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GAM3OV3R_ #1 Posted May 14 2011 - 01:00

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Well ive been playing since open beta and after the 1500+ battles ive experienced I feel that TDs are not really suited for there job. First of all there armor sucks so bad, anything penetrates even if its 4 tiers below you and can blow you up in 1-2 shots through the front - leaving you barely no chance of coming out alive from a firefight. But you may say its purpose is to lurk in the shadows picking off unsuspecting foes but how is that possible when TD's have the same view range of heavys of the same tier and you are spotted as soon as you spot your prey and going toe to toe with anything expect SPGs usualy ends in certain death. So wouldnt it be better to snipe with a heavy instead with the great armor and the power house guns?

Personally I think either the TD's armor needs to be buffed up or an increase of their view range so they can actually do what they are supposed to do better then any other type of tank, becuase atm its just a t1 light tank with a big gun nothing more. Let me know what you think.

davedaaznlu #2 Posted May 14 2011 - 01:05

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? do you even have one? My ts are beast,  you stay back under cover while the meds and ehavies soak up their fire and distract em, while you go bam bam boom boom and they die. also, you dont go out alone. you go on the second line. my stug actually can take 2 kv hits so the armour and hp arent that bad lmfao

BadKarma79 #3 Posted May 14 2011 - 01:06

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I'd agree on the view range thing, but you can buy binocs or an improved sight to solve that problem.

Captain_DirtyLeotard #4 Posted May 14 2011 - 01:14

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I feel for you brother

Here is my .02 -

- Buy Camo
- Buy Coated Optics
- Buy Rammer
- Train crew for camoflauge

I use Russian TDs and once you get to the SU-100 you can 1 shot anything med, hurt badly lower tier heavys, and damage hier tier heavys.  Dont buy this stuff if you dont want to keep the vehicle.  I am a brat and bought my way to the top and keep all my vehicles because to be honest its just plain fun to play lower tiered games and get the 1st win of the day bonus to rush experience.

If you are dieing try the following:

- do not rush
- do not be by yourself, doesnt matter if the other side is not defended, you will die in a fire
- be patient and learn the maps, the tendency of players on those maps
- bushes are your friend
- Smart quality shooting, ex.  If i am in su-100 and see a IS-3....I shoot for tracks so bigger firepower can have a chance and it will slow him down.
- It seems that explosive damage will work better against higher tiered opponents, but again, if you are a good shot and know the weakness of the tanks you are up against the better.
- Watch out for high tier medium tanks that are scouts, especially the russian, T-44 & T-54.  They can take huge beatings, close the distance and own you.  That is why you always need support.

Seriously though, get the coated optics so you can see 500m and stay camoflagued that is half the battle.  

Good luck

GRB_Duck #5 Posted May 14 2011 - 01:21

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.... So was that 1499 battles in SPG and 1 in your AT-1?
You kind of sound like an arty guy - sorry.

TD's can be thin skinned but a REAL TD balance armor and the QQ would be in the other direction.
OMFGGGGG The I can't pen the TD frontal armor.....

It's a game, it's OUR game, it's free.
So as they say... if you don't like  how this one plays - go out and make your own free game and if we like it - we'll be over to play and complain about how you made the TD's way too hearty.

Hi Welcome

GAM3OV3R_ #6 Posted May 14 2011 - 01:25

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Why should we have to buy addons to snipe, shouldnt they have a better view range from the get go? and fine on the armor but I only mentioned that becuase we spot each other at the same time and it comes down to armor, preferably id like better view range. And its not about tactics, I know to stick behind others but what if they die and your the only thing left in that area - your dead thats what.

But thanks for your opinion guys. Just really anoyed with the view range issue, becuase I thought snipers are meant for long range - but hey maybe i've just been smoking too much drugs.

EDIT @ GRB_Duck : I hate arty, ive only got to tier 2 in them. And the battles were in IS and jagdtiger from open beta. And currently in my JagdPanth IV and KV3.  And like I said I PREFERABLY want to see its VIEW RANGE BUFFED as opposed to ARMOR. And why you telling me not to play for stating my opinion? I thought other users and mods would like to hear user feedback, clearly your just a trolling FOOL. And it's not free im purchasing premium so im a paying customer and my voice should be heard!

Eule #7 Posted May 14 2011 - 02:07

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I think TDs are generally stronger than heavy tanks in their own tier. If any adjustments are called for, it should be to make the heavies stronger, not the tank destroyers.

I guess we'll see how the upcoming patch will affect camo and spotting. Any big changes there will affect TDs more than the other vehicles since they depend on invisibility to survive, but can't hang back as far as the arties.

GAM3OV3R_ #8 Posted May 14 2011 - 02:18

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They may have access to more powerful guns but that is countered with incredibly slow reloads, overall Heavies have a better DPM (damage per minute) then TDs and considering armor its clear who the victor will be. Adding say 50m+ on the TDs will alow you to fire off the 1st shot off and even out the battle.

Aziz_Light #9 Posted May 14 2011 - 02:21

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Why should we have to buy addons to snipe? Why doesn't every tank come with everything fully researched? Why do I have to train my crew, why don't they all come at 100%? Questions with inscrutable answers.

Aziz_Light #10 Posted May 14 2011 - 02:25

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View PostbLaCkH0uNdz_, on May 14 2011 - 02:18, said:

They may have access to more powerful guns but that is countered with incredibly slow reloads, overall Heavies have a better DPM (damage per minute) then TDs and considering armor its clear who the victor will be. Adding say 50m+ on the TDs will alow you to fire off the 1st shot off and even out the battle.
TDs have faster reloads on equivalent guns. Just a heads up. You can look at it this way: TDs get more powerful guns earlier, with faster reloads, but they're on more fragile chassis and have no turret. That's your tradeoff.

GAM3OV3R_ #11 Posted May 14 2011 - 02:29

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Faster reloads really? from what I've seen enemies put 2 rounds in me while I can put only 1. But still forgeting the armor and gun part of it, the main purpose of a TD is to snipe so dont you also agree it should have a tiny advantage in view range against other tanks? even if its something as trivial as 20m more then what the TDs are set to now, not alot, but alot at the same time.

Evisicator #12 Posted May 14 2011 - 03:12

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The TD isn't any more of a sniping platform than a Tank. Optics are Optics period, there isn't some magical optic fairy that makes better optics for certain types of vehicles.

As has been said,TD's Trade Armor and Turret for a Bigger gun that fires faster.

DemonicSpoon #13 Posted May 14 2011 - 03:12

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Quote

Faster reloads really? from what I've seen enemies put 2 rounds in me while I can put only 1. But still forgeting the armor and gun part of it, the main purpose of a TD is to snipe so dont you also agree it should have a tiny advantage in view range against other tanks? even if its something as trivial as 20m more then what the TDs are set to now, not alot, but alot at the same time.

You're not going solo. You should generally be behind other tanks and/or in bushes, both of which give you the first shot advantage. TDs are primarily support vehicles...With their awesome camo, if they got good view range in addition they'd make the game way too campy. You can, however, augment your view range with binoculars (which has far more synergy with TDs than any other class).

It would be more helpful if you stopped talking in generalities. If your enemies can put two rounds in you when you fire one...So what? if those are 37mm shells while you're firing 122mm shells yours will still hurt more! For any given tier, the tank with the best penetration and the best damage is almost always a tank destroyer. Sometimes a heavy tank of the same tier has a similar gun, but it will have worse accuracy and aim time and often ROF.

For example, see the attached image. On the right is the 107mm ZiS-6, the long-barrel gun on the KV-2. It is widely regarded as an INCREDIBLY powerful gun for its tier...to the point that KVs with the 107 are considered overpowered. Note the incredibly high penetration and damage on a tier 5 heavy tank. Now look to the left... The ZiS-6S, a similar gun fit to the SU-85, a same-tier tank destroyer, fires 10% faster, is more accurate, and has significantly better aim time. The SU-85 is also able to hide MUCH better than the KV and is a lot more agile than the KV (which is a gigantic brick).

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They may have access to more powerful guns but that is countered with incredibly slow reloads, overall Heavies have a better DPM (damage per minute) then TDs and considering armor its clear who the victor will be. Adding say 50m+ on the TDs will alow you to fire off the 1st shot off and even out the battle.

Heavies absolutely do not have better damage than TDs. As discussed above, TDs are better in that regard. Of course, a heavy will win in a frontal slugfest-that's the whole point of a heavy tank. TDs (except for maybe the top tier German TDs) are not meant to slug it out face to face with other tanks, they are meant to support from a distance with high accuracy, high penetration, and high damage.


If you don't like to sit back and snipe, I'd recommend trying out heavies. I assure you that Tds are not underpowered...they may just not work with your playstyle.

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The TD isn't any more of a sniping platform than a Tank. Optics are Optics period, there isn't some magical optic fairy that makes better optics for certain types of vehicles.

As has been said,TD's Trade Armor and Turret for a Bigger gun that fires faster.

The benefits of sniping are:

1) You are generally further from harm's way

2) You have a wide target selection.

The cons of sniping are:

3) It's harder to penetrate

4) More likely to miss.

tanks with few hitpoints and low armor are the most in need of 1), tanks that do a lot of damage benefit from 2), tanks with high penetration are penalized less by 3), and tanks with high accuracy are penalized less by 4).

Hmm, which tank class is it that has little health/armor, but high damage, penetration and accuracy?




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