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Mermaid_Witch #40801 Posted Sep 12 2019 - 16:23

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View PostDerViktim, on Sep 12 2019 - 10:11, said:

Tesla has broken the record for fastest 4 door sedan at Laguna Seca with a 1:36555 hot lap with a Model S "Plaid" powertrain and chassis prototype. Looks like the model S update is going to be something else when its ready.

 

 

But did they do it with the autopilot on?



godofdun #40802 Posted Sep 12 2019 - 17:27

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View PostDerViktim, on Sep 11 2019 - 17:46, said:

 

Truth be told the "left" is pretty much "center left" by most measuring sticks and not the radicals the reactionaries currently in power seem to paint them as.

 

View PostKilljoyCutter, on Sep 11 2019 - 18:15, said:

 

 I'm not sure how universal basic income, four more years of "free" education, "free" universal health care, literally banning billionaires, revanchism reparations based on the accident of one's skin color, open borders and blanket amnesty for illegal immigrants, etc, are "center" anything.

 

Other than Reagan's mistake with amnesty ( "After this, we're serious, totally enforcing the law, we mean it."    )  none of those ideas had ANY traction for the first half of my life.  So the idea that the country has simply "moved to the right" is... not in line with what I've observed.

 

E:  forgot to add "state and federal entitlement benefits for illegal immigrants" to the list... never mind that per polling by NPR, etc, Americans oppose decriminalizing illegal immigration and benefits for illegals by about 2 to 1, the Democrats are going to die on that hill, at least until the primaries are over and they can conveniently try to pretend they never said no such thing no sir.

 

 

I would posit that's because the American version of the Overton window has been shifting or shifted for decades.

 

Nixon's guaranteed minimum income plan passed the House but stalled in the Senate.  Highly subsidizing post-secondary education used to the be norm here, and doing that or even fully subsidizing it is the norm in a lot of other places.  This is nowhere near the first time universal health care has been discussed seriously in this country, or some for of reparations for that matter.  The marginal tax rate on high income earners used to be about 90% and other rates on high wealth was much higher than it is now as well, that's not exactly the same as a "ban" on billionaires but it's not much of a step further.  None of their plans on immigration are beyond the pale in terms of what we've had in the past or discussed in this country, and your interpretation of it as open borders is just that.

 

https://thehill.com/hilltv/what-americas-thinking/452005-poll-voters-favor-criminal-prosecution-over-civil-fines-for-illegal-border-crossings

Maybe more at the moment prefer it criminalized, sure.  First of all just a few years ago it was a minority of people who thought we needed to do so something about climate change now rather than later, those people still would have been correct regardless of whether they were in the minority or not.  Second of all to the extent that we can determine what's "fringe" or not based on polling at any given moment something that has 30%~ support is not that anyway.  We don't get to decide what's on the window just because we personally don't like it, and that goes both ways.  I think a flat tax is a monumentally stupid idea, but during the tea parties time in the sun I think that was polling around 30% or so, and that got it airtime whether I liked it or not.

 

 



KilljoyCutter #40803 Posted Sep 12 2019 - 18:00

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View Postgodofdun, on Sep 12 2019 - 11:27, said:

 

 

I would posit that's because the American version of the Overton window has been shifting or shifted for decades.

 

Nixon's guaranteed minimum income plan passed the House but stalled in the Senate.  Highly subsidizing post-secondary education used to the be norm here, and doing that or even fully subsidizing it is the norm in a lot of other places.  This is nowhere near the first time universal health care has been discussed seriously in this country, or some for of reparations for that matter.  The marginal tax rate on high income earners used to be about 90% and other rates on high wealth was much higher than it is now as well, that's not exactly the same as a "ban" on billionaires but it's not much of a step further.  None of their plans on immigration are beyond the pale in terms of what we've had in the past or discussed in this country, and your interpretation of it as open borders is just that.

 

https://thehill.com/hilltv/what-americas-thinking/452005-poll-voters-favor-criminal-prosecution-over-civil-fines-for-illegal-border-crossings

Maybe more at the moment prefer it criminalized, sure.  First of all just a few years ago it was a minority of people who thought we needed to do so something about climate change now rather than later, those people still would have been correct regardless of whether they were in the minority or not.  Second of all to the extent that we can determine what's "fringe" or not based on polling at any given moment something that has 30%~ support is not that anyway.  We don't get to decide what's on the window just because we personally don't like it, and that goes both ways.  I think a flat tax is a monumentally stupid idea, but during the tea parties time in the sun I think that was polling around 30% or so, and that got it airtime whether I liked it or not.

 

 

 

 


 I'm in my late 40s, if the "window" shifted (and frankly I find the overton window to be a bunch of postmodernist tripe that fits neatly into the current American left's concept of trying to control the conversation and silence ideas they don't care for -- and the American "Rove / Trump" -right's adoption of downright proto-fascist methods of propaganda), it shifted sometime before the early 80s when I started paying attention to politics.

 

Nixon was a bungling idiot when it came to economics, he also tried to enact price freezes, currency freezers, etc, and ended up as a major cause of the 1970s economic malaise, in some ways we're still dealing with the ramifications.

 

People in elected office (Warren, AOC and her little gang, etc) aren't just talking about pushing the highest bracket of income tax back up or reform to close high-end loopholes or reform to the "capital gains" issue, they're talking about literally "banning billionaires" and about how having "too much" money makes you inherently bad and corrupt/corrupting.


 


 


 


Edited by KilljoyCutter, Sep 12 2019 - 18:02.


Zergling #40804 Posted Sep 12 2019 - 18:30

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View PostMermaid_Witch, on Sep 12 2019 - 12:34, said:

I'm honestly really crappy at debate.

View PostKilljoyCutter, on Sep 12 2019 - 13:54, said:

We live in frustrating times, and frustration makes "bad debaters" of most of us.

 

Yuuuuuuuup, I'm not good at arguments; I'm learning to just avoid debates and arguments as much as I can, because the frustration just seems to get me stressed out or give me a headache, as happened with the argument I was having over on snailgame forums for the last few hours.



LordCommanderMilitant #40805 Posted Sep 12 2019 - 18:33

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View PostZergling, on Sep 12 2019 - 17:30, said:

 

Yuuuuuuuup, I'm not good at arguments; I'm learning to just avoid debates and arguments as much as I can, because the frustration just seems to get me stressed out or give me a headache, as happened with the argument I was having over on snailgame forums for the last few hours.

 

I'm great at arguments. LOUDER IS RIGHTER, RIGHT? :P


Edited by LordCommanderMilitant, Sep 12 2019 - 18:33.


godofdun #40806 Posted Sep 12 2019 - 21:23

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View PostKilljoyCutter, on Sep 12 2019 - 10:00, said:

 I'm in my late 40s, if the "window" shifted (and frankly I find the overton window to be a bunch of postmodernist tripe that fits neatly into the current American left's concept of trying to control the conversation and silence ideas they don't care for -- and the American "Rove / Trump" -right's adoption of downright proto-fascist methods of propaganda), it shifted sometime before the early 80s when I started paying attention to politics.

 

Nixon was a bungling idiot when it came to economics, he also tried to enact price freezes, currency freezers, etc, and ended up as a major cause of the 1970s economic malaise, in some ways we're still dealing with the ramifications.

 

People in elected office (Warren, AOC and her little gang, etc) aren't just talking about pushing the highest bracket of income tax back up or reform to close high-end loopholes or reform to the "capital gains" issue, they're talking about literally "banning billionaires" and about how having "too much" money makes you inherently bad and corrupt/corrupting.

 

 

Yes, late 70s IMO, notice how everything I referenced was early 70s or before?  Notice how all of that that made it into law got rolled back after that, even under Democratic presidents or with Dem support in congress after that?  That's not a coincidence, that's a wholesale political shift.  Abuses of the Overton window as a concept happen because it's an aggregate measure that gets used too specifically, either due to ignorance, political expediency or just being plain disingenuous by the party or person in question.

 

DV said they were moving back to the center-left, were you not arguing that this list of ideas was somehow too crazy far left even though they have a significant history of mainstream support?  If so how is that not belittling ideas you don't personally care for based on anything other than their own merits?  I mentioned the flat tax and how it makes me personally recoil in disgust, but my personal opinion on it's value is not relevant in whether it gets discussed more broadly or how to the right of center it is or isn't.  I feel that we insert too much of the personal or anecdotal into this.

 

In terms of the policy yes they are talking about many if not all of those specific proposals you just listed, depending on exactly which politician there were talking about.  With regards to the rhetorical aspect, AOC I know has said something to the effect of banning or taxing at 100% over a certain value and IIRC has used the "every billionaire is a policy failure" line. Warren hasn't by my cursory Google search. Either way as I've seen the discussion had on the left the corrupting nature and "bad-ness" of billionaires is the business practices that got them there and the governmental practices that allow or enforce those practices.  To the extent that the individual billionaires get brought in from a moral standpoint or the rhetoric starts to get punitive in nature, with folks like the Kochs, Bezos and Thiel around it's hard not to, but I do understand it ideally shouldn't be about some sort of retribution even if I agree with the policy.

 

 



FrozenKemp #40807 Posted Sep 12 2019 - 21:56

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I guess a question I'd pose is: can the existence of billionaires be viewed as a result of a flawed system that allows too much concentration of wealth and would a healthier system involve more taxation at the upper end?  (I think that's what AOC might mean by a "policy failure".) And have governments been lax about breaking up overly large companies? 

Edited by FrozenKemp, Sep 12 2019 - 21:57.


godofdun #40808 Posted Sep 13 2019 - 01:36

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View PostFrozenKemp, on Sep 12 2019 - 13:56, said:

I guess a question I'd pose is: can the existence of billionaires be viewed as a result of a flawed system that allows too much concentration of wealth and would a healthier system involve more taxation at the upper end?  (I think that's what AOC might mean by a "policy failure".) And have governments been lax about breaking up overly large companies? 

 

I'd agree with that, on top of things regarding how large corporations are taxed, letting them get away with paying very little or much lower in taxes than they should be and such.



Avalon304 #40809 Posted Sep 13 2019 - 08:40

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I just cant right now:

 

https://twitter.com/PushDustIn/status/1172306041070964738

 

Sakurai is the Director of Smash Bros. as a franchise and is well known for working long hours, to the point that atleast once hes shown up to work with an IV drip in his arm to ensure the game is at its best. And suddenly the dedication makes more sense than ever.


Edited by Avalon304, Sep 13 2019 - 08:40.


SpectreHD #40810 Posted Sep 13 2019 - 08:51

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View PostAvalon304, on Sep 13 2019 - 15:40, said:

I just cant right now:

 

https://twitter.com/PushDustIn/status/1172306041070964738

 

Sakurai is the Director of Smash Bros. as a franchise and is well known for working long hours, to the point that atleast once hes shown up to work with an IV drip in his arm to ensure the game is at its best. And suddenly the dedication makes more sense than ever.

 

This is what true game management from those in charge is like. True dedication and hard work. Can't say the same from some Western dev teams. Looking at you, BW and your managing of your ground level devs.

 

You know, I should get Nintendo systems and games just because I want to support devs that actually deserve them.



Shrike58 #40811 Posted Sep 13 2019 - 13:19

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Last week in books:

 

https://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1472917723/ref=nosim/librarythin06-20

 

https://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1612347738/ref=nosim/librarythin06-20

 

https://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1534413502/ref=nosim/librarythin06-20

 

The first is a semi-popular synthesis about what we think we know about planet formation as well as the sitrep in regards to identifying planets that might harbor Life As We Know It!

 

The second looks at the nuts-and-bolts of how these famous war games were actually conducted and would probably interest anyone who plays that game involving floaty things (...which I'm currently burned out on (not enough hours in the day)).

 

The last is a well-regarded first novel and it basically deserves the praise.



Avalon304 #40812 Posted Sep 13 2019 - 14:59

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View PostSpectreHD, on Sep 13 2019 - 00:51, said:

 

You know, I should get Nintendo systems and games just because I want to support devs that actually deserve them.

 

Nintendo first part games are quite good and often very well polished.



FrozenKemp #40813 Posted Sep 13 2019 - 15:13

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View PostShrike58, on Sep 13 2019 - 07:19, said:

The second looks at the nuts-and-bolts of how these famous war games were actually conducted and would probably interest anyone who plays that game involving floaty things (...which I'm currently burned out on (not enough hours in the day)).

 

The last is a well-regarded first novel and it basically deserves the praise.

 

Cool stuff!  Am I right in remembering that a lot of those naval war games with respect to Japan were based on the assumption of big battleship clashes?

 

I am working my way slowly through Meet Me In The Future which is a short story collection by Kameron Hurley. (I am spending more time writing than reading.) So far they have been really really good.

 

I also got a novella from the library by a local author named Kelly Robson, Gods, Monsters and the Lucky Peach.  It's definitely interesting... the planet is kinda wrecked, many humans are living underground but local ecological reconstruction efforts are under way. But a company invented time travel... and somehow an ecological reconstruction project is going to involve travelling back in time to ancient Sumeria to take observations on what the waterways and so on were like when it was healthy.



Mermaid_Witch #40814 Posted Sep 13 2019 - 16:48

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View PostFrozenKemp, on Sep 13 2019 - 09:13, said:

Cool stuff!  Am I right in remembering that a lot of those naval war games with respect to Japan were based on the assumption of big battleship clashes?

 

As I recall, their big idea was to whittle down the US forces via destroyer, submarine and aircraft attack until they reached an area near Japan, then annihilate the remaining US fleet in a Jutland-style engagement.

 

Edit:  Wait, were you talking about "Japan's naval war games" or "US naval war games with Japan as the enemy"?  What I just posted was Japan's idea of how to defeat America.

 

 


Edited by Mermaid_Witch, Sep 13 2019 - 16:50.


FrozenKemp #40815 Posted Sep 13 2019 - 17:24

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The latter actually. But still very interesting to read so thank you!

 

I just really scored at a used book sale and now have a copy of Son Of Sherman, Volume 1! All about Sherman development. 



PrimarchRogalDorn #40816 Posted Sep 13 2019 - 18:26

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Lucky! Been looking for a pdf copy of that for years now

Edited by PrimarchRogalDorn, Sep 13 2019 - 19:29.


DerViktim #40817 Posted Sep 13 2019 - 20:09

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One the big musical voices of my childhood passed away today.

 

https://www.esquire.com/entertainment/music/a29036400/eddie-money-death-tribute-obituary/

 


Edited by DerViktim, Sep 13 2019 - 20:09.


godofdun #40818 Posted Sep 13 2019 - 21:53

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Hiring/attracting the best and the brightest:

https://www.thedailybeast.com/border-patrol-agent-accused-of-hitting-migrant-with-truck-pleas-guilty

https://www.cnn.com/2019/09/05/us/ice-tennessee-shots-fired/index.html



FrozenKemp #40819 Posted Sep 14 2019 - 02:07

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View PostPrimarchRogalDorn, on Sep 13 2019 - 12:26, said:

Lucky! Been looking for a pdf copy of that for years now

 

Well, if you ever have any questions just buzz me!  I wonder how much info will really be in it compared with the Sherman Minutiae site. 


Edited by FrozenKemp, Sep 14 2019 - 02:13.


SpectreHD #40820 Posted Sep 14 2019 - 12:21

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Looks like the launch of Borderlands 3 isn't running smooth. Looks like they should have spent more resources on their game and less on sending goons to YTers house instead.


Edited by SpectreHD, Sep 14 2019 - 12:24.





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