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T29, T32, and US Heavy tanks in general?


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RPS007 #1 Posted Aug 05 2011 - 22:08

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It seems to me the is some prejudice going on here. I have read, heard, and even seen these tanks go head to head and they almost always lose (The T32 vs. Tier 8s more so than the T29) :( . America's tanks are evry bit as good if not better than their Russian counterparts, but I guess that's not how it works in a game developed by Russian Devs. Even the German tanks are beaten by the Russians. I know my tanks. Germany could produce some beastly vehicles, but these devs don't do any of them justice. They're highly biased, and it's got to stop. Fight fair Devs  :angry: .

Firespray #2 Posted Aug 05 2011 - 22:13

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View PostRPS007, on Aug 05 2011 - 22:08, said:

It seems to me the is some prejudice going on here. I have read, heard, and even seen these tanks go head to head and they almost always lose (The T32 vs. Tier 8s more so than the T29) :( . America's tanks are evry bit as good if not better than their Russian counterparts, but I guess that's not how it works in a game developed by Russian Devs. Even the German tanks are beaten by the Russians. I know my tanks. Germany could produce some beastly vehicles, but these devs don't do any of them justice. They're highly biased, and it's got to stop. Fight fair Devs  :angry: .

I believe you are playing the T32 a bit oddly, head to head engagements aren't what they are good for, going hull down and using their gun depression works great.  Your turret is near impenetrable by a Maus, so going hull down has a lot of benefits.  American heavies play very differently from their Russian counterparts as the Russian heavies are usually made for brawling while say the German heavies are for more longer range fights as German heavies have very good guns.

Vammal #3 Posted Aug 05 2011 - 22:16

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In general, the American heavy tanks have relatively weak hull armour, but great turret armour, so most players tend to achieve hull-down position, leaving only their turret exposed. I can personally only speak for the T29 at the moment, as it's the only one I've played so far, although they are quite similar. Going head to head against other tanks, the American heavies aren't too disadvantaged. Look at the Tiger I for example - it's hull armour is similar to that of the T29, and it's front is not as sloped, so it may not be too difficult to destroy it in one of those "hugging" battles. If you think you'll like the American heavies, then I say: go for it! :Smile_honoring:

Lert #4 Posted Aug 05 2011 - 22:16

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Puppeteer, learn your puppet. American tanks are easily good enough, provided you play them right. I've been solo'd in my Maus in beta by a T32, that's a tank two tiers lower.

mechsftw #5 Posted Aug 05 2011 - 22:30

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i just hugged a lowe and a tiger in 1 battle, and my t32 wasn't scratched at all except for HE shots.

JDCollie #6 Posted Aug 05 2011 - 22:37

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In my limited experience, the T29 and on line are actually excellent tanks. Their turrets are beastly tough, just keep the rest of the tank out of fire :D

Lapland #7 Posted Aug 05 2011 - 22:50

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The hell are you talking about? The only real complaint about the T32 is its woefully underpowered gun, but the tank itself built of same material used to make the KV-2-152mm, Trollitium. I swear that gun mantlet on the upgraded turret has some kind of super-science magnet that tracks all the shells aimed at a front facing T32. Top front armor is also insane. I'm pretty jelly of the T32's soft-characteristics when compared to the IS and IS-3's. All the T32 needs is a rebalanced T15E2M2 (make it separate from the Patton's own T15E2m2) and it'd be easily the best Tier 8 heavy.

ApplesauceBandit #8 Posted Aug 05 2011 - 23:02

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View PostRPS007, on Aug 05 2011 - 22:08, said:

It seems to me the is some prejudice going on here. I have read, heard, and even seen these tanks go head to head and they almost always lose (The T32 vs. Tier 8s more so than the T29) :( . America's tanks are evry bit as good if not better than their Russian counterparts, but I guess that's not how it works in a game developed by Russian Devs. Even the German tanks are beaten by the Russians. I know my tanks. Germany could produce some beastly vehicles, but these devs don't do any of them justice. They're highly biased, and it's got to stop. Fight fair Devs  :angry: .
This game is not supposed to accurately reflect a tanks performance in real life because this game is not a simulator.  Also there are enough russain bias posts, you do not need to make another.  German tank are for sniping, Russain are have high damage, low accuracy guns for up-close fighting, and American tanks are mobile and are good all around tanks.

LeuCeaMia #9 Posted Aug 05 2011 - 23:03

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There are only 2 US heavies that are considered sub par the T1 and T34(I don't see why the M6 would be worse than a VK3601(a heavy by next week)) the rest are pretty balanced or in the T29's case clearly superior.

   In the T32's defense the Soviet T44 also has the worst gun but is considered balanced due to its other characteristics
  (depression/turret for the T32, maneuverability/agility for the T44 etc.).

   Really if your not succeeding in US heavies might as well switch over to the soviets as they might fit your play style better.


*Then again I appreciate those who keep the statistics of these tanks as worse as possible to avoid nerfs. ;)

Pongo #10 Posted Aug 05 2011 - 23:10

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I have the IS3 and T32 elite, had all three tier 8 heavies in beta.

There is little to tell between them in capability, just style. I like the 32 better then the IS3 though.

RPS007 #11 Posted Aug 05 2011 - 23:41

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Ok. So maybe I was wrong. There have been just too many IS heavy tanks that have bounced my T29's 105mm gun off the HULL, raced in next to me while in hull down position, buried their gun in my engine compartment and blew me to bits time and again. It gets disgusting after a while because I'm good with my T29. It's been my favorite tank so far. I can manually aim and one-shot an light tank or fast TD or small medium tank moving at full speed at 100m on the first try (Not an exageration. I've actually done that numerous times generally in defense of my team's artillery). It just seems that no matter where I've hidden in hull down positions, they find some way to hit my hull, use HE, and their are some that seem to always hit the "ears" on my turret with every shot (Thus my doubts about what was said earlier about accuracy). My crew is 100% plus 68% repair but it sure doesn't seem to help much. I guess I just need some help in light of what you all have been saying. I'm sorry I even brought it up  :( .

Daedalus_117 #12 Posted Aug 06 2011 - 01:41

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The shitty gun on the T32 means you're basically helpless against russian and german tier 9s and up, but against equal tier and lower tanks you're a juggernaut. Hell, I successfully facehugged a jagdtiger the other day. the turret armor and profile of the tank is that good.

Well, I should add that of course you can stand a chance against tier 9 heavies if you can hit their sides, buuut I just don't usually get that luxury.

hazywater #13 Posted Aug 06 2011 - 02:14

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Like a cake, there are many layers to playing an american heavy tank. But the inch thick frosting all over the outside is this:

Posted Image

Rotsu #14 Posted Aug 06 2011 - 11:54

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View Posthazywater, on Aug 06 2011 - 02:14, said:

Like a cake, there are many layers to playing an american heavy tank. But the inch thick frosting all over the outside is this:

Posted Image


That pick cracked me up. TY

LGear #15 Posted Aug 06 2011 - 12:52

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View PostRPS007, on Aug 05 2011 - 23:41, said:

Ok. So maybe I was wrong. There have been just too many IS heavy tanks that have bounced my T29's 105mm gun off the HULL, raced in next to me while in hull down position, buried their gun in my engine compartment and blew me to bits time and again.

If you're talking about IS tanks aka the Tier 7 IS-1's, then I don't see how you're having problems. The 90mm M3 gun makes short work of IS tanks on their front hull, let alone the 105mm. If you're really having trouble, try to always aim at the vertical part of their front armor, gets them every time. I don't fear IS tanks much even in my M6, and my T29 creams them each time. The only Iosef Stalins that my T29 has trouble with is the IS-4 and IS-7, which is rather expected given their armor. The IS-1 and IS-3 though shouldn't be a problem for the 105mm.

Also, if IS tanks are able to race next to you, where are your teammates? Unless you raced all the way to the enemy's half of the map like a scout tank you should always keep allied tanks closeby to prevent such foolhardiness on your enemy's part.

Quote

It gets disgusting after a while because I'm good with my T29. It's been my favorite tank so far. I can manually aim and one-shot an light tank or fast TD or small medium tank moving at full speed at 100m on the first try (Not an exageration. I've actually done that numerous times generally in defense of my team's artillery).

Not to belittle your skill, but any tanker worth his salt should be able to do that. I've killed my share of fast-moving scouts in tanks with worse turret traverse speeds like the M10 Wolverine.

Quote

It just seems that no matter where I've hidden in hull down positions, they find some way to hit my hull, use HE, and their are some that seem to always hit the "ears" on my turret with every shot (Thus my doubts about what was said earlier about accuracy). My crew is 100% plus 68% repair but it sure doesn't seem to help much. I guess I just need some help in light of what you all have been saying. I'm sorry I even brought it up  :( .

You cannot do anything about HE rounds (though they deal so little damage against your gun mantlet they might as well be throwing bad words at you), but hull down positions are something of an art form. There are many positions which look like good hull-down positions (such as shallow dunes), only to discover that they don't hide your hull due to your enemy's position. It takes experience with both sides of a map to assess the best hull-down positions that'll let you hide your hull while keeping only your invincible turret exposed. There's no real rule of thumb for determining the best hull-down positions, since a position that maybe be a good hull-down position in one direction may turn out to be vulnerable to flanking attacks or not provide good protection if your enemy is in a different altitude, and there are some places that provide unlikely hull-down protection (you won't believe how many times I've been able to hull down by an enemy's flag if they didn't destroy their destructible watchtower). There is a reason why the T29 is a TANK, and that's because you have the mobility to switch between defensive positions or angle your hull if things get dicey.

As for the ears, the only way you're getting shot frequently on the ears is if you're letting the enemy shoot them. I've had IS-3's lose precious RoF trying to hit my ears in a facehug because I kept moving them in between reloads of my 105mm (they always end up dead afterwards). The T29 ears are so small that only German guns can reliably hit them from range (and even small movements will throw off their aim), and the only way Russian and American guns can hit them with any frequency is if you're engaged in close combat.

The T29 and T32 have been nerfed hard since their original incarnations from Closed and Open Beta yes (and with good reason), but even today these two tanks are still incredibly good heavy tanks for their tier. They just require a far different playstyle from Russian and German heavy tanks.

LeuCeaMia #16 Posted Aug 06 2011 - 14:12

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View PostRPS007, on Aug 05 2011 - 23:41, said:

There have been just too many IS heavy tanks that have bounced my T29's 105mm gun off the HULL,
Your supposed to aim for the mantlet on the IS just like against the KV-3 as its actually weaker than the one on the KV and Tiger. Even the stock IS-4 and stock IS-3 turret mantlet is penetrable. Really the only soviet heavy that can defeat the 105mm completely frontally is probably the IS-7 since the lower hull of the IS-4 when relatively perpendicular is penetrable. You better get used to the gun since you'll be using it for 3 tanks and 400,000XP  :o (if you get the 120mm).

View PostRPS007, on Aug 05 2011 - 23:41, said:

It just seems that no matter where I've hidden in hull down positions, they find some way to hit my hull, use HE, and their are some that seem to always hit the "ears" on my turret with every shot
Never stay still when your ready to fire slowly scoot out of full cover instead of aiming in the open, then quickly retreat back in they won't have the time to aim.

suvicze #17 Posted Aug 06 2011 - 15:45

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T29 is good piece of armor in its tier.But T32 with T29 version of 105mm gun with 198 penetration is biggest piece of shit in game.Hull down is totally useless because there is only few places where you can hull down and still be useful to the team and in games with artilery(almost every) you are just a nice target for it..Yeah you can penetrate almost every T8 tank problem is that only from close range ,(except lowe..), where you will die sooner than your opponent.If you met ferdinand on longer distance you can just turn back and go different way..
And best thing on it.. Gold ammo cost more than gold ammo for IS7... what a hell is that?..
Devs should finally start thinking about give T32 and T34 105mm gun from patton.. Penetration is still lower than IS3/KT have but better than nothing..
Also nice fail is T34 with 105 as stock gun because T34 is called T34 only because of its 120 mm gun that means we have only T9 version of T29.. not T34 as stock.
A would really like to see T34 with 120mm gun as stock(no problem lower penetration and maybe rof a bit) and possibility of research original version of 120mm gun and 155mm gun which T30 have..
Every T9 heavy tank has possibility to research gun which T10 tank uses only US heavy tanks dont have it...

LGear #18 Posted Aug 06 2011 - 16:50

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View Postsuvicze, on Aug 06 2011 - 15:45, said:

Hull down is totally useless because there is only few places where you can hull down and still be useful to the team

As someone who manages to find hull-down positions in every map and still get top guns and steel walls for my T29, I can quite say this is false. A bit of imagination is useful in turning even a small bump, or the side of a cliff, or a debris ramp, or using destroyed allied/enemy tanks, or even going up a steep incline into a hull-down position, and many of them are in approaches that your enemy will go to anyway, allowing you to contribute while still playing to the advantages of the T29. The basic definition of a "hull-down" is that only your turret is exposed to your enemy, so as long as you find ways to hide your hull - no matter how unconventional - you can perform a hull-down anywhere.

hiroshi_tea #19 Posted Aug 06 2011 - 17:48

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Suvicze's post gives me the impression that he's largely a base defender that finds a protected spot and just sits there
Which is a real waste because the T32 has front hull armour on par with the IS-3

The T32 is a mobile platform.  It specializes in finding hull down positions, sure, but it can brawl was well as any of the other heavies.
If you hare having trouble frontally penetrating something, then get closer.  The rather lack luster penetration of the 105mm also forces you to either be a front-line or mid-line attacker, which is a role the tank is well suited for.  Hull down doesn't mean you find a spot that covers your hull and sit there for the rest of the game.  You have enough gun depression to make any steady incline a good position.  

Refer to my post here which spends a good deal talking about it with pictures (http://forum.worldof...post__p__698200)  
Note that I am hull down against north but exposed on the sides.  I took this risk because there wasn't anything in the city, and all their heavies were up north.  If I saw some red in the city, then I'd move and reposition.  

many players treat a hull down position like a home for their tank.  They stick around, pay mortgages, raise a family and everything until the match is over.  Rather, the hull down position should be treated more like clothing.  Some temporary, expendable coverage that can be thrown away when it gets torn up too much.