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Endyrym #1 Posted Jan 21 2016 - 05:49

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Hello fellow tankers! I want to talk to everyone about the subject: Mac vs PC. Ok, ok, yes I agree, Mac's may not be the best computer for gaming, but you got to admit they are Top quality computers for editing photos, videos, and other projects. Many famous Youtuber's use Mac's to edit their videos, Even PIXAR uses Macs to animate their videos. PC on the other hand are top notch for games. PC's definitely have a advantage when it comes to games. Many games are created especially for PC's which makes the selection for Macs quite small. But that doesn't mean that Mac users Can't play games. Yes I may have my settings on standard - high getting up to 120 fps, but that doesn't make the Mac community "Bad" or "Stupid" (As a lot of PC users call them). Lets try to get along as fellow gamers. I am not hating on the PC users. I most likely will get a PC some day. My Point is that gamers are not better or worst because of the computer they use. PC are awesome and Macs are awesome. Phew... Just had to get this off my chest. What do you guys think?



dagengster #2 Posted Jan 21 2016 - 05:51

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Theyre not "bad" computers... its just they are very expensive for what they offer :P

I think this is one of the main the reasons why PC people like PC more...

also that PCs can be more easily modified and updated/upgraded to keep up with current day pace...

and PCs can run certain programs MACs cant (but this more depends on what the user is going for)...

and in terms of raw power, PCs can be build to be much more powerful than what any macs can offer


But although Im a strict PC guy, Macs do have certain advantages, like fancy silvery metal casing, nice glossy screens and etc.

I kind of view this argument as more like comparing a Rolls Royce, some import tuner car and a Bugatti. Depends on what you want.



Andrew9998 #3 Posted Jan 21 2016 - 05:53

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Lets get this strait...you are saying 120 fps makes the "mac community" look bad...Well I have some news for you! There is a large percentage of players who cant get above 20 fps m8...Otherwise, you seem to be a mac fan and so be it. 

 

 



SatyrAngel #4 Posted Jan 21 2016 - 06:00

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View Postdagengster, on Jan 20 2016 - 21:51, said:

Theyre not "bad" computers... its just they are very expensive for what they offer :P

I think this is one of the main the reasons why PC people like PC more... also that PCs can be more easily modified and updated/upgraded to keep up with current day pace... and PCs can run certain programs MACs (but this more depends on what the user is going for)

But although Im a strict PC guy, Macs do have certain advantages, like fancy silvery metal casing, nice screens and etc.

 

And if you want a Unix system you can always get a Linux distro.

I signed for an Apple Dev licence and the environment was pretty awful (then again, that was 4-5 years ago), i will pick Fedora, Devian or Archlinux any day.



Quagalicious #5 Posted Jan 21 2016 - 07:30

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They aren't top quality computers for editing photos, videos, music and or other projects. Oh I love those companies who invest into Mac's to deal with those special software licences, and all the special peripheral's needed for mac's... oh gg much laughs.

 

They still use boot camp to simulate windows on their systems to even use windows applications. 

It's like owning a gimped computer with alienware branding.. too hilarious.



Medessec #6 Posted Jan 21 2016 - 08:37

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Macintosh computers are the farthest thing from high quality.

 

Almost every aspect of their construction is to exploit value for money on manufacturing, and to wring dry the consumers on replacement/repair if something happens to the device. And this applies to all Apple devices.

 

Macbooks are made with adhesives and uniform chassis construction, they're not easily taken apart and most of the critical hardware such as the RAM and even the SSD/HDD, is soldered onto the motherboard. If you take a device to Apple and tell them something is wrong with it, they usually end up tossing out the whole thing and giving you a whole new one.

 

Apple has no care for you as the consumer. They understand that you know nothing better about computers, and are willing to sacrifice a predominant amount of your paycheck just to have a reliable form of computing. This is classic brand painting and exploitation, and monopolization. From a moral standpoint, I despise Apple for this reason, and will strongly recommend to anyone I know NOT to buy an Apple product. To be fair, a lot of other manufacturers are adopting this model, the laptop industry in general is headed in this direction... and smartphones all follow this model, but Apple relishes completely off of it and doesn't really even innovate or push a unique technology anymore.

 

 

If you want a high quality, sturdy, reliable machine that will work 100% and is easy and simple to repair, buy a Lenovo Thinkpad W520. Tech Centers love Thinkpads, and will usually charge you lower hourly rates to fix them, and it's even possible to fix most problems with them yourself, because they come apart like legos. Parts are a dime a dozen on Ebay/Amazon, and the machines themselves are extremely durable and survive punishment very well, especially if you get a good one. They're also pretty cheap for what you get, I'm seeing W520s for $300-$500 now, and a W520 with Nvidia Quadro 1000M will play World of Tanks on medium to high settings with consistent framerates.



Isola_di_Fano #7 Posted Jan 21 2016 - 08:46

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I am no tech guy, FAR from it, and I do not want to spend time to learn the in and outs of computers:

 

I have a MAC for pictures and Bootcap for WoT.

 

I do not mind spending the extra money, my time is more valuable to me.



Urdr #8 Posted Jan 21 2016 - 10:20

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View PostIsola_di_Fano, on Jan 21 2016 - 04:46, said:

I am no tech guy, FAR from it, and I do not want to spend time to learn the in and outs of computers:

 

I have a MAC for pictures and Bootcap for WoT.

 

I do not mind spending the extra money, my time is more valuable to me.

"I dont know and I dont wanna know"

Brilliant

 

Well, in mi 3rd world country, ppl is like "I want a pc, that keyboard and monitor looks good, I buy it"



vonkevin #9 Posted Jan 21 2016 - 10:49

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I am not any kind of Computechnogeekatron.  That said, fiddling with componentry inside a confuser case is no more complicated than changing your own oil.  I just want a machine that works, does what I want it to do, when I want it to do it, and doesn't cost me the Gross National Product of Canada to obtain.

 

No half-eaten rotten fruit for this kid, and it tickles me no end when the Macistas tell me about all the problems I have because of running windows...because I don't ever seem to have those problems. 

 

There is not one single thing that some $3500 Mac can do, that my built-it-myself-on-a-budget $700 Windows7 PC can't do.  NOTHING.

 

I have a REALLY nice DSLR & several lenses that I bought with the money I saved by not buying a Mac.

 

I will be happy as all get out to let you all know whenever I run across one of those mythical problems the Macitude people tell me I am supposed to have, but in 20+ years of having computers & being online, I have yet to run into any of them.



Doomslinger #10 Posted Jan 21 2016 - 10:55

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pc master race bro.  You know it, I know it, everyone knows it.  You will be assimilated, resistance is futile...

Mercer_Keel #11 Posted Jan 21 2016 - 11:28

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Moguai #12 Posted Jan 21 2016 - 11:51

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I'm sorry OP but Macs and Apple products are made for the Tech Illiterate people of this world. And as mentioned above there is nothing the a Mac can do that a PC can do as well and in many cases better at a fraction of the price.

 

Also "Point is that gamers are not better or worst because of the computer they use" is a totally false statement as someone trying to play with 15fps will be handicapped vs a player that is getting 60fps on average. So yeah it really does matter on what computer they use.



dstud208 #13 Posted Jan 21 2016 - 17:28

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Amen bro!! Couldn't agree with you more!!

 

View PostMoguai, on Jan 21 2016 - 03:51, said:

I'm sorry OP but Macs and Apple products are made for the Tech Illiterate people of this world. And as mentioned above there is nothing the a Mac can do that a PC can do as well and in many cases better at a fraction of the price.

 

Also "Point is that gamers are not better or worst because of the computer they use" is a totally false statement as someone trying to play with 15fps will be handicapped vs a player that is getting 60fps on average. So yeah it really does matter on what computer they use.

 

Well thats not entirely true. The correct statement would be be "There is no GAME a Mac can do that a PC can do as well for a fraction of the price", there are lots of things a PC can't do any better than a mac for the same $$$ of hardware. If you truly compare ALL the stats and build/buy yourself a truly equivalent PC (not better, not worse, but the same) you will end up spending about the exact same price. Perfect example of this is the Dell XPS 15. The thing is, macs are workstation class computers. They are built for the office, for programs that require powerful chips across the board, not just one mega powerful graphics card. Also side note: I get 60+ fps on medium settings, not amazing but also not "limiting" as you put it.
 
Yes, PC's are  much better for gaming (generally) for the same $, not trying to argue with that. But mac's aren't made for gaming, they're made for the workplace. Something thats left over from the old days of trying to be taken seriously, back when Mac's Apple computers were the go-to gaming hardware - a position that was viewed to be "inferior". 
 
Anyways, the point is lets all just be friends! We are here to enjoy a game! It really doesn't matter what hardware your using as long as you can play and have fun!


Isola_di_Fano #14 Posted Jan 21 2016 - 21:42

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View PostUrdr, on Jan 21 2016 - 04:20, said:

"I dont know and I dont wanna know"

Brilliant

 

 

I also agree, it is brilliant.

No time to learn stuff that is of no interest to me, ergo I will spent the extra money.

 

I would rather spend time doing things that interest me. Simple.

 

View PostMercer_Keel, on Jan 21 2016 - 05:28, said:

 

Awww a classic.

Watch the Beethoven vs Bieber, also a classic :)

 


Edited by Isola_di_Fano, Jan 21 2016 - 21:49.


black_colt #15 Posted Jan 21 2016 - 23:22

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View Postdagengster, on Jan 21 2016 - 05:51, said:

Theyre not "bad" computers... its just they are very expensive for what they offer :P

I think this is one of the main the reasons why PC people like PC more...

also that PCs can be more easily modified and updated/upgraded to keep up with current day pace...

and PCs can run certain programs MACs cant (but this more depends on what the user is going for)...

and in terms of raw power, PCs can be build to be much more powerful than what any macs can offer


But although Im a strict PC guy, Macs do have certain advantages, like fancy silvery metal casing, nice glossy screens and etc.

I kind of view this argument as more like comparing a Rolls Royce, some import tuner car and a Bugatti. Depends on what you want.

 

I challenge your statement that they are very expensive for what they offer - please provide detailed information so we can draw conclusions.

 

I have two IBM workstations [at one time ran one of the following - OS/2 v3 and v4, Windows 2000, Windows NT 4, SuSE Linux, Solaris for Intel, Ubuntu, MS Windows 7 Pro, MS Windows 8 Pro, and MS Windows 10 Pro] and two iMacs [both dual-boot with OS X 10.11 and MS Windows 10 Pro] at home. So I am familiar with the hardware and the OS[s] including their strengths and weaknesses.

 

I am not aware of a pre-built machine [runs either MS Windows or Linux] that matches the exact or has better specifications than that of the 27-inch iMac 5k Retina [uses a single screen form factor] and is less expensive.  Please prove me wrong.

 

As for running certain programs - that can be said about MS Windows and Linux as they cannot run some applications from other OS[s] - how is that a disadvantage for OS X only?

 

And lets be honest - how much time and money have you really spent fixing issues on MS Windows hardware [i.e. looking for a driver, making sure the pins are configured correctly, not having the OS recognize the new hardware]?

 

As for raw power - do you mean how fast it can go with sub-zero cooling, a set of fans that sound like aircraft taking off, etc.? Raw numbers mean nothing if you cannot use them without your machine being on the verge of melting.

 


Edited by black_colt, Jan 21 2016 - 23:33.


black_colt #16 Posted Jan 21 2016 - 23:35

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View PostMoguai, on Jan 21 2016 - 11:51, said:

I'm sorry OP but Macs and Apple products are made for the Tech Illiterate people of this world. And as mentioned above there is nothing the a Mac can do that a PC can do as well and in many cases better at a fraction of the price.

 

Also "Point is that gamers are not better or worst because of the computer they use" is a totally false statement as someone trying to play with 15fps will be handicapped vs a player that is getting 60fps on average. So yeah it really does matter on what computer they use.

 

I have two IBM workstations [at one time ran one of the following - OS/2 v3 and v4, Windows 2000, Windows NT 4, SuSE Linux, Solaris for Intel, Ubuntu, MS Windows 7 Pro, MS Windows 8 Pro, and MS Windows 10 Pro] and two iMacs [both dual-boot with OS X 10.11 and MS Windows 10 Pro] at home.

 

So are you calling me tech illiterate just because I have a Mac for the ease of use, not needing to run anti-virus software, being able to dual-boot and use alternative OS[s]?

 

As for different FPS - that is because the game company chose a particular platform to optimize their game for - that is not the fault of the Mac. For example, DirectX is not available for OS X - is that the fault of Apple? - No that fault lies with Microsoft. And as such Mac users are forced - by Microsoft - to use a wrapper to play World of Tanks which generally results in poorer performance than the native OS.

 

Just because the physical numbers of PC [MS Windows] hardware are greater does not make it automatically better [think cockroach]


Edited by black_colt, Jan 21 2016 - 23:44.


dagengster #17 Posted Jan 21 2016 - 23:43

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View Postblack_colt, on Jan 21 2016 - 22:22, said:

 

I challenge your statement that they are very expensive for what they offer - please provide detailed information so we can draw conclusions.

 

I have two IBM workstations [at one time ran one of the following - OS/2 v3 and v4, Windows 2000, Windows NT 4, SuSE Linux, Solaris for Intel, Ubuntu, MS Windows 7 Pro, MS Windows 8 Pro, and MS Windows 10 Pro] and two iMacs [both dual-boot with OS X 10.11 and MS Windows 10 Pro] at home. So I am familiar with the hardware and the OS[s] including their strengths and weaknesses.

 

I am not aware of a pre-built machine [runs either MS Windows or Linux] that matches the exact or has better specifications than that of the 27-inch iMac 5k Retina [uses a single screen form factor] and is less expensive.  Please prove me wrong.

 

As for running certain programs - that can be said about MS Windows and Linux as they cannot run some applications from other OS[s] - how is that a disadvantage for OS X only?

 

And lets be honest - how much time and money have you really spent fixing issues on MS Windows hardware [i.e. looking for a driver, making sure the pins are configured correctly, not having the OS recognize the new hardware]?

 

As for raw power - do you mean how fast it can go with sub-zero cooling, a set of fans that sound like aircraft taking off, etc.? Raw numbers mean nothing if you cannot use them without your machine being on the verge of melting.

 

 

k

I went on apple's site, picked the cheapest mac book pro. I cant compare the 27 in imac u said bc i dont know which one.

Then went on newegg, picked a similarly priced laptop

Macbook:

Using the stock config:

i5 (didnt specify which one)

8gb ram

128 gb ssd

no dedicated GPU

Retina display 13in

$1299


Lenovo Y50-70

i7 4720HQ

16gb RAM

1TB hybrd hard drive (so part ssd, part normal hd)

gtx 960m 4gb

UHD 4k display 15.6 in

$1169

 

Neither computer were on sale. The PC laptop was actually cheaper, but will completely trash the mac book in terms of performance.

This is just one example, and it was even a prebuilt. Self builds are even cheaper. If you want more examples, go look for urself.

How much money ive spent of ms issues? $0. The drivers are on the manufacturer's site. U just download it.

As for the pins, Ive built 4 desktops and modified 1 laptop. Its really not that hard... the instructions that are included in the MB tell u what to do... if u cant figure it out urself.

Most things its just u plug it in, and its kind of obvious. Like a pcie GPU goes into the pcie slot not the SATA 3 bc u know... it doesnt fit.

And for raw power, temps are all fine and sound fine too. Call me when macs can run 7 platforms on 1 physical computer and still play games with good fps and settings.

Spoiler

 


Edited by dagengster, Jan 22 2016 - 00:02.


black_colt #18 Posted Jan 22 2016 - 00:23

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View Postdagengster, on Jan 21 2016 - 23:43, said:

 

k

I went on apple's site, picked the cheapest mac book pro. I cant compare the 27 in imac u said bc i dont know which one.

Then went on newegg, picked a similarly priced laptop

Macbook:

Using the stock config:

i5 (didnt specify which one)

8gb ram

128 gb ssd

no dedicated GPU

Retina display 13in

$1299


Lenovo Y50-70

i7 4720HQ

16gb RAM

1TB hybrd hard drive (so part ssd, part normal hd)

gtx 960m 4gb

UHD 4k display 15.6 in

$1169

 

Neither computer were on sale. The PC laptop was actually cheaper, but will completely trash the mac book in terms of performance.

This is just one example, and it was even a prebuilt. Self builds are even cheaper. If you want more examples, go look for urself.

How much money ive spent of ms issues? $0. The drivers are on the manufacturer's site. U just download it.

As for the pins, Ive built 4 desktops and modified 1 laptop. Its really not that hard... the instructions that are included in the MB tell u what to do... if u cant figure it out urself.

Most things its just u plug it in, and its kind of obvious. Like a pcie GPU goes into the pcie slot not the SATA 3 bc u know... it doesnt fit.

And for raw power, temps are all fine and sound fine too. Call me when macs can run 7 platforms on 1 physical computer and still play games with good fps and settings.

Spoiler

 

 

Thanks - finally facts that we can review for portable machines.

 

Look for 27-inch iMac 5K Retina [MK462XX/A, MK472XX/A, MK482XX/A] ... the specifications are clearly listed at https://www.apple.com/imac/specs/

 

Not sure what you mean by platforms as that rig was running Virtual Machines - all the screens were running MS Windows. Macs can run Virtual Machines - not their strong suite but they can. z/OS on z/Architecture probably runs circles around that machine. If so, then we must both bow to that machine.

 

I have been referring to being able to run OS X AND other OS[s] on the same hardware natively.

 

 

 

 

 


Edited by black_colt, Jan 22 2016 - 00:23.


black_colt #19 Posted Jan 22 2016 - 00:39

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View Postblack_colt, on Jan 22 2016 - 00:23, said:

 

Thanks - finally facts that we can review for portable machines.

 

Look for 27-inch iMac 5K Retina [MK462XX/A, MK472XX/A, MK482XX/A] ... the specifications are clearly listed at https://www.apple.com/imac/specs/

 

Not sure what you mean by platforms as that rig was running Virtual Machines - all the screens were running MS Windows. Macs can run Virtual Machines - not their strong suite but they can. z/OS on z/Architecture probably runs circles around that machine. If so, then we must both bow to that machine.

 

I have been referring to being able to run OS X AND other OS[s] on the same hardware natively.

 

 

 

 

 

View Postdagengster, on Jan 21 2016 - 23:43, said:

 

k

I went on apple's site, picked the cheapest mac book pro. I cant compare the 27 in imac u said bc i dont know which one.

Then went on newegg, picked a similarly priced laptop

Macbook:

Using the stock config:

i5 (didnt specify which one)

8gb ram

128 gb ssd

no dedicated GPU

Retina display 13in

$1299


Lenovo Y50-70

i7 4720HQ

16gb RAM

1TB hybrd hard drive (so part ssd, part normal hd)

gtx 960m 4gb

UHD 4k display 15.6 in

$1169

 

Neither computer were on sale. The PC laptop was actually cheaper, but will completely trash the mac book in terms of performance.

This is just one example, and it was even a prebuilt. Self builds are even cheaper. If you want more examples, go look for urself.

How much money ive spent of ms issues? $0. The drivers are on the manufacturer's site. U just download it.

As for the pins, Ive built 4 desktops and modified 1 laptop. Its really not that hard... the instructions that are included in the MB tell u what to do... if u cant figure it out urself.

Most things its just u plug it in, and its kind of obvious. Like a pcie GPU goes into the pcie slot not the SATA 3 bc u know... it doesnt fit.

And for raw power, temps are all fine and sound fine too. Call me when macs can run 7 platforms on 1 physical computer and still play games with good fps and settings.

Spoiler

 

 

Ok - please provide numbers/specific examples on exactly how the Lenovo will trash the MacBook Retina.

 

 



dstud208 #20 Posted Jan 22 2016 - 01:19

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View Postdagengster, on Jan 21 2016 - 15:43, said:

 

k

I went on apple's site, picked the cheapest mac book pro. I cant compare the 27 in imac u said bc i dont know which one.

Then went on newegg, picked a similarly priced laptop

Macbook:

Using the stock config:

i5 (didnt specify which one)

8gb ram

128 gb ssd

no dedicated GPU

Retina display 13in

$1299


Lenovo Y50-70

i7 4720HQ

16gb RAM

1TB hybrd hard drive (so part ssd, part normal hd)

gtx 960m 4gb

UHD 4k display 15.6 in

$1169

 

Neither computer were on sale. The PC laptop was actually cheaper, but will completely trash the mac book in terms of performance.

This is just one example, and it was even a prebuilt. Self builds are even cheaper. If you want more examples, go look for urself.

How much money ive spent of ms issues? $0. The drivers are on the manufacturer's site. U just download it.

As for the pins, Ive built 4 desktops and modified 1 laptop. Its really not that hard... the instructions that are included in the MB tell u what to do... if u cant figure it out urself.

Most things its just u plug it in, and its kind of obvious. Like a pcie GPU goes into the pcie slot not the SATA 3 bc u know... it doesnt fit.

And for raw power, temps are all fine and sound fine too. Call me when macs can run 7 platforms on 1 physical computer and still play games with good fps and settings.

Spoiler

 

 

Well actually it wouldn't "trash" the mac at everything. I mentioned previously that macs are made for across the board performance, and people on video game forums are usually only concerned with video games. Yes, I will agree with you that Lenovo would "trash" the mac you posted but only with regards to video games - and yes, the mac does cost a few hundred more. For the sake of the argument I'm just going to put down the following:

  1. Lenovo has much faster graphics
  2. Lenovo is $130 cheaper
  3. Lenovo has larger disk space and double ram
  4. Mac doesn't need anti-virus (apple has their own built in - works amazing)
  5. Mac has much faster disk drive (don't try to tell me your gonna install all your games on that 8Gb ssd on the lenovo)
  6. Mac has a faster CPU (2.7 overclocked to 3.1 vs 2.6) - yes the Lenovo is a quad and the mac a duo, but the mac actually scores higher in both single and multi (9100 vs 8100 for multi core)

 

As mentioned earlier, for similar hardware you will get similar price - regardless of brand. The lenovo is geared towards gaming, the mac is geared towards life, its like comparing a truck and a sports car that have the same engine and trying to argue that one is better than the other. No, one is good at hauling wood, and the other is good at hauling ###.

 

The Lenovo will "trash" the mac at games, the Mac will "trash" the Lenovo at Pro-level applications (Large excel sheets, photoshop, etc). Its what these computers were made for that matters. If you find a "Pro" level pc, it would also get trashed at video gaming by that Lenovo, but it would also do the trashing at "Pro" things.


Edited by dstud208, Jan 22 2016 - 01:21.






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