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Tier 8 Match Making


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Carl #21 Posted Dec 18 2017 - 15:51

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View PostKomitadjie, on Dec 18 2017 - 14:45, said:

I've heard nothing about that, myself... As far as I know, it's "random" with a preference for 3/5/7s, based around what's in the queue at the time. That just tends to mean 8s get the shaft pretty often.

 

Block Quote

 

  • The matchmaker will try to randomize your position on the team. As if you were at the bottom several times, the MM will put you at the top or at the middle.
  •  

 

 

Thats from the current wiki page on MM. A completely random tier assignment within your MM bracket would result in equal amounts as top, middle and bottom. There was a more explicit statement but i can't find it right now. Too much info released through too many sources at the same time to easily sort through.



sergeantmine09 #22 Posted Dec 18 2017 - 15:52

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Nyaha! Got it. Here take a look, taken from the patch notes of 9.18:

 

  • Preference of placing a player at the top/middle of the team list, if they have already played several battles at the bottom of the team list.

 

As someone stated later in the post that I found this in, it doesn't guarantee a top tier, however after a certain amount of battles it will do it's best to make sure you're not bottom tier, whether that be top or mid tier. That makes sense. Not happy still, but it makes sense... END MY BOTTOM TIER SUFFERING (Don't know why it is staying bold, but whatever).



Carl #23 Posted Dec 18 2017 - 15:59

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View Postsergeantmine09, on Dec 18 2017 - 14:52, said:

Nyaha! Got it. Here take a look, taken from the patch notes of 9.18:

 

  • Preference of placing a player at the top/middle of the team list, if they have already played several battles at the bottom of the team list.

 

As someone stated later in the post that I found this in, it doesn't guarantee a top tier, however after a certain amount of battles it will do it's best to make sure you're not bottom tier, whether that be top or mid tier. That makes sense. Not happy still, but it makes sense... END MY BOTTOM TIER SUFFERING (Don't know why it is staying bold, but whatever).

 

 

Forum can be a little buggy about the bold. What i quoted above is more an extension of what you dug up btw. As it explicitly points out that it's supposed to help produce a random distribution. the problem is the T10 population is high enough that it's pulling so many T8's, (and T9's), into T10 matches that there aren't enough tanks to create enough T8 and T9 matches to give T8's enough mid/top tier games to make that work. And the dearth of T8 's for T8 top tier games is creating a situation where T7's have semi-preferential MM which results in T6's getting the same kind of issues T8 and T9 tanks face.



Markd73 #24 Posted Dec 18 2017 - 16:02

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View PostRumsweet, on Dec 18 2017 - 06:06, said:

I want to keep this fresh because the moment we stop saying that tier 8 mm is just absolutely horrendous, is the moment WG will try to slide this under the table because they know we all think it is just worse than ever and they want to try to forget about a very serious, and broken system that was put in place post 9.18.

WARGAMING: You guys need to tell us something. ANYTHING. You say mm is "in a good place"... and no... no its not. 99% of the population agrees with this. I watch streams, I watch youtube vids, I play the game myself on occasion. Would play more... but I cant. I simply cant. The 10th time in a row when I am bottom-tiered [edited]is when I call it. This is #1 primary complaint. We all need peace. At least tell us that you wont fix the issue so we can all move on to other things. Your silence is making it worse. We need an update.

I'd way rather have pre 9.18 even if it means I am the only tier 8 in an all tier 10 match 50% of the time. The short answer to this solution guys is change the template if you dont want to go back. 5/5/5 maybe. Anything. Just ******* FIX IT PLEASE! OR TELL US THAT THIS IS WHAT IT IS. Just tell us something.

 

Do you have any objective non-anecdotal evidence to back up this claim?



NeatoMan #25 Posted Dec 18 2017 - 18:28

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View PostKomitadjie, on Dec 18 2017 - 09:46, said:

They're probably thinking adding the other match types in there as well, at +1 and level tier, and calling those top tier as well.

Going by that criteria my tier 8 MM has been approximately

26% 0 tier (top tier or same tier)

24% -1 tier (1 tier below top tier)

50% -2 tier (2 tiers below top tier)

 

compared to my tier 4-7 MM which has been

25% 0 tier

40% -1 tier

35% -2 tier



Komitadjie #26 Posted Dec 18 2017 - 18:40

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View PostNeatoMan, on Dec 18 2017 - 18:28, said:

Going by that criteria my tier 8 MM has been approximately

26% 0 tier (top tier or same tier)

24% -1 tier (1 tier below top tier)

50% -2 tier (2 tiers below top tier)

 

compared to my tier 4-7 MM which has been

25% 0 tier

40% -1 tier

35% -2 tier

 

Hmm, still doesn't line up, then...  



boysenbeary #27 Posted Dec 18 2017 - 18:47

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Go back to 3-5 tier mm spreads OWO

Komitadjie #28 Posted Dec 18 2017 - 18:51

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View Postboysenbeary, on Dec 18 2017 - 18:47, said:

Go back to 3-5 tier mm spreads OWO

 

I actually liked the more varied play a bit better.  I could deal with the occasional really bad matchmaking (was sometimes funny as hell) for the better chance to see top tier, especially in my limited tanks.  The new MM feels kind of stale, and a perpetual series of kinda-crap games instead of the occasionally really bad one.



NeatoMan #29 Posted Dec 18 2017 - 19:16

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View PostKomitadjie, on Dec 18 2017 - 12:51, said:

I actually liked the more varied play a bit better.  I could deal with the occasional really bad matchmaking (was sometimes funny as hell) for the better chance to see top tier, especially in my limited tanks.  The new MM feels kind of stale, and a perpetual series of kinda-crap games instead of the occasionally really bad one.

So far for me the same tier battles have lead to more blowouts than either the 2 tier and 3 tier games.



Thomasguns #30 Posted Dec 18 2017 - 19:16

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 At tier VIII I mostly feel as if I’m there as fodder for the bigger tanks. Totally ineffective, and relegated to the roll of fodder. I will start playing again when it is fixed.  If it gets addressed at all I mean. Silence seems to be the order of the day.

NeatoMan #31 Posted Dec 18 2017 - 19:21

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View PostThomasguns, on Dec 18 2017 - 13:16, said:

 At tier VIII I mostly feel as if I’m there as fodder for the bigger tanks. Totally ineffective, and relegated to the roll of fodder. I will start playing again when it is fixed.  If it gets addressed at all I mean. Silence seems to be the order of the day.

I don't feel totally ineffective, but I am having a hell of a time winning in almost every single one of my Tier 8s. 



TankFullOfBourbon #32 Posted Dec 18 2017 - 19:23

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View Postda_Rock002, on Dec 18 2017 - 13:42, said:

 

 

It really sounds like your advice is for everyone to quit using all the tier8 tanks they are grinding through on their way to the top of a line, and to quit using tier8 tanks they enjoyed when they first got them, and to quit using tier8 premiums they bought because they looked enticing, and to quit playing the game when it f's you.    You have a point. 


 

Is tier 8 the only "short end of the shaft from MM"........   What happens if EVERYBODY quits playing EVERYTHING that MM f's them on? 

 

I think you missed the "or suck it up like the rest of us", buddy.

Komitadjie #33 Posted Dec 18 2017 - 19:53

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View PostThomasguns, on Dec 18 2017 - 19:16, said:

 At tier VIII I mostly feel as if I’m there as fodder for the bigger tanks. Totally ineffective, and relegated to the roll of fodder. I will start playing again when it is fixed.  If it gets addressed at all I mean. Silence seems to be the order of the day.

 

I'm definitely not totally ineffective, but I'm not good enough to hold up a falling team from bottom tier.  Sometimes, sometimes as top tier I can, though.



Mikosah #34 Posted Dec 18 2017 - 20:27

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The MM wouldn't matter nearly as much if penetration wasn't such a fundamental balancing point. Or better yet, if this issue wasn't even further skewed by bugs features like excessive RNG or code 22. If the typical expectation was that most tanks two tiers higher can be frontally penetrated reliably without the help of code 22, then being bottom tier wouldn't be a liability. 

 

Well, I take that back. When your team blows and you have to carry, you'll still wish to be top tier. But there's a solution for that problem as well. And that's to award earnings strictly on the basis of individual performance rather than the team's outcome. 



Komitadjie #35 Posted Dec 18 2017 - 20:34

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View PostMikosah, on Dec 18 2017 - 20:27, said:

 And that's to award earnings strictly on the basis of individual performance rather than the team's outcome. 

 

If only! 



Cannonitus #36 Posted Dec 18 2017 - 20:34

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I feel like the power creep alone has made high tier games brutal to VIIIs. I remember VII used to be the worst. I say switch to +1 instead of +2 at tier VIII. I've played casually, off and on since beta and I'm seeing some tier VIIIs that no longer have any business in matches with Xs.

Prosqtor #37 Posted Dec 18 2017 - 20:37

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Open up grand battles to tier IX and the MM problem is solved. 

Joe150 #38 Posted Dec 18 2017 - 20:42

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I sold my all my VIIIs except the Lorr and t 34 100 and the only reason I kept them is because they cant be bought back as readily.

  I also sold my 30B becuase no matter how good I do in it it's a loss.I'll keep my obj 140 for CWs skirmishes etc wont be running it in pubs becuase the MM is terrible post 9.18.

   Any tier but VIII and X seem to be fine.I don't know why tier X is the way it is now maybe guys that were bad in VIIIs are tired of being bottom tier and there just saying screw it its the only way to be top tier I don't  know don't  care anymore not bothering with those tiers anymore until things get better but chances are it won't. 



Crimson_Saber #39 Posted Dec 19 2017 - 05:14

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My theory to the mass of bottom tier matches for tier VIII is the massive tier VIII population. These latest loot boxes awarding tier VIII premiums along with the advent calendar will only increse tier VIII bottom tier MM imo. 

NeatoMan #40 Posted Dec 19 2017 - 07:25

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View PostCrimson_Saber, on Dec 18 2017 - 23:14, said:

My theory to the mass of bottom tier matches for tier VIII is the massive tier VIII population. These latest loot boxes awarding tier VIII premiums along with the advent calendar will only increse tier VIII bottom tier MM imo. 

and it's made tier 8 no better than the newb tiers.   Tier 8 gameplay is in the sewer, and unless you are playing a carry tank, you're going right down the drain with them.  I was looking forward to playing the swedish TDs, but being so team dependent in this era of zero team work makes them unbearable to play.  Shoot, fall back, shoot, fall back until you are sitting with arty.  At least they have the sense to go drown when the enemy is upon them.  I have this crazy idea that i might be able to do something about it.

 

If I was wearing tinfoil I'd swear that once I got within 20k xp of the tier 9 strv, they kept making me lose in a vain attempt to get me to spend money to skip the gawdawfulness that is tier 8.  Being the idiot that I am, I refused and played right through it to the tune of sub 40% win rates

 

I'm going back to my czech autoloader mediums.  At least they can do something about the festering pile of dung filling up tier 8 right now.  It's today's meta; might as well not fight it.


Edited by NeatoMan, Dec 19 2017 - 07:31.





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