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ltalian low tier clubbers


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Dirizon #1 Posted Apr 16 2018 - 23:02

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Anyone notice the low tier Italian tanks, have 7.5cm reasonably accurate reasonable velocity good aim-time guns? That remarkably, have very high by tier and by caliber, HE pens? l mean, if you take tanks like Hetzer or T - Fourty, that don't have a turret, or Cruiser ll, that has disgusting aim-time and low velocity - these ltalian tanks have it way better for shotgunning people with HE. Surprisingly, their HE shells have higher pen than KV or SU85s 12.2 howitzer, a bore size also double....Weird. And also still include reasonable AP and gold rounds, but lower damage. l still think that is way better, as they are able to hit more, hit further away, aim at weakness - sort of like how RU251 and Cent A X have high powered HE rounds. Seal clubber guns?

 

 



FluffyBadBad #2 Posted Apr 16 2018 - 23:21

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error

 

does not compute



Mikosah #3 Posted Apr 16 2018 - 23:51

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A couple caveats- one is that these stats could still change during testing. Another is that for instance at tier 4 the 75mm HE with 70 pen and 175 damage is still going to be very inconsistent because the small caliber has poor overmatch potential even at this tier. And even 70 pen itself in spite of being very high for HE is still going to be situational. There will be many borderline situations where 70 doesn't quite cut it and the low alpha splashes for negligible damage. In short, the 105mm howitzers will not be obsolete any time soon.

pepe_trueno #4 Posted Apr 16 2018 - 23:57

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i am more anoyed that they used the fiat 3000 as the tier 1, i mean do we realy need another renault ft clone? even more so when italians have this beauty :teethhappy:

 

 

 

 

 


M0nkE #5 Posted Apr 17 2018 - 00:13

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View PostMikosah, on Apr 16 2018 - 22:51, said:

A couple caveats- one is that these stats could still change during testing. Another is that for instance at tier 4 the 75mm HE with 70 pen and 175 damage is still going to be very inconsistent because the small caliber has poor overmatch potential even at this tier. And even 70 pen itself in spite of being very high for HE is still going to be situational. There will be many borderline situations where 70 doesn't quite cut it and the low alpha splashes for negligible damage. In short, the 105mm howitzers will not be obsolete any time soon.

 

Uhh, you know HE doesn't overmatch, right?

Scorpiany #6 Posted Apr 17 2018 - 00:23

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The 75mm's only do 175 alpha. If you don't penetrate with the HE, you'll hardly do any damage at all; unlike the other 105mm and 122mm derp guns that you listed. If you're not going to pen with HE, you'll have to shoot AP... In which case your DPM goes down the toilet.

_Gungrave_ #7 Posted Apr 17 2018 - 00:28

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View Postpepe_trueno, on Apr 16 2018 - 23:57, said:

i am more anoyed that they used the fiat 3000 as the tier 1, i mean do we realy need another renault ft clone? even more so when italians have this beauty :teethhappy:

 

 

 

 

 

Its actually the FIat 2000 as the Fiat 3000 was an Italian version of the Renault FT. Besides the F2k's main armament was 65mm gun that is obviously too high a caliber for tier 1 when most tier 1s use 37 to 40 mm guns.

Striker_70 #8 Posted Apr 17 2018 - 00:32

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It's a good step towards making HE more relevant.  I wouldn't mind if they lowered the alpha of HE rounds while increasing the penetration on most every tank in the game.  There are 3 ammo choices, they should all be strategically usable in nearly every game rather than constantly ignored for stretches of 20 games in a row.

Dirizon #9 Posted Apr 17 2018 - 00:45

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View PostMikosah, on Apr 16 2018 - 18:21, said:

A couple caveats- one is that these stats could still change during testing. Another is that for instance at tier 4 the 75mm HE with 70 pen and 175 damage is still going to be very inconsistent because the small caliber has poor overmatch potential even at this tier. And even 70 pen itself in spite of being very high for HE is still going to be situational. There will be many borderline situations where 70 doesn't quite cut it and the low alpha splashes for negligible damage. In short, the 105mm howitzers will not be obsolete any time soon.

 

l never said other low tier howitzers would be obsolete. This one is just alot better. lt fires faster, more accurately, at longer ranges, with better velocity, without aim-time problems. AND has reliable AP/APCR / HEAT to use. The other howitzers do not have these things. Yes, splashing hits will be very ineffectual, you will see alot of 45 damage hits sadly, and would likely cause zero damage hits against things like KV, that larger caliber howitzers will hit for hundred - but the DPM factor against lighter armours is large. 53mm pen off these howitzers we already have floating around tiers 4-6, it is a major step up having seventy (mm)   Tanks like T127, T-Fifty, VK31H / DW2 - just to name a few tanks that 53mm won't pen, but seventy will. And of course, alot more side pens like T1H / M6, M4s, Etc. lt is far more relaible weapon, as it still has useful enough anti-armour characteristics in the AP / HEAT rounds they have too. For instance, the T4 7.5cm HEAT is one-thirty (mm), quite a step up over Lago, Cruiser ll, PzlV / M4 howitzers HEAT - while firing faster too and being more reliable. as l said, when it won't cut it and you start getting those 45 damage negligible splashes, you still have decent pen normal ammo. 

 

HE does not over match, by the way. 



pepe_trueno #10 Posted Apr 17 2018 - 01:08

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View Post_Gungrave_, on Apr 17 2018 - 00:28, said:

 

Its actually the FIat 2000 as the Fiat 3000 was an Italian version of the Renault FT. Besides the F2k's main armament was 65mm gun that is obviously too high a caliber for tier 1 when most tier 1s use 37 to 40 mm guns.

 

it was a light ww1 cannon for infantry to carry around , if i have to guess it will be like the tier 1 medium mk   6 pdr (57mm) with lower pen and shell velocity but  10 or 20 more damage

 

overall it was about bringing something new to the table rather than another renault ft clone.

 

 

  



_Gungrave_ #11 Posted Apr 17 2018 - 01:13

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View Postpepe_trueno, on Apr 17 2018 - 01:08, said:

 

it was a light ww1 cannon for infantry to carry around , if i have to guess it will be like the tier 1 medium mk   6 pdr (57mm) with lower pen and shell velocity but  10 or 20 more damage

 

overall it was about bringing something new to the table rather than another renault ft clone.

 

 

  

 

Well people don't really care about tier 1 clones I mean you only play tier 1 for a handful of battles then forget about it.

Mikosah #12 Posted Apr 17 2018 - 03:52

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View PostDirizon, on Apr 16 2018 - 17:45, said:

 

l never said other low tier howitzers would be obsolete. This one is just alot better. lt fires faster, more accurately, at longer ranges, with better velocity, without aim-time problems. AND has reliable AP/APCR / HEAT to use. The other howitzers do not have these things. Yes, splashing hits will be very ineffectual, you will see alot of 45 damage hits sadly, and would likely cause zero damage hits against things like KV, that larger caliber howitzers will hit for hundred - but the DPM factor against lighter armours is large. 53mm pen off these howitzers we already have floating around tiers 4-6, it is a major step up having seventy (mm)   Tanks like T127, T-Fifty, VK31H / DW2 - just to name a few tanks that 53mm won't pen, but seventy will. And of course, alot more side pens like T1H / M6, M4s, Etc. lt is far more relaible weapon, as it still has useful enough anti-armour characteristics in the AP / HEAT rounds they have too. For instance, the T4 7.5cm HEAT is one-thirty (mm), quite a step up over Lago, Cruiser ll, PzlV / M4 howitzers HEAT - while firing faster too and being more reliable. as l said, when it won't cut it and you start getting those 45 damage negligible splashes, you still have decent pen normal ammo. 

 

HE does not over match, by the way. 

 

Point taken, but then again something like a Hetzer only has a 1.7 second base aim time and its reload can be brought under control with a good loadout. Plus the scare factor of being able to realistically one-hit-kill a fair number of tanks it can be matched against. Not to mention that the T4 HEAT is expensive as balls relative to its alpha.

xtcmax #13 Posted Apr 17 2018 - 04:48

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Where do u see italian tech tree?

M0nkE #14 Posted Apr 17 2018 - 05:41

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View Postxtcmax, on Apr 17 2018 - 03:48, said:

Where do u see italian tech tree?

 

Should be up on test server now, I think. Also been posted on other third-party sites, like The Armored Patrol, though you'd have to find it.




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