Jump to content


Panther not feeling the love


  • This topic is locked This topic is locked
45 replies to this topic

Poll: Panther not feeling the love (89 members have cast votes)

What module on your panther is destroyed the most (multipule choices now enabled)

  1. Gun (35 votes [15.35%])

    Percentage of vote: 15.35%

  2. Turret (16 votes [7.02%])

    Percentage of vote: 7.02%

  3. Engine (45 votes [19.74%])

    Percentage of vote: 19.74%

  4. Tracks (32 votes [14.04%])

    Percentage of vote: 14.04%

  5. Radio (12 votes [5.26%])

    Percentage of vote: 5.26%

  6. Periscope (9 votes [3.95%])

    Percentage of vote: 3.95%

  7. Ammorack (59 votes [25.88%])

    Percentage of vote: 25.88%

  8. Fuel tank (20 votes [8.77%])

    Percentage of vote: 8.77%

Do you feel that the panther is in dire need of defencive upgrades

  1. Definately (51 votes [57.30%])

    Percentage of vote: 57.30%

  2. Somewhat (27 votes [30.34%])

    Percentage of vote: 30.34%

  3. Not really (7 votes [7.87%])

    Percentage of vote: 7.87%

  4. Not at all (4 votes [4.49%])

    Percentage of vote: 4.49%

Vote Hide poll

MisterLemons #1 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 04:51

    Captain

  • Players
  • 36207 battles
  • 1,048
  • Member since:
    03-03-2011
It would seem that wargamings benine neglect to the german tree could be summed up as the almighty panther. Completely stock, this thing is absoloutely terrible. Fully upgraded, you still have the problems as when it was stock, only now its the fully upgraded modules being taken out. I dont know WHAT the hell wargaming has done to this thing but it isnt right. The entire hull is an engine hitbox as well the the whole unbelieveably thin side being an ammorack, even the rear side where the engine is apprears to be an ammorack hitbox. Something just does not add up. Either the programming of the game is wrong and the armor is technicly not slopped at all or it is set to be in all reality only aout 40mm thick, because leopards penitrate my frontal armor at times. Every hit penitrates, every hit damages. My VK(DB) bounces more shots and has the same frontal armor in the same tier matches.

They claimed to make the outlandishly large hitboxes more covered by adding an astonishing and breathtaking 2mm of armor to the lower front of the hull. A whole mother ******* 1/5th of a centimeter (not an inch, not half inch, one fifth of a CENTIMETER) of frontal armor to the LOWER HALF. Because the 200mm+ penitration of the T54s, lowes, KV5s, pershings, and every other vehicle (and i mean EVERY vehicle it encounters) was not taken into account.

A question to wargaming. What in the HELL are you guys doing with the money forked over by players. It certainly doesnt go into upgraded traffic capable servers to subdue lag. Its not going into game designers who have half a clue on how to ballance opposing vehicles. Sure not being spent on anything player related. Where does it all go and why does it not take part in a better gaming experience?

RolandVH #2 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 05:17

    Captain

  • Beta Testers
  • 36253 battles
  • 1,654
  • [XMCX] XMCX
  • Member since:
    12-13-2010
Stock Panther is definitely terrible. I hope the Panther II [and later, the E-50] are more competitive.

Goldensaver #3 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 05:18

    Staff sergeant

  • Players
  • 6890 battles
  • 398
  • Member since:
    04-14-2011
Can I check all the buttons, as fire breaks everything, and happens all the time in a Panther? Having a fire extinguisher doesn't even help, as the second shot will start another fire.

hectorjr21 #4 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 05:23

    Captain

  • Beta Testers
  • 15580 battles
  • 1,081
  • [SPIDY] SPIDY
  • Member since:
    12-21-2010

View PostMisterLemons, on Jun 06 2011 - 04:51, said:

Huge whine post. Too big to quote.
The Panther takes less module damage than the T44 and the T23.('Nuff said.) The Panther when fully upgraded IMO is the best tier 8 medium, better gun than the T23/T44, same mobility, better armor than the T23, only drawback is the huge profile.

XenomorphZZ #5 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 05:40

    Major

  • Beta Testers
  • 12556 battles
  • 4,665
  • [RSRC] RSRC
  • Member since:
    01-24-2011
O_o What the hell?
For one thing, a panther does NOT have the same mobility as a T23. The T23 can GTFO when it needs to anytime, not so much for the panther...
I question that the long 88mm on the panther is generally better than the 90mm M3 on the T23

Oh one more thing,
You're attempt at crude humor fails with the edited quote.

MisterLemons #6 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 05:40

    Captain

  • Players
  • 36207 battles
  • 1,048
  • Member since:
    03-03-2011

View Posthectorjr21, on Jun 06 2011 - 05:23, said:

I speak lies
That is impossible good sir as the game would simply be unplayable in said tanks. There are more T44s and T23s than one can count, while panthers seem to be really lacking in numbers, almost as much so with its armor. Every hit, every explosion, so much as one tank LOOKING at a panther will break something GUARENTEED.

THORNS #7 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 05:50

    Corporal

  • Players
  • 21984 battles
  • 92
  • Member since:
    03-12-2011
I have an elite 3002DB and currently grinding some exp to unlock the Tiger when the new tech tree arrives, but after reading so many complains (not just in this topic) I doubt I sell the DB, I wonder if its even worth to try the Panther, not to mention I dont have premium so the grind to fully upgrade it is gonna be nasty and I'm gonna lose credits every match.

hectorjr21 #8 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 06:04

    Captain

  • Beta Testers
  • 15580 battles
  • 1,081
  • [SPIDY] SPIDY
  • Member since:
    12-21-2010

View PostMisterLemons, on Jun 06 2011 - 05:40, said:

That is impossible good sir as the game would simply be unplayable in said tanks. There are more T44s and T23s than one can count, while panthers seem to be really lacking in numbers, almost as much so with its armor. Every hit, every explosion, so much as one tank LOOKING at a panther will break something GUARENTEED.
I played the Panther for over 200 battles, and I'm current upgrading my Panther 2. I speak out of experience, and the Panther has normal module damage, your just exaggerating.

View PostXenomorphZZ, on Jun 06 2011 - 05:40, said:

O_o What the hell?
For one thing, a panther does NOT have the same mobility as a T23. The T23 can GTFO when it needs to anytime, not so much for the panther...
I question that the long 88mm on the panther is generally better than the 90mm M3 on the T23

Oh one more thing,
You're attempt at crude humor fails with the edited quote.
The Panther is slightly slower than the T23, thats pretty much it.(fully upgraded of course)
You question that the Long 88 isn't better than the 90mm M3? Have you seen their stats? The Long 88 has a higher ROF than the 90mm(9.84vs8.40), better penetration(203mm vs 160mm), better accuracy(0.3vs0.33); while the 90mm has .5 better aiming time and 20 more damage.

Valeriadrina #9 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 16:18

    Staff sergeant

  • Beta Testers
  • 0 battles
  • 289
  • Member since:
    08-12-2010
I`d say Panther has bit of a problem with gun getting knocked out and especially with engine hits from front. I wish there was engine HP boosting module available to germans like russian cyclone filters. I think I`d replace one of my mods with that...  :Smile-bajan2:

handyman84 #10 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 17:23

    Corporal

  • Beta Testers
  • 4646 battles
  • 70
  • Member since:
    11-30-2010
What they need to do is make the gearbox for all tanks it's own module. Damage to it will reduce top speed, not acel. No fires.

MisterLemons #11 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 18:27

    Captain

  • Players
  • 36207 battles
  • 1,048
  • Member since:
    03-03-2011

View Posthectorjr21, on Jun 06 2011 - 06:04, said:

I played the Panther for over 200 battles, and I'm current upgrading my Panther 2. I speak out of experience, and the Panther has normal module damage, your just exaggerating.


The Panther is slightly slower than the T23, thats pretty much it.(fully upgraded of course)
You question that the Long 88 isn't better than the 90mm M3? Have you seen their stats? The Long 88 has a higher ROF than the 90mm(9.84vs8.40), better penetration(203mm vs 160mm), better accuracy(0.3vs0.33); while the 90mm has .5 better aiming time and 20 more damage.
Its not the speed, its the turning and acceleration. I dont blame that because american armor in WWII was designed with quantity in mind and were therefore lightly armored. So the redial engine in some of them was powering a paperweight moving faster than a tigers turret could move at 100 yards

That doesnt change the point though. Panther recieves every other blow as a critical hit and simply does not have the mobility to hassel out of the prediciment.

Second, you must be a camper because thats the only way you could possibly take no module damage. JUST came from a battle where a shot from a T1 to my front wrecked the engine and a shot to my ass end took out the turret, then their stug buddy came from the front and completely stopped my engine this time. Dont give the players that BS, the module damage is insane and its like driving around in a box made of glass. At least the DB was solid. This things whopping 50mm of armor between the ammorack and the round shot at it isnt enough. Its just letting thr rounds right through. A godamn tier 2 tank could wreck my panther at this rate.

XenomorphZZ #12 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 18:34

    Major

  • Beta Testers
  • 12556 battles
  • 4,665
  • [RSRC] RSRC
  • Member since:
    01-24-2011

View Posthectorjr21, on Jun 06 2011 - 06:04, said:

I played the Panther for over 200 battles, and I'm current upgrading my Panther 2. I speak out of experience, and the Panther has normal module damage, your just exaggerating.


The Panther is slightly slower than the T23, thats pretty much it.(fully upgraded of course)
You question that the Long 88 isn't better than the 90mm M3? Have you seen their stats? The Long 88 has a higher ROF than the 90mm(9.84vs8.40), better penetration(203mm vs 160mm), better accuracy(0.3vs0.33); while the 90mm has .5 better aiming time and 20 more damage.
I have panther 2 and pershing... I speak outta expierecne too.

KillingMeSoftly #13 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 18:48

    Captain

  • Beta Testers
  • 8741 battles
  • 1,358
  • Member since:
    10-04-2010
I'm halfway to the Panther right now.

I had both the Panther and Panther II in beta, so I can't speak on their performance in the current patch and environment.  But the Panther was a wonderful tank when I had it, and its gun is great.  Once you hit Tier 6 and Tier 7.. tanks will do enough damage per shot to reliably wreck your modules.  This is just normal; I've never had a high level tank that didn't take module damage during a fight.  Some fights are worse than others, but honestly it happens.  Even on my Soviet tanks I'll get my engine wrecked and get caught on fire from frontal shots.

In my experience the most fragile part of the Panther is the ammo rack but that's true for many tanks.

evanb90 #14 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 19:13

    Staff sergeant

  • Beta Testers
  • 17908 battles
  • 335
  • Member since:
    09-01-2010
I got to the Panther II during the beta, during the 5x thing. I had done extremely well in the T23 (my average EXP was close to 850 and rising) and had shot at T-44s/T-54s so much that I knew their general capabilities and respected them. Panther just never seemed that impressive to me. To me, it was a pretty boring tank, basically a Tiger with a 50% higher top speed. And I had one of those in my garage at the time.

You did the same things with the Panther as you did with the Tiger. Avoid dog-fighting and brawling like the plague and hang back whenever possible. The biggest difference is that you wouldn't be yelled at when going up hills, like on Malinovka, Himmelsdorf, Prokhorovka.  :P

Panther II on the other hand, just felt sub-par. Pershing (which I had also) and T-54 had personality, there was something more to them than their guns. T-54 had the mobility and the armor that made it a shock and awe tank. Pershing had the gun depression, on-the-move accuracy that gave it a lot of flexibility. Panther II felt like a 105mm L/52 Ausf B strapped to a rocket.

To answer the poll questions
1-  I marked everything. I don't know how it is post 0.6.4, but when I had it in the beta, the module damage was completely over the top. No one-shot ammo rack stuff but losing something on every shot was extremely common. Picking between ammo rack and gun to repair was painful in ways I can't quite describe.
I remember once burning down a Panther in my T-34 with ONE 57mm shot to the side. After he died, I apologized in all-chat that it was a BS shot that shouldn't have done that before he said anything. (or he probably just rage-quit immediately and went on to his next tank)
I also once got hit by a M5 Stuart with the 75mm ONE TIME in the rear (on Himmelsdorf, on the hill), got set on fire, took 1000 HP damage and would have died had I not fixed ammo-rack. He must have been laughing too hard because he ran into a wall and I slowly turned around, rammed into him and then shot him.

As KillingMeSoftly says though, it's not that exceptional. T-44s are infamous for the ammo-rack issue and T23 has pretty bad crew death.

2- Panther armor will perform better at Tier 7.

Fazar #15 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 19:17

    Major

  • Players
  • 13593 battles
  • 3,758
  • [PBKAC] PBKAC
  • Member since:
    04-28-2011
[Previously mean conversation I'm revoking.]

Nimnthor #16 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 19:30

    Staff sergeant

  • Beta Testers
  • 5419 battles
  • 375
  • Member since:
    10-25-2010
The Panther was horribly disappointing for me in beta after playing the VKDB, the Panther II was a lot better (but still suffered from the abundance of T-54s). I had a 43% win rate in Panther, 58% in VKDB, I contributed so much more dogfighting with the DB's short 88 than attempting to snipe with the Panther.

Not enough alpha to play peekaboo, huge visible fire-prone inadequately-armored target if you try to sit still and snipe, not enough mobility/dps to dogfight, only 200 more hp than the VKDB. I could never find an effective way to play it and I pretty much felt like I was dooming my team if I was at the top of the list (and based on my win rate that pretty much was the case).

Luffwaffle #17 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 19:59

    First lieutenant

  • Players
  • 6863 battles
  • 795
  • Member since:
    04-22-2011

View Posthectorjr21, on Jun 06 2011 - 05:23, said:

The Panther takes less module damage than the T44 and the T23.('Nuff said.) The Panther when fully upgraded IMO is the best tier 8 medium, better gun than the T23/T44, same mobility, better armor than the T23, only drawback is the huge profile.

We obviously aren't using the same tank. Every hit I take in my Panter breaks a module. I bounce less things than my DB against the same Tier tanks, and I get lit on fire every other game.

When I shoot a T-44 I never get critical hits, same for the T-23, but when I shoot another panther I always get a critical hit.

hectorjr21 #18 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 20:00

    Captain

  • Beta Testers
  • 15580 battles
  • 1,081
  • [SPIDY] SPIDY
  • Member since:
    12-21-2010

View PostMisterLemons, on Jun 06 2011 - 18:27, said:

Its not the speed, its the turning and acceleration. I dont blame that because american armor in WWII was designed with quantity in mind and were therefore lightly armored. So the redial engine in some of them was powering a paperweight moving faster than a tigers turret could move at 100 yards

That doesnt change the point though. Panther recieves every other blow as a critical hit and simply does not have the mobility to hassel out of the prediciment.

Second, you must be a camper because thats the only way you could possibly take no module damage. JUST came from a battle where a shot from a T1 to my front wrecked the engine and a shot to my ass end took out the turret, then their stug buddy came from the front and completely stopped my engine this time. Dont give the players that BS, the module damage is insane and its like driving around in a box made of glass. At least the DB was solid. This things whopping 50mm of armor between the ammorack and the round shot at it isnt enough. Its just letting thr rounds right through. A godamn tier 2 tank could wreck my panther at this rate.
I never said I don't take module damage, I said I take average module damage, similar to all my other tanks; and no, I didn't just camp in my Panther.
The Panther doesn't have mobility? Upgrade the engines, then you'll have all the mobility that you will ever need.
Looking at your stats, it shows that you only play the German medium line, which means you have no other tank to compare it to.

View PostXenomorphZZ, on Jun 06 2011 - 18:34, said:

I have panther 2 and pershing... I speak outta expierecne too.
I have no way of knowing that, since with the account you are using on the forums you have no battles with.

MisterLemons #19 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 20:02

    Captain

  • Players
  • 36207 battles
  • 1,048
  • Member since:
    03-03-2011

View PostFazar, on Jun 06 2011 - 19:17, said:

Honestly... hard to take you serious anymore.
Please do shut up and have a piece of the cake. You cant take me seriously because youre stalking the guy who you cannot in any way relate to. You dont want to take me seriously? Fine, GTFO and leave me alone for five minute, mom...

Get yourself a panther, get out of the bush ans start playing world of tanks. Only then will you understand what I am talking about at any one time. Players are a minority, campers, rush-in's, and general idiots are the majority...

Fazar #20 Posted Jun 06 2011 - 20:24

    Major

  • Players
  • 13593 battles
  • 3,758
  • [PBKAC] PBKAC
  • Member since:
    04-28-2011

View PostMisterLemons, on Jun 06 2011 - 20:02, said:

Please do shut up and have a piece of the cake. You cant take me seriously because youre stalking the guy who you cannot in any way relate to. You dont want to take me seriously? Fine, GTFO and leave me alone for five minute, mom...

Get yourself a panther, get out of the bush ans start playing world of tanks. Only then will you understand what I am talking about at any one time. Players are a minority, campers, rush-in's, and general idiots are the majority...


I do plan on getting 'every' tank one day so I can properly compare them, and I have gone German Vehicles lately to see what the big deal was about.

The reason I can't take you seriously is when I(among others) confronted you with logical conversation, critique, and otherwise even helpful advice about your posting habbits, you're response was silence.  Any attempt at rational discussion is reduced to either being overally negative, or ignoring anything helpful like you did.  You obviously like to talk back when you're made fun of, but when someone outstreches a hand, and offers some advice, you shut down.

Also I understand you perfectly well.  You're a man who has only played German Tanks, and thus you can only look at a problem from one side.  You see yourself doing terrible in said tank, so the immediate response to anyone who provides a counter arguement of other vehicles of the same tier being in the same boat, or perhaps worse is "It has to be lies".

Now if you actually weighed opinions, and compared facts properly, you might come off less as a jaded, jealous player who feels robbed, and your words might hold more weight.  Oh and Hyperboles don't help much either.




1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users