it briskly

Cons:
*.46 accuracy, atrocious on the move, 3.4s aim time renders this thing a blunderbuss -- close distance to get your best work done
*typically horrible Chinese gun depression, like 3. You're often going over-wide around hills or backing up into wall -- doing all the tricks -- to lay steel down range
*no armor; odd angles can create bounces on the turret, that's about it.
*Poor view & radio ranges
*An absolute money sink if you do HEAT spam.  

It's a very unrefined tank. It has the speed, maneuverability and tank profile (forward turret, turret rotation speed) to excell in the peek-a-boo; it can just about trail meds or take the more aggressive choke points and can escort bigger tanks and give as good as it takes. Alone, it's flaws tend to be felt or highlighted; 2 of them instantly creates a force to be reckoned with and top tiered, it is a bit OP -- you can damage anything in every exchange. Played within the limits of a tank which should never be forced into an ad hoc sniper role, it can do some serious damage, and it's able to flex to hot spots well.

That same mobility, turret-location and HEAT shell makes it a great finisher of tanks -- in a flank, ambush, bullrush, or hasty-shot peek-a-booms, it has the tools to get the kill shot.

Quote

ON LACK OF GUN DEPRESSION & SUPER-HIGH PEN:
I've always stated that a sufficient amount of overpen partially makes up for horrid gun depression. I own this and the 121 tier X medium, and this is true -- FFS, the 121 has gone through IS-7 turret face. This IS-2 has gone through King Tiger glacis armor. The lack of gun depression is oddly more of a liability in peek situations on hilly maps, where there's a bit of slope next to hills, and not at knife-fighting circle & flank attacks. At these ranges, going to 1st person and just slowing down a touch (a bit of finesse in other words) means you can just hit a side-hull or turret consistently for damage.

It truly is an unrefined blunderbuss though. It's not quite the OP HEAT-spamming tank I imagined, but it's been an easy grind, performs superbly when top tiered and is a worth tier 7. It's not so good I'm personally  keeping it but that's mostly because being a new-tree tank, I don't have crews to spare. They'll move onto the 110, WZ & 113 in due time.

Edited by ArmouredCorps, Jan 27 2013 - 22:01.


Redwing6 #2 Posted Jan 25 2013 - 21:55

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THanks AC, I appreciate the review.  I'm only very slowly grinding up the Chinese lines, and I'm glad to know what I'm looking at on the heavy line.

ArmoredCorps #3 Posted Jan 25 2013 - 22:02

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I can already tell you the 110 looks like a cross between the VK 4502 Ausf A & the IS-3. Very well protected, but with an Ausf-A like useable gun; it probably has the worst lower-hull and turret location of all 3, and at least as listed, has the worst HP/ton.
(the Ausf A's turret is so far forward, the gun so accurate, and front-sprocket so small and low, it's in my view, the best peeking tank in the game -- in terms of quick execution and reliable results)

I have heard and somewhat felt the Chinese tree as a whole differs in a few key respects from the Russian one:

*even worse gun depression
*even higher pen, or alpha, on various guns & tiers
*better passability
*otherwise generally the same in mobility, armor, general tank layout (forward turrets, low, stuffed full of gas tank & ammo rack hitboxes, but generally behind armor good enough not to highlight this weakness)

Oh and alibi: despite the porous armor, this thing, for example, doesn't rack up the kind of module damage the French 8 premium FCM does. I would not call the IS-2 "robust" in terms of module resistance  nor though is it comically prone to terribad module damage. (like an FCM tier 8 French premium)

anonym_8c6WUbf6C7MT #4 Posted Jan 25 2013 - 22:06

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I know what it is, it's a tank with lead paint.  :Smile_trollface-3:

NavySnipers #5 Posted Jan 25 2013 - 22:12

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In your opinion,

IS-2 > IS?

ArmoredCorps #6 Posted Jan 25 2013 - 22:24

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The HEAT shell alone says yes. I don't fear ambushing a tier 9 -- and why should I? I will do damage, if it's a 1-2 hit kill, he has more to fear from me than I him. He'll get 1 shot off, 2 if my ambush is hasty, reckless or sloppy.
But I'm not beholden to the risk I might bounce. I probably won't. (dispersion is the bigger worry)

edit: added back-up speed. I always hate guides that forget it, my shamefur dispray has been edited away.
http://mwreplays.com/ArmoredCorps replays uploaded, they're all wins, most are platooned, not all are top tiered.

You might learn more from losses, but you can see from the general derpiness the kind of playstyle and decision making it dictates. You're a hedium, through and through -- able to get to the fight fast, and bring heavy tank firepower. A blob of allies helps wonders, but your mobility means you can make your own luck, too.

============

Last edit: finally, credit generation. It doesn't, not with HEAT spam. In an efficient game with a few no-damage shots or misses, you'll lose only in the single-thousands (<10K).
In a sniper-qualifying game, you tend to make the opposite, a as much as... 15K. (that's usually if you're able to off-load onto normal rounds against lights, meds & arty) 1-10K more common.

In those games you end up ad hoc sniping, yeah, I've lost 44K. I don't think I've broken 50K in the red, but this is cause the alpha is superb -- it goes a long way to covering it's own premium round costs.

*This is all with premium account cause I am a Goldmonger

Edited by ArmouredCorps, Jan 25 2013 - 22:35.


MaxL_1023 #7 Posted Jan 26 2013 - 06:54

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The hull armor is actually pretty good - nothing under about 140 pen has a chance and 160 often bounces off the UFP.

ArmoredCorps #8 Posted Jan 26 2013 - 08:44

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Between power creep & premium (for silver) rounds, it doesn't feel too resilient. It is fair to note though that yes, fodder-tier tanks with normal shells or weak (stock) guns don't pose a mortal threat to you.

Magic_Fighting_Tuna #9 Posted Jan 27 2013 - 12:24

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I think the IS-2 is a good tank and I love it. Also if you equip the 122mm JT37(short 122) gun do not engage enemy tanks over 259m, if you do there is a good chance you will miss and the shells cost 1025 a piece which will destroy your income if you miss too much...

Edited by A_Metal_Bawks, Jan 27 2013 - 12:25.


DeadlyDays #10 Posted Jan 27 2013 - 21:49

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So far with 54 battles, 70% win rate at 870 avg xp 71 Kills, 71% accuracy, 67k damage

not too shabby. The worst points are accuracy and gun depression, a low height tank can go completly under you gun if it rams you, on a 56-16 all you can hit is the top of the turret, if that. Sometimes the gun will randomly shoot the ground the accuracy is so bad, don't try to snipe hard or very long range shots. Alpha damage makes this tank a beast. I do tend to bounce alot because you can angle the tank just right, side armor is same value, the front sides aren't angled like IS4 so you don't make them as flat when you angle the tank.

I did not upgrade the tracks, engine, or radio nor do i intend to.

Edited by DeadlyDays, Jan 27 2013 - 21:51.


Leader_H #11 Posted Jan 28 2013 - 06:27

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I just had my first battle in it, dealt 2600 damage with ease, I free XPed the first 122 and the tank feel viable to me (good enough as a T7 heavy), I think I would skip the radio /engine/tracks as I don't really need vents or anything else on this tank. You will need torsion bars to mount both the GLD/Rammer and the first 122mm.

First 122mm is a very good cannon 300 pen is almost autopen (you can laugh at tanks like super pershing) for things you get matched with.

ComradeHX #12 Posted Jan 28 2013 - 15:44

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Imo, -5 and -6 depression do not have that big of difference.

And IS-2 gets a 100mm gun for free in stock form, no more grinding with 85mm fail IS.

OmniJackal #13 Posted Jan 29 2013 - 15:01

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This is a great tank. I feel like I performed better with the 100mm than with the short 122mm tho. Should have the long 122mm by tomorrow so it's not an issue.

taror #14 Posted Jan 29 2013 - 22:37

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Whats the point of the "late" turrent? I understand you have to get it to move on to the tier 8, but you dont have to have it for its top gun, so is it just for looks?

ComradeHX #15 Posted Jan 30 2013 - 00:07

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View Posttaror, on Jan 29 2013 - 22:37, said:

Whats the point of the "late" turrent? I understand you have to get it to move on to the tier 8, but you dont have to have it for its top gun, so is it just for looks?
Adds HP, I assume.

OmniJackal #16 Posted Jan 30 2013 - 04:56

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Buy it for looks. Buy it for life.

ArmoredCorps #17 Posted Jan 31 2013 - 19:00

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Bump:
1 Best tier 7 heavy; IS-2; CH; 6,095 games (or owners?) 57.4% win rate in the tank 54.4% average win rate of players who own it 1.06
I.E., people who own this do better than their average win rate in this tank. So it is fairly broken OP.

http://blog.noobmeter.com/

Edited by ArmouredCorps, Jan 31 2013 - 19:00.


Leader_H #18 Posted Feb 01 2013 - 03:14

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View PostArmouredCorps, on Jan 31 2013 - 19:00, said:

Bump:
1 Best tier 7 heavy; IS-2; CH; 6,095 games (or owners?) 57.4% win rate in the tank 54.4% average win rate of players who own it 1.06
I.E., people who own this do better than their average win rate in this tank. So it is fairly broken OP.

http://blog.noobmeter.com/

The fact that someone can win 68 games out of 70 in pubs with this tank means this tank is indeed fairly broken...

Palehorse1 #19 Posted Feb 01 2013 - 05:47

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I've only upgraded the suspension, radio, and the gun. Don't nerf it just yet please, I am still in it and with only 13 battles in it under my belt I still have a 100% win rate in it. I need to get an ace tanker in it and more XP to get the 110.

Leader_H #20 Posted Feb 01 2013 - 07:15

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View PostPalehorse1, on Feb 01 2013 - 05:47, said:

I've only upgraded the suspension, radio, and the gun. Don't nerf it just yet please, I am still in it and with only 13 battles in it under my belt I still have a 100% win rate in it. I need to get an ace tanker in it and more XP to get the 110.

Nerf is very probable... but I guess you still have 8.4 to pad winrate and grind.




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