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SPGs as a skillful support class (complete overhaul suggestion)

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Uzi_Does_It #1 Posted May 08 2017 - 18:31

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TL;DR version:

To emphasize SPG player’s skill and team play I propose a major overhaul of SPG mechanics. A 3 tier damage system (direct, blast, and fragments), a new aiming mechanics (fast initial stage for area attacks, very slow second stage for very accurate fire), and plurality of shell types (smoke, HE, HEAT, HESH, AP, fragmentation – concussion, time and proximity fused, incendiary) are at the core of this suggestion. Add Mortars because I think they’ll be fun. Overall arty effects should be negligible for heavily armored vehicles such as HTs, MTs, and heavy TDs (mostly just outside module damage) except for the (rare!) occasion of a direct hit. Roofless/lightly armored vehicles should fear the SPG. Smoke can become a very effective means of advancing team play and drastically enhancing the dynamics of a battle. This is a preliminary idea only – I am placing it here for further development. 

 

Long version:

I liked playing SPGs before 9.18 and like it now, but there are some major issues with current (and past) SPG game play in WOT: they mostly play as sporadic, opportunistic snipers (hardly advancing team play) and SPG players have very little room to show their skill. Take any other class and you can easily see who’s a noob and what players have real skill, but with arties there is too much chance. There is also the fact that arties rely on other team mates to hold the lines and save them in case of an attack, while the notion is hardly reciprocated. Yes, 9.18 was probably a step in the correct direction in this regard, but the situation is largely the same.

I propose a complete overhaul with major game play significance for the role of SPGs in the game. I will give some physical and historical excuses for it, but the main drive is fun for all WOT players. This should not be seen as a package deal (i.e. read it, then mix and choose the components) nor is it a done deal (please give feedback so I can make it better).

Let’s start with the changes themselves:

  1. SPG main damage mechanism: 3 types of damage – direct contact shock, blast (air-born shockwave), and fragmentations. Direct contact shock should be very devastating for all tanks, but should be very rare from afar (see below). It should have high damage and pen, especially for specialty shells such as HEAT and HESH, and a stunning effect if the tank survives. Blast should be relatively short range and be very ineffective against armor, but should be devastating against lightly armored/roofless/light targets. Blast should push, perhaps flip the target (depending on target weight and shell type) – use the blast to push that LT off the cliff! Frags are like small projectiles shooting around in all directions. Again – mostly effective against lightly armored targets (more so than blast) and outside modules. They should have a very long range destructive potential.
    Game play effects: SPGs will become the bane of paper TDs, SPGs, and very lightly armored LTs. MTs, armored TDs, and HTs will almost never see damage from SPGs (as IRL) but can see crew stunned and outside modules destroyed from frags and blast. At close range even HTs will have to be careful (again, see below for aim and accuracy).
  2.  Aim and accuracy: Artillery crews are mostly concerned with accurate, fast shooting. They have the best techniques to achieve the best accuracy, way more so than tank gunners (who do not need such high accuracy). Arties should also be able to aim very quickly at a zone target because of their better aiming equipment. They should not, however, be able to quickly aim accurately, as accuracy takes very long time to achieve (in WW2 they used many manual tables and calculations to aim accurately, and this takes time and skill). I propose a double aiming time mechanism for SPGs, a quick one for lousy accuracy and a long one for best accuracy. An example: 1-2 seconds to achieve 3-4 m/100 aim but then 20-30 (or even more) sec for a 0.1 m/100 aim. Also, both time and absolute accuracy should depend on gunner’s proficiency.
    Game play effect: except for unique circumstances (a very stupid/trapped/flipped HT you want to destroy with a direct hit) players will have to shoot before absolute aim is achieved = a point for more skillful players. More area effects will have to be used. There will be the possibility of snipping a tank, and even choosing soft spots from afar, but that will be very, very rare.
  3.  Rate of fire: it should depend on gun caliber, obviously, but generally arties should have a higher rate of fire than tanks with the same caliber. The main issue should be aiming time, but area effect bombardment should be possible, and that can only be achieved with a higher rate of fire. It is also technically correct, as tank loader have a harder time than artillery loaders due to space considerations (and the fact that SPGs’ main functionality is firepower while tanks are... rounder).
    Game play effects: area effect artillery becomes possible, mostly effective against forward scouts or hiding paper TDs (because of frags far from the blast). That will also be the main MO for anti battery fire, again due to frags and thin armor of SPGs. Main issue will become aiming time and choice of technique. Again – more points for skillful players.
  4.  Smoke/illumination: An important aspect of Artillery IRL. These shells will greatly enhance team play when used by skillful players. Smoke should work roughly like a temporary bush with the following differences: more effective (1.5-2 times), cannot be seen through even from close by, does not dissipate if shots are fired nearby, and lowers immediate detection (you can almost slam into a tank before you see it…;). Tank shooting from the edges of the cloud should still have the negative effects, that is see no one else, but should become visible because of the flash. So smoke can be used to blind both sides, allowing for advancement of your side, or shot at the opponent so that he cannot see but if he shoots – he is seen. There should be a good XP boost for masking your team and any damage done by vehicles hidden because of smoke should count as assisted damage.
    If night battles are enacted (and I hope they will be) than smoke shells should become illumination shells with the obvious effects and XP mechanism.
    Game play effect: a pronounced effect on team play and possibility of attacks. Consider the valley of Lakeville with smoke… a well coordinated, dynamic attack becomes a possibility. Absolute chaos with enemy tanks getting into very close proximity becomes another possibility, which may also be fun. False attacks can also be used to distract the enemy by smoking an irrelevant area.
  5.  Shell types: So smoke/illumination and HE. Also add HEAT, HESH, and AP for direct or short range attacks (I do not think these should be premium because they are almost useless most of the time. See aim and accuracy above). HEAT and HESH should have a lot of direct contact damage but less blast and fragments than HE. High fragmentation shell (Shrapnel) – low blast, relatively low direct hit damage, but very high fragmentation content. Add a mechanism for time delayed frag shell: you press the right mouse button in tactical view and the shell is taken out and reloaded with the time fuse set to explode 5 meters above your aim point. This is roughly how it worked IRL… these should be very complex to use, but very effective against soft targets or fast scouts. Premium shells: proximity frag, just like time fuse but no need to reset and reload every time. Incendiary shell – some splash damage causes some damage to outside modules and engine fire (unless engine is protected) or something similar. you may be surprised how effective simple fire bombs are against tanks...
    Game play effects: way more points for skillful players who chose and mix shells correctly and know what shell to use when. A lot of friendly hits and fines for noobs who use frags too close to their LTs, HEATs to help a HT being circled by several LTs, and HE instead of frag for area effect against a roofless TD. Skillful players can use AP to protect themselves from point blank (or heat or HESH), smoke to help their team, frags with time fuse against SPGs and soft TDs, HE or frag for close support of an HT in a circle of enemies, HEs to cause module damage to HTs and MTs with a reasonable rate of fire (aim dependent, but HEs do not need direct contact for outside module damage by blast).
  6.  Mortars: Just for fun, as mortars are very strange and unique. Considering WOT’s small battlefield, all regular SPGs are “caught in the fray”. Mortars are meant for such ranges. Mortars are the only vehicle type that can shoot itself… because of the high bomb arc, the closer the mortar shoots the MORE longer the flight time of the shell (neglecting the effect of changing the propellant amount), so accuracy is actually better for longer ranges (again, with the same propellant charge). Very short barrels and low charges mean very limited aim flare-up upon shooting – you can shoot several rounds while aiming. Very, very long time to target (20-30 sec seems legit), so a very different mindset for the player. No AP or HESH and I think no HEAT shells in WW2, but HE, smoke, frag (time, proximity and concussion fused), and incendiary shells. Very high rate of fire – you can fire several shells before the first lands… double aiming mechanism as above, but with generally worse absolute accuracy. While moving the aiming circle should be, like, 1 km wide, but very fast initial aim.
    Game play effect: hard to tell now, but probably very fun and will need many tweaks to work. If used for rapid fire – will become prime target for anti battery fire because of the many tracers showing its location and the mandatory open roof, inviting a time fused frag shell… will be the most valuable artillery in city maps, and probably an important ally (if used by a skillful player) in open terrain maps. Very mobile (otherwise – dead).

Conclusion: Heavily armored tanks should not fear arties, as was IRL, but arties should be able to knock them down with a direct hit (on rare occasion). Lightly armored vehicles should have fire under their tracks all the time… smoke/illumination and different shell types will enable real support of the attacks and defense by SPGs. Reloading should not be the major issue slowing SPG fire down, but aiming time with the new mechanism proposed. There should also be some other changes, such as a “give us smoke here” command, but these are more trivial tweaks for later.

 

Sorry for the long post. Who’s with me?



ClydeCooper421 #2 Posted May 08 2017 - 18:35

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The only thing that will fix arty, is removing it. We've gone over this time and time again. Arty is a broken mechanic, and it's not healthy for gameplay.

xrays_ #3 Posted May 08 2017 - 18:54

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View PostClydeCooper421, on May 08 2017 - 12:35, said:

The only thing that will fix arty, is removing it. We've gone over this time and time again. Arty is a broken mechanic, and it's not healthy for gameplay.

 

It's actually easier to remove people like you from the game because they don't add a single positive element to begin with. If only they'd just learn how to play the game as it's delivered to their computers instead of constantly whining that this and that is unfair or broken. By Jove, is that how they live their lives as well?

 

Adapt or quit.

 

x..



Uzi_Does_It #4 Posted May 08 2017 - 18:55

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Well, ClydeCooper421, what I propose amounts to removing current arties and adding something completely different instead.

ClydeCooper421 #5 Posted May 08 2017 - 18:56

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View Postxrays_, on May 08 2017 - 09:54, said:

 

It's actually easier to remove people like you from the game because they don't add a single positive element to begin with. If only they'd just learn how to play the game as it's delivered to their computers instead of constantly whining that this and that is unfair or broken. By Jove, is that how they live their lives as well?

 

Adapt or quit.

 

x..

 

I don't mean to whine. If I do, well I apologize. I love this game and will never stop playing it. I'm simply stating that artillery as a mechanic is unhealthy for gameplay. If you disagree, that's fine--that's your right as an individual. I'm simply stating my opinion on the matter, and what I think could be done with it. 

 

Saying I should be banned from the game/forums for giving my feedback from the game is simply messed up. 

 

And also, "Adapt or quit." I have adapted. That's how I've managed to 3 mark 4 tanks and still play the game. It's not like I threaten WG with "fix arty or I'll stop playing/paying" Cause the fact is, I won't. 


Edited by ClydeCooper421, May 08 2017 - 18:59.


Mikosah #6 Posted May 08 2017 - 19:01

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The trouble with an indirect attack like arty is that when used to its full potential (firing over solid cover and outside of render range) then you get a lose-lose situation. If such a weapon is strong, then there's nothing the enemy can do to avoid it. For it to be weak enough to be balanced in this context, it would have to be practically useless. The more arty becomes different from the other classes, the harder it will be to balance according to the same set of rules. 

 

That said, the ability to lob smoke/flares indirectly is another matter. Pure support functions like these need not be constrained by the rules that we normally assign to damage. If arty is to remain indirect, then being a pure support class is the only way to realize this goal. But if arty is expected to deal damage and secure kills as everyone else is, then in a game like this that depends so greatly on positioning, cover use, and line-of-sight management is broken by indirect attacks. 

 

So those are the two viable options- remain indirect as a pure support class, or become a direct combat class that cannot use the overhead view modes. And just between you and me, I think the latter is far more likely and practical. If tanks like the KV-2 and Hetzer can do it, then arty could too (with the right re-balancing).



JRingo20 #7 Posted May 08 2017 - 19:13

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View PostClydeCooper421, on May 08 2017 - 11:35, said:

The only thing that will fix arty, is removing it. We've gone over this time and time again. Arty is a broken mechanic, and it's not healthy for gameplay.

 

I think restoring arty to pre 8.6, (Rock, paper, scissors balance) would do just fine.

_JUMPER__1 #8 Posted May 08 2017 - 19:14

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Love arty hahaha.anyways yes mortar launchers would be awseome!more love to drop on tankers!be a whole new complaint section for whiners who have never actually played it or even figured it out will say its easy no skill involved.yes send arty players mortars nukes anything from the sky above to drop on unsuspecting careless tank drivers!!!!

Dracheherr #9 Posted May 08 2017 - 19:14

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This is a dead horse. No matter what is or is not done to arty, there will ALWAYS be slice of the WoT playing population who will be dissatisfied and loudly vocal about it.

 

Solution: ban all arty "discussion."



ClydeCooper421 #10 Posted May 08 2017 - 19:14

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View PostJRingo20, on May 08 2017 - 10:13, said:

 

I think restoring arty to pre 8.6, (Rock, paper, scissors balance) would do just fine.

 

I came to the game in 9.8--I am unfamiliar with pre 8.6 artillery. 

ClydeCooper421 #11 Posted May 08 2017 - 19:15

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View PostDracheherr, on May 08 2017 - 10:14, said:

This is a dead horse. No matter what is or is not done to arty, there will ALWAYS be slice of the WoT playing population who will be dissatisfied and loudly vocal about it.

 

Solution: ban all arty "discussion."

 

That's a really stupid idea. The point of the forums is to discuss the game. There's no reason to ban arty discussion. 

ArmorStorm #12 Posted May 08 2017 - 19:16

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Uzi_Does_It #13 Posted May 08 2017 - 19:22

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View PostMikosah, on May 08 2017 - 19:01, said:

The trouble with an indirect attack like arty is that when used to its full potential (firing over solid cover and outside of render range) then you get a lose-lose situation. If such a weapon is strong, then there's nothing the enemy can do to avoid it. For it to be weak enough to be balanced in this context, it would have to be practically useless. The more arty becomes different from the other classes, the harder it will be to balance according to the same set of rules. 

 

That said, the ability to lob smoke/flares indirectly is another matter. Pure support functions like these need not be constrained by the rules that we normally assign to damage. If arty is to remain indirect, then being a pure support class is the only way to realize this goal. But if arty is expected to deal damage and secure kills as everyone else is, then in a game like this that depends so greatly on positioning, cover use, and line-of-sight management is broken by indirect attacks. 

 

So those are the two viable options- remain indirect as a pure support class, or become a direct combat class that cannot use the overhead view modes. And just between you and me, I think the latter is far more likely and practical. If tanks like the KV-2 and Hetzer can do it, then arty could too (with the right re-balancing).

 

You can also say that some TDs are actually LOS AT artillery. But I think arties should have a role in the game as support. they should be able to kill soft targets, but mostly a nuisance for heavily armored ones (with NO damage done unless by direct hit, and that should be very rare). SPGs should change the dynamics of the game, but as support and not as main damage dealers (as they sometimes were before 9.18) that leads to worse camping than ever...

Anyway, my main concern is the fact that SPG players cannot learn how to better play their vehicles simply because it's impossible to do so.

RMxR #14 Posted May 08 2017 - 19:22

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View PostUzi_Does_It, on May 08 2017 - 11:31, said:

TL;DR version:

To emphasize SPG player’s skill and team play I propose a major overhaul of SPG mechanics. A 3 tier damage system (direct, blast, and fragments), a new aiming mechanics (fast initial stage for area attacks, very slow second stage for very accurate fire), and plurality of shell types (smoke, HE, HEAT, HESH, AP, fragmentation – concussion, time and proximity fused, incendiary) are at the core of this suggestion. Add Mortars because I think they’ll be fun. Overall arty effects should be negligible for heavily armored vehicles such as HTs, MTs, and heavy TDs (mostly just outside module damage) except for the (rare!) occasion of a direct hit. Roofless/lightly armored vehicles should fear the SPG. Smoke can become a very effective means of advancing team play and drastically enhancing the dynamics of a battle. This is a preliminary idea only – I am placing it here for further development. 

 

Long version:

I liked playing SPGs before 9.18 and like it now, but there are some major issues with current (and past) SPG game play in WOT: they mostly play as sporadic, opportunistic snipers (hardly advancing team play) and SPG players have very little room to show their skill. Take any other class and you can easily see who’s a noob and what players have real skill, but with arties there is too much chance. There is also the fact that arties rely on other team mates to hold the lines and save them in case of an attack, while the notion is hardly reciprocated. Yes, 9.18 was probably a step in the correct direction in this regard, but the situation is largely the same.

I propose a complete overhaul with major game play significance for the role of SPGs in the game. I will give some physical and historical excuses for it, but the main drive is fun for all WOT players. This should not be seen as a package deal (i.e. read it, then mix and choose the components) nor is it a done deal (please give feedback so I can make it better).

Let’s start with the changes themselves:

  1. SPG main damage mechanism: 3 types of damage – direct contact shock, blast (air-born shockwave), and fragmentations. Direct contact shock should be very devastating for all tanks, but should be very rare from afar (see below). It should have high damage and pen, especially for specialty shells such as HEAT and HESH, and a stunning effect if the tank survives. Blast should be relatively short range and be very ineffective against armor, but should be devastating against lightly armored/roofless/light targets. Blast should push, perhaps flip the target (depending on target weight and shell type) – use the blast to push that LT off the cliff! Frags are like small projectiles shooting around in all directions. Again – mostly effective against lightly armored targets (more so than blast) and outside modules. They should have a very long range destructive potential.
    Game play effects: SPGs will become the bane of paper TDs, SPGs, and very lightly armored LTs. MTs, armored TDs, and HTs will almost never see damage from SPGs (as IRL) but can see crew stunned and outside modules destroyed from frags and blast. At close range even HTs will have to be careful (again, see below for aim and accuracy).
  2.  Aim and accuracy: Artillery crews are mostly concerned with accurate, fast shooting. They have the best techniques to achieve the best accuracy, way more so than tank gunners (who do not need such high accuracy). Arties should also be able to aim very quickly at a zone target because of their better aiming equipment. They should not, however, be able to quickly aim accurately, as accuracy takes very long time to achieve (in WW2 they used many manual tables and calculations to aim accurately, and this takes time and skill). I propose a double aiming time mechanism for SPGs, a quick one for lousy accuracy and a long one for best accuracy. An example: 1-2 seconds to achieve 3-4 m/100 aim but then 20-30 (or even more) sec for a 0.1 m/100 aim. Also, both time and absolute accuracy should depend on gunner’s proficiency.
    Game play effect: except for unique circumstances (a very stupid/trapped/flipped HT you want to destroy with a direct hit) players will have to shoot before absolute aim is achieved = a point for more skillful players. More area effects will have to be used. There will be the possibility of snipping a tank, and even choosing soft spots from afar, but that will be very, very rare.
  3.  Rate of fire: it should depend on gun caliber, obviously, but generally arties should have a higher rate of fire than tanks with the same caliber. The main issue should be aiming time, but area effect bombardment should be possible, and that can only be achieved with a higher rate of fire. It is also technically correct, as tank loader have a harder time than artillery loaders due to space considerations (and the fact that SPGs’ main functionality is firepower while tanks are... rounder).
    Game play effects: area effect artillery becomes possible, mostly effective against forward scouts or hiding paper TDs (because of frags far from the blast). That will also be the main MO for anti battery fire, again due to frags and thin armor of SPGs. Main issue will become aiming time and choice of technique. Again – more points for skillful players.
  4.  Smoke/illumination: An important aspect of Artillery IRL. These shells will greatly enhance team play when used by skillful players. Smoke should work roughly like a temporary bush with the following differences: more effective (1.5-2 times), cannot be seen through even from close by, does not dissipate if shots are fired nearby, and lowers immediate detection (you can almost slam into a tank before you see it…;). Tank shooting from the edges of the cloud should still have the negative effects, that is see no one else, but should become visible because of the flash. So smoke can be used to blind both sides, allowing for advancement of your side, or shot at the opponent so that he cannot see but if he shoots – he is seen. There should be a good XP boost for masking your team and any damage done by vehicles hidden because of smoke should count as assisted damage.
    If night battles are enacted (and I hope they will be) than smoke shells should become illumination shells with the obvious effects and XP mechanism.
    Game play effect: a pronounced effect on team play and possibility of attacks. Consider the valley of Lakeville with smoke… a well coordinated, dynamic attack becomes a possibility. Absolute chaos with enemy tanks getting into very close proximity becomes another possibility, which may also be fun. False attacks can also be used to distract the enemy by smoking an irrelevant area.
  5.  Shell types: So smoke/illumination and HE. Also add HEAT, HESH, and AP for direct or short range attacks (I do not think these should be premium because they are almost useless most of the time. See aim and accuracy above). HEAT and HESH should have a lot of direct contact damage but less blast and fragments than HE. High fragmentation shell (Shrapnel) – low blast, relatively low direct hit damage, but very high fragmentation content. Add a mechanism for time delayed frag shell: you press the right mouse button in tactical view and the shell is taken out and reloaded with the time fuse set to explode 5 meters above your aim point. This is roughly how it worked IRL… these should be very complex to use, but very effective against soft targets or fast scouts. Premium shells: proximity frag, just like time fuse but no need to reset and reload every time. Incendiary shell – some splash damage causes some damage to outside modules and engine fire (unless engine is protected) or something similar. you may be surprised how effective simple fire bombs are against tanks...
    Game play effects: way more points for skillful players who chose and mix shells correctly and know what shell to use when. A lot of friendly hits and fines for noobs who use frags too close to their LTs, HEATs to help a HT being circled by several LTs, and HE instead of frag for area effect against a roofless TD. Skillful players can use AP to protect themselves from point blank (or heat or HESH), smoke to help their team, frags with time fuse against SPGs and soft TDs, HE or frag for close support of an HT in a circle of enemies, HEs to cause module damage to HTs and MTs with a reasonable rate of fire (aim dependent, but HEs do not need direct contact for outside module damage by blast).
  6.  Mortars: Just for fun, as mortars are very strange and unique. Considering WOT’s small battlefield, all regular SPGs are “caught in the fray”. Mortars are meant for such ranges. Mortars are the only vehicle type that can shoot itself… because of the high bomb arc, the closer the mortar shoots the MORE longer the flight time of the shell (neglecting the effect of changing the propellant amount), so accuracy is actually better for longer ranges (again, with the same propellant charge). Very short barrels and low charges mean very limited aim flare-up upon shooting – you can shoot several rounds while aiming. Very, very long time to target (20-30 sec seems legit), so a very different mindset for the player. No AP or HESH and I think no HEAT shells in WW2, but HE, smoke, frag (time, proximity and concussion fused), and incendiary shells. Very high rate of fire – you can fire several shells before the first lands… double aiming mechanism as above, but with generally worse absolute accuracy. While moving the aiming circle should be, like, 1 km wide, but very fast initial aim.
    Game play effect: hard to tell now, but probably very fun and will need many tweaks to work. If used for rapid fire – will become prime target for anti battery fire because of the many tracers showing its location and the mandatory open roof, inviting a time fused frag shell… will be the most valuable artillery in city maps, and probably an important ally (if used by a skillful player) in open terrain maps. Very mobile (otherwise – dead).

Conclusion: Heavily armored tanks should not fear arties, as was IRL, but arties should be able to knock them down with a direct hit (on rare occasion). Lightly armored vehicles should have fire under their tracks all the time… smoke/illumination and different shell types will enable real support of the attacks and defense by SPGs. Reloading should not be the major issue slowing SPG fire down, but aiming time with the new mechanism proposed. There should also be some other changes, such as a “give us smoke here” command, but these are more trivial tweaks for later.

 

Sorry for the long post. Who’s with me?

 

 

Your ideas sound amazing but only for a total new gameplay since it seems "too much for the average too little" players, maps, mechanics and battle modes can offer right now.

 

However, implementing your ideas completely will be hard since there are a lot of players that still whine about artillery; shell types would be reduced since no one wants more HEAT/AP "one shots", illumination and smoke will be swarmed by whiners that don't comprehend strategy or game mechanics (and can make OP camo  tanks even more OP) however i think you could change the concealment improvement for the elimination of the tank edge lines that allow us to determinante the shape of the vehicle (you can see it but you need to aim manually and actually use your eyes and hands at 100%.

 

Overall your ideas are good and interesting replica of real life arty role :) but players are too whiny:

Before 9.18: OMFG NERF ARTY TOO MUCH DAMAGE

Now: OMFG NERF ARTY TOO MUCH SPLASH AND STUN

Wargaming: REALLY?!

 

Implementing your ideas requires bigger maps, more hp, respawn, larger teams... (Sounds familiar uh)

 

 

Thanks for posting your suggestions +1 :)


Edited by RMxR, May 08 2017 - 19:27.


Uzi_Does_It #15 Posted May 08 2017 - 19:25

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View Post_JUMPER__1, on May 08 2017 - 19:14, said:

Love arty hahaha.anyways yes mortar launchers would be awseome!more love to drop on tankers!be a whole new complaint section for whiners who have never actually played it or even figured it out will say its easy no skill involved.yes send arty players mortars nukes anything from the sky above to drop on unsuspecting careless tank drivers!!!!

 

skill goes both ways - move or die. No rock is tall enough to hide you from the high arc of a mortar.

Uzi_Does_It #16 Posted May 08 2017 - 19:25

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View PostDracheherr, on May 08 2017 - 19:14, said:

This is a dead horse. No matter what is or is not done to arty, there will ALWAYS be slice of the WoT playing population who will be dissatisfied and loudly vocal about it.

 

Solution: ban all arty "discussion."

 

So what if they dislike it?

ClydeCooper421 #17 Posted May 08 2017 - 19:31

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View PostUzi_Does_It, on May 08 2017 - 10:25, said:

 

skill goes both ways - move or die. No rock is tall enough to hide you from the high arc of a mortar.

 

Which is not good for healthy gameplay. 

Uzi_Does_It #18 Posted May 08 2017 - 19:36

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View PostRMxR, on May 08 2017 - 19:22, said:

 

 

Your ideas sound amazing but only for a total new gameplay since it seems "too much for the average too little" players, maps, mechanics and battle modes can offer right now.

 

However, implementing your ideas completely will be hard since there are a lot of players that still whine about artillery; shell types would be reduced since no one wants more HEAT/AP "one shots", illumination and smoke will be swarmed by whiners that don't comprehend strategy or game mechanics (and can make OP camo  tanks even more OP) however i think you could change the concealment improvement for the elimination of the tank edge lines that allow us to determinante the shape of the vehicle (you can see it but you need to aim manually and actually use your eyes and hands at 100%.

 

Overall your ideas are good and interesting replica of real life arty role :) but players are too whiny:

Before 9.18: OMFG NERF ARTY TOO MUCH DAMAGE

Now: OMFG NERF ARTY TOO MUCH SPLASH AND STUN

Wargaming: REALLY?!

 

Implementing your ideas requires bigger maps, more hp, respawn, larger teams... (Sounds familiar uh)

 

 

Thanks for posting your suggestions +1 :)

 

First of all, thanks :-). Eliminating tank edge lines is a great idea, regardless of smoke.

But my main issue with SPGs is that I love them and do become a very skillful player, which is almost impossible now. So yes, I can hit a fast moving LT once out of 3-4 shots (used to kill him before 9.18... not always true now), but that is where the topmost skill ends for arties. I want a more complex class, and hope WG will move towards this end. I am sure it will be very slowly, but I've got time...

 

I love this game and want to improve it, so I do my best.



Guilty_By_Association_xD #19 Posted May 08 2017 - 19:37

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i agree



Uzi_Does_It #20 Posted May 08 2017 - 19:42

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View PostClydeCooper421, on May 08 2017 - 19:31, said:

 

Which is not good for healthy gameplay. 

 

Why not? consider you are facing a mortar and know that - adjust your game play. do not camp and if you do camp - run when spoted. it will change game play, but I am not sure it will be bad.

anyway, Mortars will have to be tested in sandbox before release. I am not sure it is a good idea, but it sounds fun to play, even if not too much fun to face.

 

BTW - mortars are the only vehicles with absolute zero self defense capabilities. add this to their better effectiveness at short ranges (due to taller arc), and you get many dead mortars... 







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