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Best AR system in 7.62x51?


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Slacker #1 Posted Sep 03 2011 - 05:39

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What do you guys think is a good choice in terms of these rifles? I am looking for a gun for the range and deer hunting.

I was thinking this Panther arms and to just modify it for my purposes. So what do you think is the best AR platform in 7.62x51 for 2k or under?

Toasted_Rofls #2 Posted Sep 04 2011 - 04:20

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View PostSlacker, on Sep 03 2011 - 05:39, said:

What do you guys think is a good choice in terms of these rifles? I am looking for a gun for the range and deer hunting.

I was thinking this Panther arms and to just modify it for my purposes. So what do you think is the best AR platform in 7.62x51 for 2k or under?

I have no experience with a 7.62 AR, let me be honest. And your budget rules out the KAC offerings, which are widely regarded as the best 7.62 AR's on the market. However, I do have a suggestion I can make with confidence after looking into a 7.62 AR myself: Spend a little extra, and get one for LMT or Larue if possible. If you see one on sale, grab one.

On the other hand, do you think a AR style rifle might be overkill for deer hunting? I myself do not, nor have, hunted, so I am no expert, but I would think you would be better off with a nice bolt action and a good scope for the same cost. The 7.62 are was originally designed as a military rifle, then repurposed for sports shooters as well as to be a marksman rifle. It's more expensive than a bolt action, and weighs more to. As for having a AR for the range, a good 5.56 will coast half as much, have cheaper ammo and more parts, and generally be better. Not only that, it makes a good varmit rifle to, or so I've heard, as long as you get one with a good barrel.

Mechanize #3 Posted Sep 04 2011 - 04:57

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If you Want an AR-10 platform I'd recommend you go with someone like Bushmaster instead as you can still get one of their AR-10 models for under 2k, The difference being that unlike DPMS, They use higher quality mil spec materials such as 4150 barrels which are less prone to overheating under sustained fire and 7075-T6 Aluminum receivers which are much more durable.

Other choices you should look into are the M14, Galil AR, and FAL platforms, I've also Heard good things about the Scar-H but haven't gotten the chance to try one for myself.

BaronJaeger #4 Posted Sep 04 2011 - 05:31

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I always get a huge LOL when I see people out deer hunting with some hi-cap assault/tactical rifle :D  As far as that round goes-it's damned good for deer hunting-nice flat trajectory and can bust through some brush if it has too. I had a Remington 700 5R for awhile (quit rifle hunting-no challenge imo) and that thing was a tack driver. I've seen them lately for around $600 on up, depending on the goodies. Friend of mine just picked up a CETME in .308 pretty cheap (like $400) but personally I don't care for it-too heavy for hunting and not accurate enough. I've never fired the one OP showed, so I can't comment.

Toasted_Rofls #5 Posted Sep 04 2011 - 07:59

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View PostMechanize, on Sep 04 2011 - 04:57, said:

If you Want an AR-10 platform I'd recommend you go with someone like Bushmaster instead as you can still get one of their AR-10 models for under 2k, The difference being that unlike DPMS, They use higher quality mil spec materials such as 4150 barrels which are less prone to overheating under sustained fire and 7075-T6 Aluminum receivers which are much more durable.

Other choices you should look into are the M14, Galil AR, and FAL platforms, I've also Heard good things about the Scar-H but haven't gotten the chance to try one for myself.

Bushmaster? I haven't heard one good thing about there standard caliber AR's, so I wouldn't trust their higher caliber ones. However, I have no experience with Bushmaster rifles except for a old piston AR of theirs that I wasn't that impressed by, so once again, I cannot know for sure. However, during my AR research, I came to the conclusion Bushmaster was a bad brand. I spent a long time doing this, and I looked at many sources, and all I can say is that if someone offered me a basic Colt or a Bushmaster with a free Aimpoint, I'd take the Colt.

Krazny13 #6 Posted Sep 04 2011 - 22:09

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View PostToasted_Rofls, on Sep 04 2011 - 04:20, said:

I
On the other hand, do you think a AR style rifle might be overkill for deer hunting? I myself do not, nor have, hunted, so I am no expert, but I would think you would be better off with a nice bolt action and a good scope for the same cost. The 7.62 are was originally designed as a military rifle, then repurposed for sports shooters as well as to be a marksman rifle. It's more expensive than a bolt action, and weighs more to. As for having a AR for the range, a good 5.56 will coast half as much, have cheaper ammo and more parts, and generally be better. Not only that, it makes a good varmit rifle to, or so I've heard, as long as you get one with a good barrel.

View PostBaronJaeger, on Sep 04 2011 - 05:31, said:

I always get a huge LOL when I see people out deer hunting with some hi-cap assault/tactical rifle :D

Ahh, its always interesting to see folks ask why hunt with an AR vs. a bolt action rifle.  News flash, those bolt guns WERE the military assault weapons of their day.  Technology has moved on, and they're obsolete for a reason.  They say every generation has its own rifle here in the US, 50 years ago, it was the Model 70, 20 years ago it was a custom sporterized Enfield or Mauser, and today? Well, today its the AR15. . .  

I've hunted with an AR-15 in 5.56x45.  Its about shot placement and bullet selection, and the 77 gr SMK's I used worked pretty well.  Sure it gets me a lot of hate from the fudds, but I usually end up laughing at them when they gutshoot a deer, miss, or start to complain about the weight/recoil/whatever.  And don't get me started on the morons who use the Remington 7400/7600 series or the BAR's. . . .

To put it simply, the AR-10 and AR-15's are more accurate, lighter weight, just as reliable, simple, and easy to work on.  Honestly, if you can turn a wrench, you can work on an AR, not so with your Remchester bolt action.  They're the small block chevy of the gun world, because a huge number of companies make them, make parts for them, or work on them.  You can get an AR in any caliber form .22LR all the way up to .50BMG, and everything in between. They are the #1 selling civilian long gun in the United States for the past couple years by a large margin.  And they are getting more and more common in the field because of their performance.    

Anyway, to answer the OP's question:

There are 2 main types of AR10 pattern rifles out there.  The KAC pattern and the Armalite pattern.  Differences are MOSTLY the upper reciever, magazine well, and there's some differences in the lowers as well.

KAC pattern:
Knights - Gold standard.  You can find them used for $2.5k and up.
Larue - Awesome rifles, great company, $2500 and up.
LMT - Good rifles, KAC parts, somewhat heavy (10 lbs) but rugged and reliable.  
Panther Arms = DPMS. - They're cheap, and have a lot of issues I'd rather avoid.  If you get one, replace the trigger, get the gas key staked, and get a spare bolt, firing pin, and plan on dealing with playing around with buffers, recoil springs and ammunition types to get it to run right.  
Remington - Rebranded DPMS with a 25% price increase for the Remington name
LWRC REPR - hit or miss.  I'd avoid unless you find one you know runs.

Armalite Pattern:
Armalite - Standard, mass produced, can require tweaking
Noveske - Armalite pattern, but top notch, and damn good Customer Service.  
Bunch of smaller manufacturers.

Misc pattern:
CMMG - (G3 mags) I'd avoid due to the number of tweaks you need to do to make sure they work. . . .
Bushmaster/RRA - FAL mags, AVOID due to issues with broken bolts.
Mega MaTen - Can use either Armalite OR KAC pattern parts, expensive, still somewhat new and unproven.


For your budget, you're kind of limited to the DPMS or the Armalite.  Or you can build your own.  Personally, I'd scrape up a couple hundred more and get either a LMT MWS ($2300-ish if you look around) or a LaRue PredatAR 7.62mm ($2500).  They are a bit more, BUT you defiantly get what you pay for.  The LMT is in service with the British Royal Army (L129A1), and the rumor is that KAC is making/supplying some parts to LMT.  (B/BC, possibly lowers.)  The LaRue PredatAR is a lot lighter, and comes from one of the best companies I've dealt with in terms of customer support and general awesomeness.  

Both of these can use the Magpul 7.62mm PMag, which is a good reliable mag, and fairly cheap compared to the others.  ($20 compared to $35 and up.)

If you have any specific questions, I can do my best to answer them.

other option would be to get an AR-15 in .300 Blackout, 6.8x43 SPC, 7.62x40 or maybe 6.5 Grendal.

Toasted_Rofls #7 Posted Sep 05 2011 - 01:14

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View PostKrazny13, on Sep 04 2011 - 22:09, said:

Ahh, its always interesting to see folks ask why hunt with an AR vs. a bolt action rifle.  News flash, those bolt guns WERE the military assault weapons of their day.  Technology has moved on, and they're obsolete for a reason.  They say every generation has its own rifle here in the US, 50 years ago, it was the Model 70, 20 years ago it was a custom sporterized Enfield or Mauser, and today? Well, today its the AR15. . .  

I've hunted with an AR-15 in 5.56x45.  Its about shot placement and bullet selection, and the 77 gr SMK's I used worked pretty well.  Sure it gets me a lot of hate from the fudds, but I usually end up laughing at them when they gutshoot a deer, miss, or start to complain about the weight/recoil/whatever.  And don't get me started on the morons who use the Remington 7400/7600 series or the BAR's. . . .

To put it simply, the AR-10 and AR-15's are more accurate, lighter weight, just as reliable, simple, and easy to work on.  Honestly, if you can turn a wrench, you can work on an AR, not so with your Remchester bolt action.  They're the small block chevy of the gun world, because a huge number of companies make them, make parts for them, or work on them.  You can get an AR in any caliber form .22LR all the way up to .50BMG, and everything in between. They are the #1 selling civilian long gun in the United States for the past couple years by a large margin.  And they are getting more and more common in the field because of their performance.

Anyway, to answer the OP's question:

There are 2 main types of AR10 pattern rifles out there.  The KAC pattern and the Armalite pattern.  Differences are MOSTLY the upper reciever, magazine well, and there's some differences in the lowers as well.

KAC pattern:
Knights - Gold standard.  You can find them used for $2.5k and up.
Larue - Awesome rifles, great company, $2500 and up.
LMT - Good rifles, KAC parts, somewhat heavy (10 lbs) but rugged and reliable.  
Panther Arms = DPMS. - They're cheap, and have a lot of issues I'd rather avoid.  If you get one, replace the trigger, get the gas key staked, and get a spare bolt, firing pin, and plan on dealing with playing around with buffers, recoil springs and ammunition types to get it to run right.  
Remington - Rebranded DPMS with a 25% price increase for the Remington name
LWRC REPR - hit or miss.  I'd avoid unless you find one you know runs.

Armalite Pattern:
Armalite - Standard, mass produced, can require tweaking
Noveske - Armalite pattern, but top notch, and damn good Customer Service.  
Bunch of smaller manufacturers.

Misc pattern:
CMMG - (G3 mags) I'd avoid due to the number of tweaks you need to do to make sure they work. . . .
Bushmaster/RRA - FAL mags, AVOID due to issues with broken bolts.
Mega MaTen - Can use either Armalite OR KAC pattern parts, expensive, still somewhat new and unproven.


For your budget, you're kind of limited to the DPMS or the Armalite.  Or you can build your own.  Personally, I'd scrape up a couple hundred more and get either a LMT MWS ($2300-ish if you look around) or a LaRue PredatAR 7.62mm ($2500).  They are a bit more, BUT you defiantly get what you pay for.  The LMT is in service with the British Royal Army (L129A1), and the rumor is that KAC is making/supplying some parts to LMT.  (B/BC, possibly lowers.)  The LaRue PredatAR is a lot lighter, and comes from one of the best companies I've dealt with in terms of customer support and general awesomeness.  

Both of these can use the Magpul 7.62mm PMag, which is a good reliable mag, and fairly cheap compared to the others.  ($20 compared to $35 and up.)

If you have any specific questions, I can do my best to answer them.

other option would be to get an AR-15 in .300 Blackout, 6.8x43 SPC, 7.62x40 or maybe 6.5 Grendal.


Good points, but you cannot honestly say a .308 AR weighs less then most bolt actions. The AR is a very light rifle by modern military weapons standards, no doubt, but compared to a bolt action, most will weigh less. If it ways more than a AR, I don't think I would go trekking into the backwoods with it, but then again, never hunted, so I cannot say this from experience.

Anyhow, this guys recommendations are solid. I'd go with what he said.

Also, as for the semi-auto, I always assumed you should be taking down an animal in one shot, but then again, follow up shots... I don't know much about hunting, all though I do plan to try it one day. Seems like a fun, challenging way to get a nice dinner. Not only that, it has guns (or bows) involved as well. Sounds like a winning combination.

Dominatus #8 Posted Sep 05 2011 - 01:23

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No experience with weapons or hunting, but a bolt-action is generally more accurate than a semi-auto AR. Again, I have no experience with hunting, so I have no idea if that affects anything or not.

Toasted_Rofls #9 Posted Sep 05 2011 - 01:45

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View PostDominatus, on Sep 05 2011 - 01:23, said:

No experience with weapons or hunting, but a bolt-action is generally more accurate than a semi-auto AR. Again, I have no experience with hunting, so I have no idea if that affects anything or not.

Military AR? Yes. However, many hunting AR's (High quality 16 inch and up barreled AR's) can approach and even best the accuracy of many lower end bolt models.

Krazny13 #10 Posted Sep 05 2011 - 02:01

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View PostToasted_Rofls, on Sep 05 2011 - 01:14, said:

Good points, but you cannot honestly say a .308 AR weighs less then most bolt actions. The AR is a very light rifle by modern military weapons standards, no doubt, but compared to a bolt action, most will weigh less. If it ways more than a AR, I don't think I would go trekking into the backwoods with it, but then again, never hunted, so I cannot say this from experience.

Anyhow, this guys recommendations are solid. I'd go with what he said.

Also, as for the semi-auto, I always assumed you should be taking down an animal in one shot, but then again, follow up shots... I don't know much about hunting, all though I do plan to try it one day. Seems like a fun, challenging way to get a nice dinner. Not only that, it has guns (or bows) involved as well. Sounds like a winning combination.

Lighter than most?  If not, they're pretty close.  I put together an AR10 using a Noveske lower/upper, 21 inch heavy match barrel, and a 14 inch DD rail with a Magpul PRS stock.  Sucker shot Half MOA with FGMM 168's at 200 yards, and I think with the NF 3.5-15x and bipod used for the break in it was 12lbs total.

Around the same time I did some work on an accurized Remington 700.  22 inch heavy match barrel, McMillan A5 stock (bedded, free floating barrel), and a Badger Ord M5 detachable mag setup. That mother shot a hair better, but weighed in at 16 lbs with the same NF scope/bipod combo.      

Here's the kicker.  By the time it was all said and done, the AR-10 had set the owner back $1400, and I put it together for him one evening.  That 700 cost $3200 and change to build, and took a week.      

AR's are freakishly light for their size.  Most of the weight is the barrel and bolt carrier, which are the largest steel components.  Rest is aluminum and plastics, which are far less dense than wood or steel.  Honestly, the weight difference isn't much, and if you look to build a bolt gun for maximum accuracy, the AR will be a hell of a lot lighter.  (Cause AR's are easy to accurize)  Sure, you can get a 6 lb bolt gun if you use a cheap plastic stock, and a pencil thin barrel with iron sights, but you sure as hell arent going to want to fire it much.

As for the accuracy, there's a reason the AR platform has been winning all the national matches at Camp Perry for the past 15 years.   ;)

Krazny13 #11 Posted Sep 05 2011 - 02:09

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View PostToasted_Rofls, on Sep 05 2011 - 01:45, said:

Military AR? Yes. However, many hunting AR's (High quality 16 inch and up barreled AR's) can approach and even best the accuracy of many lower end bolt models.

Posted Image

With a 4x ACOG and 77 gr SMK's, I could hit a 12 inch target out at 600 yards with boring regularity.  Not bad for an 8.75 lb carbine with a 16 inch barrel.

aznnoodle727 #12 Posted Sep 05 2011 - 02:40

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Hmm...my friend has always preferred the G3 and the FN FAL. I'm leaning towards the LWRC REPR.

Slacker #13 Posted Sep 05 2011 - 06:33

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View PostKrazny13, on Sep 04 2011 - 22:09, said:

Ahh, its always interesting to see folks ask why hunt with an AR vs. a bolt action rifle.  News flash, those bolt guns WERE the military assault weapons of their day.  Technology has moved on, and they're obsolete for a reason.  They say every generation has its own rifle here in the US, 50 years ago, it was the Model 70, 20 years ago it was a custom sporterized Enfield or Mauser, and today? Well, today its the AR15. . .  

I've hunted with an AR-15 in 5.56x45.  Its about shot placement and bullet selection, and the 77 gr SMK's I used worked pretty well.  Sure it gets me a lot of hate from the fudds, but I usually end up laughing at them when they gutshoot a deer, miss, or start to complain about the weight/recoil/whatever.  And don't get me started on the morons who use the Remington 7400/7600 series or the BAR's. . . .

To put it simply, the AR-10 and AR-15's are more accurate, lighter weight, just as reliable, simple, and easy to work on.  Honestly, if you can turn a wrench, you can work on an AR, not so with your Remchester bolt action.  They're the small block chevy of the gun world, because a huge number of companies make them, make parts for them, or work on them.  You can get an AR in any caliber form .22LR all the way up to .50BMG, and everything in between. They are the #1 selling civilian long gun in the United States for the past couple years by a large margin.  And they are getting more and more common in the field because of their performance.    

Anyway, to answer the OP's question:

There are 2 main types of AR10 pattern rifles out there.  The KAC pattern and the Armalite pattern.  Differences are MOSTLY the upper reciever, magazine well, and there's some differences in the lowers as well.

KAC pattern:
Knights - Gold standard.  You can find them used for $2.5k and up.
Larue - Awesome rifles, great company, $2500 and up.
LMT - Good rifles, KAC parts, somewhat heavy (10 lbs) but rugged and reliable.  
Panther Arms = DPMS. - They're cheap, and have a lot of issues I'd rather avoid.  If you get one, replace the trigger, get the gas key staked, and get a spare bolt, firing pin, and plan on dealing with playing around with buffers, recoil springs and ammunition types to get it to run right.  
Remington - Rebranded DPMS with a 25% price increase for the Remington name
LWRC REPR - hit or miss.  I'd avoid unless you find one you know runs.

Armalite Pattern:
Armalite - Standard, mass produced, can require tweaking
Noveske - Armalite pattern, but top notch, and damn good Customer Service.  
Bunch of smaller manufacturers.

Misc pattern:
CMMG - (G3 mags) I'd avoid due to the number of tweaks you need to do to make sure they work. . . .
Bushmaster/RRA - FAL mags, AVOID due to issues with broken bolts.
Mega MaTen - Can use either Armalite OR KAC pattern parts, expensive, still somewhat new and unproven.


For your budget, you're kind of limited to the DPMS or the Armalite.  Or you can build your own.  Personally, I'd scrape up a couple hundred more and get either a LMT MWS ($2300-ish if you look around) or a LaRue PredatAR 7.62mm ($2500).  They are a bit more, BUT you defiantly get what you pay for.  The LMT is in service with the British Royal Army (L129A1), and the rumor is that KAC is making/supplying some parts to LMT.  (B/BC, possibly lowers.)  The LaRue PredatAR is a lot lighter, and comes from one of the best companies I've dealt with in terms of customer support and general awesomeness.  

Both of these can use the Magpul 7.62mm PMag, which is a good reliable mag, and fairly cheap compared to the others.  ($20 compared to $35 and up.)

If you have any specific questions, I can do my best to answer them.

other option would be to get an AR-15 in .300 Blackout, 6.8x43 SPC, 7.62x40 or maybe 6.5 Grendal.

Thanks for the info.

I was wondering how available these manufactures are to get weapons from without a FFL. I would need to be aboe to get these at a local gunstore or some way other than via the mail because you need a FFL for that or so ive heard.

Toasted_Rofls #14 Posted Sep 05 2011 - 07:40

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View PostKrazny13, on Sep 05 2011 - 02:09, said:

Posted Image

With a 4x ACOG and 77 gr SMK's, I could hit a 12 inch target out at 600 yards with boring regularity.  Not bad for an 8.75 lb carbine with a 16 inch barrel.

Not bad at all. It's an extremely accurate rifle, no doubt. Going to get myself a BCM upper with a DD rail once they get back in stock so I can have my own. Been researching AR's for a year, finally decided on what I want, and from who I want it from. Hopefully, I'll be able to get similar results, allthough my accuracy with rifles is best described as "Iraqi".

O.k, maybe not that bad. But close. http://forum.worldof...e_veryhappy.gif

Krazny13 #15 Posted Sep 05 2011 - 21:25

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View PostSlacker, on Sep 05 2011 - 06:33, said:

Thanks for the info.

I was wondering how available these manufactures are to get weapons from without a FFL. I would need to be aboe to get these at a local gunstore or some way other than via the mail because you need a FFL for that or so ive heard.

Here in the US, you'll have to thru a dealer unless its a private party to private party transfer where you are both residents of the same state.

First off, make sure its legal to own in your area.  Then, look around for a dealer willing to do a transfer for you.  Don't pay more than $25-$50, because its literally 10 minutes of paperwork and a phone call on their end.  If an FFL tells you the transfer fee is a percentage of what you pay, go elsewhere.  

Once you have an FFL lined up to do the transfer, go ahead and buy the firearm from the place you find it online.  Then, have your transfer dealer email or fax a copy of his FFL to the seller, with your name and what you bought somewhere on the paperwork. They'll ship to the dealer, who will give you a phone call, and you go in and fill out a 4473 plus whatever state paperwork is needed.

Then you get to take it home.  


View PostToasted_Rofls, on Sep 05 2011 - 07:40, said:

Not bad at all. It's an extremely accurate rifle, no doubt. Going to get myself a BCM upper with a DD rail once they get back in stock so I can have my own. Been researching AR's for a year, finally decided on what I want, and from who I want it from. Hopefully, I'll be able to get similar results, allthough my accuracy with rifles is best described as "Iraqi".

O.k, maybe not that bad. But close. http://forum.worldof...e_veryhappy.gif

BCM is good kit, they don't cut corners, and they stand behind their product.  Then again, I'm a bit biased, as I have 2 of their CHF uppers. (16 inch and an 11.5 inch SBR.  Both with URX2's.)

Posted Image
http://img.photobuck.../1130091252.jpg

If I can make a suggestion, go with the midlength gas system.  Longer HG's, smoother recoil impulse and a lot better balance.  

As for the accuracy, all I can say is shoot.  A lot.  Buy ammo and hit the range often.  Get a .22 conversion kit or dedicated upper if you cant afford a lot of 5.56 ammo.  you'll get better.

Toasted_Rofls #16 Posted Sep 06 2011 - 03:01

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View PostKrazny13, on Sep 05 2011 - 21:25, said:

BCM is good kit, they don't cut corners, and they stand behind their product.  Then again, I'm a bit biased, as I have 2 of their CHF uppers. (16 inch and an 11.5 inch SBR.  Both with URX2's.)

Posted Image
http://img.photobuck.../1130091252.jpg

If I can make a suggestion, go with the midlength gas system.  Longer HG's, smoother recoil impulse and a lot better balance.  

As for the accuracy, all I can say is shoot.  A lot.  Buy ammo and hit the range often.  Get a .22 conversion kit or dedicated upper if you cant afford a lot of 5.56 ammo.  you'll get better.

Exactly what I plan to do. 16 inch mid-length with a DD rail, and a .22 conversion kit so I can afford to shoot it as much as I want to. Practice makes perfect, this is a something I found applies to shooting especially. I figure if I don't go to the range at least twice a month, then I shouldn't buy a rifle in the first place.

As for the lower, I plan to but a BCM blem lower. Why pay extra for a lower that's only feature is that it has a better finish, seeing as how I plan on it getting scratched anyways? It's a tool. Would you pay more for a hammer because it had a green handle over a black one, and offered nothing else?

Also, you lucky bastard, I can't get SBR where I live.

BaronJaeger #17 Posted Sep 06 2011 - 12:00

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I do have to agree that modern technology has made the accuracy gap between semiauto vs bolt/manual pretty damned close. One thing to keep in mind is a lot of states have varying laws on mag caps, barrel lengths, etc. when it comes to what is classified as a "hunting" rifle. I can practically guarantee if a game warden sees you walking through the woods with an AR, he's at least gonna come and check you out (some poeple just don't want the hassle). I basically spent my first 20 years hunting in shotgun only states-which is a bit more challenging. Still want to try muzzleloaders-some of the new ones are damned nice. Happy huntin' anyway.

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View PostBaronJaeger, on Sep 06 2011 - 12:00, said:

I do have to agree that modern technology has made the accuracy gap between semiauto vs bolt/manual pretty damned close. One thing to keep in mind is a lot of states have varying laws on mag caps, barrel lengths, etc. when it comes to what is classified as a "hunting" rifle. I can practically guarantee if a game warden sees you walking through the woods with an AR, he's at least gonna come and check you out (some poeple just don't want the hassle). I basically spent my first 20 years hunting in shotgun only states-which is a bit more challenging. Still want to try muzzleloaders-some of the new ones are damned nice. Happy huntin' anyway.

I already got 2 shotguns for deer and a muzzle loader trying something new and hopefully increasing my amount of deer with less trips lol.

BaronJaeger #19 Posted Sep 07 2011 - 09:19

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View PostSlacker, on Sep 07 2011 - 01:59, said:

I already got 2 shotguns for deer and a muzzle loader trying something new and hopefully increasing my amount of deer with less trips lol.

Hehe-well that gun should definitely work fork for that (no such thing as overkill when it comes to weapons,lol.)  On a side not-I heard the wonderful US government gun control fascists tried to sneak thru a bill limiting high cap mags (I believe it was over 10 rounds.) From what I heard they stuck it on the end of the "debt extension" package this time around. Bill HR 308 for specifics.  Just wondering if anyone else has heard more about it-hopefully it dies in committee-otherwise, stock up now!!

Spectre12078 #20 Posted Oct 31 2011 - 06:15

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Im an M14 guy,but I hear stainless barrels tend to perform better.