208 replies to this topic

[Fluffy_Kittens]

well i wish teyy would make it part of the vanilla client, not necessarily the win/loss chance, because that is often wrong as it is right, but i would like to see a persons PR rating beside their name when i [tab] my team.

with everyone seeing how much of a failtard you are, perhaps that may encourage people to actually improve.

 

[nukesixing]

I am against banning XVM. 

Sure, some people use XVM in-game stats for bad purposes. But just like alcohol, you shouldn't ban it because some people abuse it. 

People curse and say bad things in chat all the time, it's not largely because of xvm stats.

 

XVM gives me a lot of information: the good players and bad players behave differently, and I can adjust my play accordingly with their stats shown. 

As for stats sniping, well, this is just a game, you die, you get out and play next game.No big deal. I doubt "stats sniping" can significantly affect one's performance. 

[scHnuuudle_bop]

Voltare_2014, on Mar 31 2018 - 23:22, said:

 

LMMFAO. 

 

"I downloaded XVM outside of game that shows where the reds are going, but I don't care about that, I only downloaded it for the pretty colors."

 

"Hunting down the reds hasn't done anything for my statistics."

 

"I hunt the purples". 

 

Bwahahaa

 

not quite sure what that even means? Very strange comment, oh well kids will be kids.

[scHnuuudle_bop]

 

 

So, if XVM got removed, what would the game look like?. How many mods are tied to XVM? 

 

I can easily do without the stat information, but things like the mini map mods , garage fluff, zoom and such are pretty benign. 

Edited by scHnuuudle_bop, Apr 01 2018 - 10:06.

[choSenfroZen_1]

So. I have been away for a while 

The XVM debate is very long,   this   seems to touch a nerve.

 

Is it worth loading, or will it just be a waste on a scrub like me?

[Backfire_]

choSenfroZen_1, on Apr 01 2018 - 04:14, said:

So. I have been away for a while 

The XVM debate is very long,   this   seems to touch a nerve.

 

Is it worth loading, or will it just be a waste on a scrub like me?

 

Not really unless you wanted features from xvm or a mod pack like changes to tank carousel in garage/auto-return crew/etc.   Realistically I find I do better if I just assume everyone on the enemy team is good and everyone on my team is bad.  You never know when a bad player will pull off some brilliant play randomly, and you can't count on that purple player to support you, etc.  That and every update there is a chance it breaks/needs updating/can cause crashes etc.  I've been vanilla for over a year and don't plan on adding any mods back in.  WG added a lot of quality of life UI elements to the base game that used to require xvm if you wanted them.

[Battlecruiser]

Whisky_A_Go_Go, on Mar 31 2018 - 08:19, said:

 

This coming from someone that uses a fake sig with bad stats in it intentionally, hoping that somebody will say something to him so he can snap back with the "Look at my REAL stats" argument and try to get a fight going.

 

Sounds legit.

 

Sounds like you're the one that wants the argument.

Realign, on Apr 01 2018 - 04:24, said:

 

Not really unless you wanted features from xvm or a mod pack like changes to tank carousel in garage/auto-return crew/etc.   Realistically I find I do better if I just assume everyone on the enemy team is good and everyone on my team is bad.  You never know when a bad player will pull off some brilliant play randomly, and you can't count on that purple player to support you, etc.  That and every update there is a chance it breaks/needs updating/can cause crashes etc.  I've been vanilla for over a year and don't plan on adding any mods back in.  WG added a lot of quality of life UI elements to the base game that used to require xvm if you wanted them.

 

Here's the general rundown
if your wn8 is bad it's because your damage is bad.
Reds have difficulty making damage, they either camp, suicide, or draw a stalemate on a corner. They don't even know what the spotting system is let alone timing and placement.
oranges are more likely to dive you than reds.
yellows don't typically suicide which means you can depend on them to cause a stalemate. can also probably kill you if they dive on you.
^those three usually have a habit of sitting around waiting to get cleaned up after the rest of their team has died Also try to keep your hitpoints above half (or otherwise out of one to three shot range) or else the zombies will begin to come.

greens don't usually know about the good spots and if they do they're probably alone and in some really bad tank for the map. Generally just a touch too aggressive and their timing/placement strategies aren't the best but they can whop out some good plays. Be wary.

blue/low purple are usually solo, or in some bad tank, or generally doing something not optimal for random battles. Like putting themselves into positions that give pubbies an opportunity to make plays, for example, but they're still very dangerous if they're making an effort. Generally pretty aggressive players.

and mid-high purples usually do the same thing reds do, just in better spots and with better aim. Countering them consistently requires map knowledge so you can screw up their timing and placement then they're no better than a red because they're passive and afraid of scratching paint and the moment something falls out of their routine they stop and don't know how to flex usually. If you know they're in a routine don't do something stupid like let yourself get farmed.

Super high purples are pvp autistic, they don't really have any weaknesses. They do everything properly, right tank, platoon, good placements at the right times, and lucky to boot. unlike the majority of the purple bracket which is rigid and predictable and simply following a guide, probably written from a super unicum anyway.

The entire game is timing and placement, how good you are at it and how lucky you get with starting position/map relative to the tank you're driving dictates your damage potential and the ability of your team to not get wiped and to move out of base tends to predict your damage ceiling for that particular game. Relative team compositions and placements also play a minor part in what the initial skirmishes look like. Usually if one team gets 2/3rds of the map it's over. Not always but you can also usually tell when not always is.

This is why "unicums" hate arty so much, arty disrupts their internet found guide on how to play the map and in what tank so when they roll up to a hill in the open to "make damage" then get slapped by three artillery because their stats look goodest. Or maybe just because they're the only thing lit because their team didn't leave the base. Regardless, remove xvm and suddenly players have to use their brain instead of shooting colors (Isn't that like some kind of racism?) or playing psyops.

Personally I think that stats gained in random battles are not a qualifier for competitive play, only an indicator of potential.

Anyway, the one I didn't mention. The anti-unicum. The deep red. They're usually active players despite starting at 45% wr and below.  They screw up your timing and placement by taking your spots, they block shots and don't pen anything, they do something that makes you type to them, they're disrupting the team. They teamkill or otherwise start confrontations, usually over nothing. Sometimes they  come in platoons, they're in tier 10's, sometimes even good tier 10's, but they carry losses, not wins.  Every one you have on your team is usually one negated good player on your team. Some suspect they're alt accounts of purples but the bottom line is, you see someone with a 41% win rate, you have to work for that. They have bad stats for a reason. Don't talk to them, just ignore them, pretend they don't exist so they don't ruin your own playing when you get caught up in it.

I could write another dissertation about how XVM and stat culture is used as a marketing tool to sell tanks and how it's pushing the balance and tank release decisions, but that one should be pretty obvious.

[Bavor]

Devildog8, on Mar 31 2018 - 17:57, said:

 

not mine Wotlabs and Gosu are way off

 

Your overall WN8 is a difference of 1.  Your recent WN8 uses a different number of battles on both sites. That may be the difference int he recent WN8.  Noobmeter gives yet another different number for recent WN8 and overall WN8.  Tanks.gg shows numbers close to Wotlabs.  Wottactic gives a number closer to Wotlabs, but it is different.  

 

The difference may be when the sites update from the Wargaming API and how frequently they update.

[fuern3]

I have no problem with people using XVM it's the ones that instantly say "GG we lose." or "I'm always getting matched with idiots." just piss me off.

[Flarvin]

fuern3, on Apr 01 2018 - 13:00, said:

I have no problem with people using XVM it's the ones that instantly say "GG we lose." or "I'm always getting matched with idiots." just piss me off.

 

Those comments are not just from XVM users. 

 

Players claim “we lose” for several reasons, like map spawn spot, top tier tank match ups, clan toons, etc. 

[minneerminneer]

xvm is a tool that people can use to determine how much you can rely on your team.

 

if i see my entire team is a bunch of 100-600 wn8 players and i'm playing a light tank i will play a lot more passive than if my team is mostly 1k-2k wn8 players.  the exact same thing would happen just after battles with people shaming PR removing xvm would change nothing.

[Battlecruiser]

_Gungrave_, on Mar 31 2018 - 05:18, said:

As always I'm in support of disabling while in a match though reallistically disabling XVM won't be going far enough as the game really needs a fog of war system.

 

Implementing a Fog of War will be more beneficial than simply disallowing stats from being public while in a match.

 

they should introduce as its own game type at first to gauge feedback. I get the feeling a blunt and sudden change like that to random battles would get a harsh reaction.

[Reedy005]

bann all XVM cheats 

 

[_Gungrave_]

Battlecruiser, on Apr 01 2018 - 23:39, said:

 

they should introduce as its own game type at first to gauge feedback. I get the feeling a blunt and sudden change like that to random battles would get a harsh reaction.

 

Well it could result in a harsh drop of stat shaming and stat sniping which hurts both ends of the player spectrum respectively.

[Bavor]

the_Deadly_Bulb, on Mar 28 2018 - 14:08, said:

As to XVM sniping, do you players who bemoan XVM sniping REALLY believe everyone is running around the map looking for you? The reason you get destroyed is the same reason everyone else from tomatoes to unicorns get destroyed, you ventured out in front of an opponents gun. XVM or purple stats won't make it any more difficult to pen your tank when you make a fatal error. It had precious little to do with XVM, but if it makes you feel better go ahead and believe it.

 

I just had two battles in a row where I had the highest WN8 on my team.  In both battles the enemy arty focused me the entire battle.  They only shot at me and all the damage they did the entire battle for both battles was to my tanks.  Yet XVM sniping doesn't exist? That's funny!  

[Dirizon]

WN8, like most tools on the planet, can cause plenty of benefits. Likewise, tools used improperly, can cause ineffectiveness and uselessness. So, this argument boils down, not to the tool, but to the user instead. A user, being smart and resourceful, or an idiot being instigating and incompetent. 

 

Ban XVM, introduce an in-game optional W/R and PBR tab beside players names in randoms load-in chart before battle. As said, it should be optional, but a WG fabricated option. 

[the_Deadly_Bulb]

Bavor, on Apr 01 2018 - 21:01, said:

 

I just had two battles in a row where I had the highest WN8 on my team.  In both battles the enemy arty focused me the entire battle.  They only shot at me and all the damage they did the entire battle for both battles was to my tanks.  Yet XVM sniping doesn't exist? That's funny!

 

First question, do you run XVM?

I guess so since you knew you were had the highest wn8 on your team. So you use it to know who's who, but no one else should? LOL

 

REMEMBER PLAYERS XVM IS FOR GOOD PLAYERS ONLY!

 

Second question, why were you the only one they fired at? Were you the only one exposed and sitting still?

You were it then, right.

The only high value target?

Arty shot at no one else, because you were the only 'good player'?

 

Hard to believe, you can if you like.

Edited by the_Deadly_Bulb, Apr 02 2018 - 17:28.

[Battlecruiser]

_Gungrave_, on Apr 01 2018 - 23:04, said:

 

Well it could result in a harsh drop of stat shaming and stat sniping which hurts both ends of the player spectrum respectively.

 

exactly. This is a business environment after all, you don't want to start driving away retained customers. XVM stat culture has been allowed to fester into something nasty and removing it could do some real financial damage. At this point treatment is the only option.

[Kenshin2kx]

_Gungrave_, on Apr 01 2018 - 23:04, said:

 

Well it could result in a harsh drop of stat shaming and stat sniping which hurts both ends of the player spectrum respectively.

 

exactly 

 

 

Sounds wonderful ... heck, for me it would even make artillery a bit more intuitive in that, the default (for lack of info) becomes an effective analysis of the battlefield in terms of who to aim for in terms of artillery bombardment.  Now, I do believe that the better artillery players do this already ... thing is, I am statistically certain not all of them do ... and the elimination of 'convenience stats' would then mandate that they 'have to' think and actually look, remember and choose who gets shot at.  Now, this is not to focus only on artillery, this holds true for all the other classes as well ... fog of war and the lack (or presense) of intel can play a pivotal role in the win or a loss of a match.

[Kenshin2kx]

Battlecruiser, on Apr 02 2018 - 07:12, said:

 

exactly. This is a business environment after all, you don't want to start driving away retained customers. XVM stat culture has been allowed to fester into something nasty and removing it could do some real financial damage. At this point treatment is the only option.

 

Okay, now I'm a bit confused ... so, removing XVM <stat elements> can cause 'financial damage' ... so, what would be the treatment then?  I'm thinking that if some players leave due to stat removal ... there would be a fairly good potential for others to stay (or even return) due to the less toxic stat based culture of the game (while playing it).

Edited by Kenshin2kx, Apr 02 2018 - 18:31.