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ClydeCooper421 #21 Posted Feb 02 2016 - 16:40

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View Postuberdice, on Feb 02 2016 - 04:36, said:

 

The only value of the beach is to immediately identify which players on your team can't be relied on to contribute even if they survive until the late game.

 

Ok, then what happens when the enemy tanks that went beach keep going and flank the friendly tanks on the 3-4 lines? BTW, I'm not trying to debate you or say that my idea is better then yours at all. Obviously, you're a better player and know a lot more then me. I'm just trying to figure it out. So thanks. 



BattlecryGWJ #22 Posted Feb 02 2016 - 18:45

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View PostClydeCooper421, on Feb 02 2016 - 09:40, said:

Ok, then what happens when the enemy tanks that went beach keep going and flank the friendly tanks on the 3-4 lines? BTW, I'm not trying to debate you or say that my idea is better then yours at all. Obviously, you're a better player and know a lot more then me. I'm just trying to figure it out. So thanks. 

 

The beach on Overlord has the same problem.  When you go to the beach, you're effectively taking your gun out of the fight for the amount of time it takes you to traverse the beach and come up behind the enemy, unless someone on the enemy team is foolish enough to go to the beach.  Coming off the beach you have to climb off of it to the heights, and there are limited spots where you can come up at.  If you take 3 people to the beach and the enemy takes 0, you've removed 20% of your teams firepower for the time it takes to traverse the beach, so while you're attempting to gain an advantageous position, your team is fighting at a disadvantage.  How long your team is able to stand up to a disadvantage will vary depending on the team, but if you and your two buddies take two minutes to traverse the beach to get behind the enemy what kind of fighting condition will the rest of your team be in? 

 

Trying to look at it another way... you're spending time to gain position, but your team has to expend hit points to buy you time to take that position.  Is that position worth the cost that your team is paying?

 

Maybe it will pay off, but if the enemy team has two tanks that peek over the ridge occasionally to spot the beach group as they try to flank, while staying in a position that allows them to fire in support of their team, those two tanks will neutralize the beach group and still contribute to the fight that the team is had.  Now you're talking about enemy tanks being out of the fight with effectively no cost to your team.

 

Sure, if a team doesn't pay attention to the map, and if they don't realize they have local superiority, and if your team can stand up down a few guns, you might get a flank run to work on easily defended flanks like the valley or the beach, but the circumstance is far too specific to say that its a reliable tactic.  You're better off staying in a higher position, watching how your team deploys and how the enemy deploys, then look for a weakness in the deployment to exploit.



ClydeCooper421 #23 Posted Feb 02 2016 - 19:35

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View PostBattlecryGWJ, on Feb 02 2016 - 18:45, said:

 

The beach on Overlord has the same problem.  When you go to the beach, you're effectively taking your gun out of the fight for the amount of time it takes you to traverse the beach and come up behind the enemy, unless someone on the enemy team is foolish enough to go to the beach.  Coming off the beach you have to climb off of it to the heights, and there are limited spots where you can come up at.  If you take 3 people to the beach and the enemy takes 0, you've removed 20% of your teams firepower for the time it takes to traverse the beach, so while you're attempting to gain an advantageous position, your team is fighting at a disadvantage.  How long your team is able to stand up to a disadvantage will vary depending on the team, but if you and your two buddies take two minutes to traverse the beach to get behind the enemy what kind of fighting condition will the rest of your team be in? 

 

Trying to look at it another way... you're spending time to gain position, but your team has to expend hit points to buy you time to take that position.  Is that position worth the cost that your team is paying?

 

Maybe it will pay off, but if the enemy team has two tanks that peek over the ridge occasionally to spot the beach group as they try to flank, while staying in a position that allows them to fire in support of their team, those two tanks will neutralize the beach group and still contribute to the fight that the team is had.  Now you're talking about enemy tanks being out of the fight with effectively no cost to your team.

 

Sure, if a team doesn't pay attention to the map, and if they don't realize they have local superiority, and if your team can stand up down a few guns, you might get a flank run to work on easily defended flanks like the valley or the beach, but the circumstance is far too specific to say that its a reliable tactic.  You're better off staying in a higher position, watching how your team deploys and how the enemy deploys, then look for a weakness in the deployment to exploit.

Ah, I see now. Thanks for the detailed explanation. 



Windoge8 #24 Posted Feb 04 2016 - 19:38

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It's a near truism to state that if you could convince your team in every pub battle you enter to go 90% to one side, you'd probably have an equivalent win rate. You would steamroll the enemy, coming all the way around the map to clean up. That's what happens as it is when one flank breaks through in dramatic fashion. Loading up further on one side would just expedite matters.

 

So unicums don't think that a tactically challenged flank is unimportant...they just think it's disadvantageous. So long as it's covered/spotted, that's all thats important. Put your force behind the active head of the spear. Pays mucho dividends over sitting in the valley picking your nose.

 

It's interesting to study the heat maps of the game maps. Doing so will give you an appreciation of why some routes on each map are more important than others:

 

http://www.vbaddict.net/heatmaps/

 


Edited by Sollus, Feb 04 2016 - 19:49.


Spanktankk #25 Posted Feb 04 2016 - 19:53

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To look at it another way.

 

If you are in Lakeville Valley.. .or Overlord Beach... do you have a direct, easily accessible escape route? 

 

Do you have another route to leave and help another flank?>

 

Answer is "NO" on both.

Bottlenecking yourself is committing to whatever comes directly in front of you..for the better....or for the worse.

You  remove your ability to flex and relocate.

The current meta is Mobility.  No mobility, you're hurting your team.


Edited by Spanktankk, Feb 04 2016 - 19:54.





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