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French Tech Tree Revision


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yams42000 #21 Posted Jul 17 2011 - 22:28

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View Postrvail136, on Jul 17 2011 - 17:32, said:

French tanks, excepting the Samoua s35, and the H35...the rest were thouroughly obsolete by the start of the war...when you tie this to infantry based doctrine of the French Army...you end up with stupidity all around.

It would have been better to develop the British line...at least they were on the right track by the end o the war.  The Comet and Centurion were as good as any tanks in 1945.  The French on the otherhand were still stuck in a development of the Char line of obsolete tanks...it's called the AMX50...try reading the Wikipedia entry on this horrible abortion of a tank.

LOOOOL the expert troll again and again! Just looking on your profile, all your posts is against the French...

Lunaris #22 Posted Jul 20 2011 - 12:36

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AMX 50 are based from Panther tank. Probably the only post ww2 tank directly influenced by german tanks. If AMX 50 is bad then entire german medium is also bad.

The reason why AMX 50 canceled because the dead of heavy tank. Almost all heavy tank project canceled. Centurion and IS 3 are the last heavy tank to see combat.

Redwing6 #23 Posted Jul 24 2011 - 00:00

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The Centurion wasn't a heavy tank...it was the last "cruiser" tank produced during/after WW2.  The T10M was essentially that last "heavy"tank produced and was the final derivative of the IS line of tanks.  It saw combat in 1967 and 1973...with heavy losses by the Egyptians.

Lunaris #24 Posted Jul 24 2011 - 15:50

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Funny don't you think if Centurion and T 10 weight the same yet T 10 is faster.

martingalindo #25 Posted Jul 26 2011 - 18:13

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sorry, For my opinion the AMX65t is going to tier 8, then AMX68t tier 9 and AMX70t tier 10. It is more logical. Its only my opinion.

Echo_Sniper #26 Posted Jul 26 2011 - 21:49

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The FCM 50t looks like a VK4502 ausf A.

Noah56 #27 Posted Aug 13 2011 - 04:29

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news flash i found a pic on WoT about the new french tech tree (sorry i @%$#! lost it) and they also say it will be the USSR German then american then the british and japenese after that. no plan on italian tanks. if so i want to get one and yell PASTA!!!! at the beginning of each battle

MR_magician_PK #28 Posted Aug 13 2011 - 19:06

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what about this tank
http://forum.worldof...c/53692-amx-46/

Sparviero #29 Posted Aug 13 2011 - 20:10

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View PostNoah56, on Aug 13 2011 - 04:29, said:

news flash i found a pic on WoT about the new french tech tree (sorry i @%$#! lost it) and they also say it will be the USSR German then american then the british and japenese after that. no plan on italian tanks. if so i want to get one and yell PASTA!!!! at the beginning of each battle

I'd rather yell  Baccalà alla Vicentina. Watcha gonna do when the cod hits you? :Smile-izmena:

ps

I ated all your cats.

Ariecho #30 Posted Aug 16 2011 - 19:30

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View Postrvail136, on Jul 17 2011 - 17:32, said:

French tanks, excepting the Samoua s35, and the H35...the rest were thouroughly obsolete by the start of the war...when you tie this to infantry based doctrine of the French Army...you end up with stupidity all around.

It would have been better to develop the British line...at least they were on the right track by the end o the war.  The Comet and Centurion were as good as any tanks in 1945.  The French on the otherhand were still stuck in a development of the Char line of obsolete tanks...it's called the AMX50...try reading the Wikipedia entry on this horrible abortion of a tank.

You Sir, are incorrect.  While the French doctrine was awful, the tanks were actually better than what the Germans had to oppose in 1940.  Only the 88mm guns and the Luftwaffe could inflict any damage on them.  As a matter of fact, the Wermacht incorporated some of the French tanks into its own ranks, a fact that is actually also reported into this very game.

Sparviero #31 Posted Aug 16 2011 - 20:38

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View PostAriecho, on Aug 16 2011 - 19:30, said:

You Sir, are incorrect.  While the French doctrine was awful, the tanks were actually better than what the Germans had to oppose in 1940.  Only the 88mm guns and the Luftwaffe could inflict any damage on them.  As a matter of fact, the Wermacht incorporated some of the French tanks into its own ranks, a fact that is actually also reported into this very game.

The 8.8cm got the fame the 10.5cm did the work in the BoF. :P

XenomorphZZ #32 Posted Aug 26 2011 - 04:04

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-blink-

I just noticed this particualr heavy isnt mentioned anywhere...
http://www.chars-fra...id=53&Itemid=41

The competition of the ARL-44, the Char SOMUA SM

LoooSeR78V #33 Posted Aug 26 2011 - 13:45

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Multiturret system will be implemented in 2012, after french tanks introduction (wich will be in ~october) :( . Some french low-tier heavys wil have provlems...
About Somua SM - i think that ARL-44 will be better choise for game, becouse Somua SM look like AMX-50-100, while ARL have different look  :lol:

Souroy #34 Posted Sep 01 2011 - 20:24

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A little update about the FCM 50t (direct copy/paste from the EU forum  ^_^ ):


Finally !

Gentlemen, let me introduce the FCM 50t:

Posted Image

Posted Image

Posted Image

Project from December 1945 and rival of the AMX-50.

Length : 7.40m (8.19m with gun)
Height : 3.02m
Width : 3.57m
Weight : 54.240t

Crew : 5
Armor : 120mm max
Gun : 90mm SA45 (91 shells)

Engine : Maybach at 1000hp (HL 295 ?)
Speed : 51 km/h max

More details on Chars-français.

Personally it make me think of an improved ARL-44, the shape of the hull is similar (as well as the tracks), same armament but a better top speed and sides armor (visual estimation) while being globally smaller.

A nice Tier 7 ?

XenomorphZZ #35 Posted Sep 02 2011 - 00:51

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Buggeration and ... wow souroy...

Looks like the French's attempt to make a KT look like a T-34...

Still want it in the game =D

Redwing6 #36 Posted Sep 03 2011 - 00:38

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View PostAriecho, on Aug 16 2011 - 19:30, said:

You Sir, are incorrect.  While the French doctrine was awful, the tanks were actually better than what the Germans had to oppose in 1940.  Only the 88mm guns and the Luftwaffe could inflict any damage on them.  As a matter of fact, the Wermacht incorporated some of the French tanks into its own ranks, a fact that is actually also reported into this very game.

No sir, you are the one who is incorrect.  The best of the French tanks at the start of the war only had 1 or two man turrets where the commander also doubled as either the gunner or the loader.  Nor did they routinely mount radios.  Additionally, they were armed with low velocity guns (47mm's).  Having the tank commander either firing or loading dramatically reduced his ability to control either his vehicle...or in the case of platoon and company comanders their commands...since they couldn't contact individual vehicles on radios.  It's a myth that their tanks wer superior to german vehicles.

Starting with the Pz III every single German vehicle had a 3 man turret...which allowed vehicle commanders to direct not just their own vehicles but others as well,  since they had radios in  ALL their tanks.  These two seemingly isolated technical items ALLOWED their superior doctrine to scythe through the French and British forces.  The Germans only suffered 2 reverses one by a battalion of Matilda II's @ Arras (oh, and just how does the game justify mounting a 76.2mm gun on a tank that couldn't take a gun larger than a 2 pdr/40mm???? the mind boggles, but I digress). The 2nd reverse was by the division commanded by Charles DeGaul, but they were unable to exploit their sucess as most of the French tanks either ran out of fuel, broke down, or ran out of ammunition.

Thus, as, I have shown, French tanks were NOT superior to German designs in any real way.

Ramki #37 Posted Sep 03 2011 - 08:03

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View PostAriecho, on Aug 16 2011 - 19:30, said:

You Sir, are incorrect.  While the French doctrine was awful, the tanks were actually better than what the Germans had to oppose in 1940.  Only the 88mm guns and the Luftwaffe could inflict any damage on them.  As a matter of fact, the Wermacht incorporated some of the French tanks into its own ranks, a fact that is actually also reported into this very game.
Don't fight the "Know it all Troll".


I am looking forward to all the new tanks that will be in play though.

GoodGameXXX #38 Posted Sep 06 2011 - 20:10

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I'd like a lot of love for the American and British lend-lease to the Free French 2nd Armored division, maybe as premiums.

That should include the Valentine, M3 Stuart, M5, M4 variants at the least.


At RVAIL,  +1 about the radios.

Tiger_23 #39 Posted Sep 06 2011 - 20:41

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Take you French tank and BOOM !



lol

Drakenred #40 Posted Sep 06 2011 - 20:42

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ok lets review

durring the Battle for France, Germany had

627 Panzer IIIs and IVs
228 Panzer 38(t)(2 man turret)
106 Czech Panzer 35(t)(2 man turret)
955 Panzer II (2 man turret)
523 were Panzer Is(1 man turret)

basicaly the bulk of the  German tank force were obsolete 1 and 2 man tanks. most of the tanks were armed with a gun that was the equal of the french 37mm gun, and none were the equal of the french 47mm.

Ironicaly the problem was that French (for the infantry tank units) saw tanks basicaly filling a role taken by sutch vehicls as the Bradly and Striker. they just never had the production to meet that goal.

basicaly the goal was to have literal swarms of light tanks armed with a 37 or 47mm anti tank gun blanketing the battlefeild, with a forth of the tanks being so heavily armored that the Panzer IIIs and IVs would have been bouncing rounds off the armor. In fact, not counting the towed and truck mounted anti tank weapons, the light tanks alone in the planed "40 Division" for France would have been pointing more anti tank guns at german divisios than the germans had guns and morters in an infantry AND an armored division.

basicaly france had 3 problems

1 they may have overinvested in fortifications
2 the did not invest in tank production even though there entire war plan (including the fortification) had actualy called for a larger tank park than what they ended up with
3 they had poor tactical doctrins and poor comunications

had France come anywhere close to that goal with a properly trained tank core in the infantry, the French infantry divisions, even with the "penny packet" distibution of tanks would have seriously outgunned Germany by 1 47mm equiped tank for EVERY TANK in the german division, and 2-3 37mm gun equiped tanks. and many of the german tanks would have still been armed with underpowered guns compared to the armor they were going up again.

makes you wonder about the invetment in steel in the french fortifications.




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