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O-I tier 6 japanese heavy tank is still overpowered


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Poll: Do you think the O-I at tier 6 is overpowered (59 members have cast votes)

Do you think the O-I at tier 6 is overpowered

  1. Overpowered (28 votes [47.46%])

    Percentage of vote: 47.46%

  2. Not overpowered (24 votes [40.68%])

    Percentage of vote: 40.68%

  3. Dont Care (7 votes [11.86%])

    Percentage of vote: 11.86%

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n4cer67 #21 Posted Jun 15 2016 - 02:23

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It's never been OP.

 



Midna1 #22 Posted Jun 15 2016 - 05:13

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Load the gold ammo if it's directly in front of u, what I always do in my tier 6 med 

Strigonx #23 Posted Jun 17 2016 - 00:05

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View Postminim8greyhound, on Jun 14 2016 - 14:17, said:

OP isn't the correct wording. Its Imbalanced.

 

Making a tank with OP armor ultra slow doesn't necessarily return balance to the game.

All WG needs to do is add a weak spot on the front of the tank and that would be a great place to start.

Just make the left or right turret like the R2D2 on the KV-5, heck they could make it move a little faster as long as we can pen it from somewhere on the front. 

 

O-I at tier 6, already has a weakspot

 

And almost anything at tier 6 can butter through the flat 150mm plates, even some tier 5's can



Wyvern2 #24 Posted Jun 17 2016 - 08:02

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View PostStrigonx, on Jun 17 2016 - 00:05, said:

 

O-I at tier 6, already has a weakspot

 

And almost anything at tier 6 can butter through the flat 150mm plates, even some tier 5's can

That weakspot is miniscule and almost unhittable in a lot of situations.

Almost anything? At T5 there's almost nothing. VK3001H has 157 pen, StuG 150, Flak Bus 194 and S35 has 165(iirc), ELC has 170 Other than that, none of the meds, heavies or TD's have the pen necessary to even try to penetrate, and realistically, out of those I listed, only the Flak Bus can do it with any degree of confidence/consistency.

At T6, among meds, only the Firefly has 171 pen, the Chi-To has 155 pen, the Germans can get 150, none of those values except the Fireflys are high enough to consistently pen. Amongst heavies, M6 has 160, KV-85 170, T-150 167, VK 145/157, Churchill(lol) 148, ARL 165/212. Assuming we want a laugh, I'll include lights, only the T37 is anywhere near the required pen at 150. TD's start to have a glimmer of hope. Jpz has 150, M18/M36 160, Su-100 175, AT-8/Achilles 171, Nashorn 203, Church GC 214, Arl V39 165/212.

Now looking at those values there's hardly a lot of tanks that can nominally pen 150mm of armor. Then, the weakest points on the O-I's front are 155 effective. To punch through the turret/mini turrets, 170+ is required. If it angles, 160+ is needed on the hull, leaving only small trolly areas on the mini turrets. "just pen the sides you say" yes, in theory, that's great, but for normal guns, only a small area is actually vulnerable, the only tanks up to T6 that can actually triple overmatch the 35mm of side the O-I has are the T-150/KV-2(using AP on either top gun) and Su-100. Furthermore, of the guns rated over 200 pen, the french long 90 is trash and not really considered the top gun by most decent players. The other tanks that mount it are either god awful in all other ways(GC) or campy bush sniping TD's who get [edited] in meta(Nashorn) So essentially, the O-I is trollish/impenetrable to almost anybody loading regular ammo. Even some of the heavies and TD's have to load prem to get consistent penetrations, let alone meds/lights, all but one of which are forced to load prem.

 

And the issues don't stop there, yes gold can negate the O-I's armor, but its gun remains stupidly good, either an ok 105mm, or a derp that outmatches the KV-2's in almost every way that matters. Snipe and vision games then? Hahaha, how about no, the O-I has 370M view range, which everything but a light will struggle to beat, especially when the tank just barrels down on you in WOT's lovely corridor maps. Compared to the Churchill VII, the only tank with comparable frontal armor, the O-I has smaller weakspots, a far superior gun and superior mobility+gun depression. There is literally nothing the Churchill VII has except 10hp and some nominal camo.

 

And this is coming from me, a person who almost never used the O-I in competitive play when calling unless given no other option, since I believe it's the inferior competitive tank. Nonetheless, it remains one of the most poorly balanced tanks, especially when matched up against hte nonexistence of gold in many pub matches and the cancerous camp strats(reinforced by bad map design) that are found during SH/CW.



MUMBLESRUMBLES #25 Posted Jun 18 2016 - 02:10

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the o-I is a guessing game since they never actually made one.... the tog2 will destroy it easily with gold rounds, and fast because a tog can fire 12 -14 rounds a minute.. and pen 239 with gold, cya o-I....

Wyvern2 #26 Posted Jun 18 2016 - 02:56

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View Postmumblecorefilms, on Jun 18 2016 - 02:10, said:

the o-I is a guessing game since they never actually made one.... the tog2 will destroy it easily with gold rounds, and fast because a tog can fire 12 -14 rounds a minute.. and pen 239 with gold, cya o-I....

 

Which is irrelevant, because A, no decent O-I will stand in the open letting you wail on it if you can pen it and B an O-I can literally 2 shot a TOG. He shoots you once, and even standing in the open there's a chance he'll beat you given a smidge of RNG, and if he peekabooms, which isn't a problem given the TOG's garbage speed, he's won already.

Edited by Wyvern2, Jun 18 2016 - 02:57.


Chaosticket #27 Posted Jun 21 2016 - 02:10

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Question: Have any of your speaking against the O-I actually driven it?

 

It has strong frontal armor and a decent gun, but what are you comparing it to? I hope youre not comparing it to medium tanks, as it is a heavy tank. Its frontal armor is high because it is meant to actually stop shells fired from the front. Some people find the concept of armor that works hard to comprehend.

 

Its speed, mobility, size, and camouflage are all bottom. 20kph speed, approximately 20 degrees per second turning, low accuracy, bad gun depression, etc.

 

It is easily defeated by not trying to fight it one-vs-vs from the front. flank its much lower armor, hug its side armor(pst, it cant aim down), track it, etc.



Wyvern2 #28 Posted Jun 21 2016 - 03:19

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View PostChaosticket, on Jun 21 2016 - 02:10, said:

Question: Have any of your speaking against the O-I actually driven it?

Yes, it's horribly imbalanced in it's tier.

It has strong frontal armor and a decent gun, but what are you comparing it to? I hope youre not comparing it to medium tanks, as it is a heavy tank. Its frontal armor is high because it is meant to actually stop shells fired from the front. Some people find the concept of armor that works hard to comprehend.

The most common comparison is the KV-2 and Churchill VII, since one fills the derp heavy niche and the other fills the super armored heavy niche. It easily outclasses both of them in just about every category that matters. The problem isn't armor that works, the problem is armor that has next to no weakspots and is either proof to everything or absolute butter to anybody who presses 2/is a higher tier. The Church VII and AT8, both of which are nominally equal and better in armor, are crippled by large weakspots that a player with such knowledge can abuse. Said weakspots can be hidden though, given a skilled user. The O-I is so all or nothing that user skill is irrelevant.

Its speed, mobility, size, and camouflage are all bottom. 20kph speed, approximately 20 degrees per second turning, low accuracy, bad gun depression, etc.

No, it's speed is 29 top, certainly no speed demon, but given decent terrain resistance, it can easily maintain 25+ on flat ground. Compared to its peers, it really isn't that slow of a heavy, especially when compared to the other 2 "super heavies" the Churchill and AT8, which only go 20. It's not agile, but no heavies except the med level armored KV-85/M6/Arl44(Not 100% every situation true, but largely so) are really agile. For a heavy of its armor level and firepower, it's stupidly agile/mobile.

 

It's accuracy is bad, but it just has to hit to do damage, and you're usually brawling close in where accuracy doesn't matter. Furthermore, the closest gun in hard stats is the KV-2's, which is inferior in everything except ROF and bloom after firing, completely irrelevant on a super slow firing derp tank.

 

Bad gun depression? In what world? it has 4 in a very small arc towards the rear, otherwise it has 6 over the sides and 9-10 at the front. That is very good gun depression, especially when compared to its peers. Frontally, only the M6 and Arl 44 are comparable.

 

It is easily defeated by not trying to fight it one-vs-vs from the front. flank its much lower armor, hug its side armor(pst, it cant aim down), track it, etc.

WOT maps are super corridory, given a vaguely intelligent O-I player, he can keep his front to you without too much trouble, and if you're equal or lower tier, will most likely 1-2 shot you depending on what ammo he is loading. Yes, in a super specific sidehugging situation, you can beat it very handily, but how many times do you get such an opportunity, especially in SH where a campy team might have several. There's also the fact that its rear is inexplicably as thick as its front, meaning you have to get its side, and only its side, to have a very easy pen.

 

The problem isn't that it can't be beaten though, it's that it is disproportionately powerful against lower/equal tiers(especially if they dont shoot gold), while simultaneously being fairly weak vs higher tiers/gold spammers, though less so than the next 4 tiers of japanese heavies, since its derp is a great equalizer.

 


Edited by Wyvern2, Jun 21 2016 - 03:20.


Chaosticket #29 Posted Jun 21 2016 - 04:29

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I really hate when people want lower tiers to beat higher tiers. The matchmaker problem is that it mixes tiers, not giving everything bigger guns and gold ammo. Tiers should be equal so you play towards each vehicles' real strengths such as speed or armor, not armed with Tiger killer weapons.

 

If Wargaming is going to change historical data often for game balance, then change the names off all vehicles to knockoffs. I am sick of seeing a faux-simulation going further and further into arcade territory without being fun about it

 

Heavy tanks ingame arent heavy enough. If your heavy tank isnt top tier, it shouldnt be in the match. They are horribly impractical. The best ones at least have highly effective weapons.

 

What do you think a heavy tank should play like, disregading historical examples? They should have armor heavy enough to stop all frontal damage, enough penetration to beat other heavy tanks and fortifications, and enough speed to match infantry transports.

 


Edited by Chaosticket, Jun 21 2016 - 04:29.





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