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Why does this game have soooo many unbalanced battles?


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Jer1413 #21 Posted Jan 06 2018 - 02:35

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View Postdunahee2, on Jan 05 2018 - 01:13, said:

I've been playing my Rheinmetall Skorpin G today - 10 battles 

1 battle at tier 8 - 0 wins - 1 lost

3 battles at tier 9  - 1 win - 2 lost

6 battles at tier 10 - 2 wins - 4 lost

Granted I'm not the best player but seriously?  3 wins out of 10 and most were so one sided. This game is getting so frustrating to play!  Bottom line I guess I pay good money to lose at WOT! 

 

 

So, if teams were skill-balanced in some way, would you never see a 3-7 record? Every 10 game string would be 5-5? Would you complain if you went 7-3?

 



Son_of_the_South #22 Posted Jan 06 2018 - 14:56

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View Postdunahee2, on Jan 04 2018 - 20:13, said:

I've been playing my Rheinmetall Skorpin G today - 10 battles 

1 battle at tier 8 - 0 wins - 1 lost

3 battles at tier 9  - 1 win - 2 lost

6 battles at tier 10 - 2 wins - 4 lost

Granted I'm not the best player but seriously?  3 wins out of 10 and most were so one sided. This game is getting so frustrating to play!  Bottom line I guess I pay good money to lose at WOT! 

 

​They don't balance skill. In fact, they don't really balance anything. They feed the red to the purple. It keeps the purple happy because their matches are easy. Put purples against purples and their will be a mass exodus of purple because they aren't good anymore.

Son_of_the_South #23 Posted Jan 06 2018 - 14:57

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View PostF_Type, on Jan 04 2018 - 20:19, said:

It's working as intended. A real MM would require everyone to sit in queue for a few more seconds allowing the MM to balance the teams but no one has time for that! 

 

I have time for it. I would be willing to wait on a skill based mm.

ChzBrgr1 #24 Posted Jan 06 2018 - 15:28

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Blowouts come from dummies going to dump places over and over again. Like lakeville valley and the beach on overlord. Or heavies back camping. And on and on.

Reaper225 #25 Posted Aug 30 2018 - 02:47

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I quit playing because of the poor MM for a year. Lately... after time and time again, being on teams that get blown out by the other team. I see that MM, hasn't improved and seems to have gotten worse. I like this game, but I am already tired of this constantly terrible team match ups. Thinking I am going to have to go back to Armored Warfare or War Thunder.

Rumbaugh #26 Posted Aug 30 2018 - 04:20

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I agree. I play for several hours a night and many times that day I'm at 30% or less. I've had whole weekends avg that. Fridays are the worse. The more players on the more chance of having bad teams or making mistakes. A few more seconds wait wouldn't be a problem. If you don't have the patience then you're the tank that's probably done quickly.  I can tell pretty soon which way a match is going to end. I've only been surprised a couple of times. I also play World of Warships. 0-3 kills losses rarely if ever happen. A lot of the problem with WoTs is the maps. They are too small in many cases. The view system is worse in WoTs also. You can see and shoot at tanks farther than you should be. (ie: Province,ugh) Especially when they chose to put tier x tanks on maps that used to just be <V. This is why the Frontline mode was so popular. The other thing is with WoTs having so many players you get a wide variety of ages. The younger the age the likelihood you want things quick and easy. A problem many games have to deal with. They have a older base but want to attract the younger player so changes are made that make the older players unhappy.

Reaper225 #27 Posted Oct 01 2018 - 03:43

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Wasn't going to bad as far as teams, but the last couple of weeks it seems like there are more stacked teams like before. Today I played maybe 15-20 games I think (don't quote me) but maybe only won 2-3 game. Most were blow out losses to the other teams. If MM was making teams fair, there would not be that many blow out losses. Usually when this starts happening I just quit playing for the day, because it usually doesn't change. I know several others that have the same issues and they just quit for the day also.

AZandEL #28 Posted Oct 01 2018 - 22:40

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View Postdunahee2, on Jan 05 2018 - 01:13, said:

I've been playing my Rheinmetall Skorpin G today - 10 battles 

1 battle at tier 8 - 0 wins - 1 lost

3 battles at tier 9  - 1 win - 2 lost

6 battles at tier 10 - 2 wins - 4 lost

Granted I'm not the best player but seriously?  3 wins out of 10 and most were so one sided. This game is getting so frustrating to play!  Bottom line I guess I pay good money to lose at WOT! 

 

Assuming you are talking public battles, then Its because of the way the game is currently setup. Some call it meta. Combination of things; high tiers on micromaps, corridor maps that make lights/TDs/arty useless, lack of cover, TD view range nerf 2 years ago, power/armor/speed creeped tanks, etc has resulted in lots of 2 min coin flip games, while a few years ago games almost always went 10 minutes. If your team goes down 2 right away and then 4 its typically unrecoverable barring some heroic play and even then if there are only say 3-4 fighting hard but its say 4v9 its usually over. Also at certain times of day its simply toxic - right after school lets out and any 3x+ or giveaway weekend - lots of yoloing. Finally at least for me the worst part of the game is grinding out a new tank to get it maxed out - especially with inexperienced crew. Almost all tanks suck until they get maxed out. Save yourself some grief and pay the gold to train up at least the commander and gunner when moving them to new tank (not a problem in your prem of course) and play the tanks you have already buffed and enjoy/are best at.

Reaper225 #29 Posted Oct 03 2018 - 03:01

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5 battles and 4 lost by an overwhelming loss to the other team, so far tonight.

Anublister #30 Posted Oct 03 2018 - 03:10

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View PostF_Type, on Jan 05 2018 - 01:19, said:

It's working as intended. A real MM would require everyone to sit in queue for a few more seconds allowing the MM to balance the teams but no one has time for that! 

 

But they have time for a blowout?

Anublister #31 Posted Oct 03 2018 - 03:49

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View PostDa_Craw, on Jan 05 2018 - 01:36, said:

 

Maybe it is what keeps people coming back.  It kept me coming back over 20,000 times.  It kept YOU coming back over 30,000 times.  The matches ARE balanced, just not in the way YOU want.  A lot of people DON'T want the matches skewed in favor of poor players.  Why shouldn't the better players get the benefit of being better?  I'm barely over the Mason-Dixon line myself, I don't want to have to carry the OP every battle. 

 

True balance wouldn't skew anything. You obviously haven't thought this through. A good TRY at balancing would be to have the basic match set up, then juggle the skilled players based on some system (xvm color works fine). You balance the colors so no team has more than +-1 edge for any color group of players. Excluding platoons. Not for anything other than Random battles. It's not that hard to do, a child could balance it. And it wouldn't take more than a second. This would place an approximate number of skilled players against each other. Any red player would only have to think he had to beat one other red player to make a positive difference. Greens would be challenged by an equal number of greens. Of course the lower skilled players would drop first as usual, but their would be no more massively unbalanced battles and everyone would have the satisfaction of feeling they had an equal chance at winning. Any skilled player in favor of the old system is just advocating massively unfair battles for no justifiable reason. Are you a "good" player for beating up a bunch of kindergartners? Are you a bad player for being the best player on the losing side? Why does WG balance the teams in other ways? Tank types, limited arty, tier? Why even do that if you want a random battle? Let's have all the tiers mixed 1-10. That would be fair right? Those tier 10 tankers earned their tanks over a long grind. Why shouldn't they just roll over the tier 1 tanks, invincible. It's not hard to figure out. It wouldn't be fun. So WG I challenge you to DO SOMETHING about this. 

Anublister #32 Posted Oct 03 2018 - 03:58

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View PostAZandEL, on Oct 01 2018 - 21:40, said:

 

Assuming you are talking public battles, then Its because of the way the game is currently setup. Some call it meta. Combination of things; high tiers on micromaps, corridor maps that make lights/TDs/arty useless, lack of cover, TD view range nerf 2 years ago, power/armor/speed creeped tanks, etc has resulted in lots of 2 min coin flip games, while a few years ago games almost always went 10 minutes. If your team goes down 2 right away and then 4 its typically unrecoverable barring some heroic play and even then if there are only say 3-4 fighting hard but its say 4v9 its usually over. Also at certain times of day its simply toxic - right after school lets out and any 3x+ or giveaway weekend - lots of yoloing. Finally at least for me the worst part of the game is grinding out a new tank to get it maxed out - especially with inexperienced crew. Almost all tanks suck until they get maxed out. Save yourself some grief and pay the gold to train up at least the commander and gunner when moving them to new tank (not a problem in your prem of course) and play the tanks you have already buffed and enjoy/are best at.

 

Your off track here. This game has been around long enough for poor skilled players to grind to tier 10. They still have atrocious hit/pen rates. They still seem lost on the maps or seem to enjoy either turtling or waltzing in the field. They have poor crew skills and poor choices of equipment. They don't know which type of ammo is appropriate for a given opponent and don't know where to aim. That's fine, IF you can match them up with someone on the other side close to their skill level. There's no need to pile them all together on the same team and offer them up as snacks to the other team. It isn't a challenge to outmaneuver an opponent that you know can't come close to matching you in skill. Ever hear of the special Olympics? Why shouldn't they compete with the regular crowd? Do you think that would be fair? I'm not saying you put them in their own server, but if that was done it would make it more fair for them. The best solution is to try what I advocated in my previous post. It's at least a try to salvage something that I argue most players would agree is the fairest option.

FunkyMonkey911 #33 Posted Oct 03 2018 - 06:14

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Wow, wow, WOW!  How can SBMM change anything? I have run XVM off and on for several years and the one thing holds true ALWAYS: Positioning and pushing vs defending wins battles.  I have seen way too many times losing battles badly with an 80% chance to win and stomping wins with less that 10% chance to win.  Even bad players can get it right from time to time and push a flank at the right time.  I have seen unicum platoons get run over by a noob rush.  Every thing in this game is by chance and you have a choice to go 1 or 9 line and the enemy the same, sometimes you chose the right flank and push through easily and other times you get smacked in the face.  Does not matter the W8 of the players on the other side. 

FearTheBadger #34 Posted Oct 03 2018 - 15:28

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This is what support told me in short how it works.

Matchmaker assembles teams based on tank class, tier, and role. Victories and defeats are the results of each players' individual contributions in a battle. So in a battle you'll be teamed up and fight against players of various skill sets; some better, some worse, some almost the same as you. 

 

That being said it doesn't ensure a fair balance of good, average and bad players, also you need to include new players into the mix.

 

View PostDa_Craw, on Jan 05 2018 - 02:36, said:

 

Maybe it is what keeps people coming back.  It kept me coming back over 20,000 times.  It kept YOU coming back over 30,000 times.  The matches ARE balanced, just not in the way YOU want.  A lot of people DON'T want the matches skewed in favor of poor players.  Why shouldn't the better players get the benefit of being better?  I'm barely over the Mason-Dixon line myself, I don't want to have to carry the OP every battle. 

 

Matches are far from being balanced and my reply  to your comment is "why should you get that benefit" as a good player.  Bad and average players want to get better, so do good players.  Good player's  who continually get as you say benefit from being better should be challenged by playing opponents that are equal to their skill or better.  Remember you the good player can be considered a bad player in someone else's eyes. 

 

No bad or average player wants the matchmaker to favor them just balance the teams.   That way everyone gets a chance to succeed.


Edited by FearTheBadger, Oct 03 2018 - 15:30.


FrDashing #35 Posted Oct 03 2018 - 16:23

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Just a fact: Nothing is fair in war!

If you can't handle the heat of battle, feel free to leave.



FearTheBadger #36 Posted Oct 03 2018 - 16:50

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your right nothing is fair in War and there is no matchmaking in War.  But this is a game.  You will have opinions from both sides those that want the status quo and those that want change.  Matchmaking is broken even war gaming has admitted that.

 

please read this bulletin https://worldoftanks...tchmaking-0718/

 

you will find their comment on the state of matchmaking in general. 

Face it at the end of the day  who will war gaming listen to or will they even listen to anyone

 

Now to answer you comment "WG Please add more French vehicles to the game!"  Do we really need more French Tanks, I think we should add more Soviet Tanks.  We could always more of those ... :)



Stonecoldelf #37 Posted Oct 05 2018 - 19:10

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Pay to Play Bottom Tier. Tier 8 Match Making is so broken. It isn't even worth while to play let alone buy tier 8 premiums. Until they fix the Match Maker stick to tier 6 premium grinding. As always, do not buy WG products/services until the match maker is fixed. #walletclosed

Stonecoldelf #38 Posted Oct 06 2018 - 18:39

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View PostSon_of_the_South, on Jan 06 2018 - 13:56, said:

 

​They don't balance skill. In fact, they don't really balance anything. They feed the red to the purple. It keeps the purple happy because their matches are easy. Put purples against purples and their will be a mass exodus of purple because they aren't good anymore.

 

THIS IS SO TRUE. Keep those unicums happy and streaming.

Reaper225 #39 Posted Oct 26 2018 - 00:25

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I am so tired of these crap MM games, just been yoloing since it doesn't matter and teams lose most of the time. Going back to playing Warthunder and Armored Warfare. Heck might even uninstall this game, so fed up with it!



EmperorJuliusCaesar #40 Posted Oct 29 2018 - 08:11

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View PostAnublister, on Oct 03 2018 - 09:49, said:

View PostDa_Craw, on Jan 05 2018 - 01:36, said:

 

Maybe it is what keeps people coming back.  It kept me coming back over 20,000 times.  It kept YOU coming back over 30,000 times.  The matches ARE balanced, just not in the way YOU want.  A lot of people DON'T want the matches skewed in favor of poor players.  Why shouldn't the better players get the benefit of being better?  I'm barely over the Mason-Dixon line myself, I don't want to have to carry the OP every battle. 

 

True balance wouldn't skew anything. You obviously haven't thought this through. A good TRY at balancing would be to have the basic match set up, then juggle the skilled players based on some system (xvm color works fine). You balance the colors so no team has more than +-1 edge for any color group of players. Excluding platoons. Not for anything other than Random battles. It's not that hard to do, a child could balance it. And it wouldn't take more than a second. This would place an approximate number of skilled players against each other. Any red player would only have to think he had to beat one other red player to make a positive difference. Greens would be challenged by an equal number of greens. Of course the lower skilled players would drop first as usual, but their would be no more massively unbalanced battles and everyone would have the satisfaction of feeling they had an equal chance at winning. Any skilled player in favor of the old system is just advocating massively unfair battles for no justifiable reason. Are you a "good" player for beating up a bunch of kindergartners? Are you a bad player for being the best player on the losing side? Why does WG balance the teams in other ways? Tank types, limited arty, tier? Why even do that if you want a random battle? Let's have all the tiers mixed 1-10. That would be fair right? Those tier 10 tankers earned their tanks over a long grind. Why shouldn't they just roll over the tier 1 tanks, invincible. It's not hard to figure out. It wouldn't be fun. So WG I challenge you to DO SOMETHING about this. 

 

Many "good" players don't want to fight other "good" players.  Watch them in battles, I did, thinking I could learn something from them, but all to often I see them literally go to where they think the other good players won't be or even leave a flank if a good player in on the same flank on the opposing team.






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