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how many thinking of quitting?


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Hazakdds #61 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 14:03

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View PostMichiganMike, on Sep 15 2014 - 22:19, said:

 

Having read Fox_Trax's comments, I believe that playing WoT is rather like being caught in a bad relationship. She (WoT) promises to be fun and easy ("Play for free."). And everything is so exciting at first. You are thrilled with your new love. So, you put more and more time into the relationship.

 

And she demands more and more of your time. But you realize you aren't having the fun you thought you would. She isn't nearly as easy as she seemed to promised. You try again and again, and you aren't getting any ....wins. Your stats are lousy. You feel bad. No matter how hard you try, you just can't seem to please her. Her love is conditional.

 

But she promises that if you give just a little more - study the game mechanics, study the maps, buy the top gun and turret, move up to that heavy in the next tier - - - THEN the old magic will return.

 

But it doesn't. Each new investment gives only fleeting and unfulfilling satisfaction. And slowly you begin to realize that your life has been consumed by chasing the unattainable. She (WoT) will never give you the joy you sought. She will always be witholding and unattainable.

 

What to do? Consider the words of Fire _ Trax: "Then I quit because I dumped that witch and had a social life again."

 

I haven't played a singe game today. I went to a rifle range out the country. Had it all to myself. The weather was cool and damp. I brought along good cup of coffee and a sandwich. I tested four new loads I developed for my Ruger 77 7mm-08. I found it liked 28 grains of Alliant MR 2000 behind a hand cast 180 grain bullet. I cast my own bullets using a 50-50 mix of Linotype and wheel weights. It was all very satisfying. After that, I stopped a  little Mexican restaurant and enjoyed a chicken enchilada, beans and rice.

 

A good time was had by all.

 

MichiganMike

 

 

 

Roger that brother.



Kuhnini #62 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 15:14

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Just a few battles away from 5700 the thought of quitting has entered my mind for a number of reasons.  The main one seems to be fellow players though.  My clan is great but I mostly play solo public battles and that is where the rub is.  I hate the words r*t**d and id**t.  You see them all the time in chat.  I turned chat off for awhile but felt like I was missing something.  My stats are slowly but surely getting better but I believe that is only because I'm playing elite tanks now and am dealing out more damage than I used to.  I finally bought three months of premium (first real money I've spent on the game) and having premium keeps me from losing credits on my tier 8 tank.  I could be on the winning team, get a kill but not do very much damage and lose credits on the battle.  Drove me nuts! 

 

Back to the players.  It seems as though I'm either getting yelled at or others in the battle are.  A team member(s) does something even my own tomato self sees as ridiculous and trust me, I thought that was hard to do but it isn't.  Also *ducking under computer desk to avoid the tomatoes being thrown at me* believe it or not, the non red players don't seem to be playing that well in the public matches.  Basically, it is very difficult to be on a winning team, at least for me.  Sure I'm bad, but I'm on teams somewhat frequently that have greens, yellows, and blues on them and we get beat 15 to 2,3, or 4.  And you guessed it, chat is going nuts with people calling names and cursing.  After 5700 battles that is getting really, really old.  

 

At the end of the day, sure I am on the winning team sometimes and occasionally players will say good work and the other team will say gg and all is fine and dandy.  However, it is my experience that a battle very rarely goes that way.  Even the ones that I am on the winning team, name calling and cursing seem to be the order of the day.  This is getting close to sounding like whining but honestly, it is getting old.  So old that the thought of quitting has entered my mind.

 

I enjoy the game itself.  I don't even mind the things wargaming does to help earn money for the company.  MM works the way it does for a reason (tin foil hat is on).  I am convinced it is programmed in a way to suggest players spend money.  I'm not going to go in to that in this post.  Everything in the game is to a certain extent and as I said, I'm alright with that.  It is the players and their actions that have caused me to start thinking about quitting. 



Insurrectional_Leftist #63 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 15:15

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View PostDriftin, on Sep 16 2014 - 08:42, said:

Today was the last straw for me. Tags dropped and game uninstalled. Between RNG, lopsided games nonstop, and WG's crap. I am out after 3 years...I don't expect anyone to care really, just figured I'd add one more long term player gone to the list.

 

 

Driftin,

 

you have been noticed....  And not fallen on deaf ears.

 

There is much frustration now in the game in my own opinion.  The game are too Lopsided to be sure, and it goes back and forth like a ping pong ball, and it proves that skill has no regard to the control of these matches at all in most cases that I have observed, there is a very strange anomaly that seems to take place in these matches?  As you point out the RNG can change the outcome of a match in a moments notice or the outcome of a game throughout the course of a battle more than once in different ways.  Certain game policy decisions I personally believe are affecting levels of player dissatisfaction and discontent in combination.  There are many contributing factors.

 

Each person can come up with a list of things which add up.  Examples could range from MM alogrithms software, team balancing, battle tier 12 removal?, Stats issues, Corrosive community issues, moderation issues at the staff level, upper management issues, etc.

 

Grinds have become long, and game economy issues, (less silver, $$) and more frustration with less fun...  The WNx (8) system being at the heart of some of the discontent as well.  Too much happiness being penned around the a WN8 score (or a certain color) that if your not then your just a "Failure" then you have failed the game.  Which the metric is flawed its self, and can be inflated, and can be padded.  Now, it's more about that instead of the just trying to play the tanks.  Its taken all of the fun out of it all, and created more frustration.

 

And then it's Wargaming itself.  Their attitude towards us in general, the way they treat us from a customer service stand point as a customer.  Their lack of appreciation for us, and the level of rewards given back to us in return in the end for the "Money Spent $$", Many hours of time, Days of play, Time from our lives to play this game, and a lot of us whether we win or lose at the keyboard where we could be somewhere else more important at times.  There is just not enough appreciation/rewards being given back in return for the level of frustration we are dealing with over the long haul.

 

I too am considering a course change myself on my playing future here, given some recent game battle results, and customer service interactions with NA.

 



capt_jay #64 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 16:00

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It has become harder to earn credits. I have probably a half dozen tanks unlocked that I have not bought cause I don't have the credits. I usually play about an hour a day as a rule, some days maybe more. I have had the KV-13 and several other tanks in the 1.5 million cost range unlocked for many weeks. So it seems like I am earning XP at a faster rate than I am earning credits...or maybe I am blowing said credits on equipment for the tanks I already have unlocked ( more likely). I saved my credits to pick up the Tiger II (which was 2.4 mil I think). Earning potential is a direct reflection of your combat ability. I like this, and I am sorry if this sounds elitest, but it helps keeps the scrubs out of the higher tier games where they contribute nothing except make it harder for their team to win, cause it is harder for them to scrape together the credits to buy tier 7+ tanks ( this does nothing to keep said players from using their wallet to buy their way into tier 8 premium tanks, which is why so many players rage about it). It FORCES you to become a better player in order to earn the credits you need...and as a byproduct, your crew skills should go up. I feel that ultimately this mechanic can result in a better player base, skill wise, assuming people learn to play better in the process. You wont become a better player by just doing the same thing over and over, as evidenced by the players with 20k+ games and still bad stats.

 

I don't even have 10k games, but I have NEVER seen a team composed of all green/purple/blue against a team of red with a couple yellow. I've rarely seen more than 2 purple players on a team, but I only have 1 tier 8 tank and probably 6 battles in it. Maybe that is the case in even higher tiers.


 

Ultimately, I have no problem with the higher tiers being the playground of the very best players. If WG is changing the game to 'enforce' this, I am all for it, even though I am certain to be excluded on this as I am not a great player. But like many have complained about, I would like to see them keep the very best players out of the lower tiers (4 and below). Now, I know they also have to grind new tanks lines and start somewhere. But the really good players don't want to play at that level of competition and most of them have enough free XP to skip the first 4-5 tiers anyway.


 

The game is the way it is, if you don't like facing the fact that a terribad player cannot get to the highest level of this game, or feel like you are being ganged up on and steamrolled game after game, you have 3 choices as I see it. 1) Stop playing, go find a game you like more, than gives you joy, stop spending your 'fun' time being angry and pi$$ed off, life is too short, be kind to yourself 2) Accept this is the way it is 3) get better.


 

Everyone can get better. It took me a year to go from a black/red tomato to being, overall, below average and recent, average. I'm certainly no tanking genius, but I read these and other WoT related forums regularly, and they are full of resources that if you read and apply, can bring you to an average level. You may never be a unicum, I am pretty sure I wont be. I still get teams that I get steamrolled on, but there are also games where what I contribute is a deciding factor in the win. There are lots of caustic arseholes in chat, to be sure. But on the forums I have found lots of players that are not only willing to give advice, but critique your replays, point out where you need to improve and several that are willing to platoon and show that advice in action.



zeke3 #65 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 16:19

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View PostDriftin, on Sep 16 2014 - 02:42, said:

Today was the last straw for me. Tags dropped and game uninstalled. Between RNG, lopsided games nonstop, and WG's crap. I am out after 3 years...I don't expect anyone to care really, just figured I'd add one more long term player gone to the list.

 

 

I'm very close to where he is.    Taking out all of the bushes / hiding spots where camo works really bugs me.   Great scouts like Tazilon are gone.

I keep finding better ways lately to spend my time....



VariaVespasa #66 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 16:42

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View PostWhiskey_Blue, on Sep 16 2014 - 09:20, said:

 

 

 What the hell does more or less experience have to do with being right or even being able to critically observe the situation and make an accurate assessment of the peoples displeasure and the cause of that displeasure??? 

Shirley you cant be serious...   Its sort of an axiom that when two people have differing opinions on a subject that the more experienced person (in that subject) is more likely to be right.  A guy who's watched 3 football games in his life says one thing.  Another guy who played football for 15 years and coached/managed a team for 10 more says a different thing.  Does *anyone* seriously think the 3-game watcher is likely enough to be right to be sided with over the 25-year veteran?  Is it theoretically possible he's right? Yes.  Is it remotely likely? No.  The gap here is obviously less extreme, but the fundamental principle still applies.  You are less experienced at tanks, you are less likely to be right, and therefore your opinion is of lesser value on this subject.  So you need to provide actual evidence to back your claims and you havent done so.



Samurai_Mouse #67 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 17:01

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View Postcapt_jay, on Sep 16 2014 - 08:00, said:

It has become harder to earn credits. I have probably a half dozen tanks unlocked that I have not bought cause I don't have the credits. I usually play about an hour a day as a rule, some days maybe more. I have had the KV-13 and several other tanks in the 1.5 million cost range unlocked for many weeks. So it seems like I am earning XP at a faster rate than I am earning credits...or maybe I am blowing said credits on equipment for the tanks I already have unlocked ( more likely). I saved my credits to pick up the Tiger II (which was 2.4 mil I think). Earning potential is a direct reflection of your combat ability. I like this, and I am sorry if this sounds elitest, but it helps keeps the scrubs out of the higher tier games where they contribute nothing except make it harder for their team to win, cause it is harder for them to scrape together the credits to buy tier 7+ tanks ( this does nothing to keep said players from using their wallet to buy their way into tier 8 premium tanks, which is why so many players rage about it). It FORCES you to become a better player in order to earn the credits you need...and as a byproduct, your crew skills should go up. I feel that ultimately this mechanic can result in a better player base, skill wise, assuming people learn to play better in the process. You wont become a better player by just doing the same thing over and over, as evidenced by the players with 20k+ games and still bad stats.

 

I don't even have 10k games, but I have NEVER seen a team composed of all green/purple/blue against a team of red with a couple yellow. I've rarely seen more than 2 purple players on a team, but I only have 1 tier 8 tank and probably 6 battles in it. Maybe that is the case in even higher tiers.


 

Ultimately, I have no problem with the higher tiers being the playground of the very best players. If WG is changing the game to 'enforce' this, I am all for it, even though I am certain to be excluded on this as I am not a great player. But like many have complained about, I would like to see them keep the very best players out of the lower tiers (4 and below). Now, I know they also have to grind new tanks lines and start somewhere. But the really good players don't want to play at that level of competition and most of them have enough free XP to skip the first 4-5 tiers anyway.


 

The game is the way it is, if you don't like facing the fact that a terribad player cannot get to the highest level of this game, or feel like you are being ganged up on and steamrolled game after game, you have 3 choices as I see it. 1) Stop playing, go find a game you like more, than gives you joy, stop spending your 'fun' time being angry and pi$$ed off, life is too short, be kind to yourself 2) Accept this is the way it is 3) get better.


 

Everyone can get better. It took me a year to go from a black/red tomato to being, overall, below average and recent, average. I'm certainly no tanking genius, but I read these and other WoT related forums regularly, and they are full of resources that if you read and apply, can bring you to an average level. You may never be a unicum, I am pretty sure I wont be. I still get teams that I get steamrolled on, but there are also games where what I contribute is a deciding factor in the win. There are lots of caustic arseholes in chat, to be sure. But on the forums I have found lots of players that are not only willing to give advice, but critique your replays, point out where you need to improve and several that are willing to platoon and show that advice in action.

 

earning credits is actually easy for me, but i got a premium account and a few premium tanks that i put to work as farm tools.. Yeah sure I get insulted from time to time, but the prem tanks are great for farming experience, silver and crew training. Thats how I got the A-44, by playing a meta game, and the A-44 has been better too me than any other tank ive used. I've got over a million silver just from using it. Experience is a bit of a different story.  I normally would see between 300 and 900 exp for a match but lately with the lopsided matchmaking ive seen as low as 18 to 70 exp per match.. Its quite abit different different than the 300 - 900 exp i normally get and nowhere near the 2K - 4K better players average.. fortunately I have no desire to go to tier 8 or higher.. I like the Tank I have.

As for the game being the way it is??  Times change, populations change, everything changes. What seemed like a good idea four years ago, no longer applies because the user base has grown past the original design of the game. Back then, no one had any clue what would happen when a whole lot og people grew past 24K - 40K games. They called their best shot and the did the bast they could in designing the games core. However, Now we have the 26K game veteran being pitted against the 100 game newbie and therein lies the rub. I'm certain MM functions as designed but it was designed for a completely different situation, and it isnt uncommon now to find the highest ranked player on one team being les experienced than the lowest ranked player from the second to top tier on the oppositions team. As an example. In the above picture I posted a couple days ago, our best player has a win rate of 48%, whereas  the best player from the opposition has 56%. Since the top tier was tier 9 that  that placed their  48%'er in tier 8. That meant that our best tier 9 player  was playing at the same skill level as their tier 8 player..  They had several people above tier 8 which guaranteed that the game ended in less than five minutes.  The game hasnt changed, but the players have. Theyve grown and learned and advanced beyond the games initial parameters creating the quagmire we have today. The game needs to follow the players and change as well.

 


Edited by Whiskey_Blue, Sep 16 2014 - 17:32.


CeltGhost #68 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 17:05

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quitting my job?  yes.



DrZhivago #69 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 17:22

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Wow....so much laundry to air out lol. Truth is, the newest version of IL2 Sturmovik is coming in December and, being a longtime veteran pilot from simulator air combat, will be back in the skies having a blast (not the out of body dumb experience you get in warthunder or worldofplanes). WOT for me was/is nothing but a free time waster until IL2 returns. I'm sure I'm not the only CFS1,2 & IL2 pilot doing the same here. Btw, you other air combat sim pilots please stay in touch....maybe we can create the next great air warfare squadron.



Samurai_Mouse #70 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 17:28

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View PostVariaVespasa, on Sep 16 2014 - 08:42, said:

Shirley you cant be serious...   Its sort of an axiom that when two people have differing opinions on a subject that the more experienced person (in that subject) is more likely to be right.  A guy who's watched 3 football games in his life says one thing.  Another guy who played football for 15 years and coached/managed a team for 10 more says a different thing.  Does *anyone* seriously think the 3-game watcher is likely enough to be right to be sided with over the 25-year veteran?  Is it theoretically possible he's right? Yes.  Is it remotely likely? No.  The gap here is obviously less extreme, but the fundamental principle still applies.  You are less experienced at tanks, you are less likely to be right, and therefore your opinion is of lesser value on this subject.  So you need to provide actual evidence to back your claims and you havent done so.

 

In a sentence sir: It's because those involved directly in any given social situation are too close to the problem to see it clearly. This is exactly why Fortune 500 companies  regularly hire third party firms to come in, observe and critique the companies operational practices and suggest changes to the business practices of that company. You believe that because I am less experienced than you that i could not possibly have anything of value to contribute, but what you dont see or understand is that I am not talking about tanks or playing the game. I am critiquing the system itself and the state that it has gotten into. Should you wish to instruct me on becoming a better player, then I would gladly listen to everything you say, however we are discussing the deficiencies of the entire system that is the foundation for this game and is currently frustrating enough to a great many players that they are leaving. You and I are comparing apples to oranges. Knowing "the game" is not the same as observing "the system" . They are two completely different paradigms.

ShadowDancer27 #71 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 18:13

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If you don't enjoy certain tanks and enjoy others...stick to the ones you enjoy and seek out ones like that.  If you never enjoy the game, save yourself the misery and find another game that suits you better.

 

I personally get frustrated with highly situational tanks:

 

Least frustrating: The KV-2 played properly doesn't really change whether you are in a tier 6 or tier 8 match.  In either case you want to shoot bad guys at close range with enough friends around that you can hide to reload and don't take too much focus fire.  On most maps you can find some close quarters where heavies can pound away at whatever comes there without being too exposed.  If the enemy is hull down or sidescraping it just means you have to get a little closer since you don't really care about another heavy tanks armor angle anyhow.

 

Somewhat frustrating:  Tanks that lean on armor tend to struggle at +2MM since many of the +2 tanks will blow through your armor.  Having a gold flinging Ferdi blast your hull down T29 through its turret face is sad - your tanks glory negated.  Or in a Jumbo after you pew pew a distracted Borsig that doesn't really need to aim to melt your armor someone else tracks you and you get blasted off the map before your slow tank can get behind something.

 

More frustrating: A low pen tank that needs to get behind the enemy to do anything on maps and MM where getting behind anything is infeasible....the three lane maps with +2 tier heavies at each one and you in a puny pew pew pew medium.

 

I give up!!!: Slow glass canon tanks on small maps with loads of fast derpy tanks.  When you're 50 meters from spawn when your first spotted and receive your first damage while broadside to the oncoming force it is disheartening to say the least.

 

 



Necrophore #72 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 18:24

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View PostKuhnini, on Sep 16 2014 - 07:14, said:

I enjoy the game itself.  I don't even mind the things wargaming does to help earn money for the company.  MM works the way it does for a reason (tin foil hat is on).  I am convinced it is programmed in a way to suggest players spend money.  I'm not going to go in to that in this post.  Everything in the game is to a certain extent and as I said, I'm alright with that.  It is the players and their actions that have caused me to start thinking about quitting. 

 

After taking a few days off, this pretty much sums up my experience. I can deal with the game mechanics. I can deal with the credit drought. I can't deal with teams that either refuse to play by hiding in a corner, or who suicide rush the open field and cry "Warpack!" when someone shoots them. The last couple weeks of play have left me with no real urge to log back into WoT.

 

Last night a couple friends and I fired up some old Warcraft accounts and chased tigers around while telling dirty jokes. I spent the weekend canning the veggies from my garden (100-odd jars of Sun Gold Tomato Basil Jam, Strawberry Jalepeno Jam, Seven-Tomato Salsa, and Spicy Spaghetti Sauce). Life goes on.



ShadowDancer27 #73 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 18:31

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View PostWhiskey_Blue, on Sep 16 2014 - 11:28, said:

 

In a sentence sir: It's because those involved directly in any given social situation are too close to the problem to see it clearly. This is exactly why Fortune 500 companies  regularly hire third party firms to come in, observe and critique the companies operational practices and suggest changes to the business practices of that company. You believe that because I am less experienced than you that i could not possibly have anything of value to contribute, but what you dont see or understand is that I am not talking about tanks or playing the game. I am critiquing the system itself and the state that it has gotten into. Should you wish to instruct me on becoming a better player, then I would gladly listen to everything you say, however we are discussing the deficiencies of the entire system that is the foundation for this game and is currently frustrating enough to a great many players that they are leaving. You and I are comparing apples to oranges. Knowing "the game" is not the same as observing "the system" . They are two completely different paradigms.

 

Good point sir but many that don't know the game jump to the wrong conclusions about the game.  There are countless threads on MM and unfairness and most are anecdotal observations of small samples of random data.

 

I have matches that are frustrating because I screw up.

I have matches that are frustrating when I play really well and my team loses anyway.

 

There is clearly a considerable amount of random butterfly effect noise in the outcome of each match that the overall outcome and your game play in that match are counter-indicated.  You suck and win, you shine and you lose.  But ON AVERAGE with a large enough sample size good/bad play will shift the mean.

 

This game has some weird mechanics - particularly camo and spotting system.  It is a game and not a sim...some things you need to just deal with.

 

The game has some situational balance issues.  Some tanks are overall OP and some are situational niche tanks.  But everyone has the same choices/opportunities so that seems to sort itself out too.  You pay your dues in some turd tanks to get to the glorious OP ones.  Such is life.

 

Almost every pvp combat game in existence has some paper-rock-scissors power triangle.  WoT is no different, in fact it has much more than 3 dimensions so that there are niche tanks of many flavors.  The interesting games are the ones where those combinations really come to the fore.  A hull down JagdTiger with a long shooting lane is a beast (e.g. SW Sand River).  But add three arty to the match and he is toasty after 2 shots.  A T95 on a long street is unstoppable...unless there is a tier 5 Leopard behind him.  It is what makes the game interesting.



capt_jay #74 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 18:32

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Whiskey, keep your pants on here.


 

No offense, but my numbers are nearly 3x as good as yours, so I should be able to earn nearly 3x the credits you do, no? Since earning credits and XP is based on the same things the stats blocks are based on, right? Sounds fairly logical? And I am comparing your most recent to my most recent, which is roughly the same tier...so, I am smelling some [edited]in your claims of credits and XP, at least in terms of you averaging that...maybe once in a blue moon you do.  Cause I don't average 900xp and the corresponding levels of credits...at least I don't think I do.


 

Here's the hard part for some folks to swallow, and I am using you as an example Whiskey_Blue, there are literally 1000's of players like you...you don't have the skill to be playing in tier 6+, your stats CLEARLY show it, you are a burden to your team. And I am taking about your most recent. You don't average a kill even every 2 games. You certainly aren't anywhere near a tier 6 tanks hp in damage...In effect, what I hear from you is we need to change the game to cater to people that suck at the game. I contend people like you need to get BETTER at the game the way it is and stay at a tier where you are not so outclassed..  Now, in your case, you have less than 3k games, so no one expects your stats to be awesome. Mine were awful too.  But at tier 6 in a T-150, one penetrating shot does more damage than you are averaging. If you cant score more damage than that before you are dead, can you NOT see you are so way over your head that you cant even see the surface of the water?? The solution is not to change the game, the game works decently well...it's not perfect to be sure. The issue here is you and players of your skill level, or lack thereof and your refusal to try to get better within the system, instead insisting the system must change. The difference between you and me, I didn't come in here complaining about they need to change this, they need to change that. I listened to the advice I was given, which is given on these forums EVERY....SINGLE.....DAY.  Drop down several tiers and get a handle on the basic mechanics of the game. Be willing to learn and listen to good advice. The other flaw in your argument, # of games played is NO indication of talent whatsoever on its own. I have seen guys with 20k+ games with the same stats as guys with 1.5k games. WN8 combined with W/R tell you about a player's talent or skill. I've seen guys with my number of games with DARK PURPLE stats. You can have worked at a job for 20 years, but not learned anything new in the last 19 years, you just have that same one year of experience over 20 years.  Times change, things change, but one thing that will never change about WoT, you have to understand the basic mechanics in order to be decent. You seem like a bright guy, but you seem to have some ego issues related to your current ability in this game.


 

Hit me up some time if you want to platoon, maybe we can learn a couple things from each other.

 

 



albee3 #75 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 18:39

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From everything I've been reading, my suggestion to all who are thinking of quitting - and I am NOT speaking to Tier 9 and X players, this is the Newcomer's Forum here, I think we should all remember that fact - is to get into Tier 5 and stay there for many months while you train your crews up in skills/perks, and even more importantly, while you learn your OWN skills at the game.  After grinding (and I do mean grinding in the standard sense - playing tanks that I dislike playing every single day, no matter what, to get the x2 bonus so I can eventually get out of that tank) thru all those lower tiers, I speak from my own personal experience when I tell you Tier 5 is where the fun begins in this game.  Yeah, you'll have some Tier 7 games, but you're no longer shooting spitballs at Tier 5, you've got real guns and real tanks (heavy tanks are the real tanks to me, IMO obv).  I highly suggest this game plan for your "WoT career" if you are struggling and thinking of quitting.  It does indeed get better.

capt_jay #76 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 18:47

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View Postalbee3, on Sep 16 2014 - 12:39, said:

From everything I've been reading, my suggestion to all who are thinking of quitting - and I am NOT speaking to Tier 9 and X players, this is the Newcomer's Forum here, I think we should all remember that fact - is to get into Tier 5 and stay there for many months while you train your crews up in skills/perks, and even more importantly, while you learn your OWN skills at the game.  After grinding (and I do mean grinding in the standard sense - playing tanks that I dislike playing every single day, no matter what, to get the x2 bonus so I can eventually get out of that tank) thru all those lower tiers, I speak from my own personal experience when I tell you Tier 5 is where the fun begins in this game.  Yeah, you'll have some Tier 7 games, but you're no longer shooting spitballs at Tier 5, you've got real guns and real tanks (heavy tanks are the real tanks to me, IMO obv).  I highly suggest this game plan for your "WoT career" if you are struggling and thinking of quitting.  It does indeed get better.

 

 

Ding ding ding ding, winner!



Burning_Desire #77 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 18:53

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This game reminds me a lot of golf...

 

I have a crappy hole and score 8 on a par 4 and it's "I hate this game!". The next hole, everything goes right and I score a birdie (4) on a par 5 hole and it's "I love this game!"  Golf has as much RNG as WoT does, but there are some things you can do to mitigate it.

 

That being said, I do hate it when I fire 4 shots at an enemy tank and they all pen, bringing him down to a one-shot kill, then the next 3 shots give 0-damage crits or bounces, but they were all aimed at the exact same (weak)spot. The same enemy then turns his turret and fires a long-range unaimed snap shot that pens me and rolls high, one-shotting me for a kill...



Kuhnini #78 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 18:58

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Good point albee3 as far as this being the Newcomer's forum.  My advice to the newcomers is as follows:  Be prepared to be called a r*t**d and an id**t.  Put your thick skin on because you will need it even at tier 1.  For sure by tier 3 and guaranteed after tier 3.  The way this can change is with the newcomers.  In my book the best way to make this game fun is to treat people with respect.  Admit when you've made a not so smart move in the battle and say so in the chat, heaven forbid, you may even apologize for it.  If someone calls you a name either ignore it or remind them they are not very original or not very classy.  If you get to the point where you are tempted to name call, take a break from the game. 

 

Someone said in an early post to not change the game, then proceeded to tell someone how they need to change.  I disagree with that.  This is a game.  Each player can play it however he or she feels like playing it.  If a player wants to speed right up the tiers, they can do so if they wish.  There may be a price to pay for a certain style of game play but each player is free to do as he or she wants.  Newcomers, don't get to the point after playing for awhile, of telling someone how they have to play the game.  If they want advice that is fine.  Don't get a "better than you" attitude towards other players.  This may sound old fashioned or "corny" as they say but let people play the game how they want to play it as long as it's within the rules of the EULA.  Be respectful and have fun.  Newcomers you will have the choice to make this game more pleasant to play as far as player interaction goes or start the name calling and such and add to what already exists. 

 

As I stated in my earlier post, players are the main reason why I am starting to consider leaving the game.  I realize playing a game on the internet with other human players usually leads to name calling and such but it sure gets old quick.  5700 battles quick to be frank.



Necrophore #79 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 19:05

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View Postskidsteer5, on Sep 15 2014 - 18:11, said:

The game is becoming unplayable because unicum players play in low tier matches platooning. Seal clubbing which happens far too often.

 

Seals can leave the seal-clubbing tiers in an hour or two. I do think players with less than 50 battles should be protected, but everyone else who continues to play at those tiers at some point has to be considered not-a-seal. Players with thousands of battles still complaining about being clubbed aren't seals, they're failed clubbers. 

 

There is also the bigger issue of seals staying seals all the way up the tree. Players are simply not learning the game as they move up in tiers. I can play tier 6 for a week and not see a single teammate that has broken past a 49% winrate. The top tiers are full of 42% platoons that are all dead in the first two minutes, and who are still complaining about "invisitanks". I had a tier 9 battle last week with the tier 6 scout doing more damage than the rest of team combined...with a 57mm gun. There just aren't enough non-seals in the queue to build workable teams on most tiers, and the game is suffering from it.



VariaVespasa #80 Posted Sep 16 2014 - 19:11

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View PostWhiskey_Blue, on Sep 16 2014 - 18:28, said:

 

In a sentence sir: It's because those involved directly in any given social situation are too close to the problem to see it clearly. This is exactly why Fortune 500 companies  regularly hire third party firms to come in, observe and critique the companies operational practices and suggest changes to the business practices of that company. You believe that because I am less experienced than you that i could not possibly have anything of value to contribute, but what you dont see or understand is that I am not talking about tanks or playing the game. I am critiquing the system itself and the state that it has gotten into. Should you wish to instruct me on becoming a better player, then I would gladly listen to everything you say, however we are discussing the deficiencies of the entire system that is the foundation for this game and is currently frustrating enough to a great many players that they are leaving. You and I are comparing apples to oranges. Knowing "the game" is not the same as observing "the system" . They are two completely different paradigms.

Um, your personal initially stated issue was that "until theres an equal or near equal chance of winning a match theres simply no point in playing."  You're a 45% player.  Equal is 49% in this game due to draws accounting for 2%.  You're within 10% of equal.  That IS near equal.  The fact that you cant see that renders your judgement suspect.

 

You make an issue out of number of games played.  I have a lot of games played- am I not allowed to play my tier 1-4's occasionally because few players down at those tiers have many games?  Those are tanks that I've earned, and in a few cases paid real money for, but I'm not allowed to use them?   Only against people with a similar game count?  There arent many people with similar game counts at ANY tier - if I can only play against people with similar game counts MM is going to take a while and I'll see a lot of 5 v 5 etc after 5 minute waits.  Are you suggesting that because I've played so many games I'm essentially no longer allowed to play WoT (or only in severely restricted form) because of the experience imbalance?  If youre big on "fair" explain how *that* is fair.  You dont appear to have thought that all the way through either.  Suspect judgement.

 

You equate number of games played to inherent skill in the game.  It is not.  I have a great many games, yet I'm only a 53% player.  If games inherently equalled skill I would be a God Among Men in WoT.  I am not.  There is a saying - "fail to the top", that is applied to the many players with lots of games running around in top tier tanks with a 46% or lower win rate, including some with similar game counts to me.  Theyre not good players.  Should they be forbidden from playing low tier tanks merely by virtue of their game count, when they have no more skill than the average newbie, and sometimes less?  It should be obvious then that raw game count is not a valid reason to limit MM.  Granted I have allowed you to continue making the mistaken equivalency of game count and skill till now, but if you were indeed the keen and insightful observer whose opinions should be given weight that you wish to be taken as then you shouldnt have made that mistake in the first place.  Your judgement and observational skills are suspect.

 

You suggest that as an outside observer you can see things that those inside cannot.  This is *sometimes* true, but you say its *always* true, and that is blatantly false.  Being an insider does NOT inherently mean youre blind to whatever issues there may be, and being an outside observer doesnt not mean you can inherently spot issues, or even know what the hell youre looking at in the first place.  Hired consultants at least generally have some training in the area theyre consulting on, but you have none.  You give the outsider position far more credit than its due to elevate yourself.  Suspect judgement.  And motivation.

 

Some players are leaving? Of course they are. Its a video game.  They dont hold interest forever, especially since new ones keep coming out with new varieties of shiny etc.  I think my personal max has been 5 years in any one game, but 2-3 years is about the most you can expect from most players.  WoT is 3.5 years old or so, so naturally there are long-time players leaving.  One day I'll leave.  So what?  There are also new players joining.  15 million of them last year, in fact.  The fact that some are leaving is irrelevant in itself.  Its only when more leave than are joining that it becomes an issue at all, and again, so what?  No game lasts forever.  Five years of prime condition is a pretty good run, and again WoT is 3.5 years old.  Did you expect WoT to still be going in 100 years or something?  Its merely that some people who leave are noisy about it, usually because the game didnt cater to them in exactly the way they wanted. It doesnt make them right, or even reasonable in their complaints.  It mostly makes them sound like jilted lovers, but more, like jilted unrequited lovers.  They built a false image in their minds of what WoT should be and fell in love with that, and then because of their emotional investment they get extra hurt/angry when they find out WoT isnt what they thought it was/wanted it to be, and blame WoT rather than themselves for building the false image in the first place.  So they come here to spew their toxin over their self-inflicted hurt to try to get the world to agree that they were right.  They mostly arent.  Its a mistake to believe otherwise without unemotional evidence.  Hence the far-too-often toxic nature of MMO message boards, especially MMOs involving pvp.

 

And last, on your specific post,  I did NOT say "(you) could not possibly have anything of value to contribute".  I EXPLICITLY said, in the very post you were replying to "you are less LIKELY to be right".  Not impossible.  Merely less likely.  Suspect comprehension or outright dishonest intent, neither is a mark in your favor.

 

 

Historical note regarding an earlier post of yours - you commented that with this many games WoT must have been a different game when I started, and I didnt have to face 20+k players as a newbie, unlike todays newbies.  Its true it was different, and I didnt have to face 20+k players back then.  No, instead I had to face fleets of @&#%$ Lowes in tier 5 tanks.  It felt like there were bleeping millions of the damn things.  Certainly 3-5 per game wasnt uncommon, and given that Himmelsdorf was a very common map at the time (with all its tight channels) it meant lots of owie to the face as these monstrous behemoths rolled over my head.  So I'm not entirely convinced that I had it so much easier back then... Different, but not easier.

 

Oh, as to becoming a better player-  Your K/d and damage done/taken ratios are expletive terrible.  Your shot accuracy is mediocre, but not heinous, especially for that tier.  Your survival rate is terrible.  Given that, I suspect your problem is that youre rushing ahead too far and too fast, and running into several enemy tanks at once without any support of your own and thus getting gunned down fast and early.  So my advice to you is the same as I gave to a different player a couple of days ago- slow down, do not go first.  Initially FOLLOW at least 2 other tanks, preferably including at least one heavy, from 50 yards behind, and stay back till 20 seconds after the lead tanks in your section engage the enemy.  Then, and only then, engage yourself and manoeuvre and fire freely for the duration of that local battle.  Once that engagement is concluded, if it is, then get behind at least one other friendly tank (if there are any) and move on to the next fight.  Never be first to engage till you have a better handle on the maps and the various tanks in each match, and have made looking at the minimap a continual habit.






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