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M4A3E2 and M4A3E8 rethinking them for 2017 a discusion

M4A3E8 Buff M4A3E2 90mm

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smiley119 #1 Posted Jan 20 2017 - 06:42

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It's 2017 the USA T6 meds been around a fairly long time and yet besides a profitability nerf back in 2012(?) they haven't changed much since then. Honestly they don't seem too competitive since I started

playing with the introduction and re-balancing of their Tier 6 counterparts the Americans have just been left to sit.

 

 

E8 Deficiets 

Gun: Sitting at 128 mm pen with AP and 177 with HVAP this is the least amount pen amongst it's T6 counterparts leaving them least capable at dealing with current threats up to T8 even with weakspot sniping

Gun Acc: Sitting at a 0.40 it was once considered decent by medium tank standards back in the day is far behind what other tanks have

Mobility: Once considered the dogfighter of T6 it's role has been replaced by the Cromwell in all regards other than heavy hill fighting 

 

E2 Deficits ~ The E2 sits in a special position on the tech tree it's meant to be the bridge between the MT and HT lines but it gets the armament similar to the E8 

 

In order to bring the E2 and E8 back up to snuff I propose a few things ...

The E2

Give the E2 the Pershing Turret with the M3 90mm with a ROF 6.5/min this would make the E2 feel like a bridging medium (similar to what the VK3601 was) to the T29. This would also make the T29 grind less of a hassle. While removing the the 76 mm M1A2 from the E2's tree. As well as removing the link from the E2 to the T20

 

The E8

Give the E8 a buff to the terrain resistances to 0.85/0.95/1.5 to allow it better acceleration to compete with the likes of Cromwell without overtaking it. 

Buff the 76 M1A2 Pen to 148mm/205mm/38mm whilst improving Acc values to 0.38 and aim time of 2.1s this will allow E8 compete well at T6 and deal with heavier foes at T8

 

These buff would also indirectly benefit the T21 giving it similar gun performance to T37 as well as improve the grind on the T20... and I completely forgot ... the FURY cause why not :p

 

So what does everyone think of the old girl would you buff her or leave her be ?


Edited by smiley119, Jan 20 2017 - 18:00.


Rain_Twister #2 Posted Jan 20 2017 - 06:47

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If E8 gets buffed I would like to see a buff to the Fury E8 as well. It would be nice if Fury or the E8 could be the 2nd T6 that could be used in Strongholds and hang with the Crom Army.

Doomslinger #3 Posted Jan 20 2017 - 06:57

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Buff the penetration by 20 for the AP and APCR rounds and that would probably balance them. Any more than that and they would be OP for their teir.

smiley119 #4 Posted Jan 20 2017 - 06:59

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View PostRain_Twister, on Jan 19 2017 - 21:47, said:

If E8 gets buffed I would like to see a buff to the Fury E8 as well. It would be nice if Fury or the E8 could be the 2nd T6 that could be used in Strongholds and hang with the Crom Army.

 

 I completely forgot about the fury ... but yeah it'd be a nice switch up in the meta for SH. instead of just nothing but cromwells and T37s ...

CanOfTomatoes #5 Posted Jan 20 2017 - 07:09

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Russian game do you think top of the list is American tanks...Top server is RU server are they playing American tanks...Devs are Russian... that's enough? I agree they are trash in many respects right now but I do not think its even close to a top priority.

Edited by CanOfTomatoes, Jan 20 2017 - 07:11.


SpectreHD #6 Posted Jan 20 2017 - 08:13

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View Postsmiley119, on Jan 20 2017 - 13:42, said:

It's 2017 the USA T6 meds been around a fairly long time and yet besides a profitability nerf back in 2012(?) they haven't changed much since then. Honestly they don't seem too competitive since I started

playing with the introduction and re-balancing of their Tier 6 counterparts the Americans have just been left to sit.

 

 

E8 Deficiets 

Gun: Sitting at 128 mm pen with AP and 177 with HVAP this is the least amount pen amongst it's T6 counterparts leaving them least capable at dealing with current threats up to T8 even with weakspot sniping

Gun Acc: Sitting at a 0.40 it was once considered decent by medium tank standards back in the day is far behind what other tanks have

Mobility: Once considered the dogfighter of T6 it's role has been replaced by the Cromwell in all regards other than heavy hill fighting 

 

E2 Deficits ~ The E2 sits in a special position on the tech tree it's meant to be the bridge between the MT and HT lines but it gets the armament similar to the E8 

 

In order to bring the E2 and E8 back up to snuff I propose a few things ...

The E2

Give the E2 the Pershing Turret with the M3 90mm with a ROF 6.5/min this would make the E2 feel like a bridging medium (similar to what the VK3601 was) to the T29. This would also make the T29 grind less of a hassle. While removing the the 76 mm M1A2 from the E2's tree. As well as removing the link from the E2 to the T20

 

The E8

Give the E8 a buff to the terrain resistances to 0.85/0.95/1.5 to allow it better acceleration to compete with the likes of Cromwell without overtaking it. 

Buff the 76 M1A2 Pen to 148mm/205mm/38mm whilst improving Acc values to 0.38 and aim time of 2.1s this will allow E8 compete well at T6 and deal with heavier foes at T8

 

These buff would also indirectly benefit the T21 giving it similar gun performance to T37 as well as improve the grind on the T20... and I completely forgot ... the FURY cause why not :p

 

So what does everyone think of the old girl would you buff her or leave her be ?

 

Definitely buff. The E8 and E2 has been horribly power creeped. Whatever DPM the E8 has is compounded by low accuracy and penetration. Furthermore, the physics additions feels like it has reduced the E8's agility from early on during its implementation. I agree with the improvement to penetration and aim time.

 

As for the E2, its armour is worthless especially when the top turret has less armour. I suggest the E2's top and stock turret be swapped so it can use the 76mm M1A2 with the heavily armoured turret. As an alternative to adding the Pershing turret and 90mm M3 (if it wasn't historical), I suggest good buffs to dispersion, accuracy and reload for the 105mm when using the top turret to really set it apart from the E8.



caramel #7 Posted Jan 20 2017 - 11:22

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View PostCanOfTomatoes, on Jan 19 2017 - 22:09, said:

Russian game do you think top of the list is American tanks...Top server is RU server are they playing American tanks...Devs are Russian... that's enough? I agree they are trash in many respects right now but I do not think its even close to a top priority.

 

Devs are Belarusian, not Russian.

esdren #8 Posted Jan 20 2017 - 20:30

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View Postsmiley119, on Jan 20 2017 - 06:42, said:

 

These buff would also indirectly benefit the T21 giving it similar gun performance to T37

 

Except the T21 doesnt need a firepower buff and will rape a T37 4/5 times if it isnt using the autoloader



smiley119 #9 Posted Jan 22 2017 - 01:33

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View Postesdren, on Jan 20 2017 - 11:30, said:

 

Except the T21 doesnt need a firepower buff and will rape a T37 4/5 times if it isnt using the autoloader

 

Considering the last time I did strong holds there was nothing but T37 and Cromwell I don't think the T21 is considered in the same league. Honestly the only time I can see the T21 being competitively in SH is if it spams APCR to make good on that DPM. And considering this thread is directed towards the E2 and E8 tanks that have very much been left by the wayside where as the T21 is something that has come along in more recent years. What would you suggest for the T21 if the 76 mm M1A2 gets buffed?

An_Innocent_Bystander #10 Posted Jan 22 2017 - 06:21

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View Postsmiley119, on Jan 20 2017 - 06:42, said:

The E2

Give the E2 the Pershing Turret with the M3 90mm with a ROF 6.5/min this would make the E2 feel like a bridging medium (similar to what the VK3601 was) to the T29. This would also make the T29 grind less of a hassle. While removing the the 76 mm M1A2 from the E2's tree. As well as removing the link from the E2 to the T20

That would make it a bit OP at tier 6.



caramel #11 Posted Jan 22 2017 - 07:50

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View PostAn_Innocent_Bystander, on Jan 21 2017 - 21:21, said:

That would make it a bit OP at tier 6.

 

Eh not really, it'd more make the E6 redundant, since the E2 really is the actual heavy of the US tier 6 line. If anything it should fire that 90 slightly slower then its dedicated heavy counterpart and be slightly less accurate.

US_3rd_Army #12 Posted Jan 22 2017 - 22:01

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Block Quote

 

The E2

Give the E2 the Pershing Turret with the M3 90mm with a ROF 6.5/min this would make the E2 feel like a bridging medium (similar to what the VK3601 was) to the T29. This would also make the T29 grind less of a hassle. While removing the the 76 mm M1A2 from the E2's tree. As well as removing the link from the E2 to the T20

Then if we take that approach to the Sherman Jumbo, then shouldn't reclassify it has a heavy tank? IF they fix things here and there, i think it would be a good tier 6 heavy.

 

Block Quote

 

The E8

Give the E8 a buff to the terrain resistances to 0.85/0.95/1.5 to allow it better acceleration to compete with the likes of Cromwell without overtaking it. 

Buff the 76 M1A2 Pen to 148mm/205mm/38mm whilst improving Acc values to 0.38 and aim time of 2.1s this will allow E8 compete well at T6 and deal with heavier foes at T8

The pen buff sounds nice in my opinion, but to be fair, the Easy Eight is my favorite tank, so of course i will take buffs

for the accuracy, you can get it down to .37 right now 

Spoiler: 

To those buffs overall sound good especially if WG is still planning to hit it with the nerf bat when they put it into HD

http://ftr.wot-news....an-fury-armor/ 



caramel #13 Posted Jan 23 2017 - 01:41

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View PostUS_3rd_Army, on Jan 22 2017 - 13:01, said:

Then if we take that approach to the Sherman Jumbo, then shouldn't reclassify it has a heavy tank? IF they fix things here and there, i think it would be a good tier 6 heavy.

 

The pen buff sounds nice in my opinion, but to be fair, the Easy Eight is my favorite tank, so of course i will take buffs

for the accuracy, you can get it down to .37 right now 

Spoiler: 

To those buffs overall sound good especially if WG is still planning to hit it with the nerf bat when they put it into HD

http://ftr.wot-news....an-fury-armor/ 

 

The jumbo was always a "Heavium" Kinda tank, really, its more of a heavy then a medium, and step for step it feels like a better heavy {With a weaker gun} then the M6.

smiley119 #14 Posted Jan 23 2017 - 06:58

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View PostUS_3rd_Army, on Jan 22 2017 - 13:01, said:

Then if we take that approach to the Sherman Jumbo, then shouldn't reclassify it has a heavy tank? IF they fix things here and there, i think it would be a good tier 6 heavy.

 

The pen buff sounds nice in my opinion, but to be fair, the Easy Eight is my favorite tank, so of course i will take buffs

for the accuracy, you can get it down to .37 right now 

 

To those buffs overall sound good especially if WG is still planning to hit it with the nerf bat when they put it into HD

http://ftr.wot-news....an-fury-armor/ 

Yeah I can definitely say that it's my favourite tank as well been in the garage since 2012 still love it to this day :3 here's to hoping eh?

 

View PostAn_Innocent_Bystander, on Jan 21 2017 - 21:21, said:

That would make it a bit OP at tier 6.

 

Considering the base turret from the Pershing can be penned by any gun over 120 mm of pen and the fact that all T6 vehicle have over 120 mm of pen having the big fat turret would actually be a detriment (IMO that's fairly balanced)so either that that or the have the E2 retain it's current flimsy to turret and allow that to mount the 90 mm gun (6.5ROF(1560DPM), 2.3s Aim Time, 0.38acc)

 

As on Tanks.gg the stock Pershing turret is ridiculously squishy



US_3rd_Army #15 Posted Jan 24 2017 - 19:33

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I came up with this idea of what they can do if they decide to make some changes in the Sherman Jumbo (It's simply an idea i wanted to throw out in similar fashion i did with the thread i did yesterday):

 

1) Switch the turrets so the stock is the second turret and the second because the stock

2) Based on that, base HP with the stock turret is 750 and 850 with the second turret

3) The current stats for the turrets and gun options for each turret stay the same 



carlus54 #16 Posted Jan 28 2017 - 05:41

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Personally the M4 are my favorite tanks. But I think these tanks have lost some interest. The E8 is fine, but what happens when you get the textures of Easy 8 HD? Will M4E2 change anything? :sceptic:.  



Joan_Of_Arc #17 Posted Apr 04 2017 - 23:05

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On the Easy 8 and Jumbo something need to be done.  I got over 3000 battles in the Jumbo and it getting long in the tooth.  Use to be I could slug it out with the 2nd turret and faster firing 76 mm cannon.  But now day I use the 1st turret and 1st 76mm to have a chance to survie a battle.  105mm on a Jumbo  ROFLMAO.  I do run the Jumbo some in a SH .  When I do, I found the 2nd turret and 2nd cannon work better , for faster reload and longer view range.  But now days  the shermans r getting left behind.



Priest070 #18 Posted Apr 08 2017 - 17:19

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I agree with increase 20mm for pen, and a slight increase to accuracy on both the primary M4's




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