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In real tank warfare the guns sometimes get in the way, but in wot...


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blautiger #1 Posted Jul 31 2011 - 06:40

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In real tank warfare the gun sometimes get in the way.  The gun turn where there is something in the way. For example if there is a building in the way.  But in WOT I see the gun turn into the building.  What happens when the gun fires in the building?  

Also in real warfare when you are in contact with the enemy tank you can't sometime fire on them for the same reason.  But I see guns turn into tanks and fire.  Does that count as a full hit?  

Also what happen if you are so close to another tank but if their gun don't have a line of fire at you because their gun have reach their elevation limit (that is they gun is pointed to its lowest point) and still don't have a line of fire at you then can't hit you?  



thanks

MrVic #2 Posted Jul 31 2011 - 07:13

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View Postblautiger, on Jul 31 2011 - 06:40, said:

In real tank warfare the gun sometimes get in the way.  The gun turn where there is something in the way. For example if there is a building in the way.  But in WOT I see the gun turn into the building.  What happens when the gun fires in the building?  

Also in real warfare when you are in contact with the enemy tank you can't sometime fire on them for the same reason.  But I see guns turn into tanks and fire.  Does that count as a full hit?  

Also what happen if you are so close to another tank but if their gun don't have a line of fire at you because their gun have reach their elevation limit (that is they gun is pointed to its lowest point) and still don't have a line of fire at you then can't hit you?  



thanks

Shells originate from about a foot down the gun barrel from turret, so if your barrel is "inside or clipped" into a object and you fire it will travel and hit that object.

Any object or tank above or below your barrel elevation will not hit,  So a really small tank next to a Maus can avoid being hit for example.

Remember a HE shell does have a radius of splash damage so shooting point blank into a enemy or object you might take splash damage at the range from your own shell.

hope that helps :)

MrTabs #3 Posted Jul 31 2011 - 07:44

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FYI this isn't real warfare.

xGear #4 Posted Jul 31 2011 - 07:48

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View PostMrTabs, on Jul 31 2011 - 07:44, said:

FYI this isn't real warfare.
LIES

Ricox #5 Posted Jul 31 2011 - 08:20

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The physics in this game aren't really any good at the moment, but they're working on a new physics engine, perhaps it will also address this, but I personally prefer them not to address it - that's too much realism.

ServiusTheBear #6 Posted Jul 31 2011 - 09:19

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Personally I see no probs with the game. Make it to real and it will drive foke off. This is fun and thats how it should be :)

Deathskyz #7 Posted Jul 31 2011 - 10:38

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Well if the Game implement this, there will be some tactical advantage of short derp guns over long barreled monstrosities like the 105 L/70

I imagine the Pz III stubby able to win a IS-4 because of this

Clockworkred #8 Posted Jul 31 2011 - 10:46

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The guns may clip through buildings, but they're very capable of absorbing shells meant for enemy tanks.

Yamaxanadu #9 Posted Jul 31 2011 - 11:02

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View PostRicox, on Jul 31 2011 - 08:20, said:

The physics in this game aren't really any good at the moment, but they're working on a new physics engine, perhaps it will also address this, but I personally prefer them not to address it - that's too much realism.
Devs said they can easily do gun barrels to be real thing but mentioned that most players will curse them for this (and town maps will be lost).

CrashTailspin #10 Posted Jul 31 2011 - 17:35

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View PostDeathskyz, on Jul 31 2011 - 10:38, said:

Well if the Game implement this, there will be some tactical advantage of short derp guns over long barreled monstrosities like the 105 L/70

I imagine the Pz III stubby able to win a IS-4 because of this

Yes, they are working on a new physics engine, where the gun barrel will essentially be a "solid" piece on the tank.  If you run it into a building, the gun will be damaged.  It won't be able to turn "into" an enemy turret, etc.  Also, if you're in your PzIII and go charging right up to the edge of a hill without slowing down, in the current game you will stop before going over the side.  In the new physics model, you WILL go over the edge, potentially destroying your tank.

As far as the derp guns are concerned, I highly doubt that a PzIII or anything of similar tier will be able to destroy something like an IS-4, simply because of the lack of accuracy and armor of the higher-tiered tank.  That's not to say you can't try, though!  I think most players will simply alter their playing style slightly and keep their more accurate, harder punching cannons.

As far as the 105 L/70.....you must have been one-shot by a Panther II or something.  Here's my advice - take the Panther II out first.  And don't platoon your PzIII with something like an IS-3, because you WILL be pulled into battles you're not ready for.

Good luck on the battlefield!  And beware the Panther II...soon to be E-50.

SKurj #11 Posted Jul 31 2011 - 18:35

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I could be wrong but I had heard during early testing they tried adding collision detection to the gun barrel but it was too painful, so they had no plans to implement this again...

blautiger #12 Posted Aug 01 2011 - 01:16

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View PostMrVic, on Jul 31 2011 - 07:13, said:

Shells originate from about a foot down the gun barrel from turret, so if your barrel is "inside or clipped" into a object and you fire it will travel and hit that object.

Any object or tank above or below your barrel elevation will not hit,  So a really small tank next to a Maus can avoid being hit for example.

Remember a HE shell does have a radius of splash damage so shooting point blank into a enemy or object you might take splash damage at the range from your own shell.

hope that helps :)


o.k.  lets get this straight.  So they way to look at this regarding the gun length is to assume all guns are about a foot long regardless of how it looks on the screen.  That is why building or other tanks will not interfere with the gun.  

thanks

MrVic #13 Posted Aug 01 2011 - 04:15

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View Postblautiger, on Aug 01 2011 - 01:16, said:

o.k.  lets get this straight.  So they way to look at this regarding the gun length is to assume all guns are about a foot long regardless of how it looks on the screen.  That is why building or other tanks will not interfere with the gun.  

thanks

Yep exactly :)

Westwooda #14 Posted Aug 01 2011 - 04:36

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I usually make my own realism so when I "damage" my gun by either of those listed in the OP I choose not to fire my gun again for the rest of the match.  :lol:  I'm only kidding, or am I?

Hunt3rj2 #15 Posted Aug 01 2011 - 04:52

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They should really implement barrel collision, it annoys me to have something with it's barrel off the right deck of the hull at 60 kph going through trees like nothing is happening. IRL the turret would probably be forced to spin so rapidly it would just flat out pop out of the hull and be stuck in one position, and everyone inside would be jarred.

IRL hitting a tree with a tank at even 40 km/h is going to incapacitate someone.

Also this will make tanks like the T95 more realistic in how they go about cross-country travel.

worldeaters #16 Posted Aug 01 2011 - 05:35

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If they fix it then soviet tanks can't face hug you....who wants that. :rolleyes:

daletkine #17 Posted Aug 01 2011 - 05:47

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Personally, I gave this thought when I first encountered clipping of gun barrel. It doesn't look good, lets you know it's not reality, but reality would be too ugly to play. Transmission breakdowns, guns not able to turn in narrow streets, especially for TDs, indeed, crew members incapacitated by minor collisions, guns having such low accuracy that they can't hit squat (most guns had terrible accuracy back then). This is not a simulator and I'm glad.
I really do believe that most players would be ticked off if gun collision was on...

Hunt3rj2 #18 Posted Aug 01 2011 - 06:20

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I know it's not a simulator, but there should be an advantage to having a gun with a shorter barrel. Tanks in cities are tough to handle, and in OIF they had to give out AT-4s in case the main gun couldn't traverse to engage something. Crew deaths would be too frustrating.

Gun damage from collisions shouldn't be put in, but just simple collision would be okay by me.

This would also give the VK4502B an advantage because the barrel comes from the rear of the hull so the barrel is less likely to hit something when in the forward position.

Yamaxanadu #19 Posted Aug 01 2011 - 10:18

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View Postworldeaters, on Aug 01 2011 - 05:35, said:

If they fix it then soviet tanks can't face hug you....who wants that. :rolleyes:
The USA tanks will suffer as well... =)

GearaDoga #20 Posted Aug 01 2011 - 10:40

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View Postdaletkine, on Aug 01 2011 - 05:47, said:

(most guns had terrible accuracy back then).

...Say what?

Not really sure where you're getting that idea from.  

Historically speaking, a Tiger with the short 88 would have been able to score hits with each and every shell fired at a tank sized target from more than an entire map length away, if it was stationary.  

Historically, many tanks were expressly designed to be combat viable at ranges double, triple, or more than the absolute maximum possible in the game.

Historically, at the typical WoT combat ranges (200, 300 meters), every tank in the game would have easily been 100% accurate, and most would have been able to place their shots on specific bolts on their target's hull, nevermind just aiming at certain general areas.

I'd LOVE to have period correct gun performance and accuracy - my German 88's would be twice as accurate, easily!




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