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I am willing to accept the pref MM change if

KV5 MM 3/5/7 IS6 E25 Super P Type 59 T-34-3

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hikerjon1 #41 Posted May 22 2018 - 16:31

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The 2K gold is the price that you ​MAY​ have to pay if you trade in your KV-5 for another premium. So, if you want to trade it in for a Lowe it will cost you some gold--because the Lowe costs more. 

 

If you keep the improved KV-5, there's no charge. If you sell it, you will get compensation in credits, not gold. This is the same a selling any other tank.



CapPhrases #42 Posted May 22 2018 - 17:57

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View Posthikerjon1, on May 22 2018 - 10:31, said:

The 2K gold is the price that you ​MAY​ have to pay if you trade in your KV-5 for another premium. So, if you want to trade it in for a Lowe it will cost you some gold--because the Lowe costs more. 

 

If you keep the improved KV-5, there's no charge. If you sell it, you will get compensation in credits, not gold. This is the same a selling any other tank.

 

why don't they just make it simple and allow me to get my T-34-3's gold worth back instead? why the nonsense of trades? you know they'll do the typical BS of "only same tier or above" for the trade ins. I'd rather have the flexibility of gold than the fussiness of dealing with a list of trade in vehicles.

ArmorStorm #43 Posted May 22 2018 - 18:26

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View PostCapPhrases, on May 22 2018 - 07:07, said:

my refund should be free, not including a 2K gold charge. that is all I have to say on this debacle

 

You are reading it wrong.  Based on the gold cost of the trade-in VS, the new premium you want you will pay UP TO 2000 gold.  Could be nothing if you are picking a like-value tank, could be up to 2000 gold, if you are selecting something like the Lowe.

ArmorStorm #44 Posted May 22 2018 - 18:29

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View PostCapPhrases, on May 22 2018 - 10:57, said:

 

why don't they just make it simple and allow me to get my T-34-3's gold worth back instead? why the nonsense of trades? you know they'll do the typical BS of "only same tier or above" for the trade ins. I'd rather have the flexibility of gold than the fussiness of dealing with a list of trade in vehicles.

 

They SHOULD absolutely offer the gold value of the tank as an option.  My choice whether to select a new tank, convert experience or whatever.  Dumb of them not to offer that really.

Mikosah #45 Posted May 22 2018 - 19:10

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View PostMacDaddyMatty, on May 22 2018 - 07:34, said:

E-25 needs to be bigger, slower, and slower firing gun.

I suspect they will put missiles and a turret on it (oh wait, no its not Russian).


 

Spoiler

 

 

The problem is that relying on MM alone for balancing is a very unreliable solution to any of our problems. Imagine for instance if they gave the E25 normal MM. Its still going to be top tier and when it is then the tier 5s are just as screwed as they would be if they met an E25 right now. So changing from limited MM to normal MM is a placebo if that's the only change that's headed our way. Balancing a tank to be fair in both the +2 and the -2 scenarios is an exercise in futility, and even WG is smart enough not to even bother trying. The problem is that they still use +/-2MM and that leaves us with a game that only kind of works some of the time.



CapPhrases #46 Posted May 22 2018 - 19:22

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View PostMikosah, on May 22 2018 - 13:10, said:

 

The problem is that relying on MM alone for balancing is a very unreliable solution to any of our problems. Imagine for instance if they gave the E25 normal MM. Its still going to be top tier and when it is then the tier 5s are just as screwed as they would be if they met an E25 right now. So changing from limited MM to normal MM is a placebo if that's the only change that's headed our way. Balancing a tank to be fair in both the +2 and the -2 scenarios is an exercise in futility, and even WG is smart enough not to even bother trying. The problem is that they still use +/-2MM and that leaves us with a game that only kind of works some of the time.

 

^^ exactly. WG with their new prems is constantly walking a razor edge. if they make a tier 8 that can fight tier 10's then it will just roflstomp as top tier. however if they make it balanced to not be unfair against tier 6 tanks no one is gonna want it since tier 10 tanks will just roll right over it.  it's nearly impossible to make something not completly broken when top tier but still competent when bottom, and if that prem happens to be a heavy that needs to rely on armor to be effective? well rip tier 6 then as WG tries to make it competent when bottom tier. why is WG so obsessed with +/-2 mm? some of us average players have difficulty with some same tier tanks how are we supposed to deal with coming across something with literally twice the hitpoints, massive firepower upgrades, armor upgrades, and mobility upgrades? it just doesn't work so well so we have to depend on higher tier tanks to do it, and if our top tiers are derp when theirs aren't the game is usually fairly well decided right there. I will admit right up front that i'm kinda a filthy casual who just wants to be able to play with his tanks without having to try and scrape and claw my way through 70% bottom tier games. it isn't fun.

and isn't that why I downloaded this game in the first place? to have fun?



Bogart1943 #47 Posted May 22 2018 - 19:22

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I might as well change my player name to Ben_Dover with all this love we're getting.

ethics_gradient #48 Posted May 22 2018 - 19:26

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e25 will need to be smaller, faster, better cammo, and better penetration.  :-)

 

Type 59 needs better penetration and bigger engine.



the_dude_76 #49 Posted May 22 2018 - 19:28

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View PostNunya_000, on May 22 2018 - 15:20, said:

 

The cash value of a tank has no relevance after it is purchased as it has no resale value.

 

I have over 11 preferred MM tanks in my garage.  Many of them I purchased for the sole purpose of it's preferred MM.  While  am going to wait and see what the final product turns out to be before I twist my panties into a bunch, if I am not satisfied with the result, WG should offer a reimbursement.....even if it is a partial reimbursement because I did play them and obtained some enjoyment in their current state.

 

Why would they reimburse you for something that has no value??

 

Sorry but you can't have it both ways, either the tanks have some actual cash value or they don't.



Frostblitz20 #50 Posted May 22 2018 - 19:30

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View Postthe_dude_76, on May 22 2018 - 14:58, said:

 

So you think you deserve gold compensation because they're going to BUFF your tanks??? This makes sense to you somehow???

The buffs are subpar to getting your tank bent over by tier 10’s while you bounce every shell your shoot at them. Just look at the kv5 changes you have less then a 15% chance to even take off half the hp off a t10 heavy due to 217 pen and 200mm frontal armor isn’t going to block anything not even from tier 9 



Nunya_000 #51 Posted May 22 2018 - 19:31

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View Postthe_dude_76, on May 22 2018 - 10:28, said:

 

Why would they reimburse you for something that has no value??

 

Sorry but you can't have it both ways, either the tanks have some actual cash value or they don't.

 

So as not to piss off customers.

 

While the tank does not have any resale value (i.e. turning a $35 tank into a $50 tank does not matter to the player), it still has some personal value.  People know they spent $35-$50 on a tank and the reason they spent that much money.  If you remove one of the reasons they spent that much money, they will not take it lightly.  The Kelly Blue Book value after the buff is not relevance to the players.  They will not see any theoretical increase in value as it does not really change anything.  They have one tank of a certain tier in their garage that they spent real money on.

 

While I often agree with some things you post...and even agree with the logic of your arguments in this post, in this case you seem to have a disconnect of understanding of the average consumer.  Logic does not really apply when your are dealing with emotional driven responses.  



the_dude_76 #52 Posted May 22 2018 - 19:39

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View PostFrostblitz20, on May 22 2018 - 18:30, said:

The buffs are subpar to getting your tank bent over by tier 10’s while you bounce every shell your shoot at them. Just look at the kv5 changes you have less then a 15% chance to even take off half the hp off a t10 heavy due to 217 pen and 200mm frontal armor isn’t going to block anything not even from tier 9 

 

Since they've only announced one tank I'm not quite sure how you've determined that they are all subpar. The KV5 is utterly useless right now, these buffs will put it on par with the other tier 8 prem heavies and will be a significant upgrade over the current tank which is virtually unplayable right now.

the_dude_76 #53 Posted May 22 2018 - 19:48

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View PostNunya_000, on May 22 2018 - 18:31, said:

 

So as not to piss off customers.

 

While the tank does not have any resale value (i.e. turning a $35 tank into a $50 tank does not matter to the player), it still has some personal value.  People know they spent $35-$50 on a tank and the reason they spent that much money.  If you remove one of the reasons they spent that much money, they will not take it lightly.  The Kelly Blue Book value after the buff is not relevance to the players.  They will not see any theoretical increase in value as it does not really change anything.  They have one tank of a certain tier in their garage that they spent real money on. 

 

First let me say that I don't disagree with the idea of offering a refund, I just don't see it happening.

 

But I can't get behind the idea that players should be allowed to "trade up" for no additional expense, discounted maybe, but not zero. I only paid 35 bucks for my KV5 if I were allowed to trade that tank for a $50 tank how would that be fair to the people who had to pay full price for that tank?

 

And you keep talking about how "the players" will feel. Well I'm one of those players and I really don't have any problem. In fact the only reason I bought the KV5 was in anticipation of the long overdue buff. I'm quite pleased with the fact that the tank I paid 35 bucks for will now be on par with the tanks offered for 50 bucks.



Nunya_000 #54 Posted May 22 2018 - 20:17

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View Postthe_dude_76, on May 22 2018 - 10:48, said:

 

First let me say that I don't disagree with the idea of offering a refund, I just don't see it happening.

 

But I can't get behind the idea that players should be allowed to "trade up" for no additional expense, discounted maybe, but not zero. I only paid 35 bucks for my KV5 if I were allowed to trade that tank for a $50 tank how would that be fair to the people who had to pay full price for that tank?

 

And you keep talking about how "the players" will feel. Well I'm one of those players and I really don't have any problem. In fact the only reason I bought the KV5 was in anticipation of the long overdue buff. I'm quite pleased with the fact that the tank I paid 35 bucks for will now be on par with the tanks offered for 50 bucks.

 

As I said, I do agree with the logic of your argument. 

 

Some things that many people will not consider:

 

1.  They may have played thousands or 10s of thousands of battles in a certain tank, but they will expect full refunds.  Many will not consider that they may have already received the entertainment value of their purchase.

 

2.  They may actually like the buffed tank.

 

3.  Any idea that they will "trade-up" will likely cost them money.  Saw a guy ask if he could trade up a T-7 Combat Car for a Defender.  I do not think WG will allow an open ended trade up.  Certain tanks will likely only be allowed to trade for specific tanks.

 

4.  It is doubtful that a cash refund is being considered.  We are not losing anything, though the argument could be made that what we ended up with is not what wey purchased.  I doubt WG is going to open their pocketbook.

 

5.  Some people are probably already scheming on ways that they can take advantage of this change to greatly benefit themselves.

 

Problem is that most of the responses to this change are emotion based and not logic based.  People are afraid that the tank they paid money for will not be as desirable to play....and some just want to take advantage of the situation.



Frostblitz20 #55 Posted May 22 2018 - 20:25

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View Postthe_dude_76, on May 22 2018 - 19:39, said:

 

Since they've only announced one tank I'm not quite sure how you've determined that they are all subpar. The KV5 is utterly useless right now, these buffs will put it on par with the other tier 8 prem heavies and will be a significant upgrade over the current tank which is virtually unplayable right now.

How it only gives it better pen the armor values do not make it on par with t8’s as they removed 150mm off the back side and 80/90 in other spots on the back which reverse sidescrapping is what players did in it. The turret is even easily pennable with 230 at its strongest spot the mantle.  This thing is a huge walking pile of hp/credits to mostly every tier 8 at least most tanks have a strong point to them this one does not.... 



the_dude_76 #56 Posted May 22 2018 - 20:48

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View PostFrostblitz20, on May 22 2018 - 19:25, said:

How it only gives it better pen the armor values do not make it on par with t8’s as they removed 150mm off the back side and 80/90 in other spots on the back which reverse sidescrapping is what players did in it. The turret is even easily pennable with 230 at its strongest spot the mantle.  This thing is a huge walking pile of hp/credits to mostly every tier 8 at least most tanks have a strong point to them this one does not.... 

 

Players reversed side scraped ONLY so they could hide R2D2 and R2D2 is getting a major buff.

The simple fact is that we won't know how any of these tanks play or preform until we try them. Preemptively btching about what you think might happen really makes no sense.



the_dude_76 #57 Posted May 22 2018 - 20:52

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View PostNunya_000, on May 22 2018 - 19:17, said:

People are afraid that the tank they paid money for will not be as desirable to play....and some just want to take advantage of the situation.

 

I agree with all of your points, especially #1, I had not taken that one into consideration myself.



Zeedox #58 Posted May 22 2018 - 20:52

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View Postthe_dude_76, on May 22 2018 - 14:48, said:

 

...And you keep talking about how "the players" will feel. Well I'm one of those players and I really don't have any problem. ....

 

I'm one of those players too and I DO have a problem with it - It's UNETHICAL

Frostblitz20 #59 Posted May 22 2018 - 20:54

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View Postthe_dude_76, on May 22 2018 - 20:48, said:

 

Players reversed side scraped ONLY so they could hide R2D2 and R2D2 is getting a major buff.

The simple fact is that we won't know how any of these tanks play or preform until we try them. Preemptively btching about what you think might happen really makes no sense.

200mm still gotta hide it even though turret is weak as well and the stats are already posted by WG so it’s not preemptively.



Hurk #60 Posted May 22 2018 - 20:55

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they just need to handle it the same way as the super P was handled.

cash out everyone and let those that want it, buy it back. 

there is no reason at all to make people have to choose a different tank over the one they purchased.






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