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I don't care what you or WG says, I'm convinced MM is rigged.


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Nunya_000 #21 Posted Aug 10 2017 - 22:20

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View PostGrimdancer, on Aug 10 2017 - 12:30, said:

 

.....

I didn't all-of-a-sudden start playing terrible.

......

 

 

 

You know, I say the same exact thing on some days when I golf.  I'm thinking that golf is rigged.



BillT #22 Posted Aug 10 2017 - 22:39

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"But every once in a while I get on streaks like the one I am on right now. Bad. Very bad. The last few days I've lost nearly 75% of the battles I've played."

 

If you didn't have hot and cold streaks, that would prove the MM is rigged.  A truly random MM will produce some surprising streaks. 

 

"The wording of their own patent makes it clear that MM is intentionally designed to make things more "challenging" for players that get on win streaks."

 

What that section says is that if you're on a losing streak, the MM will try harder to make you top tier. It doesn't say it's going to put a bunch of tomatoes on the other team so you win.  So tell me... do you see that happening?  When you're on a losing streak do you find yourself being top tier all the time?  I sure don't.  And this is something you can easily test.  All you have to do is record whether you were top, middle, or bottom in the match and whether you won.  Collect a few hundred battles worth of data and you can calculate for yourself whether MM works that way.



BillT #23 Posted Aug 10 2017 - 22:40

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View PostNunya_000, on Aug 10 2017 - 16:20, said:

 

You know, I say the same exact thing on some days when I golf.  I'm thinking that golf is rigged.

 

Golf is absolutely rigged.   How else can you explain Tiger Wood?  Unicum one year, tomato the next.

Markd73 #24 Posted Aug 10 2017 - 22:47

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View PostKliphie, on Aug 10 2017 - 21:08, said:

I don't care what she says, I'm convinced Jennifer Anniston is my wife and there is nothing you or anyone else can say or do to change my mind!

 

Except for maybe a restraining order.

 

:hiding:



BillT #25 Posted Aug 10 2017 - 22:47

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View PostGrimdancer, on Aug 10 2017 - 15:30, said:

 

What leaped out at me was that over the past 7 days and thirty days, you're averaging about sixty games a day.  That must be five hours or more of play time at 10-12 battles per hour.  And then in the past 24 hours you played 279  games?  No wonder your win rate sunk, you must have played 23 hours non-stop. You must have been drunk with exhaustion, malnutrition, and cramps.



Grimdancer #26 Posted Aug 10 2017 - 22:51

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View PostBillT, on Aug 10 2017 - 21:47, said:

What leaped out at me was that over the past 7 days and thirty days, you're averaging about sixty games a day.  That must be five hours or more of play time at 10-12 battles per hour.  And then in the past 24 hours you played 279  games?  No wonder your win rate sunk, you must have played 23 hours non-stop. You must have been drunk with exhaustion, malnutrition, and cramps.

 

Due to my schedule I get 7 days off once per month. I'm on my week off right now and it's been rainy, crappy weather with nothing else to do.

 

But yes, I do play this dam game way too much.

 

What leaps out to me on that graph is a win% that is steadily increasing over the past 60 days.... then all of a sudden it drastically drops within two days. And like I've been trying to point out, it's very noticable how the teams I've been on the last few days have been terrible.

 

If you put my win% on a graph over the last 60 days, it would look like this


Edited by Grimdancer, Aug 10 2017 - 23:04.


OldFrog75 #27 Posted Aug 10 2017 - 22:53

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View PostGrimdancer, on Aug 10 2017 - 20:45, said:

 

 

But every once in a while I get on streaks like the one I am on right now. Bad. Very bad. The last few days I've lost nearly 75% of the battles I've played. 

 

 

Your recent stats on WotLabs look better than this....:confused:



ISNomads #28 Posted Aug 10 2017 - 23:26

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BlackFive #29 Posted Aug 11 2017 - 00:52

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View PostGrimdancer, on Aug 10 2017 - 21:30, said:

 

Thanks for the link. It's nice to see that I was approaching 55%

However, the graph only proves my point. I didn't all-of-a-sudden start playing terrible. Yes there is a very small dip in certain stats like kill ratio, but not nearly enough to explain such a drastic out-of-nowhere drop in wins. So thanks for proving my point.

 

 

Oh jeez... where to start?

 

Yes, YESTERDAY you played poorly and had a one day dip of 3.5% w/r from your WEEKLY average.  For the record: your Weekly avg... INCLUDES yesterday.  So in general terms... you haven't had a statistical change in your recent stats.

 

I will bet you that you had a good day prior to that ... sometime in the week.  Where was the "Game is rigged, I'm not playing well but still winning' thread?



Grimdancer #30 Posted Aug 11 2017 - 00:58

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View PostBlackFive, on Aug 10 2017 - 23:52, said:

 

Oh jeez... where to start?

 

Yes, YESTERDAY you played poorly and had a one day dip of 3.5% w/r from your WEEKLY average.  For the record: your Weekly avg... INCLUDES yesterday.  So in general terms... you haven't had a statistical change in your recent stats.

 

I will bet you that you had a good day prior to that ... sometime in the week.  Where was the "Game is rigged, I'm not playing well but still winning' thread?

 

Why do you seem incapable of understanding or noticing a drastic drop from the last 60 days compared to recently? You do realize that I'm talking about the last few days, not just yesterday. I'm talking about yesterday and today and the day before yesterday. The graph is broken down only recently between the last 7 days and the past 24 hours. It doesn't show anything in between.

 

And I didn't have a good day prior to that, I had a good two months.

 

But whatever. I see what I see and I am noticing what I am noticing. I've gotten more [edited], terrible, ridiculously stupid teams in the last few days than I've gotten in several months.

 

Like I said. I am convinced that both the patent and the news letter that says WG can and will adjust MM to "balance" players and to "keep players from getting bored" combined with my own experience that this crap is rigged to high heaven. WG does what they see fit.

 

And you people are naive sheep for thinking otherwise.


Edited by Grimdancer, Aug 11 2017 - 01:00.


Thornir #31 Posted Aug 11 2017 - 01:09

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Don't confuse the OP with facts, folks. His mind's made up.

 

Cognitive Dissonance, anyone?



Grimdancer #32 Posted Aug 11 2017 - 01:30

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View PostThornir, on Aug 11 2017 - 00:09, said:

Don't confuse the OP with facts, folks. His mind's made up.

 

Cognitive Dissonance, anyone?

 

Stalin claimed it was German Soldiers that executed 22,000 Polish officers in the Katyn Massacre.

 

It wasn't until documents proving otherwise were released in the 1990s that the world learned it was, in fact, Stalin's Communist Party that carried out the mass executions of a supposed ally.

 

I would love to go back in time and accuse the families of these Polish Officers of Cognitive Dissonance. They knew dam well it was Russia and Stalin. Yet nobody believed them.

 

Only a fool believes what he is told w/o question and I know what I am seeing with my own eyes. If you believe for one second that WG is somehow above or beyond lying to their player base, then you are a fool. They are a cooperation and they will do and say what brings in the most money.

 

What effect do you think it would have on the player base if they admitted the win% was being manipulated?

 

 

 


Edited by Grimdancer, Aug 11 2017 - 01:30.


KingofDragons #33 Posted Aug 11 2017 - 01:38

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Well i see it not as being rigged but as a balancing system.. example .. i was in my Tier 6   T150 top dog in a game which i had 4 kills and top in damage on winning team.. I pretty well knew that if i did good , with this tank , MM was going to whoop my [edited].

 

I was right .. Next game i'm in a Tier 8 match facing 112s / Defenders / UDES 03 / Black Prince and so on .. U know how long a T150 lasts with this type of MM ?



Kliphie #34 Posted Aug 11 2017 - 01:39

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View PostGrimdancer, on Aug 10 2017 - 19:30, said:

 

Only a fool believes what he is told w/o question and I know what I am seeing with my own eyes. If you believe for one second that WG is somehow above or beyond lying to their player base, then you are a fool. They are a cooperation and they will do and say what brings in the most money.

 

What effect do you think it would have on the player base if they admitted the win% was being manipulated?

 

 

 

 

To what gain, why you specifically?  Which is more likely, WG has a vendetta against you personally or you're playing too many games in too small of a window and are playing on tilt?

Grimdancer #35 Posted Aug 11 2017 - 01:47

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View PostKliphie, on Aug 11 2017 - 00:39, said:

 

To what gain, why you specifically?  Which is more likely, WG has a vendetta against you personally or you're playing too many games in too small of a window and are playing on tilt?

 

I've never said anywhere in this thread that WG is targeting me specifically. What I've pointed out effects everyone. When you get on a good, long winning streak and your win% begins to steadily rise, you get put on teams with lower win% for two reasons.

1- To create more of a challenge so you don't get "bored" by "easy matches"- This concept is clearly mentioned in their patent.

2- So bolster the chances of a win for the players with a lower win% by adding better players to their team. - This is also mentioned in the patent.


Edited by Grimdancer, Aug 11 2017 - 02:00.


BlackFive #36 Posted Aug 11 2017 - 02:39

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View PostGrimdancer, on Aug 11 2017 - 00:58, said:

 

Why do you seem incapable of understanding or noticing a drastic drop from the last 60 days compared to recently? You do realize that I'm talking about the last few days, not just yesterday. I'm talking about yesterday and today and the day before yesterday. The graph is broken down only recently between the last 7 days and the past 24 hours. It doesn't show anything in between.

 

And I didn't have a good day prior to that, I had a good two months.

 

But whatever. I see what I see and I am noticing what I am noticing. I've gotten more [edited], terrible, ridiculously stupid teams in the last few days than I've gotten in several months.

 

Like I said. I am convinced that both the patent and the news letter that says WG can and will adjust MM to "balance" players and to "keep players from getting bored" combined with my own experience that this crap is rigged to high heaven. WG does what they see fit.

 

And you people are naive sheep for thinking otherwise.

 

Look at the numbers again.  Your past week's w/r is better - BETTER - than you have had in the last two months.  Including a crappy last 24.

 

You really should take a step back and think about this.  You don't suffer from Cognitive Dissonance as one poster suggests, but you are victim to Motivated Reasoning:

 

Block Quote

...motivated reasoning, says sociologist Steven Hoffman, visiting assistant professor at the University at Buffalo. "Rather than search rationally for information that either confirms or disconfirms a particular belief," he says, "people actually seek out information that confirms what they already believe." 

 

 

Check out this story from Newsweek.  While it might trigger some folks... its actually good reading, and non-technical.  http://www.newsweek.com/why-we-believe-lies-even-when-we-learn-truth-78775



NeatoMan #37 Posted Aug 11 2017 - 02:59

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maybe it's because you played 279 games in the last 24 hrs?  get some sleep.
 

btw, battle level is the same as battle tier.   That entire paragraph deals with battle tiers. 

 

btbtw,  why did you cutoff the rest of the Wotlab stats. such as DPG, WN8, etc.  I notice your kpg was down a little too.


Edited by NeatoMan, Aug 11 2017 - 03:24.


Grimdancer #38 Posted Aug 11 2017 - 03:07

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View PostBlackFive, on Aug 11 2017 - 01:39, said:

 

Look at the numbers again.  Your past week's w/r is better - BETTER - than you have had in the last two months.  Including a crappy last 24.

 

 

 

That is my point. My win% was steadily going up over the last several months including the majority of the last 7 days. It was like flipping a switch all of a sudden two days ago. It happened very abruptly. Then for two days straight I lost an immense amount of battles. A large % of them were blowouts.

 

You, nor anyone else in this thread has said anything to convince me otherwise. In fact, the most amusing response I see is "Well, WG has clearly stated they don't manipulate the win% in any fashion".

 

I take that back. What I find more amusing actually, are people like you and others who are attempting to slap a psychological diagnoses on me or anyone else that dares to consider it a possibility that WG is LYING.

 

Corporations lie all day and every day.

 

I suspect my win% will bounce back up sooner or later, but I do not believe for one second longer that it's pure coincidence that it literally fell off the face of a cliff.



NeatoMan #39 Posted Aug 11 2017 - 13:18

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post the full screenshot of your wotlabs stats.  Maybe you've been doing less damage than usual.

NeatoMan #40 Posted Aug 11 2017 - 13:30

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View PostGrimdancer, on Aug 10 2017 - 19:47, said:

I've never said anywhere in this thread that WG is targeting me specifically. What I've pointed out effects everyone. When you get on a good, long winning streak and your win% begins to steadily rise, you get put on teams with lower win% for two reasons.

1- To create more of a challenge so you don't get "bored" by "easy matches"- This concept is clearly mentioned in their patent.

2- So bolster the chances of a win for the players with a lower win% by adding better players to their team. - This is also mentioned in the patent.

The patent says no such thing.  that paragraph says it adjusts your battle tier based on your win%.  "Battle level" in the patent is the same as battle tier.  If you read the whole patent you would have seen that.

 

 

Here's an important part of that parapgraph you skipped over

 

According to another aspect, the matchmaking server may store a win/loss percentage for each user (or vehicle) at a given battle level. As the player's win/loss ratio decreases, the player becomes more likely to be placed in battles having battle levels at the lower end of the allowable range, whereas as the player's win/loss ration increases, the player becomes more likely to be placed in battles having battle levels at the upper end of the allowable range. Thus, when a player has been repeatedly put into too many difficult battles, the balancing is done in favor of easier battle sessions, thereby encouraging the player by providing an easier game environment. Similarly, when the player has been repeatedly put into too many easy battles, the balancing is done in favor of harder battle sessions, thereby keeping the player challenged instead of letting the player become bored with easy games

 

"Thus"  meaning "as a result" or "as a consequence..".  So the challenge is a result of higher or lower battle levels (battle tier)


Edited by NeatoMan, Aug 11 2017 - 13:39.





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