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Patch 9.20 Can we include the Leopard 1?


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Hippowolf #1 Posted Aug 01 2017 - 17:40

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I am requesting the devs include some buffs for the Leopard 1 in the 9.20 patch.  The Leo has, over the last year or two, been nerfed a little too much.  I play this tank all the time and I can safely say its effectiveness has diminished greatly.  With ZERO armor, reduced quickness (specific power), reduced accuracy, reduced damage, and mediocre camo it has become very "meh" in its ability to compete on a Tier 10 battlefield.  In 9.20 several mediums are getting "updates" to make them more competitive.  Can we please include the Leopard 1 in those updates??  The Leo gives up ALL of it's armor in trade for an excellent gun and quickness, only the gun is less accurate than other Tier 10 meds (in-game stats NOT withstanding.  Based on actual gameplay experience.), and it's acceleration (quickness) is also less than spactacular.  Yet other meds have substantial armor and are getting more in 9.20.  The Object 140, 62A, 48 Patton, 30B (and the tier 9 30 prot.) have better guns and accuracy (again, this is from experience and not the stats you see in the tech tree). Please consider a review/balance of the Leopard 1 for patch 9.20.

 

ref:  LemmingRush's video testing the accuracy of the Leo1:  

 

 

 



CapPhrases #2 Posted Aug 01 2017 - 17:58

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don't forget Claus!

 

 

the soft stats are what really kill the tank.



fred_632 #3 Posted Aug 01 2017 - 18:03

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1.82sec aim time, the dispersion is 0.29, dispersion when moving might be bad but 0.08 dispersion with turret traverse 2.88 when firing. There's nothing wrong with the leopard 1 its gun handling is better than most tier 10 meds. It even has the same stats as the M48 and AMX 30B with regards to gun handling

 

Maybe the armor can be checked but the gun is fine, maybe just maybe review the way you play the tank

 

I've learned that if I stopped listening to what other people said about specific tanks I can have my own playstyle with those tanks, lemmingrush, circon, QuickyBaby etc. they have their own playstyles, don't try to copy them you'll just stress yourself out find your own. QB likes to snipe with some meds if you see it's not working for you, change it. It's not the tank sometimes it's the driver 


Edited by fred_632, Aug 01 2017 - 18:11.


Lonewolfpj #4 Posted Aug 01 2017 - 18:18

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Please buff I am grinding my way up to her. 

Lycurge #5 Posted Aug 01 2017 - 18:53

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Leopard 1 need a good turret armor, they buff t54 and other russian who have still a good turret armor. In your leo you can be pen by anyone, sometimes its almost unplayable

churchill50 #6 Posted Aug 01 2017 - 18:53

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View Postfred_632, on Aug 01 2017 - 10:03, said:

1.82sec aim time, the dispersion is 0.29, dispersion when moving might be bad but 0.08 dispersion with turret traverse 2.88 when firing. There's nothing wrong with the leopard 1 its gun handling is better than most tier 10 meds. It even has the same stats as the M48 and AMX 30B with regards to gun handling

 

Maybe the armor can be checked but the gun is fine, maybe just maybe review the way you play the tank

 

I've learned that if I stopped listening to what other people said about specific tanks I can have my own playstyle with those tanks, lemmingrush, circon, QuickyBaby etc. they have their own playstyles, don't try to copy them you'll just stress yourself out find your own. QB likes to snipe with some meds if you see it's not working for you, change it. It's not the tank sometimes it's the driver 

 

http://tanks.gg/compare/m48-patton?t=amx-30-b~leopard-1

Please tell me how dispersion values that are almost twice as bad (Leopard 1's 0.17 versus the M48's 0.10) mean that the leopard has the same stats as the M48 and AMX 30B.



Hans_Mo1eman #7 Posted Aug 01 2017 - 19:02

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I feel like a buff to camo is all it really needs. 

 

After about 40 battles in the leopard 1 it just sits in my garage until camo goes back on sale. I think it snipes just fine if you have time to aim your shot but I don't think it has enough camo to do that in most cases. I guess I play it like a teir ten hellcat or like a big ru251 - which require good camo to operate well. I feel like it will excel in 30 v 30 but we will see.



Hippowolf #8 Posted Aug 01 2017 - 19:09

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View Postfred_632, on Aug 01 2017 - 17:03, said:

1.82sec aim time, the dispersion is 0.29, dispersion when moving might be bad but 0.08 dispersion with turret traverse 2.88 when firing. There's nothing wrong with the leopard 1 its gun handling is better than most tier 10 meds. It even has the same stats as the M48 and AMX 30B with regards to gun handling

 

Maybe the armor can be checked but the gun is fine, maybe just maybe review the way you play the tank

 

I've learned that if I stopped listening to what other people said about specific tanks I can have my own playstyle with those tanks, lemmingrush, circon, QuickyBaby etc. they have their own playstyles, don't try to copy them you'll just stress yourself out find your own. QB likes to snipe with some meds if you see it's not working for you, change it. It's not the tank sometimes it's the driver 

 

​You can't evaluate the Leo via the stats you see in the tech tree.  Of all the tanks I play the soft stats (those you do not see and only the devs know) on the Leo are the ones MOST out of sync with the public stats.  The Leo is a niche tank.  With no armor and mediocre quickness it does not do well in medium rang and close rang combat, so you are very much a stand-off fighter using cover, range and hopefully accuracy to be effective.  You can play tag-a-long if you have some good heavies holding the attention of enemies, but if not, then you will get rekt by every single tank that can see you regardless of tier (No armor means MAX pen for any tier 8+).  I also find the Leo gets spotted too easily.  My crew is 4+ skilled with MAX camo (skill, camo net, paint, vents, food) yet I will almost always get spotted regardless of how many bushes are between me and the enemy.  

 

Like every tank, you can have an exceptional game in the Leo as well.  However, the Leo needs a little upgrade to keep up with the rising tide of armor, alpha, and other improvements showing up in so many tanks these days (things I very much approve of btw).  It's supposed to be the most accurate tank/gun in the game, but it is not.  I can not tell you exactly why that is the case.  I can only relate my experience from 500+ battles in the Leo compared to as many in other tier 10 meds.  My skills are far from the best, but it does not take a lot of skill to see fully aimed shots miss the target again and again, nor to experience high alpha heavies HE snapshotting you regularly because you cannot poke and backup quick enough.  



arunvarun #9 Posted Aug 01 2017 - 19:44

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can it also include chinese meds?

 



fred_632 #10 Posted Aug 01 2017 - 21:03

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View Postchurchill50, on Aug 01 2017 - 18:53, said:

 

http://tanks.gg/compare/m48-patton?t=amx-30-b~leopard-1

Please tell me how dispersion values that are almost twice as bad (Leopard 1's 0.17 versus the M48's 0.10) mean that the leopard has the same stats as the M48 and AMX 30B.

 

God, you took the 2 bad things about it and made a big deal about it really, 2 things? I will show you again what I said n bold red letters "dispersion when moving might be bad 

 

Did you see it now or did you still miss it?



fred_632 #11 Posted Aug 01 2017 - 21:11

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View PostHippowolf, on Aug 01 2017 - 19:09, said:

 

You can't evaluate the Leo via the stats you see in the tech tree.  Of all the tanks I play the soft stats (those you do not see and only the devs know) on the Leo are the ones MOST out of sync with the public stats.  The Leo is a niche tank.  With no armor and mediocre quickness it does not do well in medium rang and close rang combat, so you are very much a stand-off fighter using cover, range and hopefully accuracy to be effective.  You can play tag-a-long if you have some good heavies holding the attention of enemies, but if not, then you will get rekt by every single tank that can see you regardless of tier (No armor means MAX pen for any tier 8+).  I also find the Leo gets spotted too easily.  My crew is 4+ skilled with MAX camo (skill, camo net, paint, vents, food) yet I will almost always get spotted regardless of how many bushes are between me and the enemy.  

 

Like every tank, you can have an exceptional game in the Leo as well.  However, the Leo needs a little upgrade to keep up with the rising tide of armor, alpha, and other improvements showing up in so many tanks these days (things I very much approve of btw).  It's supposed to be the most accurate tank/gun in the game, but it is not.  I can not tell you exactly why that is the case.  I can only relate my experience from 500+ battles in the Leo compared to as many in other tier 10 meds.  My skills are far from the best, but it does not take a lot of skill to see fully aimed shots miss the target again and again, nor to experience high alpha heavies HE snapshotting you regularly because you cannot poke and backup quick enough.  

 

I hear you mate, we'll just have to wait and see what happens, maybe next patch. The only thing I'm happy about is my FV4202 will get better armor, so that's the only reason I'm looking forward to patch 9.20



churchill50 #12 Posted Aug 01 2017 - 22:07

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View Postfred_632, on Aug 01 2017 - 13:03, said:

 

God, you took the 2 bad things about it and made a big deal about it really, 2 things? I will show you again what I said n bold red letters "dispersion when moving might be bad 

 

Did you see it now or did you still miss it?

 

 

Your two claims:

1) That the Leopard 1's dispersion when moving might be bad, and 

2) That the Leopard 1's gun performance is on par with that of the M48

are at odds. They contradict each other. I pointed out that the Leopard 1's gun performance is definitely worse than the M48's, leaving your claim that the Leopard 1's dispersion when moving is bad (which I agree with). Dispersion values when moving are an integral part of gun performance, and you elected to ignore that in your analysis of how good the Leopard 1's gun performance really is.



Battlecruiser #13 Posted Aug 03 2017 - 04:43

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leopard is [edited]

french garbage can replaces stb-1 as mid ranger

Midna1 #14 Posted Aug 03 2017 - 05:13

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i would very much like a buff to my leopard 1 nowadays its just sitting in garage collecting dust.

SpectreHD #15 Posted Aug 03 2017 - 05:31

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I say increase the DPM considerably.

mrmojo #16 Posted Aug 03 2017 - 05:58

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Remember when players were asking for the Leopard?

Serb: "You will get your glass tank"

 

Kv-2 vs Leopard sniping. Leo wins?

https://www.youtube....h?v=oKZ95l005wE

 

 



Drseckzytime #17 Posted Aug 06 2017 - 09:11

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Let's give it garbage soft stats for gun handling, make it feel sluggish now, to complement it's absolute lack of armor.  Then lets buff RU meds.  This is WG people.  It's lack of armor it should have the best hard and soft stats, or increase it's DPM to be best by a margin.




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