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dis1 #1 Posted Nov 09 2017 - 03:25

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After thousands of games and watching this game evolve I wanted to provide some feedback to WG. I'm sure some of this feedback, if not all, you have heard before but its worth repeating. With that, let me start with the obvious:

Artillery:

Nearly 1 game in 5 I see a player complaining about arty. Playing arty is like playing a different game that magically influences and reduces the enjoyment of another completely separate game. I have heard excuses like making sure tanks don't bunch up but that's a bunch of BS. We all know why, its because it was a mistake that was introduced that's too difficult to retract because, let's face it, we have a lot of players that like it. However it is a big negative in the game and undoubtedly reduces the overall satisfaction of your player base. I played a game recently where I was speeding along at the start of battle near the back in a t-34-85 and boom, one shotted by a s-51 out of nowhere. Not a single player spotted yet on either side. Fun? I think not. I spend nearly 20% of my mental attention humping rock faces and buildings trying to make sure arty can't hit me instead of focusing on actually fighting enemy tanks. Fun? I think not. Oh and playing arty, nearly required for the personal missions. Sit in the back, not driving around, shoot, miss, wait 30 seconds to reload. Fun? Only if you like candy crush or other clickers with no fun other than neat visuals. Oh and don't get me started on how prolific arty is in ranked battles. Try playing a Maus or other heavy tank in ranked battles... Fun? I think not. With all of that said, should arty be removed? Probably not and you really can't at this point however arty should almost never dominate the battlefield with 3 arty units, each with the potential to OS 1/2 the opposing team from somewhere completely out of sight. At one point they were nerfed and stun effects added and players started to rejoice. Arty participation dropped and I normally saw 0 to 1 arty in each game per team. Finally, WG figured it out. A few months go by and arty is buffed so that they do big damage and stun. Fun? I think not. Now nearly every game has 2-3 arty per team. What's the answer? Well I'd make them far less accurate but able to reload faster. This will increase the fun. Raise the hit points too and make them more accurate if played like a TD. If they are in arty mode, make it so that players can see where they are aiming. Finally make sure 2-3 arty on a team is very rare and that the norm is 0-1. I'd say 0=70%, 1=20%, 2+=10%. This might mean arty players are forced to wait for battles. Aww, too bad, play a real tank.

MM:
I'm pretty much putting this in the order I see players complaining while in game. For this one though, wow, let me just say you guys have finally made some huge improvements!!! The number of in-game complaints I see has dropped by 1000% for MM. That said I have noticed a new and very disturbing trend. This is the chance to get a top tier battle. I played hundreds of games and was watching my chance to get mid or high tier in a 3 tier battle. Normally these games have 3 top tier, and 4 or 5 mid and the other 1/2 bottom tier. 3 top tier means I should have a 20% chance of scoring such a game, right? Nope, far far from it. I suspect these high tier games are given to new tanks that need to grind because when I recently got a new tier 9 I was top tier nearly every game. I did not appreciate this! This has become frustrating as I feel that I am some how demoted after grinding a tank to full crew, upgrades and equipment. My rates are closer to 8% for top tier and 23% for mid. As a result if I want to not be continually faced with 2 tier differences, which often results in extreme difficulties in penning the opponent and a good chance to be killed in 2 shots, I am forced to play tier 1-4 or 9-10. I will also add that this aspect of MM skews players ratings. One player that magically offsets me and gets lots of top tier battles will have a better chance of carrying his team if he is above average, thus his skill is amplified. My skill level, good or bad, and its impact on the game, including my stats for doing well, are reduced at lower tiers. I think I read that MM tracks players and attempts to give them top tier if they haven't had it in a while but I can't believe that unless single tier battles somehow meet that criteria. MM should be absolutely random in handing out top tier games with no preference to the player's tank, skill level, number of battles, nothing, period.

We also have the issue of imbalanced games. Largely WG has done a great job of balancing tanks across teams recently but not player skill. Unfortunately you can't balance a team based on skill because then, if teams are balanced so that each team has a 50% chance of winning then ... all stats will slowly drift to 50% win rates. That said, weekends are especially bad as blow outs that end in 3 minutes with a 15 to 2 or 3 victory aren't uncommon and almost the norm. This is amplified when there are specials. On days like this a regular player has a choice. Play defensive while expecting the blow out and attempt to do well and avoid being cornered but then if you are on the winning team then you basically do nothing and can never catch up to the steam roller. Play offensively and be part of the team roller but then you might find yourself playing against unpredictable noobs that throw their tanks at you with no regard for strategy or self preservation. Guess right and you have some fun, wrong and you're dead or left feeling like a stationary arty player. My suggestion here? Gosh, I wish I had one. Maybe try some minimal skill based balancing? I really don't know.

Light Tank Balancing:
First, let me say that the recent change for light tanks was a huge win. Once again, you are listening. The fact that a tier 4 light tank could see tier 7 was so absurd before. I remember one battle I was in a t-50 and found an idle Tiger I. I couldn't pen it from any angle with gold. Anyway, it was a great change that made lights playable for me at higher tiers, though I admit that my skills are still lacking due to avoiding them for so long. That said, some balancing issues still need worked out. Some light tanks with auto loaders are too OP. They can zip in, maybe even take a hit, deliver massive damage and then zip out to reload in safety. Take the Luchs for example. 300dmg in a burst at tier 4 with incredible maneuverability. Compare this to a tier up, a T-50. It can do maybe 140 dmg to a Luchs should they encounter each other in a brief skirmish. Now, none of this is particularly bad except that the tiers are misplaced. A Luchs is more powerful that a T-50 in most situations played at these tiers and even if you ignore the gun, a tier up only gets 20 additional hit points, 360 vs 340? Why does the luchs have so many hit points? Most tier 4 mediums get about 350, just 10 more. At tier 5 a medium has about 100 more hit points than tier 4 mediums and tier 5 lights. Simply put the Luchs should either be tier 5 or nerfed with less hit points.

General Tank Balancing:
Similar to light tanks, make sure there aren't any extreme outliers. Fix them like you did the T18. They are easy to spot like the horrid Toldi, something that could have only been a mistake as every characteristic it has matches tier 2 except for its hit points. Generally you do pretty good at this though.

Personal Missions:
Generally these are interesting with cool rewards. Your recent changes were paper thin though and only addressed a few of the difficult missions that couldn't be completed except at top tiers. For example I'm not great at playing lights but the final mission for a light tank for the Stug has proven impossible for me. I'm sure it can be done but I saw the changes note that it should be possible to complete the missions with tanks from the same tier as the reward tank. This is still a tall order. Have you run stats on people completing the personal missions and correlate it to the battles they have played and at what tier? What's the success rate? I sure don't see many of these reward tanks rolling around and those that are out there I doubt were won by a tank of the same tier. You should force players to play tier 4-6 to win a tier 5 Stug for example and adjust the missions for tanks of that tier.

Medals:
Another great job in providing rewards for medals. However... between 1 and 5 bonds when it takes 3000 to buy a lower grade piece of equipment? If I earn a medal one out of every 5 games it will take me 15000 games to buy one. Yea, its a nice gesture but really? It's like a sit-com where a strapping young lad goes out in his neighborhood to do odd jobs and earn money. He spends all day at some granny's place and she finally pays him with 20 cents because she never caught up with inflation. That said you can't pay too much because you will have people rushing in to earn scout or trying to kill 2+ artys. Ok ok, maybe the arty killing wouldn't be all bad but it would create imbalance. With some careful thought though this could be made to work. Just aim for the ability to get a reward based on skill so above average players can earn enough to buy something after maybe 1 thousand games. Generally though I love the idea of a reward for medals. Very cool, they just need to be enough to mean something, not granny cents.

Halloween Special/multi Turret Tanks:
This might have been your best holiday event yet! The two tanks weren't balanced against each other as the FCM 2C was far inferior but it had more interesting dynamics added to game play, for example exposing the easy to hit and pen side to deliver damage from both guns. This was a ton of fun and hopefully your first attempt at adding multi turret tanks to the game. How interesting would it be to have the M3 Lee use the top turret, the B1 Bis use the hull turret and add some of the more interesting tanks in history like the T-35. This Halloween event proves that it can be done. Please do it!

Tank Trees:
I think you guys have done a pretty good job at this for the most part. I personally prefer to use tanks that were actually created and used in combat, specifically WWII but I know you need to fill out the trees with concept vehicles etc. That said there are a few odd omissions such as Italy. 

Customizations (Equipment and Crew):
I like how the crew works however it might be nice to see exp points and requirements to gain the next level. Tank customizations are generally pretty good too but I'd like to see more, for example adding additional options like strapping logs to the side to add hit points or something at the expense of added weight. Meh, maybe that one is silly. Also, it would be cool if some of the equipment actually displayed in battle like camo net. BTW adding the 5% camo advantage to tanks with camo, about time! Great job, this is exactly the type of thing we need in games like this. 

Display Distance and Range:
This needs extended because I can sometimes hit tanks that I can't see by aiming at the map where I think they are sitting. Perhaps some equipment would extend view range, see above. Some tanks like German Tiger tanks should have an advantage here while other tanks should have their range reduced. Right now all gun range is the same with the exception of auto loading pewpew guns. This would add an interesting dynamic to the game however you might need some larger maps. Map size is currently rather small, however this is an aspect of what sets WOT apart from some of the others and I think smaller maps make for a faster game, which is fine. 

Final Thoughts:
Unfortunately I will most likely discontinue my participation in WOT. With the buff of arty I'm seeing nearly 1/2 of all games with 3 arty units and all too often I have too be super careful with my positioning to avoid being hit by magic bullets. I'm just so completely sick of arty and the issues with MM that makes it so the vast majority of my games are bottom tier doesn't help either. I challenge you to add a game mode where players can pick if they have arty in the random battle or not. I think you will quickly discover what your player base wants. Until changes are made or there is compelling content to bring me back like multi turret tanks, I am not playing anymore. You made an awesome game that's both a fun online multi player game and strategic but arty is just too prevalent and powerful. You might as well combine in world of warplanes so that a super fast and impossible to hit player can dive in and kill me from any angle and do so in seconds regardless of my hit points. Realistic? Yes. Fun? I think not. This is World of Tanks, not World of Artillery. 



GeorgePreddy #2 Posted Nov 09 2017 - 04:14

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None of what you listed is all that serious... the game is fine, just not for everyone.

 

Not everyone can be good at it.



the_Deadly_Bulb #3 Posted Nov 09 2017 - 05:10

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TL DR

I take it you're leaving.

 

Bye


Edited by the_Deadly_Bulb, Nov 09 2017 - 05:11.


dis1 #4 Posted Nov 11 2017 - 04:52

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View PostGeorgePreddy, on Nov 09 2017 - 03:14, said:

None of what you listed is all that serious... the game is fine, just not for everyone.

 

Not everyone can be good at it.

 

I take the problems with OP arty pretty seriously and so do a ton of other players based on the in-game chat complaints I continually see.

Red_Ensign #5 Posted Nov 11 2017 - 04:55

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View Postdis1, on Nov 10 2017 - 21:52, said:

 

I take the problems with OP arty pretty seriously and so do a ton of other players based on the in-game chat complaints I continually see.

 

yes whiners in chat are a big problem.

MacDaddyMatty #6 Posted Nov 11 2017 - 05:03

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Agree or not, its a pretty good read.

Whistling_Death_ #7 Posted Nov 13 2017 - 20:19

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Artillery was so destroyed in the hated 9.18 patch that thousands and thousands of players quit the game.  There is very little artillery in battles anymore and it has been so destroyed it's not much of a factor anymore.  If you still can't adjust your style of play to easily avoid being hit by artillery, then the presence of artillery is not the problem.

dis1 #8 Posted Nov 17 2017 - 07:17

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View PostWhistling_Death_, on Nov 13 2017 - 19:19, said:

Artillery was so destroyed in the hated 9.18 patch that thousands and thousands of players quit the game.  There is very little artillery in battles anymore and it has been so destroyed it's not much of a factor anymore.  If you still can't adjust your style of play to easily avoid being hit by artillery, then the presence of artillery is not the problem.

 

Yes, destroyed and the complaints stopped. But WG buffed them again and most games have 3 arty in them so not sure what you are talking about re: "very little artillery anymore"... 

Klagor #9 Posted Nov 17 2017 - 19:12

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I play mostly arty, and we have been nerfed so bad that it is truly unfair. I have sat in my M44 and waited while the aiming circle has stopped and I am tight on the enemy fire and miss, then I wait for reload and without moving my aiming circle and without the enemy moving I fire again and miss, so I wait and reload and fire and miss. If by chance I am able to get a hit it is only by splash because hitting a target that is NOT moving it almost impossible. My gun has had the damage reduced by half and the chance of a hit by 90%. I can barely fire over a small hill let alone a building, this is artillery and if you allow tanks to shoot targets with just the commanders hatch showing why do you make it so hard for an arty to hit it's target. I am not sure staying in this game and spending my money here is such a good idea anymore. Used to be fun but with all the complainers about arty getting us reduced to near nothing I think my money would be better spent some place else.

dis1 #10 Posted Dec 03 2017 - 23:14

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View PostKlagor, on Nov 17 2017 - 18:12, said:

I play mostly arty, and we have been nerfed so bad that it is truly unfair. I have sat in my M44 and waited while the aiming circle has stopped and I am tight on the enemy fire and miss, then I wait for reload and without moving my aiming circle and without the enemy moving I fire again and miss, so I wait and reload and fire and miss. If by chance I am able to get a hit it is only by splash because hitting a target that is NOT moving it almost impossible. My gun has had the damage reduced by half and the chance of a hit by 90%. I can barely fire over a small hill let alone a building, this is artillery and if you allow tanks to shoot targets with just the commanders hatch showing why do you make it so hard for an arty to hit it's target. I am not sure staying in this game and spending my money here is such a good idea anymore. Used to be fun but with all the complainers about arty getting us reduced to near nothing I think my money would be better spent some place else.

 

That's the price you pay for being able to shoot targets that you don't see, can't see you and requires almost no skill, just luck. You don't even have to move. You could literally use your other hand for "other activities" while playing arty. I have zero sympathy for arty players when WG applies an arty nerf and hope to see more such nerfs for arty. 

Sgt__Guffy #11 Posted Dec 04 2017 - 18:51

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View Postdis1, on Nov 08 2017 - 20:25, said:

After thousands of games and watching this game evolve I wanted to provide some feedback to WG. I'm sure some of this feedback, if not all, you have heard before but its worth repeating. With that, let me start with the obvious:

 

 

Well it is not feedback is it. It is just an amalgam of observing players comments and the OP's personal opinion, most of which has be similarly aired on the forum many times. 

 

So no, it is not really worth repeating.


Edited by Sgt__Guffy, Dec 04 2017 - 18:51.


dis1 #12 Posted Dec 12 2017 - 05:15

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View PostSgt__Guffy, on Dec 04 2017 - 17:51, said:

 

Well it is not feedback is it. It is just an amalgam of observing players comments and the OP's personal opinion, most of which has be similarly aired on the forum many times. 

 

So no, it is not really worth repeating.

 

Your logic is flawed sir. If every bit of feedback was only voiced a single time by players then WG wouldn't have any way to understand what feedback carries more weight with players. But with less than 2K battles you seem to spend more time reading about the game as opposed to playing it so if anybody can be accused of feedback that is based more on reading other's opinion as opposed to playing the game and forming personal opinions... gosh, it just might be you. How's that for an observation?

dpmgumby #13 Posted Dec 13 2017 - 19:20

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View PostGeorgePreddy, on Nov 09 2017 - 04:14, said:

None of what you listed is all that serious... the game is fine, just not for everyone.

 

Not everyone can be good at it.

 

View Postthe_Deadly_Bulb, on Nov 09 2017 - 05:10, said:

TL DR

I take it you're leaving.

 

Bye

 

View PostRed_Ensign, on Nov 11 2017 - 04:55, said:

 

yes whiners in chat are a big problem.

 

View PostSarg Guffy, on Nov 11 2017 - 05:03, said:

Well it is not feedback is it. It is just an amalgam of observing players comments and the OP's personal opinion, most of which has be similarly aired on the forum many times. 

 

So no, it is not really worth repeating.

 

Funny how the Fanboi foursome is all over this thread.....

 

Do you guys at least get paid by Wargaming to stick up for them everytime someone post something negative? or do you just get off on trolling other people.

 

I would be lucky to find one post that you 4 idiots have ever agreed to something negative about the game, all you do is talk crap about people who post stuff.

 

FYI its a "FEEDBACK" post so stfu with your trolling we dont give a crap how you feel, the point is to let WG know what customers feel like about issues, nobody gives a crap what you think, 

 

 

 


Edited by dpmgumby, Dec 13 2017 - 19:23.


Michael_Cochrane_2017 #14 Posted Dec 14 2017 - 01:56

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View PostGeorgePreddy, on Nov 08 2017 - 21:14, said:

None of what you listed is all that serious... the game is fine, just not for everyone.

 

Not everyone can be good at it.

 

lol and getting raped isn't for everyone but some love it.......I see you're the latter not the former. 

Let me guess: you run premium russian tanks, with a premium account, and spam gold? Those three factors is what makes this game "enjoyable" for some. I spent hours training crews in american and british tanks only to find that on a tier for tier basis, my T29 really only performs like a tier iv against russian tanks (and some german). 

Sorry, don't care how "good" you are, if you don't have a stick, you're not going to score against any player....or enjoy yourself trying. 

yes, this game isn't for everyone, because most people cannot afford to "pay to win" and that's what this has become. 

Michael_Cochrane_2017 #15 Posted Dec 14 2017 - 01:58

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View PostKlagor, on Nov 17 2017 - 12:12, said:

I play mostly arty, and we have been nerfed so bad that it is truly unfair. I have sat in my M44 and waited while the aiming circle has stopped and I am tight on the enemy fire and miss, then I wait for reload and without moving my aiming circle and without the enemy moving I fire again and miss, so I wait and reload and fire and miss. If by chance I am able to get a hit it is only by splash because hitting a target that is NOT moving it almost impossible. My gun has had the damage reduced by half and the chance of a hit by 90%. I can barely fire over a small hill let alone a building, this is artillery and if you allow tanks to shoot targets with just the commanders hatch showing why do you make it so hard for an arty to hit it's target. I am not sure staying in this game and spending my money here is such a good idea anymore. Used to be fun but with all the complainers about arty getting us reduced to near nothing I think my money would be better spent some place else.

 

well, you must be doing something wrong because I get killed 9 times out of 10 by arty (ok maybe 7 times) and see them racking up damage left right and center.....I mean hell, you have GOD VIEW and sit in relative safety and fire and kill tanks 1 km away......

Train your crews to 100% on everything and you'll be up there with the pros in no time.

dpmgumby #16 Posted Dec 14 2017 - 02:46

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View PostRed_Ensign, on Nov 11 2017 - 04:55, said:

 

yes whiners in chat are a big problem.

 

7K BATTLES ALL IN TIER 3OR UNDER

 

go home and shut up

 

tired of seeing you fanboi these threads, nobody gives a crap what a useless sealclubber thinks about the game



dpmgumby #17 Posted Dec 14 2017 - 02:48

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View PostGeorgePreddy, on Nov 09 2017 - 04:14, said:

None of what you listed is all that serious... the game is fine, just not for everyone.

 

Not everyone can be good at it.

 

another [edited]fanboi who has all his games in T5 or less

 

seriously shut up



dexatrin82 #18 Posted Dec 14 2017 - 04:01

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the fanbois make new accounts because they got banned previously on their modded accounts, so they make new ones just to cheat more and troll forums defending wargamings almost obvious pay to win, ever since I started spending money on this game My win rate has been going up and so has my PR, coincidence I think not....




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