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Penning Problems

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Ericmopar #1 Posted Nov 15 2017 - 01:10

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I just had a nice experience, in which I had a nice juicy M4 Sherman present it's broad side for a full 6 shots, at least, and I couldn't pen it with the L60 on my Derpsbergwagen.

I should have been able to pen the sides with standard AP easily, but couldn't, and when I switched to APCR I still couldn't touch it.

I could see the tank's marker dim when I hit it but no damage was done at all.

This M4 just presented itself to me in a perfect broadside near 90deg, but no go on the hits.



Slayer_Jesse #2 Posted Nov 15 2017 - 01:18

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What was the range? That gun has poor standard penetration, and APCR has severe penetration falloff at range.

Edited by Slayer_Jesse, Nov 15 2017 - 01:19.


galspanic #3 Posted Nov 15 2017 - 01:20

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Let's see a replay.  Why does everyone post topics saying "OMG Why did this happen?!" and then not show us what happened?

ArtofTanks #4 Posted Nov 15 2017 - 01:27

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View PostEricmopar, on Nov 14 2017 - 19:10, said:

I just had a nice experience, in which I had a nice juicy M4 Sherman present it's broad side for a full 6 shots, at least, and I couldn't pen it with the L60 on my Derpsbergwagen.

I should have been able to pen the sides with standard AP easily, but couldn't, and when I switched to APCR I still couldn't touch it.

I could see the tank's marker dim when I hit it but no damage was done at all.

This M4 just presented itself to me in a perfect broadside near 90deg, but no go on the hits.

 

With a replay many people would come help you with what went wrong.

ledhed14 #5 Posted Nov 15 2017 - 01:28

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RNG may have decided your shots belonged in the tracks and they just either passed through gaps doing nothing or tracks ate the shots without " breaking " because you idnt hit drivewheel .

 Also what often happens is you " see " a big juicy red target but you are shown a big rock or other junk that eats shells before they hit the target slowing them or even stopping them . Yes a side shot with even a 37 mm " should " pen the armor but we have a RNG system and destructable / non destructable terrain junk that has an influence on shots . I have hit the side of an Amx 12 T with 128 mm AP from point blank range and gotten zero damage roll . So nothing is a surprise anymore .



WeSayNotToday #6 Posted Nov 15 2017 - 01:31

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View PostEricmopar, on Nov 15 2017 - 01:10, said:

I just had a nice experience, in which I had a nice juicy M4 Sherman present it's broad side for a full 6 shots, at least, and I couldn't pen it with the L60 on my Derpsbergwagen.

I should have been able to pen the sides with standard AP easily, but couldn't, and when I switched to APCR I still couldn't touch it.

I could see the tank's marker dim when I hit it but no damage was done at all.

This M4 just presented itself to me in a perfect broadside near 90deg, but no go on the hits.

 

Distance is a BIG factor, AP and APCR have a fall-off in pen over distance.  Also, the tank's tracks catch shots, yielding no "actual" damage as well.  You absolutely could have hit a few times on the curve of the armor as well.  Your battle count is low, so I will also mention that you can get the whole outline of a tank by mousing over part of the tank you have line-of-sight to, but most of the tank could still be obscured by a building or dead tank, etc.  So, seeing the whole outline seems to indicate the tank is completely open to you, but, it isn't.

 

Der BrunchWagon takes a little learning to use.  It is a fine heavy tank if it is not your FIRST heavy tank.  If it is your first, keep at it.  It exists in this game as designed by WG to make getting to the Tiger frustrating.

 

Keep at the game, it is rewarding in the long run as you learn more and more.



Ericmopar #7 Posted Nov 15 2017 - 01:35

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View PostSlayer_Jesse, on Nov 14 2017 - 16:18, said:

What was the range? That gun has poor standard penetration, and APCR has severe penetration falloff at range.

Hmmmm I couldn't tell you the range, although I saw some gun specs after the match that confirmed that L60's performance drops off a lot with range.

View Postledhed14, on Nov 14 2017 - 16:28, said:

RNG may have decided your shots belonged in the tracks and they just either passed through gaps doing nothing or tracks ate the shots without " breaking " because you idnt hit drivewheel .

 Also what often happens is you " see " a big juicy red target but you are shown a big rock or other junk that eats shells before they hit the target slowing them or even stopping them . Yes a side shot with even a 37 mm " should " pen the armor but we have a RNG system and destructable / non destructable terrain junk that has an influence on shots . I have hit the side of an Amx 12 T with 128 mm AP from point blank range and gotten zero damage roll . So nothing is a surprise anymore .

Thanks for the replies.

 

Question: Doesn't that replay only work on the very last battle played?

And, I know where the link is in the game files, but not how to upload it.

I used the replay function for the first time the other day, to confirm I wasn't going nuts about some other aim and firing thing. In that case I had a green gun marker indicating I could pen, but didn't then either. In that case the tank was in the open with no scenery items etc in between me and them.
I should add, my DW2 crew is still in the 80% range as well.

 

According to the "firepower" tab I'm supposed to be down to about 2.3 second aim time, but It's actually closer to 3.5 - 4 seconds for that too. (something else I checked with the replay now that I think of it) It seemed long and was.

 

 


Edited by Ericmopar, Nov 15 2017 - 01:42.


Ericmopar #8 Posted Nov 15 2017 - 01:46

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View PostWeSayNotToday, on Nov 14 2017 - 16:31, said:

 

Distance is a BIG factor, AP and APCR have a fall-off in pen over distance.  Also, the tank's tracks catch shots, yielding no "actual" damage as well.  You absolutely could have hit a few times on the curve of the armor as well.  Your battle count is low, so I will also mention that you can get the whole outline of a tank by mousing over part of the tank you have line-of-sight to, but most of the tank could still be obscured by a building or dead tank, etc.  So, seeing the whole outline seems to indicate the tank is completely open to you, but, it isn't.

 

Der BrunchWagon takes a little learning to use.  It is a fine heavy tank if it is not your FIRST heavy tank.  If it is your first, keep at it.  It exists in this game as designed by WG to make getting to the Tiger frustrating.

 

Keep at the game, it is rewarding in the long run as you learn more and more.

 

Yes the DW here is not the one we have in Blitz which is a nice little gem.

Despite my issues in it, I have managed to get the WR over 50% in it.

 



Slayer_Jesse #9 Posted Nov 15 2017 - 01:52

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View PostEricmopar, on Nov 14 2017 - 19:35, said:

Hmmmm I couldn't tell you the range, although I saw some gun specs after the match that confirmed that L60's performance drops off a lot with range.

Thanks for the replies.

 

Question: Doesn't that replay only work on the very last battle played?

And, I know where the link is in the game files, but not how to upload it.

I used the replay function for the first time the other day, to confirm I wasn't going nuts about some other aim and firing thing. In that case I had a green gun marker indicating I could pen, but didn't then either. In that case the tank was in the open with no scenery items etc in between me and them.
I should add, my DW2 crew is still in the 80% range as well.

 

According to the "firepower" tab I'm supposed to be down to about 2.3 second aim time, but It's actually closer to 3.5 - 4 seconds for that too. (something else I checked with the replay now that I think of it) It seemed long and was.

 

 

 

Check your settings, there's an option for "Record only last battle" and record all. I think last battle is default.

 

Upload replays here: http://wotreplays.eu/

 

listed aim time is only for the aim circle to shrink to 2/3rds, iirc. Low crew skill will definitely make it take longer.

 

 

 



WeSayNotToday #10 Posted Nov 15 2017 - 04:43

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View PostEricmopar, on Nov 15 2017 - 01:46, said:

 

Yes the DW here is not the one we have in Blitz which is a nice little gem.

Despite my issues in it, I have managed to get the WR over 50% in it.

 

 

You might really enjoy the next tank in that line, the VK30.01 H.

CCCP_GDR #11 Posted Nov 15 2017 - 07:03

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                                                                      CAN'T PEN?

 

                                                                         :popcorn:

 

                                                                      USE PENCIL!



Ericmopar #12 Posted Nov 15 2017 - 08:28

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View PostCCCP_GDR, on Nov 14 2017 - 22:03, said:

                                                                      CAN'T PEN?

 

                                                                         :popcorn:

 

                                                                      USE PENCIL!

 

:D

BurglarOfBanff_ff #13 Posted Nov 15 2017 - 15:44

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The tragedy of PD (Penetration Dysfunction).  It may be embarrassing, but help is available.

MacDaddyMatty #14 Posted Nov 15 2017 - 15:54

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OP:

https://tanks.gg/tank/m4/model



Markd73 #15 Posted Nov 15 2017 - 16:21

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View Postgalspanic, on Nov 15 2017 - 00:20, said:

Let's see a replay.  Why does everyone post topics saying "OMG Why did this happen?!" and then not show us what happened?

 

1) They don't know about replays or how to post them on the forum

2) They forgot

3) They are not interested in having people disagree with them, and a replay provides the opportunity for others to disagree with them.

 

Could be any of the above. I try and give people the benefit of the doubt and think it is option 1 or 2. 

 

Although there are a number of semi-regular forum posters who are definitely option 3.

 






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