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'Rigged MM', proven, explained, beaten


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eteam #41 Posted Jul 24 2016 - 22:39

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Even though i agree with the original post we can debate statistics and rigging forever.  From the daily complaints we see about MM it is safe to assume a large number of the player base is unhappy with the MM.

I believe they are unhappy because of the large number of lop sided games.  I also believe that it is fixable and running matches with a 45 -55% win chance is very doable.  For me those close games with two evenly matched teams are always the most challenging and fun.



NeatoMan #42 Posted Jul 24 2016 - 22:44

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View Posteteam, on Jul 24 2016 - 16:39, said:

Even though i agree with the original post we can debate statistics and rigging forever.  From the daily complaints we see about MM it is safe to assume a large number of the player base is unhappy with the MM.

A large number of players may be unhappy.  The problem is they incorrectly assign the blame to the MM, or even worse on some wacko MM rigging conspiracy.
 

Block Quote

I believe they are unhappy because of the large number of lop sided games.  I also believe that it is fixable and running matches with a 45 -55% win chance is very doable.  For me those close games with two evenly matched teams are always the most challenging and fun.

 That will only satisfy players who base their enjoyment on what XVM tells them.   It will do very little in the way of reducing blowouts.

 



Tolos #43 Posted Jul 24 2016 - 22:51

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The " mm video " some people are mentioning was a troll for christ sake. They even said they pick out people they dont like on it...

Asassian7 #44 Posted Jul 24 2016 - 22:52

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Mm is random, therefore there are some games that are decided by team comps. That does not mean its rigged, or specifically designed to create these matches. Because its random.

There is no proof that its rigged, only hearsay. There IS proof howver, that its random.

aswitz87 #45 Posted Jul 24 2016 - 22:52

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View PostTolos, on Jul 24 2016 - 16:51, said:

The " mm video " some people are mentioning was a troll for christ sake. They even said they pick out people they dont like on it...

 

WG could literally make said video and release it on April 1st, and people would think it was legit.

yereverluvinunclebert #46 Posted Jul 24 2016 - 22:55

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OP - Don't listen to them, when you have neato on your case you know that you are near the mark. Keep noting your stats and keep on grinding. Ignore the shills and prosper! (at least on the forum you will).

WarStore #47 Posted Jul 24 2016 - 23:01

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View PostNeatoMan, on Jul 24 2016 - 21:44, said:

A large number of players may be unhappy.  The problem is they incorrectly assign the blame to the MM, or even worse on some wacko MM rigging conspiracy.
 

 That will only satisfy players who base their enjoyment on what XVM tells them.   It will do very little in the way of reducing blowouts.

 

Including players from both teams in the same battle. When both teams think the MM is rigged against them, something is wrong...and not with the MM.

 

Matchmaking is nowhere near from perfect, but its problems have nothing to do with the reasons people keep creating these threads.



Jyarbro28 #48 Posted Jul 24 2016 - 23:21

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Too many variables not accounted for to determine a particular cause of the results. Sample size is fine, 1200 is more than adequate to determine a general cause. But how many people were in tanks for the first time? How many were also in the 1000's on their tanks? As you can guess, someone playing a tank for the 1300th time will most likely play it better than they did did on the first time out. Is the equipment the same? Does xvm account for individual tanks equipment or just the players playing it? Until all of the unrelated and or biasing factors can be controlled or determined to be non-influencing then your results are essentially meaningless.

 

But the math is cool and the fact that you spent this much time not only in-game, but figuring all this out means you might need some social life.



Dirty_Camel #49 Posted Jul 24 2016 - 23:30

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You are wasting your time. You could show these fools a Bucket-neked pic of their sister and they would STILL say you photo-shopped it as they watch you wipe her lipstick off your collar.

Edited by Dirty_Camel, Jul 24 2016 - 23:30.


Dirty_Camel #50 Posted Jul 24 2016 - 23:31

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View PostAsassian7, on Jul 24 2016 - 22:52, said:

Mm is random, therefore there are some games that are decided by team comps. That does not mean its rigged, or specifically designed to create these matches. Because its random.

There is no proof that its rigged, only hearsay. There IS proof howver, that its random.

 

Got that proof handy :sceptic:

lukzomg1 #51 Posted Jul 24 2016 - 23:35

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View PostAsassian7, on Jul 24 2016 - 21:52, said:

Mm is random, therefore there are some games that are decided by team comps. That does not mean its rigged, or specifically designed to create these matches. Because its random.

There is no proof that its rigged, only hearsay. There IS proof howver, that its random.

 

Stop using reason and common sense please.  Some people need this rigged MM conspiracy theory in order to make them selves feel better about their own suckage, in order to keep on living without slashing their own wrists.  World is out to get them and keep em down and thats just the way it is.  Rigged MM is the politically correct lie in wot world.

lukzomg1 #52 Posted Jul 24 2016 - 23:38

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View PostDirty_Camel, on Jul 24 2016 - 22:30, said:

You are wasting your time. You could show these fools a Bucket-neked pic of their sister and they would STILL say you photo-shopped it as they watch you wipe her lipstick off your collar.

 

People today dont like truth, they have been taught in RL that its always somebody elses fault, that they are the victim of society and they them selves are not responsible for anything.  PC madness infected people's minds and they carry that sick mentality anywhere they go, like here in wot. And all you rigged MM cry babies are perfect example.

Dirty_Camel #53 Posted Jul 25 2016 - 00:01

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View Postlukzomg1, on Jul 24 2016 - 23:38, said:

 

People today dont like truth, they have been taught in RL that its always somebody elses fault, that they are the victim of society and they them selves are not responsible for anything.  PC madness infected people's minds and they carry that sick mentality anywhere they go, like here in wot. And all you rigged MM cry babies are perfect example.

 

Look in the mirror...... read your post.....and think.

Dirty_Camel #54 Posted Jul 25 2016 - 00:07

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View Postlukzomg1, on Jul 24 2016 - 23:35, said:

 

Stop using reason and common sense please.  Some people need this rigged MM conspiracy theory in order to make them selves feel better about their own suckage, in order to keep on living without slashing their own wrists.  World is out to get them and keep em down and thats just the way it is.  Rigged MM is the politically correct lie in wot world.

 

The world is not out to get them, the world is out to get their $. Wait... what I Im saying..... How could someone possibly think that a video game would be designed to make $, that would require common sense. Perhaps I should jump on the tinfoil train and assume WG just wants us to have fun without making $.

Asassian7 #55 Posted Jul 25 2016 - 00:19

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View PostDirty_Camel, on Jul 25 2016 - 10:31, said:

 

Got that proof handy :sceptic:

Even as a good player, there are games you win without you doing anything. There are games you lose despite doing 7K damage, there are games you win doing 3K damage, with both teams being extremely close. there are games where you carry your team to victory despite being on the brink of losing. There are games where other players carry you to victory despite being on the brink of losing. There are games where you have certain victory but your team somehow throws it, and there are games where one team randomly fastcaps with only 3 tanks on each team dead.

 

All of these happen every day, and there is absolutely bo consistency to it. There is bo consistency to getting good or bad teams, for every 15-3 roflstomp there is an equal number of games that are close with both teams being even. In fact, most of the outcomes from these games are due to individual player skill (or lack of) and situational awareness, and have nothing to do with anything that the Matchmaker or RNG have any influence over. 

 

Since MM does NOT take player skill into account, all MM can do to "rig" games are change the team comps and the maps around. But, for every game it does that, there are plenty of perfectly fair games. And there are plenty of games where one team has the clear advantage in team comp and map (one team has all heavies with the other being mostly meds on himmelsdorf) but still loses anyway. And even if it does, it can still only choose teams based on whats in the queue, and that is always changing as well.

 

There is no consistency, or predictability to the matchmaker. Its completely random. The ONLY consistent factor in any game MM makes, and any team you are on, is you.



_bishop_x #56 Posted Jul 25 2016 - 00:20

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View PostUrabouttudie, on Jul 24 2016 - 09:08, said:

Fact #1: Shortly after I started playing In the Spring of 2014 WG released a video which described specifically how the MM system worked.

 

Fact #2 In this video the commentator specifically stated that the MM system does exactly as the OP is showing.

 

If you win too much yMM manipulates the games you play until you no longer win too much and inversely if you lose too much MM manipulates the games you play until you no longer lose too much.

 

This was referred to as a "challenge" feature

 

Fact #3 WG subsequently pulled this video within a few days to replace it with a video that DOES NOT state there is a "challenge" feature or to make any reference whatsoever to manipulating a players chance to win.

 

These are facts for which I have no proof, but I know what I saw happen with those videos.

 

 

I remember this video too.

 



lukzomg1 #57 Posted Jul 25 2016 - 00:41

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View PostDirty_Camel, on Jul 24 2016 - 23:07, said:

 

The world is not out to get them, the world is out to get their $. Wait... what I Im saying..... How could someone possibly think that a video game would be designed to make $, that would require common sense. Perhaps I should jump on the tinfoil train and assume WG just wants us to have fun without making $.

 

But but the tinfoil hat at this point is perma attached to your head kid.  Somehow WG is out to get the noobs' money and not the good players'!  Somehow its only noobs that cry about MM, while good players dont see this rigging nonsense.  Nobody said WG is a charity company, nobody said they are not out to make money...so i dont know what is your point... If you actually took your head out your butt, then tinfoil hat off your head and use it for 1st time in your life, you would realize that it would make no sense whatsoever to rig MM as you claim all day every day. Reason for it is as frustrated as people are with MM it would only lose them more customers who would quit and take their money somewhere else. Staying in business and making money depends on KEEPING your customers for long time instead of ripping them off for few months and forcing them to take their money to competition. Your reasoning would imply that WG and Serb are as irrational as you people.  If what you said was truth WG would be out of bussiness long time ago, yet theyve been around for years and still going strong even with competition around.

 

MM is RANDOM and it comes with lots of issues that randomness brings.  It needs work, and some fixes but its far from rigged.  If its rigged how do these good players still make it work?   Somehow it wasnt up to them to be good, but instead WG and Serb, and his rigged MM picked them to be good?  Paranoia....look it up, and seek help.  



lukzomg1 #58 Posted Jul 25 2016 - 00:45

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View PostDirty_Camel, on Jul 24 2016 - 23:01, said:

 

Look in the mirror...... read your post.....and think.

 

Im not the one crying that its WG's fault for everything and therefore i dont see my self as a victim that is not responsible for anything.  You again make no sense, what a shocker!

_bishop_x #59 Posted Jul 25 2016 - 00:45

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http://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Battle_Mechanics#Matchmaking

Players should also read up on the game too.


Edited by 62bish, Jul 25 2016 - 00:48.


Dirty_Camel #60 Posted Jul 25 2016 - 00:46

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View PostAsassian7, on Jul 24 2016 - 22:52, said:

Mm is random, therefore there are some games that are decided by team comps. That does not mean its rigged, or specifically designed to create these matches. Because its random.

There is no proof that its rigged, only hearsay. There IS proof howver, that its random.

 

View PostDirty_Camel, on Jul 24 2016 - 23:31, said:

 

Got that proof handy :sceptic:

 

View PostAsassian7, on Jul 25 2016 - 00:19, said:

Even as a good player, there are games you win without you doing anything. There are games you lose despite doing 7K damage, there are games you win doing 3K damage, with both teams being extremely close. there are games where you carry your team to victory despite being on the brink of losing. There are games where other players carry you to victory despite being on the brink of losing. There are games where you have certain victory but your team somehow throws it, and there are games where one team randomly fastcaps with only 3 tanks on each team dead.

 

All of these happen every day, and there is absolutely bo consistency to it. There is bo consistency to getting good or bad teams, for every 15-3 roflstomp there is an equal number of games that are close with both teams being even. In fact, most of the outcomes from these games are due to individual player skill (or lack of) and situational awareness, and have nothing to do with anything that the Matchmaker or RNG have any influence over.

 

Since MM does NOT take player skill into account, all MM can do to "rig" games are change the team comps and the maps around. But, for every game it does that, there are plenty of perfectly fair games. And there are plenty of games where one team has the clear advantage in team comp and map (one team has all heavies with the other being mostly meds on himmelsdorf) but still loses anyway. And even if it does, it can still only choose teams based on whats in the queue, and that is always changing as well.

 

There is no consistency, or predictability to the matchmaker. Its completely random. The ONLY consistent factor in any game MM makes, and any team you are on, is you.

 

Got that proof handy? :sceptic:




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