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Panzer 58 Mutz -VS- Panther mit 8,8 cm L/71


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Danadae #1 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 09:13

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So basically, after playing the Panzer 58 Mutz the Panther mit 8,8 cm L/71feels like a turd on tracks. They're light night and day, totally different handling, but the Panther mit 8,8 just feels totally outclassed now. Did WG intend for this to happen?

Hanger_18 #2 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 09:23

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Probably tbh. The lack of decent prems lately has been ....boring

With the new model of full mm with prems,they need to compete at a t8 level,not compete at the same level as limited mm tanks



abandoned_spirit #3 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 09:26

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The panther 8.8 was trash the moment it was introduced

the reason is that the panther 2 is trash

and you cant make a prem better than the normal tank it is based off so yeah, its bad.

its not like the mutz is op or anything, its just the prems being introduced for a while were utter garbage


Edited by abandoned_spirit, Feb 03 2016 - 10:08.


mrmojo #4 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 09:32

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German tanks took a huge hit with kankou's/daigensui's engine nerfs - turned almost mobile tanks to tanks that feel like they're driving in molasses.

 

Panther II was really hit hard. If only WG would reverse them.



Hanger_18 #5 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 09:52

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View Postabandoned_spirit, on Feb 03 2016 - 03:26, said:

The panther 8.8 was trash the moment it was introduced

the reason is that the panther 2 is trash

and you cant make a prem better than the normal tank is based off so yeah, its bad.

its not like the mutz is op or anything, its just the prems being introduced for a while were utter garbage

i actually liked the panther 2

View Postmrmojo, on Feb 03 2016 - 03:32, said:

German tanks took a huge hit with kankou's/daigensui's engine nerfs - turned almost mobile tanks to tanks that feel like they're driving in molasses.

 

Panther II was really hit hard. If only WG would reverse them.

on the other hand if you actually payed any attention youd know that they buffed terrain resistance. it was still an over all nerf but dont act like it was game changing. you can still afk in an e-75,100 and still contribute by occupying enemy tanks.



abandoned_spirit #6 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 09:55

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View PostHanger_18, on Feb 03 2016 - 08:52, said:

i actually liked the panther 2

 

Liking a tank is fine, it doesn't make it good though.

I like the t-34-2

It might just be the worst excuse for a tank at tier 8. Doesn't make me not like it.



Ecksdeee #7 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 09:56

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View PostDanadae, on Feb 03 2016 - 09:13, said:

So basically, after playing the Panzer 58 Mutz the Panther mit 8,8 cm L/71feels like a turd on tracks. They're light night and day, totally different handling, but the Panther mit 8,8 just feels totally outclassed now. Did WG intend for this to happen?

 

The prems lately have been virtually copy pastes of tech tree tanks. mutz is an indien pz and the 8.8 is a pII

zed2204 #8 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 09:57

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The thing is that it is better than the non-prems too, usually the regular tanks are better but STA-1 and IndienPanzer wich are probably the closest are just not that good and Panther 2, T44 are either slow or bad gun, only Centurion 1 is on that level but its just slow

Ecksdeee #9 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 10:33

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View Postzed2204, on Feb 03 2016 - 09:57, said:

The thing is that it is better than the non-prems too, usually the regular tanks are better but STA-1 and IndienPanzer wich are probably the closest are just not that good and Panther 2, T44 are either slow or bad gun, only Centurion 1 is on that level but its just slow

 

the mutz is basically an indien pz. The panther 8.8 is basically a panther 2. Comparing them to other nation prems are like saying the E100 is over powered because it outperforms the IS-4

Sam_Sanister #10 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 10:49

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View PostHanger_18, on Feb 03 2016 - 02:52, said:

i actually liked the panther 2

 

I like it as well, actually prefer it over the Panther I.

An 88 with a VSTAB? Yes please!



Erlus #11 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 12:12

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I loved the panther 88 like a child but around my 150th match in it i started to hate it because it was just constant tier 10 matches where i couldn't do anything because i'm to slow to flank and my gold shells don't have enough pen to even get through a lot of tier 9 heavies

Kaede_Zero #12 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 14:41

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View Postkillerb, on Feb 03 2016 - 08:12, said:

I loved the panther 88 like a child but around my 150th match in it i started to hate it because it was just constant tier 10 matches where i couldn't do anything because i'm to slow to flank and my gold shells don't have enough pen to even get through a lot of tier 9 heavies

 

Great point. Incredible that WG cant fix things like that...

BigRedTankGuy #13 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 14:49

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View PostDanadae, on Feb 03 2016 - 09:13, said:

So basically, after playing the Panzer 58 Mutz the Panther mit 8,8 cm L/71feels like a turd on tracks. They're light night and day, totally different handling, but the Panther mit 8,8 just feels totally outclassed now. Did WG intend for this to happen?

 

I wouldn't go so far as to say the Panther 88 feels like a turd but ya the Mutz leaves it in the dust in a lot of areas and I do find it a lot easier to do well in the Mutz. I still like my Panther 88. I love its snap shot gun. I wish maybe they would buff the armor at least a little now for the Panther 88. The mutz basically has very similar armor to the Panther 88 and in some ways probably even better due to the sloping PLUS it gets speed so in many ways it leaves the Panther 88 in the dust. I do understand your point.

kilroy26 #14 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 15:21

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To be fair though it wouldn't take much to make a tank better than the Panther 8.8.....I find it very map dependent and not really very useful at any one thing....

SourKraut13 #15 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 15:35

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The Panther 88 has 1 thing going for it:

 

- It can still train a radioman. (since 99% of all German Medium Tanks have one )



Colddawg #16 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 15:49

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These two tanks are also very different in play style.  The Mutz can play more forward than the Panther 8,8-who is a DPM sniper with better gun soft stats.  The Mutz has the mobility advantage by about 5hp/t and better ground resistance than the Panther 8,8 but when it comes to a shot per shot the Panther 8,8 should win since it does 300+ more damage per minute.

 

TL : DR you're comparing nickels and dimes.



Slayer_Jesse #17 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 16:18

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View Postabandoned_spirit, on Feb 03 2016 - 03:55, said:

 

Liking a tank is fine, it doesn't make it good though.

I like the t-34-2

It might just be the worst excuse for a tank at tier 8. Doesn't make me not like it.

 

no, that "honor" goes to the new FV.

why_u_heff_to_be_mad #18 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 16:29

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View PostColddawg, on Feb 03 2016 - 15:49, said:

These two tanks are also very different in play style.  The Mutz can play more forward than the Panther 8,8-who is a DPM sniper with better gun soft stats.  The Mutz has the mobility advantage by about 5hp/t and better ground resistance than the Panther 8,8 but when it comes to a shot per shot the Panther 8,8 should win since it does 300+ more damage per minute.

 

TL : DR you're comparing nickels and dimes.

 

 so one tank is useful in 90% of situations and one tank is a chai - sniping  support tank that is team dependent 
 
I think you just proved his point


KaiserMartens #19 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 16:37

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Panther II shouldn't be compared. It moves a bit better and has a functional upper frontal plate which has given me a lot of bounces that shouldn't have happened. Panther II is exactly what it's meant to be, a better version of Panther 88.

 

That being said, low mobility in mediums is a recurring theme in German vehicles excepting for the Leopards. But that's okay. We're the snipers. In the few maps that allow it.... heh.

 

Back on the actual topic: Mutz is generally speaking the better of the two, but it has two achilles heels which make me prefer the Panther 88.

 

1: I MUST train radiomen.

2: Panther 88 can bruteforce things.

 

What I mean by number 2, is - well, let me give you an example.

 

Yesterday I ran into a T34 head on, without possibility of escape. I was on my Panther 88, and I demolished the bastard (as a medium tank!) and still had 2/3 of my HP afterwards. This is because Panther 88 reloads extremely quickly and has more HP. If I had been the mutz, I wouldn't have survived.

 

Mutz is like the tier 6 VK D. Mobile, more fun to play, versatile, and gets lucky bounces.

Panther 88 is like the tier 6 VK M. It's slow as molasses in comparison, but it has more HP and reloads faster, so if you're forced to deal with a heavy, you can handle it.

 

I expect most people will like the Mutz better, and I wish I had both vehicles, but if I had to choose just ONE, I'm with P88.

 

 



Hurk #20 Posted Feb 03 2016 - 19:15

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View PostDanadae, on Feb 03 2016 - 00:13, said:

So basically, after playing the Panzer 58 Mutz the Panther mit 8,8 cm L/71feels like a turd on tracks. They're light night and day, totally different handling, but the Panther mit 8,8 just feels totally outclassed now. Did WG intend for this to happen?

 

View Postabandoned_spirit, on Feb 03 2016 - 00:26, said:

The panther 8.8 was trash the moment it was introduced

the reason is that the panther 2 is trash

and you cant make a prem better than the normal tank it is based off so yeah, its bad.

its not like the mutz is op or anything, its just the prems being introduced for a while were utter garbage

the 88 is trash because it doesnt have the top engine or top speed of either of the panther or panther 2. 

 

http://tanks.gg/wot/...ii.c:panther-88

600hp engine and a capped max speed of 46 instead of 55.  






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