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Changes to Vehicles With Preferential Matchmaking + Notes on Trade-in


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Karl__Childers #21 Posted May 21 2018 - 23:35

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So my question is, after they Buff the tanks can we play them before making our decision?

If not then the full refund is definitely in order...



cloudwalkr #22 Posted May 21 2018 - 23:42

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So, Cabbage, since you're still down there I have a question for you.

 

Why would WG choose to risk upsetting a huge portion of it's paying players by doing this without the option of a straight trade in (without that bulls@@@ up charge) or straight refund?  Why does WG feel this would be the better approach as apposed to the other option of potentially making a lot of people happy and letting them have actual options and not this bs excuse of "we're giving players options" which sounds incredibly like an EA move?  

 

Are WG on par with EA now?



ThatTrafficCone #23 Posted May 21 2018 - 23:48

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As much as I advocate for the rebalance of pref-MM tanks myself, I think this is the wrong direction to take the KV-5. These changes basically just turn it into an odd-looking KV-4. It's not quite unique in my opinion.

 

If you guys want to really get crazy, I'd suggest giving the KV-5 its historical armor model and its ridiculous weakspots. Then drop it to Tier VII and give it a healthy slab of hit points. Skillful players will be able to hide the weakpoints, and the large health pool will be able to make up for any mistakes. Lower tiered vehicles will be able to penetrate the obvious weakspots and higher tiered vehicles will still have some difficulty penetrating the rest of the tank assuming they aren't hitting the armor head-on. If dropping the tier isn't an option, then keep the weakspots obvious, buff the penetration of its gun, and give it some more hit points still.

 

The KV-5 is a rather dumb looking tank with a dumb armor layout. Please don't make it not dumb, else it'll just become another generic large, armored tank.


Edited by ThatTrafficCone, May 21 2018 - 23:50.


ShookYang #24 Posted May 21 2018 - 23:51

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I don't care if you don't fix matchmaking for pref mm tanks.

 

I bought the tanks for their pref mm, because I don't want to go up against Tier 10 tanks.

 

There was discussion as potentially allowing people to keep their pref mm tanks, trade for the new version of the tank, or blah blah blah.

 

Why was this taken off the table?  Let us decide if we ant to keep the pref mm tanks with our understanding that WG won't bother trying to fix matchmaking for Tier 8 pref tanks (IE more Tier 9 or all Tier 8 battles).



Realign #25 Posted May 21 2018 - 23:55

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View PostCabbageMechanic, on May 21 2018 - 16:51, said:

Your reactions to this news have largely been negative and I completely understand - something you purchased is being changed and you are being told your primary alternative if you don't like it is to spend more gold.  Intentions here were noble - the gold value of the KV-5 is only 7,500, so a full gold refund would actually leave you 4,500 Gold short of even being able to purchase a tech tree Tier 8 Premium like the T34 (12,000) , or 5,000 short of the Löwe (12,500).  The idea was that players would have the option of a scale of vehicles to choose to swap for directly, all of which would be of significantly greater gold value than a refund.  This was not presented well, and we hear and have shared your feedback on this announcement immediately.  We will be reviewing this plan with the global team and will share updates with you on any changes when they are ready.
 

 

Right now you have 2 options but there is something missing if you want to cover all the bases and provide the best customer service within reason while still evolving the game.  Right now you can keep the kv5 or like you said, swap it for say a lowe and pay a portion of the difference.  However, this does nothing for someone who dislikes the kv5 changes and seeing tier 10s in it, but who also have no interest in spending money to bridge that cost gap.  For these customers there should be the option to take that 7500 payout.  Sure its not going to get them a direct replacement, but at least they can have an additional option to exercise how the money they spent is forcibly reallocated.  Costs WG nothing except possibly some shady upsells in the 'trade-in' process and takes care of like 90% of the bad feels.

 

The current solution also possibly causes problems to your most loyal customers.  If someone already has all the premium tanks they want but do not like the changes on their previously pref MM tanks, then the tradeup option is largely useless.  Those people should also be able to get the gold so they have it for future purchases, etc.

 

Lets assume direct refunds of cash money are not on the table as even considering.  The next best customer first option you could provide would be to refund not just the minimal value (7500g) but enough to purchase a currently available tank of similar stature (12000 g) / or direct trade heavy for heavy, med for med, of your choice.  Yes you 'eat' the difference but lets get real.  Its not like upgrading from one tv to a more expensive model or any other physical product where the actual cost of materials and labor is higher.  Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't it the same overhead to make a tier 3 light tank premium and a tier 8 heavy (give or take a little bit of effort trying to maybe balance the tier 8 better)?  Therefore in this case you're only 'eating' a completely imaginary expense to simply allow direct exchanges without charging the 'surcharge' ?

 

This all kind of reminds me of some back and forths I heard about regarding the press/league accounts.  Where HQ didn't want to provide those accounts to NA anymore because they 'cost' 10s of thousands of dollars.  There is a big disconnect between what these things 'cost' vs. what they are 'valued' somewhere in the corporate foodchain...



TheIndecentCanadian #26 Posted May 21 2018 - 23:56

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u wanna take tier 8 prem with pref MM away...let us choose another tier 8 we want dispite the difference in cost, if not leave MM alone...unless your introducing skill based match making...

BaerenGott #27 Posted May 21 2018 - 23:59

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 I really thing both WG and us players are turning a mole-hill into a mountain whining about this.

 

Why not just remove preferential MM tier VIII vehicles from random battles, and allow them in Frontline only?  Problem solved all around.



raymee101 #28 Posted May 22 2018 - 00:02

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I have all the premiums, and I have all the tier 10 tanks as well, so i have no need of trading in tanks for premiums and no need for gold to spend on free xp or whatever, so i would like the option of a full cash refund.  I paid real money for these for the reason that they dont see tier 10s, and now you are taking that away and you want to give me fake in game money that is just a click of a button for you?  No, i want the option for my cash  back, you took the cash in good faith for a product, and now you are changing that product, so its only fair you offer that cash back to me, not some game currency that has no value to you at all cause you just click a button to make it.  We paid real money, so you need to compensate with real money.  i have a lot of pref tanks that i would not have bought if they were seeing tier 10s, the whole reason i play frontline so much is i dont see 10s in my tier 8s.  

Nunya_000 #29 Posted May 22 2018 - 00:04

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View PostBaerenGott, on May 21 2018 - 14:59, said:

 I really thing both WG and us players are turning a mole-hill into a mountain whining about this.

 

Why not just remove preferential MM tier VIII vehicles from random battles, and allow them in Frontline only?  Problem solved all around.

 

so, I could not play a tank l paid $50 for in random? Only in frontline... a mode that is temporary?

cloudwalkr #30 Posted May 22 2018 - 00:04

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View PostRealign, on May 21 2018 - 23:55, said:

 

Right now you have 2 options but there is something missing if you want to cover all the bases and provide the best customer service within reason while still evolving the game.  Right now you can keep the kv5 or like you said, swap it for say a lowe and pay a portion of the difference.  However, this does nothing for someone who dislikes the kv5 changes and seeing tier 10s in it, but who also have no interest in spending money to bridge that cost gap.  For these customers there should be the option to take that 7500 payout.  Sure its not going to get them a direct replacement, but at least they can have an additional option to exercise how the money they spent is forcibly reallocated.  Costs WG nothing except possibly some shady upsells in the 'trade-in' process and takes care of like 90% of the bad feels.

 

The current solution also possibly causes problems to your most loyal customers.  If someone already has all the premium tanks they want but do not like the changes on their previously pref MM tanks, then the tradeup option is largely useless.  Those people should also be able to get the gold so they have it for future purchases, etc.

 

This option to me is still not valid.  I paid real world money for my preff MM tanks, not gold.  I don't want my paid for tanks to be changed to new stats with new mm that i didn't sign on for and only given the option of a gold refund.  I don't buy gold in this game, I don't want a refund in gold value.  

If they gave me the option of trading out for any other tier 8 premium that is in the game with no up-charge bs then I would be ok with that.  

 



NeckRomancer #31 Posted May 22 2018 - 00:05

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With WG practice of power creep in the game(not being serious here), just move the preferred MM tanks down a tier , say tier 8 to 7 , tier 5 to 4 . Do not change the specs for these tanks,at all. Now they will be OP when top tier, okay mid and okay to bad when bottom tier.

 

Just think, Type 59's fighting tier 5's again, or your IS 6 vs tier 5, KV 5 ramming tier 5.

 

( just imagine the chaos this would bring to the game, plus again i'm not serious here)



Realign #32 Posted May 22 2018 - 00:06

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View Postcloudwalkr, on May 21 2018 - 18:04, said:

 

This option to me is still not valid.  I paid real world money for my preff MM tanks, not gold.  I don't want my paid for tanks to be changed to new stats with new mm that i didn't sign on for and only given the option of a gold refund.  I don't buy gold in this game, I don't want a refund in gold value.  

If they gave me the option of trading out for any other tier 8 premium that is in the game with no up-charge bs then I would be ok with that.  

 

 

edited mine with more elaboration kind of going into that more.

Lethalhavoc #33 Posted May 22 2018 - 00:06

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Honestly guys, you've pretty much killed tier 8 with the 3/5/7 MM, and now it feels like you're going out of your way to finish the job.

Tier 8 was my favorite tier to play, and now i don't bother playing it anymore, it's no fun being bottom tier every match.



Gravtech #34 Posted May 22 2018 - 00:07

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In the end, WG is going to change the tanks we purchased for the explicit reason of having pref mm, and if we don't like the changes we have to pay another $10.34 USD in order to get something else that isn't gimped. 

 

GG WG you're still an [edited]


Edited by Gravtech, May 22 2018 - 00:08.


ReaganS #35 Posted May 22 2018 - 00:07

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It is very disappointing that I bought and paid for an juicy apple and now your telling me to enjoy the lemon.....

 

I started out buying premium tanks monthly and have 38 of them paid for right now.  I really slowed down a few years ago when the premiums were becoming OP.  These OP premiums pretty much made my old premiums worthless.  How can my IS6 even come close to competing with a SkorpG or Defender? 

 

I think a total refund for premium MM tanks is the only fair and right thing to do for your customers.  



ThePigSheFlies #36 Posted May 22 2018 - 00:08

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View PostCabbageMechanic, on May 21 2018 - 16:51, said:

Hey Tankers,

As many of you have already noticed, an article was posted today covering some upcoming  preliminary changes to the KV-5, along with some guidelines of what we are planning for the future of tanks with preferential matchmaking.  A particular section of the article has been (fairly) causing some consternation, and we would like to address it.
 

 

Your reactions to this news have largely been negative and I completely understand - something you purchased is being changed and you are being told your primary alternative if you don't like it is to spend more gold.  Intentions here were noble - the gold value of the KV-5 is only 7,500, so a full gold refund would actually leave you 4,500 Gold short of even being able to purchase a tech tree Tier 8 Premium like the T34 (12,000) , or 5,000 short of the Löwe (12,500).  The idea was that players would have the option of a scale of vehicles to choose to swap for directly, all of which would be of significantly greater gold value than a refund.  

 

here's the problem.  most of us already have the tech tree premiums we want.  also, most of us are fed up with artificially scarce premiums that only exist at rare times in the premium shop - and many of the preferential premium tanks were just exactly that anyway (like the kv5)

 

remove the notion that premiums are only available for cash in the premium shop, make them all available in the tech tree.

 

we don't want bundles, we don't want premium shop only exclusives.

 

trading a russian heavy tank premium for a german heavy tank premium seems like a silly notion for you guys to have expected acceptance on anyway...

 

that being said, I'm not certain whether or not I'd bother to trade the 'new' kv5 in.  whereas I don't care for being cannon fodder for tier 10s - I also don't think being bottom tier is all gloom and doom - there is also the FrontLine angle if that is expanded on.



ThatTrafficCone #37 Posted May 22 2018 - 00:09

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Yo Cabbage, why can't WG just offer the tank for a full gold refund for the duration of one patch like what was done with the T26E4 Super Pershing some years back? It's not like the KV-5 is for sale right now. The money is already tied up in the tank, what difference does it make if it's transformed into gold?

Realign #38 Posted May 22 2018 - 00:09

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View PostLethalhavoc, on May 21 2018 - 18:06, said:

Honestly guys, you've pretty much killed tier 8 with the 3/5/7 MM, and now it feels like you're going out of your way to finish the job.

Tier 8 was my favorite tier to play, and now i don't bother playing it anymore, it's no fun being bottom tier every match.

 

Yeah I'm prob going to try and grind out another 5-6 mil in frontline tonight and then I won't have to random in premiums at all ever.  I'll just play tier 8 for strongholds/campaigns/modes like frontline.  If random pubbing I'll just play 7 or 9.  I'd love to play more 10s but the balance there is bad as well.  Makes it really easy to resist tier 8 premiums that come out these days.

Scorpiany #39 Posted May 22 2018 - 00:10

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The very thing that makes Pref MM vehicles something I still consider playing, is the fact that they have Pref MM. You know why I'm willing to play a Type 59, Super Pershing, FCM 50t, etc.? Because I don't have to fight the Obj. 268 v4. Nor a Type 5 Heavy. Nor Conq GC. Nor Obj. 430U. Tier 9 tanks may be significantly better than the Pref MM Tier 8's, but Tier 9's haven't been powercreeped all that much. Tier 10 tanks on the other hand, have become so unbalanced as of recent, that even fighting 3 of them becomes a huge headache.

 

Offer me all of these options:

1) Allow me to keep the tank in its current state, without any changes and without losing the Pref MM.

2) Offer me a full Gold refund, not just a trade-in.

3) Accept the changed version of the tank / trade-in.

 

Option 3 should not be the only option. That's what you've currently offered. There needs to be more than that.

 

I currently have somewhere between 75-80 Premium tanks. A trade-in is pretty useless to me, because I already have every Premium that I've wanted... And unless you offered an exchange to something like the Chieftan/T95 (Which would upset all of the CW players), then a trade-in serves no purpose for a player like me. Accepting the changed tank is also going to be pointless - Because of how many Premiums I already have, I own a tank of every different playstyle. The changed tank would not be able to offer anything unique.

 

Thus, what choice do I have? I can't trade-in, and if I accept the changed version I get screwed because I specifically got the Pref MM tanks I did because of their Pref MM. A full gold refund must be an option. The ability to keep the tank in its current state, as a Pref MM vehicle, must also be an option.

 

Otherwise you're just screwing your players.


Edited by Scorpiany, May 22 2018 - 12:42.


dmb47 #40 Posted May 22 2018 - 00:10

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SO--I pay cash for a product.  After I buy it, you change the specs of said product(removing pref. MM and "Buffing" the stats to make it the WORST T8 heavy)--and you are being "NICE" to me by allowing me to give you MORE money?  Cash refund please.




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