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Update 9.17.1 - Vehicle balance changes Feedback

tanks 9.17.1

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geeknik #21 Posted Feb 28 2017 - 05:05

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Ninja nerfing the E25 wasn't very nice. Either the ground resistances or the traverse rate were fiddled with as it turns like a pig now.

Avalon304 #22 Posted Feb 28 2017 - 06:36

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View PostGhostPrime, on Feb 23 2017 - 11:07, said:

Tankers, 

Please leave feedback relating to the re-balancing of tanks in update 9.17.1 in this thread. 

 

Notes on Changes:

 

 

Type 4 and 5 Heavy derp guns were poorly thought out additions. They are currently doing more harm that good to the overall landscape of tier 9 and 10, in addition to the Type 5's quite silly armor buffs. The same can be said for the Maus which should have gotten either the gun related buffs OR the armor related buffs, not both.

 

The 3 UK medium tanks (Centurion Mk. 1, Centurion Mk. 7/1 and FV4202) received speed buffs that do not help the vehicles in any way. These vehicles needed gun handling buffs and DPM buffs. FV4202 got no DPM buffs, and the Mk. 7/1 got only an incredibly minor buff, in a tier where the most comparable tanks have 2300+ DPM as opposed to 2100+ DPM. The speed changes should be rolled back and proper DPM and gun handling buffs should be applied to these vehicles to give them back their unique role among medium tanks.



KenWyns #23 Posted Feb 28 2017 - 09:19

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View PostStrike_Witch_Tomoko, on Feb 27 2017 - 15:46, said:

a big question i have for you at WG....

WHY do you seem to be forcing us to use gold

the lack of weakspots on some of these tanks is greatly concerning

 

i know you want to make armor relevant again.  but screwing people who still aim with normal ammo.  is a crap way of doing it.

your not hurting gold spammers at all.

Simple, mate.  Gold/premium shells COST MORE = more profits for... WofT. 

One of numerous "enhancements" that make'm THE most profitable per player MOG of all.  :justwait:



driesp #24 Posted Feb 28 2017 - 10:14

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View Postenjineer, on Feb 28 2017 - 08:00, said:

 

Lowe does not get pref MM

 

Agreed, that is probably why wargaming would do well to only consider feedback about a vehicle from a representative sample of players who actually own the vehicle.

Tupinambis #25 Posted Feb 28 2017 - 13:27

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The power-creepin' for tier 8 premiums is getting out of hand. Object 252u platoons are nearly unstoppable in tier 8 battles. The Type 4 and 5 should just be balanced around the 140mm gun. Compare its visual model to the 150mm on the E-100; the Japanese gun absolutely deserves more pen than it currently has. Get rid of the 150, boost the pen and handling on the 140, and then both tanks are golden.

Edited by Tupinambis, Feb 28 2017 - 13:28.


TornadoADV #26 Posted Feb 28 2017 - 15:23

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E5 is once again trash and will drift off back into a dust filled corner like it was pre-HD update.

SmirkingGerbil #27 Posted Feb 28 2017 - 16:36

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As mentioned, either increase the camo of the Grille 15 for the loss of mobility (50HP is very noticeable) or at least increase the reverse speed, and leave the other nerfs in place.

 

It is like it was hit too hard. Even when "OP" HE could reliably disable it, and the limited traverse narrowed your options down. Speed was the only thing that kept it alive, if you keep all the other nerfs, but increase reverse, it should still be workable, but not retain all the other characteristics that upset folks.



LeaveIT2Beaver #28 Posted Feb 28 2017 - 16:45

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View PostGhostPrime, on Feb 27 2017 - 18:01, said:

 

​Great feedback. How does everyone else feel about the changes?

 

  • T110E5  - not a fan of this change at all. Ran it a lot on the test server (along with the T110E4). I have it unlocked finally, but will not buy it. Cuppola changes make no sense. I saw no changes to MAUS or E100 vulnerability 
  • "Power Creep". The new buzz words for "hey I got penned and I am mad", :trollface:

Yes - please ignore the ridiculous crybabies ranking on premium tanks. I see nothing wrong with a tank I spend $50 on being able to match the grind tanks or better. I do not see them crying over the new German heavies,Types, MAUS, E100, or any OP clan tank. Everyone has the ability to buy a tank by saving up for one. SOME people brag they never spend a penny on the game.WoT is not "free". It is a business.  Some of us carry the financial load of the freeloaders. You are welcome.

  • Accuracy seems OFF. 
  • Krupp-Steyr Waffenträger - great change to handling!
  • Panther mit 8,8 cm L/71 - nice addition
  • T28 Prototype - one of my favorites! Nice to get into battle before it is over and not be accused of camping while  moving :teethhappy:
  • Panther M10 - makes sticking out there a little more productive !

 

 

Spoiler

 


Edited by LeaveIT2Beaver, Feb 28 2017 - 17:07.


Wirbelfeld #29 Posted Feb 28 2017 - 18:09

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View PostMakesSerbProud, on Feb 23 2017 - 19:42, said:

I felt the T110E5 nerf was very uncalled for. All higher tier US heavies share the common feature of a very strong turret allowing for hull-down tactics. The E5's cupola always severely hindered this type of game play. After the cupola was buffed the tank was strong, but still balanced. A well place shot could still pen the cupola, and gold rounds had no issues going through. The lower plate and sides were paper thin, and had ammoracks. Now that the cupola has been nerfed the tank will drift off into irrelevance once again. 

 

The cupola was inpenetrable if you were hull down using your gun depression. Even with gold rounds. The side armor was very thick because of the huge tracks and made the e5 perfect sidescraper. It needed a nerf. Even right now, the cupola is difficult to hit if the e5 is hull down and using all of its gun depression

 

That being said, e5 was overnerfed. I agree with the cupola nerf, but felt like it should have been accompanied with a mobility buff or a gun buff. In its current state, the e5 is just a mediocre medium, and a mediocre heavy.



_Marine #30 Posted Feb 28 2017 - 20:47

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But, nobody complains about the Krav or IS7 when hull down... Like seriously, give us back the hatch armor on the E5, nerf the LFP and reverse speed. Done. Balanced

 

Maus needed the turret armor buffs. But, combined w/ the DPM buff (Should NOT have happened), road wheel buff (LOLOLOL) and the HP buff (like... wth?). All it needed was the turret armor buff and some of the gun handling buffs. Its playable/viable then. 

 

The derp guns on the Type 4 and 5 are horrendously thought through. Get ride of those.



dogma512 #31 Posted Feb 28 2017 - 20:50

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The T28 proto speed buff is much appreciated.  It was really frustrating to have a battle end before even getting into position.

landedkiller #32 Posted Mar 01 2017 - 00:45

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View PostGhostPrime, on Feb 27 2017 - 17:01, said:

 

​Great feedback. How does everyone else feel about the changes?

 

Panther/m10 buffs and rest of German tree fantastic. Your forgot the panzer 4 s though it needs a better engine you see arty or an o-i can still smoke ya. What is the point of calling it a medium tank when it has heavy tank mobility even the heavies move faster than it. It is very sad that a simple buff to a 400 ho engine or a 440 hp engine could not be done for it as it would be a great seller if it was indeed buffed. Call up wg Chicago ask how often people were purchasing the pz 4 s I bet it was a lot more than on PC version. The thing is you can have a tank be balanced in two versions of the game then it get's left out on the game it originally started from this World of Tanks the original. How come your going to let the game sink by not taking to your customers. I called that San Fran office five maybe six times and no response and yet the Chicago office can pick up the phone. I am really frustrated that you can't buff something so simple like a tier 6 medium tank. You could have easily made another $2,000 or more just by buffing it look at the Panther/m10 see how you buffed it and then people bought it up like crazy. I bet people would buy it if it was simply buffed like it is on console and blitz which are based off this version. Just because your a big company doesn't give you the right to ignore people thank you

Edited by landedkiller, Mar 01 2017 - 00:46.


Kelly_Sereda #33 Posted Mar 01 2017 - 02:42

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View PostStrike_Witch_Tomoko, on Feb 28 2017 - 00:46, said:

 

Maus turret.   good

maus hull.  overkill

 

 

grille 15....might have been a bit much.  but could fix that by giving it camo to shut the complainers up

 

a big question i have for you at WG....

WHY do you seem to be forcing us to use gold

the lack of weakspots on some of these tanks is greatly concerning

 

keep in mind tier 6 and 7s see VK 100.01P

tier 8s see Maus.

 

 

i know you want to make armor relevant again.  but screwing people who still aim with normal ammo.  is a crap way of doing it.

your not hurting gold spammers at all.

 

 

Obj 252......wth.

P2W much.

 

stop with the frontally god mode heavies,  until you FIX YOUR MAPS so that flanking can be done by meds and lights (aka REMOVE THE TUNNELS YOU PUT ON MAPS TO GUARD HEAVIES SIDES.    if a heavy's side is guarded by terrain, be it open deadman land or a cliff wall,   then your FORCING people to do suicide rushes to get on the side.   or to engage frontally.)

 

 

 

 

Regarding frontal armour and tunnels, I would counter that now superheavy tanks can better serve a purpose that they were designed for.  They should be virtually impenetrable from the front, that's why they can only move 20kph and have virtually 0 camo.  Getting spotted, receiving concentrated fire and being and flanked are still major issues in the superheavy, but the new armour makes them a worthy choice to play.  Also, for every map that has a tunnel, there is another with a giant field to cross, where get spotted and hammered by everyone and arty in that superheavy balances things.  How that plays out depends on your point of view.


Edited by Kelly_Sereda, Mar 01 2017 - 02:43.


Strike_Witch_Tomoko #34 Posted Mar 01 2017 - 02:57

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View PostKelly_Sereda, on Feb 28 2017 - 18:42, said:

 

 

Regarding frontal armour and tunnels, I would counter that now superheavy tanks can better serve a purpose that they were designed for.  They should be virtually impenetrable from the front, that's why they can only move 20kph and have virtually 0 camo.  Getting spotted, receiving concentrated fire and being and flanked are still major issues in the superheavy, but the new armour makes them a worthy choice to play.  Also, for every map that has a tunnel, there is another with a giant field to cross, where get spotted and hammered by everyone and arty in that superheavy balances things.  How that plays out depends on your point of view.

 

except those fields are optional.
and not even meds and lights go there because WG made them no mans land by putting tunnels around them.
 

Kelly_Sereda #35 Posted Mar 01 2017 - 08:09

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View PostStrike_Witch_Tomoko, on Mar 01 2017 - 02:57, said:

 

except those fields are optional.
and not even meds and lights go there because WG made them no mans land by putting tunnels around them.
 

 

I know what you mean, like on Malinovka or Steppes for two, but there's usually a way around and fast tanks can flex.  I'm thinking about the maps where a heavy is expected to go to a certain area, but if you get started on the wrong side of spawn and have to cut over or are just too slow and easy to spot, if the enemy is scouting well you get hammered leaving the start area: Lakeview, Mountain Pass, Serene Coast (north base) and Erlenberg that I can think of.

 

Slightly outside the scope of the vehicle edits - GhostPrime, I would suggest that in the build-up to game time, it would be nice if a player could locate their vehicle on a map of the available spawn area.  There could be markers on it showing where the other tanks are starting so people could spread out properly beforehand.  It would especially help slow tanks from having to recover lost ground due to rough initial placement.


Edited by Kelly_Sereda, Mar 01 2017 - 08:17.


PUNISHER989 #36 Posted Mar 01 2017 - 09:34

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Great changes,

But the grille 15 rework was too one sided. it needs other stats to be improved to counter for the nerfed values displayed here. 
You should always keep the changes balanced, take from one place but add to another. 


The Pz.Kpfw. IV Schmalturm should get a thicker mantlet or atleast more turret armour. 

 

The 8,8 cm Pak 43 Jagdtiger needs a better rotation speed and/or less terrain resistance. 

 

Everything is else is a welcome change and much appreciated. Its the little things after all that make a difference. 



razed98 #37 Posted Mar 01 2017 - 18:24

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I don't agree with the nerf's to the T110E5 and Grille-15, but many of the buffs to many of the mid-tier German tanks were necessary. For example, I was actually able to reliably bounce a fully upgraded IS and a Soviet IS-2 yesterday in my VK 30.02 M. Though I was over angling the front while hiding the drive wheels.

 



Thander_Tank #38 Posted Mar 02 2017 - 23:58

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IS-7 vs Maus

 

Before of update 9.17.1, IS-7 and Maus were comparable in firepower, and combined in mobility and armor, being Maus armor and IS-7 mobility, having almost the same firepower.

 

The point is that now the Maus has become very powerful, both in armor and in firepower, which is a good thing. I'm already up in your line in the technological tree, however IS-7 was much inferior compared to Maus, who already gained in armor, energy and cannon handling, among others, and now gains from afar in firepower, So I want Again reminds them that the damage of a 130mm cannon from layer 10 should be by default 550 damage, not 490 as it has been, compared to the 128mm German cannons, which are always better at all, there are up to Those that cause 560 damage, and have better penetration, as in the case of Pz.Kpfw.VII. So where is an IS-7 better than a Maus? Only in mobility, and in 4 mm more in penetration, because in almost everything else is inferior, and to complete does not even reach the maximum speed that should arrive according to the project, which is 59 KM / H, except in descents Ingrimes.

 

I sent a ticket to the support talking about the problem, but I was told that if its maximum speed is really 59 KM / H it will be unbalanced; Well, I guess anyone who says that has forgotten about the new Kranvagn, which squeaks not only at 59 KM / H but at 60KM / H, and has an apparently even stronger tower. The new heavy tanks and buffs introduced in the game, made the IS-7 stay behind, forgotten in time. And with the damage change approaching on 120mm cannons, which will deal 440 damage, will make IS-7 damage appear even poorer.

 

120 mm = 440 damage
130 mm = 490 damage

 

Note: They are (10 mm) more in the gauge, a big difference, for such close damage.

 

If this change in damage is done, the IS-7 will certainly be a tank a bit more attractive and balanced with the others, including Maus, but in any case, it will not yet be a very big change, since the cannon IS-7 will continue to be terrible as it is, and its maximum speed will continue to be approximately 35 KM / H on level ground.

I want to remember that I love World of Tanks, I want to see it better and better, and I fully believe that this change will bring improvement to the tank balance game, as well as the previous improvement suggestion about OBJ.268 that has A high price, but does not meet the expectation.

 

I ask the opinion of my players friends; sorry for translation;

 

A hug to the admirable WG team !!!


Edited by Thander_Tank, Mar 03 2017 - 00:06.


__Badfinger__ #39 Posted Mar 04 2017 - 20:06

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Since this last update something has dramatically effected the E75's gun, and every other E75 driver I ask, has said the same thing. If u doubt me, take your 75 out and see for yourself.

PCA_PANADES #40 Posted Mar 06 2017 - 03:59

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WG should be quite retarded. Grille 15 gun elevation and depression just do not match its geomety... and you idiots of WG have courage to nerf the gun depression to -7 when you should buff it to the real values it should have.

So Grille 15 is just high to get its cammo ruined; it, just can't give it gun depression. You are quite ridiculous, quite idiots. You are too much arbitrary and this will just make you lose players. The time will show it.





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