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match maker rigged skill cheating mods win rate illegal

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Capt_Hans_Yolo #1 Posted Jan 15 2018 - 22:26

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There's something funny going on with Match Maker.

Most of you already realize this.  If you read through the forums you'll notice requests by players for Match Maker to take skill into account when building teams.  These requests go back years.

I submit Match Maker already does this.  That Match Maker is already incorporating skill in it algorisms, and that this is EXACTLY the problem.  Specifically, it is not designed to make balanced teams.  It is designed to encourage players to engage in micro transactions.

EA had to make changes to several of their games after getting caught designing their algorithms so certain players would lose.  Their marketing research indicated that some players who were losing (and sometimes soundly) were more likely to make in game purchases so they could compete.  Hmmm...  Ever notice all the red on only one team?  Why so many four-minute matches?  I submit; this isn't a Match Maker flaw, this is Match Maker working as intended.

Skill of an individual player should never, in any form, be a factor in Match Maker.  A Match Maker algorism that will vary it's result so players will have "win-rates as close to 50% as possible" is good cover for such a fleecing technique.

But without actually seeing the algorism itself how can you detect this?  Is it possible to measure such as thing?

Perhaps there are better methods then the one I chose, but if Match Maker is fair then this should be apparent in Tier assignments players see on the teams they play.  Every one in the game should see roughly the same results over time.  Let's say within 10% for each tier.  So I started maintaining a record.  After a few hundred matches the numbers seemed really off, but if other players got similar results...  So I had a record, BIG DEAL.  Who else is a big enough nerd to keep a record like this?  Streamers!  On-line streamers usually keep their broadcast recordings available on-line to increase traffic to their channels.  Hundred, and hundreds, and hundreds of games. Yeah his win-rate is wildly different from mine but so what, Tier assignments should be roughly similar.  Let's call our hero streamer Mr. Q (I like Q from the Bond movies).  Here are the recorded results:

Mr. Q with a win-rate of 62% had;

     Top Tier 45%,   Middle Tier 34%,   Bottom Tier 21%

Myself with a win-rate of 49% had;

     Top Tier 15%,   Middle Tier 25%,   Bottom Tier 60%

It becomes transparent here that something untoward is happening.

But hey, if pressing buttons, watching the pretty screen change, and hearing boom, boob, BOOM is fun for you then all this doesn't matter at all to you.

As for me... Can you say "Uninstall"?

Plenty of other online game these days.  After over 40K matches this one has had it's run.


 

P.S. there could be some explanation here why War Gaming doesn't seem to take cheating and using illegal mods very seriously.  These may actually help the occurrence of micro transactions.


 


 



F_Type #2 Posted Jan 15 2018 - 22:29

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Yes MM is extremely terrible but are your results based off the same tier? 

Nudnick #3 Posted Jan 15 2018 - 22:32

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They're a business first and foremost. The game is designed to make money.

__WarChild__ #4 Posted Jan 15 2018 - 22:40

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The MM sucks for me and has for some time now.  Even though Wargaming gives me 45% automatic losses, I still enjoy the game and have fun.  If you let go of caring about winrates, this game is a lot of fun.  I've had fun since I started.

_Michael_Corleone_ #5 Posted Jan 15 2018 - 22:44

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One of a million threads about this :rolleyes:

 

It does nothing, please stop making these threads talking about tier placement 


Edited by Al_Scarface_Capone_, Jan 15 2018 - 22:44.


Tahllol #6 Posted Jan 15 2018 - 23:18

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View PostNudnick, on Jan 15 2018 - 22:32, said:

They're a business first and foremost. The game is designed to make money.

 

Yet, they would make more by fixing the broken MM system instead of rigging it for their friends and employees.

Lesser_Spotted_Panzer #7 Posted Jan 15 2018 - 23:19

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Wait, let me grab my popcorn.....

cloudwalkr #8 Posted Jan 15 2018 - 23:30

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View Post__WarChild__, on Jan 15 2018 - 22:40, said:

The MM sucks for me and has for some time now.  Even though Wargaming gives me 45% automatic losses, I still enjoy the game and have fun.  If you let go of caring about winrates, this game is a lot of fun.  I've had fun since I started.

 

bud, if you're running with chance to win on...please turn that off.  I'd honestly just uninstall XVM, personally.  It took about a week before it felt normal not seeing colors everywhere but now I go into a battle and just play my game.  It's much more enjoyable.

cloudwalkr #9 Posted Jan 15 2018 - 23:39

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View PostTahllol, on Jan 15 2018 - 23:18, said:

 

Yet, they would make more by fixing the broken MM system instead of rigging it for their friends and employees.

 

Again, why do people that actually believe this crap stick around?  You're insane if you feel it's truly rigged (IN ANY WAY) and stick around.  I think you just want to complain and blame anything but the user.

Eleven_Hotel #10 Posted Jan 16 2018 - 00:10

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Get used to it.

 

My win rate 52%

 

Top tier  10%

Middle Tier 11%

Bottom Tier 79%

400o Battle sample

 

A true soldier adapts to his/her situation.



n00bfarmer #11 Posted Jan 16 2018 - 00:16

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It does seem to put you in sessions where you either win a lot more than your average and sessions where you lose a lot more than your average. It produces an up and down curve in your w/r if you look at it in batches of 100 battles or so. Truly random wouldn't produces alternating up and down swings like that. Skill still matters because if you will lose less and win more but the game will still give the up and down sessions for all. Why do they do this? When it gives you good sessions, you will be encouraged to spend more money on the game. The bad sessions are there because everyone has to take their turn in the "crappy mm pool" so that others can have their turn being "heros".

Edited by n00bfarmer, Jan 16 2018 - 00:17.


Liberty75 #12 Posted Jan 18 2018 - 21:33

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View PostCapt_Hans_Yolo, on Jan 15 2018 - 16:26, said:

There's something funny going on with Match Maker.

Most of you already realize this.  If you read through the forums you'll notice requests by players for Match Maker to take skill into account when building teams.  These requests go back years.

I submit Match Maker already does this.  That Match Maker is already incorporating skill in it algorisms, and that this is EXACTLY the problem.  Specifically, it is not designed to make balanced teams.  It is designed to encourage players to engage in micro transactions.

EA had to make changes to several of their games after getting caught designing their algorithms so certain players would lose.  Their marketing research indicated that some players who were losing (and sometimes soundly) were more likely to make in game purchases so they could compete.  Hmmm...  Ever notice all the red on only one team?  Why so many four-minute matches?  I submit; this isn't a Match Maker flaw, this is Match Maker working as intended.

Skill of an individual player should never, in any form, be a factor in Match Maker.  A Match Maker algorism that will vary it's result so players will have "win-rates as close to 50% as possible" is good cover for such a fleecing technique.

But without actually seeing the algorism itself how can you detect this?  Is it possible to measure such as thing?

Perhaps there are better methods then the one I chose, but if Match Maker is fair then this should be apparent in Tier assignments players see on the teams they play.  Every one in the game should see roughly the same results over time.  Let's say within 10% for each tier.  So I started maintaining a record.  After a few hundred matches the numbers seemed really off, but if other players got similar results...  So I had a record, BIG DEAL.  Who else is a big enough nerd to keep a record like this?  Streamers!  On-line streamers usually keep their broadcast recordings available on-line to increase traffic to their channels.  Hundred, and hundreds, and hundreds of games. Yeah his win-rate is wildly different from mine but so what, Tier assignments should be roughly similar.  Let's call our hero streamer Mr. Q (I like Q from the Bond movies).  Here are the recorded results:

Mr. Q with a win-rate of 62% had;

     Top Tier 45%,   Middle Tier 34%,   Bottom Tier 21%

Myself with a win-rate of 49% had;

     Top Tier 15%,   Middle Tier 25%,   Bottom Tier 60%

It becomes transparent here that something untoward is happening.

But hey, if pressing buttons, watching the pretty screen change, and hearing boom, boob, BOOM is fun for you then all this doesn't matter at all to you.

As for me... Can you say "Uninstall"?

Plenty of other online game these days.  After over 40K matches this one has had it's run.


 

P.S. there could be some explanation here why War Gaming doesn't seem to take cheating and using illegal mods very seriously.  These may actually help the occurrence of micro transactions.


 


 

 

Some guy on the EU forums pulled up the MM patent and it did include player skill in it. Now whether or not they actually implemented is unknown.

AJABOOBOO #13 Posted Mar 01 2018 - 05:16

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game is rigged pure and simple.

enough said



GeorgePreddy #14 Posted Mar 01 2018 - 05:27

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ZipperDown #15 Posted Mar 02 2018 - 10:28

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View Postcloudwalkr, on Jan 15 2018 - 23:30, said:

 

bud, if you're running with chance to win on...please turn that off.  I'd honestly just uninstall XVM, personally.  It took about a week before it felt normal not seeing colors everywhere but now I go into a battle and just play my game.  It's much more enjoyable.

 

NOTICE HOW ALL THE BEST PLAYERS IN THE GAME ALWAYS COME TO THESE POST TO SAY NO MM ISNT RIGGED. ITS RIGGED IN THERE FAVOR SO THEY DONT WANT THAT TO CHANGE . AND THEY WANT XVM TO BE REMOVED OR TURNED OFF SO YOU CANT SEE ALL THE PURPLE TOP CLANNERS VS THE REDS AND YELLOWS 9 OUT OF TEN GAMES. THAT IS THE REASON FOR BLOWOUTS SO MUCH. IF MM IS TREATING ALL OF US THE SAME HOW COME THE TOP CLANNERS NEVER FACE EACH OTHER IN RANDOMS . GO CHECK THE TOP 50 CLANS THEN LOAD IN A FEW HIGH TIER GAMES SEE HOW ALL OF THEM END UP STACKED ON THE SAME DAM TEAM EVERY GAME. ITS A JOKE AND ITS TRUE AND YOU GUYS ARE THE LOWEST FROM OF LIFE FOR LETTING IT GO ON FOR AS LONG AS IT HAS. NO WONDER NA NEVER MAKES THE FINALS EVER.

cloudwalkr #16 Posted Mar 04 2018 - 01:43

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View PostZipperDown, on Mar 02 2018 - 10:28, said:

 

NOTICE HOW ALL THE BEST PLAYERS IN THE GAME ALWAYS COME TO THESE POST TO SAY NO MM ISNT RIGGED. ITS RIGGED IN THERE FAVOR SO THEY DONT WANT THAT TO CHANGE . AND THEY WANT XVM TO BE REMOVED OR TURNED OFF SO YOU CANT SEE ALL THE PURPLE TOP CLANNERS VS THE REDS AND YELLOWS 9 OUT OF TEN GAMES. THAT IS THE REASON FOR BLOWOUTS SO MUCH. IF MM IS TREATING ALL OF US THE SAME HOW COME THE TOP CLANNERS NEVER FACE EACH OTHER IN RANDOMS . GO CHECK THE TOP 50 CLANS THEN LOAD IN A FEW HIGH TIER GAMES SEE HOW ALL OF THEM END UP STACKED ON THE SAME DAM TEAM EVERY GAME. ITS A JOKE AND ITS TRUE AND YOU GUYS ARE THE LOWEST FROM OF LIFE FOR LETTING IT GO ON FOR AS LONG AS IT HAS. NO WONDER NA NEVER MAKES THE FINALS EVER.

 

the solid wall of caps and lack of even a second grade grammar level really instills faith that you know what you're talking about.

 

Here it is for you, nice and simple.  Nobody hands me wins, especially not WG.  Pull your head out of your neither regions and stop blaming outside sources.  

 

Anyway, we all know people like the one quoted here will never "own up" to it and actually try to improve.  Much easier to yell and scream like a 2yr old and blame anyone or anything besides user error.

 

edit:  and you're a combat officer in your clan...smh



FunkyMonkey911 #17 Posted Mar 06 2018 - 07:39

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View PostZipperDown, on Mar 02 2018 - 01:28, said:

 

NOTICE HOW ALL THE BEST PLAYERS IN THE GAME ALWAYS COME TO THESE POST TO SAY NO MM ISNT RIGGED. ITS RIGGED IN THERE FAVOR SO THEY DONT WANT THAT TO CHANGE . AND THEY WANT XVM TO BE REMOVED OR TURNED OFF SO YOU CANT SEE ALL THE PURPLE TOP CLANNERS VS THE REDS AND YELLOWS 9 OUT OF TEN GAMES. THAT IS THE REASON FOR BLOWOUTS SO MUCH. IF MM IS TREATING ALL OF US THE SAME HOW COME THE TOP CLANNERS NEVER FACE EACH OTHER IN RANDOMS . GO CHECK THE TOP 50 CLANS THEN LOAD IN A FEW HIGH TIER GAMES SEE HOW ALL OF THEM END UP STACKED ON THE SAME DAM TEAM EVERY GAME. ITS A JOKE AND ITS TRUE AND YOU GUYS ARE THE LOWEST FROM OF LIFE FOR LETTING IT GO ON FOR AS LONG AS IT HAS. NO WONDER NA NEVER MAKES THE FINALS EVER.

Not sure what you are seeing but I routinely see top clan members facing of in pubs, but most of the time they are not same tier. I enjoy going with them to help my side win and watch what they are doing to win and yes they are better players.



Quikzdraw #18 Posted Jul 01 2018 - 08:59

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:hiding:

 

 

 



Quikzdraw #19 Posted Jul 01 2018 - 09:02

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Another mocking response. At least tell them what tiers you play.You really don't know how match maker is in tiers 6-10.






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