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Armor Changes of the IS-6 in 9.14


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Strigonx #101 Posted Mar 18 2016 - 00:00

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TFW i can lolpen an IS-6 lower plate in almost anything now

TankingTrucker #102 Posted Mar 18 2016 - 05:17

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View Postsuperdan51, on Mar 07 2016 - 21:55, said:

This buff didnt make any sense, just like the e5 buff. Lets give a med like heavy that can bounce 25/7, with a lot of resistance to most gold ammo in the same tier. Has pref mm, and albeit has a terrible gun, but all the cons to the hd remodel got balanced out by something.

 

lets also add the fact that you pretty removed all odds of hitting those weak spots, that were already [edited]hard as hell to hit. You guys have to be sick

 

im glad I quit, you guys arent doing the right things anymore, this is another one of your wow moments that makes me wonder why ive been here for 4 years

 

guess im confused you say you quit,quit what? And if you quit tanks then why would you give a crap?

TankingTrucker #103 Posted Mar 18 2016 - 05:19

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View PostWehrmachtPanzergrenadier, on Mar 07 2016 - 23:06, said:

 

#MakeArtilleryGreatAgain

 

you want to make artillery great take it out of the game.

TankingTrucker #104 Posted Mar 18 2016 - 05:23

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View PostStrike_Witch_Tomoko, on Mar 08 2016 - 00:12, said:

 

first off. i'll leave it to you to find out what you misspelled there

 

2nd. did IS-6  REALLY need this buff? low tiers already have enough trouble penning it.  all your doing is making people default to gold because aiming wont help at all.

 

long term this is gonna screw the tank over because people will spam gold so much that its armor will seem like its not there.

 

short term its gonna screw people who still TRY to aim.

 

 

 

when did the game switch from knowing weakspots and aiming.

to spamming gold because aiming wont help?

 

 

 

because thats a move to p2w.  devaluing skill in exchange for a wallet.

 

and there are tanks that need buffs more than the pump stomper pro tank.

 

like STA-2, or 59 patton,  how about some tier 7s? or tier 6s.  god knows what they are going to do against this now.  its basically an auto win unless the tier 6 and 7s brought gold.

 

and tier 8s, meds are gonna suffer unless they bring more gold.  tunnel maps + no weakspots(or less and harder to hit weakspots)

 

as a medium tank player, i can tell you how this looks to me, it looks like the competitor is more appealing for not forcing me to use gold.

 

 

 

are you balancing the game?  or catering to russians?

 

cause the performance this tank has right now

http://wot-news.com/.../tankinfo/en/us

 

is already basically above average

 

there is NO WAY this thing needs a buff.

 

there is NO statistical evidence.

 

 

i call BULL.

and demand you show ACTUAL EVIDENCE that this tank is performing badly enough to warrant a buff.  Alternatively you can show me the pen buff you plan to make to all tier 6, 7 tanks, and tier 8 meds.  to compensate for this .

 

 

 

you have ALOT of map fixing to do (removing tunnel maps and making it possible to flank without committing suicide)  before you can consider making these kinds of buffs.

 

 

 

all this kind of "removal of skill in exchange for catering to russian players and fat wallet players" will do is make people take the competitor seriously with their "no gold round" appeal.

I agree with everything you said. but i do think the gun needs a penn buff because you have trouble penning anything. so now we have a maus with a squirt gun.



Strike_Witch_Tomoko #105 Posted Mar 18 2016 - 05:25

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View PostxxxJuggernautxxx, on Mar 17 2016 - 21:23, said:

I agree with everything you said. but i do think the gun needs a penn buff because you have trouble penning anything. so now we have a maus with a squirt gun.

no arguments here

 

nerf IS-6's armor to what it was pre-9.14

and give its gun a pen buff(around 190-198.  any more than that and the armor(weakspots i mean, not the main armor areas) or mobility will need to be further nerfed)

 

i don't care if it has more pen, i just need to be able to pen it


Edited by Strike_Witch_Tomoko, Mar 18 2016 - 05:26.


TankingTrucker #106 Posted Mar 18 2016 - 05:40

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View Postcalebjordan1983, on Mar 11 2016 - 02:49, said:

I just spent a lot of money on this game, only for the match making to get worse in the latest update. I really want my money back! I keep getting put in a battle with tanks 2 tiers higher than me! WTH? I can't even inflict damage on them! Even slipping behind them and shooting in there weak spot. This game use to be fun, now I stay mad.

 

Well then quit trying to be a seal clubber and play tier 10s and you wont have that problem. Hate to brake it to you but there is a two tier difference in any tank you play unless it gets pref match making.Been that way for a long time.You obviously did not play it back in 2011 when i did and i would be in a tier 6 and 7s going against tier 10s . Try penning a maus with a tier 6 gun.

TanksR_Epic2 #107 Posted Mar 18 2016 - 11:23

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View PostStrike_Witch_Tomoko, on Mar 18 2016 - 05:25, said:

no arguments here

 

nerf IS-6's armor to what it was pre-9.14

and give its gun a pen buff(around 190-198.  any more than that and the armor(weakspots i mean, not the main armor areas) or mobility will need to be further nerfed)

 

i don't care if it has more pen, i just need to be able to pen it

 

the is3 always seems to autopen my upper plate.

TanksR_Epic2 #108 Posted Mar 18 2016 - 11:25

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View PostStrigonx, on Mar 18 2016 - 00:00, said:

TFW i can lolpen an IS-6 lower plate in almost anything now

 

Lower plate seems to bounce most things now actually.

Strike_Witch_Tomoko #109 Posted Mar 18 2016 - 14:14

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View PostTanksR_Epic2, on Mar 18 2016 - 03:23, said:

 

the is3 always seems to autopen my upper plate.

 

the IS-3 is a heavy tank with high pen and borderline OP compared to other tier 8 heavies.

 

try penning the upper plate in a variety of tier 7s like T-34-1, T20, Comet, T-43, IS, IS-2.    or tier 8s like T-34-3, Super P, Pershing, T-44, T-34-2, T-54 mod 1, m46 patton kr, 59 patton, Type 59.



mattwong #110 Posted Mar 18 2016 - 16:27

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View PostStrike_Witch_Tomoko, on Mar 18 2016 - 08:14, said:

the IS-3 is a heavy tank with high pen and borderline OP compared to other tier 8 heavies.

 

If you're talking about its penetration, that's silly: there are plenty of other tier 8 heavies with the same or better penetration.  The Tiger II, KV-4, Carnaervon, and T34 all have equal or better penetration compared to the IS-3.

 

View PostStrike_Witch_Tomoko, on Mar 18 2016 - 08:14, said:

try penning the upper plate in a variety of tier 7s like T-34-1, T20, Comet, T-43, IS, IS-2.    or tier 8s like T-34-3, Super P, Pershing, T-44, T-34-2, T-54 mod 1, m46 patton kr, 59 patton, Type 59.

 

Ummm ... people think it should be normal to be able to punch through a tier 8 heavy tank's upper plate with a tier 7 gun, without using premium rounds?



Strike_Witch_Tomoko #111 Posted Mar 18 2016 - 16:39

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View Postmattwong, on Mar 18 2016 - 08:27, said:

 

If you're talking about its penetration, that's silly: there are plenty of other tier 8 heavies with the same or better penetration.  The Tiger II, KV-4, Carnaervon, and T34 all have equal or better penetration compared to the IS-3.

 

no. by borderline OP i ment its combination of frontal troll armor, turret, side armor,  speed, low profile, pen, alpha.

 

IS-3 has so much going for it compared to other tier 8 heavies who all have clear downsides (like for T32 its the far weaker side armor, lower plate, and bad pen. though its turret and upper plate are better.   Tiger 2...enough said honestly...IS-3 can punch through tiger 2's upper plate.     T34's dpm is worse, armor worse all round, bigger target, slower, etc.)

 

in short, IS-3 has no real downsides to it that people can use against it in a fight.  while other heavies all have a variety of downsides people can exploit against them in fights.

 

IS-3 used to have a pennable lower plate, and 20mm side weakspot.  but now. none. even its turret hatch has gotten harder to hit in the HD model.

 

View Postmattwong, on Mar 18 2016 - 08:27, said:

 

 

Ummm ... people think it should be normal to be able to punch through a tier 8 heavy tank's upper plate with a tier 7 gun, without using premium rounds?

not the upper plate.

 

but since the lower plate is LOLZ strong (199 effective)   the driver hatch was the weakspot....except now its the strongest part of the armor.

 

where do you aim now?

the lower plate that got buffed from 191 to 199

the upper plate that was already strong

the driver hatch that is now god level.

the turret cheeks that now have a smaller pennable area, are more angled(and autobounce).

the mantlet hole that is now smaller(RIP pershing....it got boned while russians get strong mantlets)

the cupolas that are now half as big as they were before?

 

 

and keep in mind IS-6 has a very high dpm for a heavy.  far more than most mediums get, on top of its decent mobility, traverse, and hp.

 

 

you basically have to shoot gold at it now if your in a tier 7. or certain tier 8 meds.   and even then, some of those gold rounds don't have enough pen (RIP comet and T-43)



Deputy276 #112 Posted Mar 18 2016 - 16:52

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View PostEpicbutcher, on Mar 16 2016 - 15:17, said:

 

​Ok honestly, I do agree with you on most of what you said, especially the reference to players not learning their tanks before calling it a POS, probably my personal greatest two tanks to mention on this, would have to be #1 M36 Jackson, you rarely see them anymore, let alone even a few patches back, but the only trouble it has now is fighting some of the buffed tier 8s it fights against. Even then the Jackson delivers quite a good standard for US Tier 6 TDs, even compared to the more popular M18 Hellcat. Also #2 aka the M3 Lee, I get hate messages from playing it sometimes, and people never give it an honest to god chance, that damn gun it has can kill or pen 95% of what it comes across without using a single gold round. Please do not take tanks literally for their "class" since the M3 Lee can only play medium-type games in certain instances, otherwise use it as a bloody TD, otherwise you'll get wiped 9 out of 10 times. Anyways, I've put my 2 cents in, and I'm not even the "best" player out there. Have fun and take it in turn... is all.

 

Well said sir! Agree with you. Most new players (not saying you are a new player, just in general) have a hard time with TDs like the Jackson and Hellcat because the armor is VERY thin. They try and play them like tanks and BOOM....dead.

I also got hate messages for the M3 tanks. But I blocked them so no incoming messages unless they are on friends list. I no longer own the M3. Needed the garage space and crew for a different vehicle. I played it as a TD and didn't have a bad time with it. :)



mattwong #113 Posted Mar 18 2016 - 16:57

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View PostStrike_Witch_Tomoko, on Mar 18 2016 - 10:39, said:

IS-3 has so much going for it compared to other tier 8 heavies who all have clear downsides (like for T32 its the far weaker side armor, lower plate, and bad pen. though its turret and upper plate are better.   Tiger 2...enough said honestly...IS-3 can punch through tiger 2's upper plate.

 

The T32's turret is near-invincible and has far superior gun depression.  I can't believe you're acting as if this is just a small and insignificant thing.  You will not do well if you drive an IS-3 around and expect to routinely punch through Tiger II upper plates.

 

View PostStrike_Witch_Tomoko, on Mar 18 2016 - 10:39, said:

in short, IS-3 has no real downsides to it that people can use against it in a fight.  while other heavies all have a variety of downsides people can exploit against them in fights.

 

Are we talking about the IS-3 or the IS-6 here?  You only brought up the IS-3 to say that its gun is OP, so it's no big deal that it can penetrate an IS-6's upper hull.  But as I already pointed out, there are many tanks at tier 8 with equal or better penetration, so the IS-6 is hardly as tough as you think it is.

 

As for the IS-3's own weaknesses which you claim don't exist: bad gun depression, mediocre accuracy, long aim-time, the fact that it can't angle without making one side of its pike butter.  The only thing that makes the IS-3 seem OP is that good drivers know they can mitigate its weaknesses by aggressively moving up, and bad players don't know where to shoot it.

 

View PostStrike_Witch_Tomoko, on Mar 18 2016 - 10:39, said:

where do you aim [at the IS-6] now?

the lower plate that got buffed from 191 to 199

the upper plate that was already strong

the driver hatch that is now god level.

the turret cheeks that now have a smaller pennable area, are more angled(and autobounce).

the mantlet hole that is now smaller(RIP pershing....it got boned while russians get strong mantlets)

the cupolas that are now half as big as they were before?

 

Aim at the lower portion of the upper plate.

 

View PostStrike_Witch_Tomoko, on Mar 18 2016 - 10:39, said:

you basically have to shoot gold at it now if your in a tier 7. or certain tier 8 meds.   and even then, some of those gold rounds don't have enough pen (RIP comet and T-43)

 

For the second time, where did you get this idea that every med should be able to punch through the upper plate of higher-tier heavies, especially without even using premium rounds?  We're talking about the IS-6: a heavy tank that routinely must use premium rounds in order to fight same-tier opponents, and you're acting as if it's ridiculous for lower-tier enemies to need premium rounds against it?


Edited by mattwong, Mar 18 2016 - 16:59.


Deputy276 #114 Posted Mar 18 2016 - 16:57

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View PostStrike_Witch_Tomoko, on Mar 16 2016 - 12:50, said:

lets see why IS-6 is more popular than 59 patton

 

US Server

IS-6
59 patton

 

 

Result.  59 patton performs horribly.

 

 

EU server

IS-6
59 patton

 

Result.  domination by IS-6. 

 

 

RU server

bias-6
59 patton

 

result: best 59 patton has done yet.  and it still flunked.  IS-6 was wierd on that graph. but it STILL bashed 59 patton's performance.

 

 

 

 

3/3 IS-6 wins

and 59 patton recieves its title as inferior.

Where did ANYONE say IS-6 ISN'T more popular than 59-Patton? If you don't like the 59-Patton...SELL IT. Not all Prem tanks are for all people. I am having a difficult time believing the information you posted in your profile. 



Strike_Witch_Tomoko #115 Posted Mar 18 2016 - 17:38

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View Postmattwong, on Mar 18 2016 - 08:57, said:

 

The T32's turret is near-invincible and has far superior gun depression.  I can't believe you're acting as if this is just a small and insignificant thing.  You will not do well if you drive an IS-3 around and expect to routinely punch through Tiger II upper plates.

 

 

Are we talking about the IS-3 or the IS-6 here?  You only brought up the IS-3 to say that its gun is OP, so it's no big deal that it can penetrate an IS-6's upper hull.  But as I already pointed out, there are many tanks at tier 8 with equal or better penetration, so the IS-6 is hardly as tough as you think it is.

 

As for the IS-3's own weaknesses which you claim don't exist: bad gun depression, mediocre accuracy, long aim-time, the fact that it can't angle without making one side of its pike butter.  The only thing that makes the IS-3 seem OP is that good drivers know they can mitigate its weaknesses by aggressively moving up, and bad players don't know where to shoot it.

 

 

Aim at the lower portion of the upper plate.

 

 

For the second time, where did you get this idea that every med should be able to punch through the upper plate of higher-tier heavies, especially without even using premium rounds?  We're talking about the IS-6: a heavy tank that routinely must use premium rounds in order to fight same-tier opponents, and you're acting as if it's ridiculous for lower-tier enemies to need premium rounds against it?

 

where did i say tanks should be able to shoot through the upper plate of heavies.   I just said you need gold to pen now.....gold to pen stuff like the lower plate.  even then gl...  look at T-43's pen. look at Comet's pen. look at T-34-1's pen.

 

what i'm saying is you need to have places they can shoot.  not something you need gold to pen.

 

T32's lower plate is easily pennable for example. plus it has the machine gun weakspot in the upper plate.     aka places to pen the T32, without gold.   T32 keeps its strong armor, but people can still fight it as it has places people can aim for.

 

compare to IS-6.  199 lower.   no where did i say they should be able to pen the upper plate.  only that they need to have places(weakspots) to pen. otherwise you have the O-I all over again.

and no. lower portion of upper plate is not pennable for the tanks i listed.

 

if prem rounds were expected to be used by lower tiers so they can fight higher tiers, they wouldnt cost half as much as it costs to repair the tank.

 

 

IS-3 doesn't need to angle,  its accuracy is not as bad as you think(T32 has worse accuracy.  not to mention stuff like T-34-3).   and its aim time is deceptive. because its gun handlign is actually really good.    .08 for turret traverse(thats tier 10 med levels).    .21 for hull traverse or on the move.  (which is really good for a heavy)

 

and its gun depression is countered by the fact its a low profile tank.   if you want to complain about gun depression, get in a large tank. like germans(E50, panther 8.8)  and you can see what bad gun depression can feel like.   Or get in a chinese medium. low profile. but truely bad gun depresson for WZ-120 and 121  (they only work out due to high pen.   oh wow. just like IS-3)

 

View PostDeputy276, on Mar 18 2016 - 08:57, said:

Where did ANYONE say IS-6 ISN'T more popular than 59-Patton? If you don't like the 59-Patton...SELL IT. Not all Prem tanks are for all people. I am having a difficult time believing the information you posted in your profile. 

 

My point was the reason 59-patton didn't gain the popularity of other premium tanks was because its performance was bad.

 

popular premiums tend to have decent to great performance.

 

unpopular premiums tend to have bad performance, and thus see alot less use(so little use apparently that WG has trouble seeing how the tank is performing due to small sample size)

 

 

 


Edited by Strike_Witch_Tomoko, Mar 18 2016 - 17:41.


mattwong #116 Posted Mar 18 2016 - 17:48

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You know what, fine: you go ahead and tell yourself that it should be possible to fight every tank in the game frontally with every other tank, without even using premium rounds.  Just make heavy tanks completely useless.

Edited by mattwong, Mar 18 2016 - 17:49.


Strike_Witch_Tomoko #117 Posted Mar 18 2016 - 17:50

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View Postmattwong, on Mar 18 2016 - 09:48, said:

You literally contradicted yourself in the same post.

 

no i didn't.

i said you need to have places to pen without gold.

 

this does not mean the upper plate.

 

usually, in the VAST number of cases. it means the LOWER PLATE.   or a reasonably sized cupola.

 

 

 

View Postmattwong, on Mar 18 2016 - 09:48, said:

You know what, fine: you go ahead and tell yourself that it should be possible to fight every tank in the game frontally with every other tank, without even using premium rounds.  Just make heavy tanks completely useless.

completely useless?

every tier tanks are pennable frontally, through weakspots.  except IS-3 and IS-6 (plus new jap heavies)

oh and vk 45.02B (WG admit is OP)

 

considerign the plague of tunnel maps.   and the fact this game used to reward knowing weakspots and aiming for them.   penning an enemy frontally doesn't make it useless.

 

it means you need to aim for them instead of derping shots into them.

 

heavies pen meds easily due to lack of armor on meds(a few exceptions beign stuff like super p,  or the turrets of russian/chinese.  or E50's upper plate.   or freak shots at odd angles.)

 

meds have to aim to pen.  except when you can't cause there isn't a place to aim(and thats where the issue is.)

 

 

 


Edited by Strike_Witch_Tomoko, Mar 18 2016 - 18:03.


TankingTrucker #118 Posted Mar 18 2016 - 19:18

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OK to kill all those rumors this tank is now the new tier 8 maus i played 10 rounds with it and 10 out of 10 rounds i bounced 4 rounds total from all standard rounds. I was shot only 1 time with a tier 7 who used gold rounds the kv-85 who penned no problem.the rest were from tier 7's 8's and 9's and all standard rounds from the front,side, side scraping, rear and every round penned me no problem and a few into the turret. So to be honest with you i think the armor is now worse not better.So now you have crappy armor and crappy gun.So all those crying about this tank being over powered fear no more now its a pile of crap. Hope your happy. And i consider myself a descent player i'm blue with a win 8 of 1724 i have 240 matches in the is-6 and have a mark of excellence so i have played it a lot before the patch and 10 matches now and i am telling you it's worse not better. I was trying to show that the rounds hit in upper lower plate and turret. penned no matter where i was hit standard rounds but the picture turned out ok. so click on the picture and it will enlarge it so you can see all red area is penned.see the one in the turret and front top plate and lower plate all penned even a tier 7 penned my upper plate easy.

 

shot_002.jpg


Edited by xxxJuggernautxxx, Mar 18 2016 - 20:07.


Deputy276 #119 Posted Mar 18 2016 - 20:08

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Good grief....I had to put that guy on my ignore list because all that anime spam was hurting my eyes. :(

Mr5by5 #120 Posted Mar 19 2016 - 03:39

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Did anybody realize that the thing NOT mentioned, but which has now become reality, is that the preferential matchmaking is now a thing of the past for the IS-6?  This is the reason for the changes.  I have been in tier 9 and 10 battles all night with it.




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