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Japanese Tank Tree & Guns Discussion


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SoukouDragon #6721 Posted Jun 24 2014 - 18:30

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View Postsp15, on Jun 24 2014 - 18:25, said:


what is it?

 

Experimental Type 98 Chi-Ho.



Life_In_Black #6722 Posted Jun 24 2014 - 18:54

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Is there anything known about its armor?

SoukouDragon #6723 Posted Jun 24 2014 - 19:24

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View PostLife_In_Black, on Jun 24 2014 - 18:54, said:

Is there anything known about its armor?

 

Don't think so unless Dai found something additional. But at any rate, the armor is very thin, so putting in any guess values of easily penetrable armor won't cross over critical game balance issues. Some quick things, 11 tons, 47mm main armament, V6 160hp diesel later a V8 160hp diesel. 

 

 



Seraphil #6724 Posted Jun 25 2014 - 12:05

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So it's a less capable Chi-Ha...

SoukouDragon #6725 Posted Jun 25 2014 - 14:51

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View PostSeraphil, on Jun 25 2014 - 12:05, said:

So it's a less capable Chi-Ha...

 

Well...not necessarily. Same top gun, similar mobility, and bad armor. Considering that the Chi-Ha is very good for tier 3 (in my opinion at least), even if the Chi-Ho is slightly inferior, it would still make out for a decent tier 3 tank.

 

Now the only reason to add the Chi-Ho in the first place is if a new medium line was to be added. Of course a second Japanese medium line is far from even getting on the long list of things to do for WG with WoT but it could go something like as follows..

 

A second medium line probably would require a few things to shuffle around in the existing medium line. Could go something like the following.

 

tier 2: Chi-Ni...............................Type 89

tier 3: Chi-Ha..............................Chi-Ho

tier 4: Chi-He/Type 2 Ho-I...........Experimental Type 1 Ho-I

tier 5: Chi-To 57mm prototype.....Chi-Nu

tier 6: Chi-To................................Chi-Ri plan 1

tier 7: Chi-Ri II..............................Chi-Ri plan 2

tier 8: STA-1.................................Chi-Ri Kai

tier 9: Type 61..............................Chi-Se

tier 10: STB-1...............................Chi-Se Kai

 

Some points.

 

There were three Experimental Type 1 Ho-I vehicles. One used a Chi-Ha hull, two used a Chi-He hull. For this tier, the Chi-He hull version can be used. There are two other turrets besides the Chi-He turret and the Type 2 Ho-I turret that can be used for the Type 1 Ho-I to differentiate it from the Chi-He/Type 2 Ho-I. Also this tank's top gun can be just the short 75 as it used. If need be, make the stats for the short 75 a little more comfortable.

 

Chi-To 57 prototype requirements were 24 tons, 75mm of armor, and top speed of 45. During test running, a top speed of 46 was recorded. Uses the same 400hp engine (which actually should be 412 maybe?). At the moment, I am not sure if it had a 50mm turret or a 75mm turret. It did not use the rounded turret but a turret that looks like the Chi-Nu turret. In-game battle weight can be something like 25 tons giving it hp/ton close to that of the Soviet T-34. Would give Japan a relatively quick mid-tier medium tank.

 

The Chi-Ri plan 1 would have the plan 1 turret as its top turret. Its stock turret can be a blue print turret which was likely drawn up before the plan for an auto loader was decided on. The Chi-Ri plan 1 suspension graphics are not represented in the game, they can be used for this tank. Top gun can be either the Model 1 or the Model 2 Type 5 75mm cannon. No belt-fed cannon. Same 550 hp engine.

 

Chi-Ri Kai would remain exactly the same except for new weapons. I would stress keeping it very much the same since a Chi-Ri Kai has never existed. So to diminish the taboo of adding a fantasy tank, it would be best to keep it very similar to the existing Chi-Ri in tech. Stock can be the 88 everyone says it was really planned for. This cannon does have existing AP rounds so no problem there. Top gun can be the Type 92 105mm cannon. Putting on the 105 leads to one of the criteria outlined for the Chi-Se, a 105 main cannon. Maybe new de-tuned levels of the engine can be introduced for it to boost mobility if really needed.

 

Chi-Ri II is like the Chi-To. Battle weight would go up to about 35 tons but gets a 500hp diesel engine so its hp/ton increases over the Chi-To. It also gets the 600mm wide treads like the Chi-Ri, as oppose to the 450mm wide treads of the Chi-To. So ground resistance should be very good. Top gun might be the same though. Perhaps the long barrel experimental 75mm AA cannon or the ge cannon can be used, don't know.

 

Chi-Se had 3 criteria outlined. (1) 105mm cannon in a rotating turret, (2) hull similar to the Chi-Ri II, and (3) new suspension. Thats all.  If the hull is going to be similar to the Chi-Ri II, then we're looking at thin armor for tier 9. Cannon can be the 105L55. Perhaps the version from the Ka-To which does not have the single tray loader attached like the 105L55 for the Ho-Ri does. Any one of the many suspension plans investigated during the Chi-Ri development can be used.

 

Chi-Se Kai.. well something to top it off, maybe it can use the frontal sloped hull from the Ho-Ri mock up. Maybe use the 105L64.7 or just stay with the 105L55 and use better ammo. Maybe the torsion bar suspension which was already investigated for the most modern effect.


Edited by SoukouDragon, Jun 25 2014 - 15:15.


Vollketten #6726 Posted Jun 25 2014 - 17:17

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don't know if anyone saw this before:



Life_In_Black #6727 Posted Jul 03 2014 - 19:58

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Not directly related to Japanese AFVs, but interesting nonetheless: http://www.lonesentry.com/articles/ttt/japanese-wwii-motor-vehicles-trucks.html

Daigensui #6728 Posted Jul 09 2014 - 14:53

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View Postarisaka38, on Aug 01 2011 - 06:31, said:

If "mostly fictional" setting is allowed (like VK45.02p),

 

I think we've come a long way from this. 



Okinoshima #6729 Posted Jul 09 2014 - 21:11

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View PostDaigensui, on Jun 24 2014 - 03:54, said:

 

 

Interesting.....

 

Dai, I've seen this photo before referred to as the Chi-Ho, is it actually in your opinion?

 

 

EDIT: WOAH Epic fail on my part, 1 letter changed the tank completely, I meant Chi-Ho but spelled Chi-To super embarrassing sorry :facepalm:


Edited by Okinoshima, Jul 10 2014 - 14:34.


Daigensui #6730 Posted Jul 09 2014 - 21:16

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Look at the turret. There is a coaxial MG mount, which only one IJA tank had.

Okinoshima #6731 Posted Jul 09 2014 - 21:55

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Ys, thats exactly what I thought, also you see see the turret is welded rather than riveted like the Chi-Ha but what sort of threw me off was the commander cupola, it looks a bit higher than the Chi-Hos you posted.

Daigensui #6732 Posted Jul 09 2014 - 22:24

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Cupolas could always be added.

Clanky44 #6733 Posted Jul 10 2014 - 12:15

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Do we have a time line on when we might see the Japanese TD's?

Okinoshima #6734 Posted Jul 10 2014 - 14:36

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The Russian site Aviarmor also claims this is a Type 98 Chi-Ho as well but then again, they're also idiots who who have a movie prop as the Type 5 Ke-Ho



Arvondor #6735 Posted Aug 09 2014 - 18:38

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So, after some less than impressive games in the new Te-Ke (the new gift tank), I decided to pull up Tank Inspector and compare the Ha-Go (the regular Japanese tier 2 light, which I quite like) with the 37mm Type 98 (the same gun used by the Te-Ke, and which is pretty good on the Ha-Go) to the Te-Ke and see how things looked. It turns out that that Ha-Go is as good as or better than the Te-Ke in almost every way. Right. Time to play a couple more final games in the Te-Ke before selling it, because what is the point of this thing, anyway?

Seraphil #6736 Posted Aug 09 2014 - 21:33

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The point of the Te-Ke is to double up on double XPs for your Ha-Go/Ke-Ni/Ke-Ho.

 

Also the Te-Ke is even smaller than the Ha-Go so provides a tougher target to hit at range, which actually means quite a bit at this low tier.



Arvondor #6737 Posted Aug 10 2014 - 13:30

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Yeah, but the horrible aiming time means that if someone does fire on you, you'll have a harder time hitting him back, too.  

shinhoto #6738 Posted Aug 13 2014 - 00:51

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Anyone have a 3/4/5 picture of a type 97 chi ha frame?

 

 

 

 

-JG52_Shinhoto






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