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AMX M4 49 OVERPOWERED?


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Poll: AMX M4 49 (123 members have cast votes)

Do you think the AMX M4 49 OVER powered

  1. YES (45 votes [36.59%])

    Percentage of vote: 36.59%

  2. NO (57 votes [46.34%])

    Percentage of vote: 46.34%

  3. Cylon Dave needs to learn how to play (21 votes [17.07%])

    Percentage of vote: 17.07%

You own the AMX M4 49

  1. YES (40 votes [32.52%])

    Percentage of vote: 32.52%

  2. NO (83 votes [67.48%])

    Percentage of vote: 67.48%

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An_Innocent_Bystander #21 Posted Nov 27 2016 - 05:10

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View PostInsecure_Roos178, on Nov 27 2016 - 04:07, said:

Is it pay to win? Strictly, no. But, it is much better than pretty much every heavy tank in the game. Only the 50 100 and the IS3s can ACTUALLY compete with this thing in most battles (oh, and that new T26E5), in my opinion., The only way any other heavy can win is flanking it. GL flanking in the current map meta though. Or prem rounds. The cupola is a weak point, but with -10 of depression, you can hide it really easily. And the tank can snap fairly well.

Have you ever actually fought one? Even if they are using all of the gun depression the cupola is still very visible and easily hit. You wouldn't even need to fight one you could just check Tanks.gg



spinax22 #22 Posted Nov 27 2016 - 16:50

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People aren't saying they're pay to win, they're saying they're overpowered. there IS a difference. 

In my opinion, they are overpowered when compared to most other premium tanks, but they're merely "good" when compared to standard tanks.

 

TL;DR: i want my IS-6 to be competitive at tier 8 again.

 

 

(edit: changed "tier 9" to "tier 8".)


Edited by spinax22, Nov 27 2016 - 16:51.


yoggraid #23 Posted Nov 27 2016 - 21:09

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Its a great tank but it is only op against stupid and lower tier tanks, give it some time and pubbies will normalize where to shoot then after a couple of months it will be hardly ever played. Tumor on top is sometimes hard to hit but for most tier 8 and better guns can just crap through the armor with gold while lower tiers can easily derp through the sides. The shoulders are easy to pen and it suffers like the Ferdi as well the Japanese boxes especially when the ammo rack takes a hit. BL-10 auto pens it :justwait:

An_Innocent_Bystander #24 Posted Nov 28 2016 - 00:57

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View Postspinax22, on Nov 27 2016 - 16:50, said:

People aren't saying they're pay to win, they're saying they're overpowered. there IS a difference. 

In my opinion, they are overpowered when compared to most other premium tanks, but they're merely "good" when compared to standard tanks.

 

TL;DR: i want my IS-6 to be competitive at tier 8 again.

 

 

(edit: changed "tier 9" to "tier 8".)

IS-6 is competitive at T8, and is frankly one of the easiest tanks to play at tier 8. It requires so little skill to perform average in the IS-6. If you aren't doing your HP in damage minimum almost every game no matter the matchmaking and winning half your games there is another issue going on that isn't the tank. 

 

The M4 49 is not a preferential matchmaking tank and therefore is not gimped like tanks such as the IS-6 or T-34-3 are.



dis_tank #25 Posted Nov 28 2016 - 04:50

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I find my Driver and Ammo rack tend to be damage more in the m4 49 than most tanks I play. I think its decent but not really op the cupola tends to get penned by people who know how to aim.

Bavor #26 Posted Nov 28 2016 - 05:21

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After playing the rental for a few battles and trying some training room experiments, I agree the tank is far from over powered.  The IS-3, T34, T28, T28 Proto, Lowe, Rhm, Skorpion G, and other tier 8 tanks can pen it frontally very consistently.  The upper plate is about 225mm of effective armor.  Also, its slow and weak everywhere except the front.

SickSix #27 Posted Nov 28 2016 - 05:56

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I know I am an average player but:

1: It doesn't necessarily have to be OP to be pay towin. If it's good enough to suddenly make noobs competitive and doesn't take skill to play then that is basically pay to win.

2: Saying that 'if you spam gold its easily penetrated' is actually helping the OP's case. You shouldn't have to spam gold to defeat a tank of the same tier. The front armor is strong. Hull and turret. Most other T8 heavies have bigger soft spots or more of them. I have a pretty good hit ratio, but that little copula can be a B to hit consistently.


Saying all that, the 'problem' probably seems so bad right now because of all the rentals. We will have to reevaluate this once the rentals are gone. But my god tight now it's 5-8 of these things in every TVIII match.

An_Innocent_Bystander #28 Posted Nov 28 2016 - 06:21

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View PostSickSix, on Nov 28 2016 - 05:56, said:

I know I am an average player but:

1: It doesn't necessarily have to be OP to be pay towin. If it's good enough to suddenly make noobs competitive and doesn't take skill to play then that is basically pay to win.

2: Saying that 'if you spam gold its easily penetrated' is actually helping the OP's case. You shouldn't have to spam gold to defeat a tank of the same tier. The front armor is strong. Hull and turret. Most other T8 heavies have bigger soft spots or more of them. I have a pretty good hit ratio, but that little copula can be a B to hit consistently.


Saying all that, the 'problem' probably seems so bad right now because of all the rentals. We will have to reevaluate this once the rentals are gone. But my god tight now it's 5-8 of these things in every TVIII match.

1. This tank is not pay to win. It absolutely does not make noobs competitive either. In fact it makes noobs less competitive than if they were in something like an IS-6. They frequently give up the side armor sit still in front of enemy guns, dont know how to aim etc. 

 

 

2. If you think the cupola is "little" or hard to hit you have brain damage. My 112 hits about 4/5 shots on the cupola at a range of about 250m all whilst the tank was juking and poking in and out of cover firing and its gun has trash accuracy. Also gold guarantees a penetration much like shooting gold at any other tier 8 heavy but it doesn't even require gold to pen fairly reliably.

 

What the hell about this tank is so hard for pubbies to pen??? All you have to do is AIM once in a while.


Edited by An_Innocent_Bystander, Nov 28 2016 - 06:24.


Hellsfog #29 Posted Nov 28 2016 - 06:58

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Once players become familiar with its weak spots, it will bully lower tiers and below average players but otherwise be an xp pinata. I don't see how that makes it op.

MurphysIaw #30 Posted Nov 28 2016 - 16:08

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I wouldn't say it's OP but these latest premiums have really power creeped the hell out of their tier 8 counterparts. I personally think the Skorpion G is better than the RHM/JP2, AMX>Tiger 2, and I think the T25E5 is slightly better than the T32 due to the increased mobility. There are certain situations where I would rather be in the RHM vs Skorpion and in the T32 over the T25E5, but I think I would pick the AMX every time over the Tiger 2.

LpBronco #31 Posted Nov 28 2016 - 16:10

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View PostSkimpyLawnChair, on Nov 26 2016 - 01:29, said:

Is it pay to win? Absolutely no. The AMX M4 49 isn't really all that strong. It's a good tank don't get me wrong. But in all reality in order for a tank to be "pay to win" they should out perform the superior tanks of the tier (ie. IS-3). Does it out perform the IS-3? Does it out perform the vast majority of tier 8 tanks? No. All WG is doing is finally balancing their premium tanks. They're finally making up for years of making crappy unbalanced tier 8 premiums.

 

 

The fact that all of you idiots think that just because the new premium tanks aren't trash compared to the old ones just shows that your guys' IQ isn't all too good.

 

If you could have made your point without the trash talk I may have had some respect for your opinion.

Bavor #32 Posted Nov 28 2016 - 21:50

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View PostSickSix, on Nov 27 2016 - 23:56, said:

2: Saying that 'if you spam gold its easily penetrated' is actually helping the OP's case. You shouldn't have to spam gold to defeat a tank of the same tier. The front armor is strong. Hull and turret. Most other T8 heavies have bigger soft spots or more of them. I have a pretty good hit ratio, but that little copula can be a B to hit consistently.

 

You don't have to spam gold in many tier 8 tanks to pen it frontally.  The upper plate is 223-230mm effective armor.  If you angle it slightly, which makes the angled cheek weaker, the armor still isn't much better and goes up to abotu 240mm effective armor on the upper front plate.  When the tank is hull down the cupola is easy to pen.

 

I noticed a lot fo players shoot at the lower front plate, which is a mistake because the angle makes the lower front plate closer to 250mm effective armor.



Beornotns #33 Posted Nov 28 2016 - 22:12

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View Postjamesdoz, on Nov 26 2016 - 06:22, said:

I like how you . compare  it to the other tier 8's..like the boarder line op is3 and that's your argument. As if the Is3 isn't the best tier 8 heavy period or tier 8 for that matter. As.long as its on Parr  with the best it ain't op. Dude pls

Why did no one say anything about the IS-6? Or the IS-3A?  This is people who want to complain, simple as that.

 

The T26E5 has the exact same DPM as the IS-6 AND the IS-3A, and for all of its "MOAR ARMOR ERMAGERD SO OP" crap, the frontal turret armor of the Caernarvon, Liberté, T34, AND IS-3A are all better than the Patriot.  As far as the Liberté, only the T34 has a lower DPM.  Also, the side hull armor of the 2 newest premium heavies are worse than the aforementioned previously released premiums T34, IS-6 and IS-3A.

 

This is not a new thing, nor is it a singular instance.  This is WG finally making premiums that can stand shoulder to shoulder with the best of the tech tree Tier VIIIs.  It is not pay 2 win...  This is pay to compete.  But as already mentioned, a poor player (someone like me for example) won't get Ace Tankers more in such tanks than the regular tree.  But good to unicom players will absolutely wreck with these tanks, and since they are putting their more experienced crews in the premium tanks for training purposes, you will get beat down by the great players that much faster, but all YOU see is the Liberté bouncing shots and laying the smack down because the driver knows angles and targeting weak-spots, not just "point tank towards enemy, click "2" button, drive forward..." that you seem to imply.

 

I for one am interested in seeing what the advent calendar holds in store for us.

 

~B


Edited by Beornotns, Nov 28 2016 - 22:13.


An_Innocent_Bystander #34 Posted Nov 28 2016 - 23:08

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View PostBeornotns, on Nov 28 2016 - 22:12, said:

The T26E5 has the exact same DPM as the IS-6 AND the IS-3A, and for all of its "MOAR ARMOR ERMAGERD SO OP" crap, the frontal turret armor of the Caernarvon, Liberté, T34, AND IS-3A are all better than the Patriot.  As far as the Liberté, only the T34 has a lower DPM.  Also, the side hull armor of the 2 newest premium heavies are worse than the aforementioned previously released premiums T34, IS-6 and IS-3A.

 

 ~B

This interests me. Everyone that I have talked to and play with have agreed that the T8 E5s cupola is less consistent for whether it pens or not is worse than the T10 E5, most likely due to the angling and sloping. The cheeks are technically weaker but still even on the weak parts of the cheeks we are talking 220-230 effective armor and that is when you hit the exact flush on spot. In real battle scenarios it is so thin a strip against any competet player at any range othe than poin blank it is extremely difficult to hit. Far betterturret armor than any of the tanks you listed ESPECIALLY the caern and Liberte.

 

The 76mm of side armor is irrelevant because it is enough  that it won't get penetrated from overmatch and is therefore easy to angle and sidescrape with keeping it at an auto bounce. And the frontal hull armor is equivalent to an IS-6 an actually better. I can easily pen the IS-6 front hull with my ST-1 using the BL-9 I'm still semi stock. The T26E5 bounces it even under the slightest of angles even though the IS-6 was angled perfectly. The lower plate is weaker but not as weak as a T32. It still maintains around 185-190 effective from head on.

 

Combine it's IS-3 like armor in that I really has no particular bad points ( Even IS-3 has the overmatch weakpoint, E5 has no such) with gun depression, best in class DPM, some of the best gun handling, and close to best in tier penetration, and above average mobility (On par with the112). It is quite the performer in all areas and isn't weak in any area. Even the widely considered borderline to yes OP IS-3 sacrifices DPM, gun depression, and gun handling...


Edited by An_Innocent_Bystander, Nov 28 2016 - 23:10.


Dragnix #35 Posted Nov 29 2016 - 07:27

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I actually destroy IS-3 and T26E5 with AMX M4 49 L; because of the both nice front hull and turret armor. I able to block the damage most tanks. I remember the match I play as AMX M4 49 L. Enemy side has more advantage in heavies like IS-3, IS, T26E5, IS-6, 2 T26E5 P. I even got bounce from Rhm. Borsig. I got most ricochet from IS-3 and IS. The IS-3 know how to use angle to protect the hull, but he still got hit from me when he tried to move back and hit me. That's first time I play AMX M4 49 L and I really admired to this new France premium heavy tank with front hull and armor better than FCM 50t 

An_Innocent_Bystander #36 Posted Nov 29 2016 - 14:15

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View PostDragnix, on Nov 29 2016 - 07:27, said:

I actually destroy IS-3 and T26E5 with AMX M4 49 L; because of the both nice front hull and turret armor. I able to block the damage most tanks. I remember the match I play as AMX M4 49 L. Enemy side has more advantage in heavies like IS-3, IS, T26E5, IS-6, 2 T26E5 P. I even got bounce from Rhm. Borsig. I got most ricochet from IS-3 and IS. The IS-3 know how to use angle to protect the hull, but he still got hit from me when he tried to move back and hit me. That's first time I play AMX M4 49 L and I really admired to this new France premium heavy tank with front hull and armor better than FCM 50t 

I highly doubt you took out any competent player in an IS-3 or Jumbo Pershing with the AMX.

 

I also highly doubt that any competent RHM player would bounce off the AMX. Even with the 15cm gun it has plenty pen to butter the hull and can easily hit the cupola with either gun.

 

Replay or it didn't happen...



cedar_door #37 Posted Nov 29 2016 - 15:49

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I find it to be exceptionally well balanced personally, and it is currently my favorite tank to play.

 

Strengths:

Very effective frontal armour profile

good penetration

good DPM

good depression

 

weaknesses

made of ammo racks

increased module damage

side armour, hull deck, roof and cupola have almost no armour

large ground resistances

 

So like most tanks in the game, the M4 49 absolutely excels at certain situations, and miserably fails at others.

 

One thing that the m4 49 excels at which few other tanks in the game happen to be able to do well is frontal pushes. Just driving right in there and laying about. This is why people think it is OP, because they find themselves being pushed on by one.



An_Innocent_Bystander #38 Posted Nov 29 2016 - 18:15

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View Postcedar_door, on Nov 29 2016 - 15:49, said:

Very effective frontal armour profile

good DPM

 

One thing that the m4 49 excels at which few other tanks in the game happen to be able to do well is frontal pushes. Just driving right in there and laying about. This is why people think it is OP, because they find themselves being pushed on by one.

XD lmbo

 

Good frontal armor and DPM 

lmbo

 

Being pushed into by one makes it even easier to kill lol


Edited by An_Innocent_Bystander, Nov 29 2016 - 18:16.


landedkiller #39 Posted Nov 30 2016 - 05:49

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It is about time we had a tier 8 premium that could compete with the is6 and all the other tier 8 premium heavies

An_Innocent_Bystander #40 Posted Nov 30 2016 - 12:32

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Tell which T8 premium heavy has trouble against the IS-6? I'm confused. My 112 seems to have no issues and it has the worst pen of the tier 8 heavies at 175 besides the KV-5.




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