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New Players. Win 8 is a lie.


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Guido1212 #41 Posted Feb 24 2018 - 14:48

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It's a metric that primarily tracks damage done.  It's a tool, nothing less.  Use your tools for the correct purpose and they will help you.  Complain that the tool is defective when it isn't, and that'll hurt you.

Kliphie #42 Posted Feb 24 2018 - 15:19

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View PostDaerlon, on Feb 24 2018 - 07:44, said:

+ for disabling the minimap to boost frame rates. More people should do this. It's just distracting you from seeing what's right in front of you, amirite?

 

That's brilliant!   

 

OP, grats on the nice game.  You evidently tied up a bunch of their team by getting hit in the face multiple times and allowed the rest of your team to farm them.  Well done.  

 

I noticed from your screenshot you're running the Spots messenger mod.  Please turn that crap off.

 

Also noticed from your game screenshots they were from the replay (the parentheses around the FPS give it away) so the part about you not having them enabled is a bit of a white lie.  


Edited by Kliphie, Feb 24 2018 - 15:35.


riot_evo #43 Posted Feb 24 2018 - 15:54

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Since I started actively monitoring my wn8, I've gone from light green to green, and my win rate has increased too.  

It's only recently I've started to try and get better. I had a crappy wn8 and win rate  (still crappy) but the more my wn8 goes up, as does my win rate- PR has gone up as well . 

The two are correlated.

 

Using wotinfo.net 



txtaxman #44 Posted Feb 24 2018 - 17:42

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View PostDaerlon, on Feb 24 2018 - 07:44, said:

+ for disabling the minimap to boost frame rates. More people should do this. It's just distracting you from seeing what's right in front of you, amirite?

 

Oooo, actually, I click it on and off :P

StiffWind #45 Posted Feb 24 2018 - 18:39

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View Post__WarChild__, on Feb 23 2018 - 23:58, said:

65% Player: "Win8 and Winrate are very important"

52% Player & Below: "Win8 and Winrate aren't important"

 

My questions are: Is matchmaking & rng the exact same for everyone?  If it's all bad, then it must all be exactly the same, right?  "Random" must mean it's exactly the same randomness for all I guess...  Otherwise, it's tin foil hat time.

 

In truth, I don't know and I don't really care what my winrate and/or win8 tells you about me.  I just know that I'm at Level 11 and moving higher in Ranked Battles and even though all my games now have Purple, Blue & Dark Green players in them, I continue to finish in the top 3 for damage & xp consistently.  That tells me all I need to know.

 

I hope whatever stat you find important is in your favor.

 

Happy Tanking!

 

__WarChild__

 

So many ignorant fallacies I wouldn't know where to start.

 



StiffWind #46 Posted Feb 24 2018 - 18:43

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View PostColonelHeinzGuderian, on Feb 24 2018 - 01:29, said:

Wrong forum, OP, you are talking to experienced players.  I don't know what "Win 8" is, but as for "wn8" I have found it to be accurate in predicting team wins and losses almost all the time.  Is it perfect?  Nope, everyone I know can point to that battle where the good guys (our team, i.e., the green team) had poor odds and won anyway.  Great.  Or the bad guys (the reds) had sucky odds but somehow crushed your 65% chances to win. 

 

But after tracking it for years, it predicts battle wins (as verified by me, over perhaps 5,000 or so battles), accurately about 90% of the time.

 

And for the quality of the player, well...it never said that it would be a perfect indicator of how you would play in a specific tank.  But it is a pretty good indicator of the general quality of your play, over time.  Argue all you like, purple players (via xvm) typically play pretty darn good.  Red players (typically) do not.  There can be variations, but as a tool, I find xvm immensely helpful in playing the game.  That is my experience.  

 

Good luck and happy tanking.

 

It could be what WoT uses to stack the teams...and thereby helping to create the correlation between WN8 and win rate.  Win rate = WN8 + MM?

 


Edited by StiffWind, Feb 24 2018 - 18:46.


riot_evo #47 Posted Feb 24 2018 - 19:00

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View PostStiffWind, on Feb 24 2018 - 18:39, said:

 

So many ignorant fallacies I wouldn't know where to start.

 

Yellow wn8. -average



txtaxman #48 Posted Feb 24 2018 - 19:50

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View PostKliphie, on Feb 24 2018 - 08:19, said:

 

That's brilliant!   

 

OP, grats on the nice game.  You evidently tied up a bunch of their team by getting hit in the face multiple times and allowed the rest of your team to farm them.  Well done.  

 

I noticed from your screenshot you're running the Spots messenger mod.  Please turn that crap off.

 

Also noticed from your game screenshots they were from the replay (the parentheses around the FPS give it away) so the part about you not having them enabled is a bit of a white lie.  

 

Knowing our community, would you make it readily available? I did use the term "may have" though... The mouse task is real and works exactly as stated. Works in live and Memorex. The cosplay fap lewds I'll leave to your imagination.... (Well spotted though!) 

 

Spot messenger isn't supposed to fire off on a heavy though. So irritating.

 

Again, this post is mainly for our newer players who catch flak for well, being new. They need to know that the toxicity is mainly due to folks worried too much about stats in general.

 

Do yourself a favor, disable messages from anyone but friends on your contact list, put on some good music and have fun. I've played a really long time before joining a clan or using higher tier tanks for Clan Wars or Strongholds. I put on my own music mix, disable ingame chat, and play sometimes for myself and sometimes for the team. I'm just as likely to track an ally for being an a55hat as I am to do spotting in a heavy because the scouts and meds are clueless. I do rant. I do rave. But I always have fun.

Oh, and I troll the forums and get warnings.  :B



Dirty_Camel #49 Posted Feb 25 2018 - 01:09

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View Posttxtaxman, on Feb 24 2018 - 08:11, said:

 

But I'm the n00b! How can a n00b p0wn the n00bs??? It is like dividing by zero. Just admit WN8 counts direct damage and that's it. Assuming you played a clan war or two, it is actually about teamplay. Direct damage is not a precursor to a win. The game is designed (although not often played) to be a team effort.

We had a 52% chance to win which is statistically dead even. 

But then again, the opinion of someone whose most played tank is an IS-6 and in which 40% of their 49,961 random battles are in only 10 tanks could probably teach me something about padding a stat or five...... So thank you! :medal:

Where do I begin......You didn't own noobs, your teammates owned the noobs while you tracked them. Now, if you tracked, damaged, tracked, damage..... that would have been owning them, but you didn't do that, because you didn't know how to. You were carried to a win by people who knew how to do damage. Any noob in a tank can sit there shooting someone in the track all day, there is about 3 grams of skill involved in that. Moving on, What does an is6 have to do with anything and 40% of my battles in t10 imply? Are you saying it is easier to statpad in T10's? Let me know the next time you find a non reroll like me with 40% of their battles in T10's. I'd be a unicum if I DIDN'T  play so many t10 battles.



Audie_L_Murphy #50 Posted Feb 25 2018 - 01:28

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I play scouts and scout in medium tanks.  This sometimes hurts WN8 because you don't shoot.  However, you can also get WN8 games of 10K plus in a scout.  It evens out.  WN8 is just a measuring stick not everything.  http://www.vbaddict.net/ has battle rating BR, WOT has the personal rating.  Win rate, average damage done etc.  All these can tell you have your doing over a period of time.

Edited by Audie_L_Murphy, Feb 25 2018 - 01:36.


txtaxman #51 Posted Feb 25 2018 - 03:30

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View PostDirty_Camel, on Feb 24 2018 - 18:09, said:

Where do I begin......You didn't own noobs, your teammates owned the noobs while you tracked them. Now, if you tracked, damaged, tracked, damage..... that would have been owning them, but you didn't do that, because you didn't know how to. You were carried to a win by people who knew how to do damage. Any noob in a tank can sit there shooting someone in the track all day, there is about 3 grams of skill involved in that. Moving on, What does an is6 have to do with anything and 40% of my battles in t10 imply? Are you saying it is easier to statpad in T10's? Let me know the next time you find a non reroll like me with 40% of their battles in T10's. I'd be a unicum if I DIDN'T  play so many t10 battles.

 

You are amazing! Reading is a skill. Reading critically is a MAJOR skill. 
https://www2.ed.gov/...ader/index.html

Dirty_Camel #52 Posted Feb 25 2018 - 06:09

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View Posttxtaxman, on Feb 25 2018 - 03:30, said:

 

You are amazing! Reading is a skill. Reading critically is a MAJOR skill. 
https://www2.ed.gov/...ader/index.html

 

^^^^^^This is like having a conversation with a Emu. :sceptic:

mworthy #53 Posted Feb 25 2018 - 06:18

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eh my opinion on wn8 still stands, i dont really see it as all that its just there so we can either feel smug about it or regret our life choices, doesnt really tell me how well players play tbh i would argue it shows how much we play

Pipinghot #54 Posted Feb 25 2018 - 15:45

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View Postmworthy, on Feb 25 2018 - 00:18, said:

eh my opinion on wn8 still stands

Well that's not surprising, it's not as if you're going to have an epiphany during a forum debate and suddenly understand how an "index stat" works and what it's supposed to accomplish. It's not a ladder ranking, it's an index stat that's intended to help you understand how to improve.



Pipinghot #55 Posted Feb 25 2018 - 15:47

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View PostStiffWind, on Feb 24 2018 - 12:43, said:

It could be what WoT uses to stack the teams...and thereby helping to create the correlation between WN8 and win rate.  Win rate = WN8 + MM?

It also "could be" that space aliens from the Planet Derp have hacked the MM and use the MM to make humans angry to evaluate their reactions. "It could be..." is not an argument, it's a conspiracy theory, and meaningless.

 

Aliens have not hacked the MM, and WoT does not use WN8 to stack the teams, that's what the real world looks like.


Edited by Pipinghot, Feb 25 2018 - 15:48.


VicRattlehead_ #56 Posted Feb 25 2018 - 16:22

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I dunno, low Wn8 players I see on my teams are usually bad, you know, the players who go valley on Lakeville, while the Blues and purples with the higher Wn8's usually are the ones killing everything and doing the heavy lifting.  No matter how ya slice it, the players who do more damage are usually the ones with the better stats and are the ones giving you the chance to win.

Al_Einstein #57 Posted Feb 25 2018 - 16:29

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They need to get rid of WN8 as it's as toxic as hell as all the uselesss [edited]that stat pad their figures to say they are any use instead of having the only figure that matters in the game which is win rate since it is a team game

 



ColonelHeinzGuderian #58 Posted Feb 26 2018 - 00:21

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View PostOmg_a_Squirrel, on Feb 25 2018 - 10:22, said:

I dunno, low Wn8 players I see on my teams are usually bad, you know, the players who go valley on Lakeville, while the Blues and purples with the higher Wn8's usually are the ones killing everything and doing the heavy lifting.  No matter how ya slice it, the players who do more damage are usually the ones with the better stats and are the ones giving you the chance to win.

 

This.  Exactly.  

HalfPastZulu #59 Posted Feb 26 2018 - 03:28

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View PostAndrewSledge, on Feb 23 2018 - 16:55, said:

With 20 shots fired and only 5 pens, you either need to aim better or use premium ammo when it's warranted. You basically acted as a scout tank; with 3600 assistance damage, you did help your team, but you could've done more.

As for WN8, everyone knows it isn't the be-all end-all of metrics, because it doesn't count assistance damage in its calculations. That doesn't mean it's a completely useless metric.

 

it is useless... and the only way folks get high win8 is by playing in a fashion that usually isnt good for the team overall but only caters to whatever the current formula for win8 is. Damage farming ect.

 

Being a good player IS NOT Quantifiable there are simply too many factors. High Win8 players often pass on doing actions good for the team but gain them no Win8 points. So they play for points as a first priority and winning as a second priority. Most of us ( The people these a$$hat$ call potatoe, tomatoe) play to win the game as our only priority.

 

Good players make bad moves and bad players get lucky now and then.



LovePrevails #60 Posted Feb 26 2018 - 10:25

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  WNX should always be examined in the context of average tier, WR, platoon ratio and tank selection. Discrepancies in WNX and WR are usually indicative of the damage farming you speak of, whereas high platoon ratios could hint at WR padding and so on. The metric was not designed or intended for use as a single, unified performance indicator. That is all.






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