Jump to content


A KV-5 Fiasco Breakdown. Where do we go from here.

KV-5 Pref-MM changes

  • Please log in to reply
34 replies to this topic

KingofDragons #21 Posted May 25 2018 - 17:38

    Staff sergeant

  • -Players-
  • 20752 battles
  • 495
  • Member since:
    05-14-2011

I paid real money for the KV-5 but lets say i payed 7500 Gold  Wouldn't the new updated KV-5 be worth more once updated ? So either they think player base is dumb or they are actually stupid..

 

My take is they are stupid.. You piss people off by taking something away and breaking our trust and now , adding insult to injury , you want to take more instead of apologizing and making things right...

 

I'm happy the community is standing up to this B.S..

 

I'll be keeping my KV-5 either way and just use it on Frontline..



FineousOrlon #22 Posted May 25 2018 - 17:38

    Sergeant

  • -Players-
  • 20679 battles
  • 217
  • Member since:
    11-29-2014

View Post24_inch_pythons, on May 25 2018 - 16:11, said:

 

1 Pref MM tank screws up the MM for up to 29 regular tanks.

 

Yeah, considering how long pref MM tanks have been around, I am not buying this.  WG is unable to prioritize things in their MM so that 2 valued commodities, pref MM, and the long-term loyalty of customers who have bought pref MM tanks, are adequately managed.

 

Also, 29 tanks potentially mess at least 1 pref MM tank's main selling point in any match with at least 1 pref MM tank.  A stark foundational statement can still have 2 ways to be presented.

 

edit: removed the last phrase, which was only 1/3 of a sentence.

 

 


Edited by FineousOrlon, May 25 2018 - 17:42.


FineousOrlon #23 Posted May 25 2018 - 17:41

    Sergeant

  • -Players-
  • 20679 battles
  • 217
  • Member since:
    11-29-2014

View PostVampiresbane, on May 25 2018 - 16:47, said:

 

Your statement oversimplifies the issue.  That 1 pref mm tank doesn't really mess it up for 29 tanks.  All the tier 8 and tier 9 tanks of those 29 tanks listed may have only been in queue for 10 secs.  That's up to 23 tanks that got +1/-1 mm because you queue'd.  I'd wager those players would much rather play +1/-1 vs 8's and 9's than be in a battle vs 8,9, and 10's.

.......

 

Now do you think most players would rather keep their pref mm tanks and deal with a minute longer queue?  I believe so.  I would and still do.  I still play my WZ-111, 112, and Super Pershing.  Having pref mm is why the majority of us bought those tanks to begin with.

 

OMG, yes.  Upvote incoming!

 



RageSimulationInProgress #24 Posted May 25 2018 - 21:55

    Private

  • -Players-
  • 13145 battles
  • 4
  • [-TBS-] -TBS-
  • Member since:
    07-02-2015

Mr. Python sits back and makes his compelling argument then reveals his biased position at the end. You don't care about pref MM then what do you hope to gain with this thread?

 

You sir are as full of crap as WG. Probably work for them too... And if not then stop defending wargaming for treating us like IDIOTS which is the ACTUAL ISSUE.

 

They can't figure out how to make a decent MM algorithm or they don't want to but they are happy to blame everything and everyone else for the problems.

(This Includes their community contributors who have been blamed by WG for making customers notice bad things about their games.) 

 

HELLO. EARTH TO EVERYONE! WG=SCUM

 

STOP DEFENDING SCUM 24 inch python you didn't even notice the COMPLETE BS in WG's article did you?

 

 


Edited by RageSimulationInProgress, May 26 2018 - 12:05.


24_inch_pythons #25 Posted May 25 2018 - 22:50

    Major

  • Players
  • 22853 battles
  • 4,238
  • [-P-] -P-
  • Member since:
    03-28-2012

View PostRageSimulationInProgress, on May 25 2018 - 14:55, said:

Mr. Python sits back and makes his compelling argument then reveals his biased position at the end. You don't care about pref MM then what do you hope to gain with this thread?

 

You sir are as full of crap as WG. Probably work for them too... And if not then stop defending wargaming for treating us like IDIOTS which is the ACTUAL ISSUE.

 

They can't figure out how to make a decent MM algorithm or they don't want to but they are happy to blame everything and everyone else for the problems.

(This Includes their community contributors who have been blamed by WG for making customers notice bad things about their games.) 

 

HELLO. EARTH TO EVERYONE! WG=SCUM

 

STOP DEFENDING SCUM 24 inch python (1 inch brain) you didn't even notice the COMPLETE BS in WG's article did you?

 

 

 

But what if their claim isn't [edited]. Why would they make all this up. Why have they been talking about Preferential MM tanks screwing up the matchmaker for years, multiple years? They were talking about how pref tanks screwed up matchmaker like three years ago.

RageSimulationInProgress #26 Posted May 26 2018 - 00:22

    Private

  • -Players-
  • 13145 battles
  • 4
  • [-TBS-] -TBS-
  • Member since:
    07-02-2015

The Match Maker Algorithm is the problem and if they ACTUALLY WANTED TO FIX THE GAME it would also be the solution, think about it would it not be easier to fix that then changing all of these pref mm tanks and trying to "balance" them all? YES IT WOULD. But that is not what wargaming wants. I know it. WE ALL KNOW IT.

 

They are getting exactly what they want when people believe they are genuinely trying to fix the MM with this little idea of theirs.

 

P.S. Here's a good question if they are genuine about this then why are they trying EXTRA hard to sell these pref mm tanks right now instead of doing the right thing and pulling them out of the store until they figure out what they are doing...?


Edited by RageSimulationInProgress, May 26 2018 - 00:33.


Stonecoldelf #27 Posted May 26 2018 - 04:48

    Corporal

  • Players
  • 26403 battles
  • 88
  • [FLUKE] FLUKE
  • Member since:
    02-26-2014
Yeah, this one is all on Match Maker. I think the ADULT solution would be to fix match maker.  No one would be butt hurt then.  Maybe the Unicums who love farming hapless -2 should take the hit on this one and we can move to a -1/+1 system.

Robert_Skera #28 Posted May 26 2018 - 10:15

    Corporal

  • Players
  • 15592 battles
  • 63
  • Member since:
    06-23-2011

View PostStonecoldelf, on May 26 2018 - 03:48, said:

Yeah, this one is all on Match Maker. I think the ADULT solution would be to fix match maker.  No one would be butt hurt then.  Maybe the Unicums who love farming hapless -2 should take the hit on this one and we can move to a -1/+1 system.

 

Problem is you would still be bad in a -0/+0 MM.  Baddies are going to get rolled no matter what the MM does.  Ive rolled the T9 portion of an enemy team in a KV-5 while the rest of my team, T9's included, died to the enemy T8's.

 

Tiers are not what is broken with MM, inconsistent player skill is.  Player stats need to be accounted for in the MM if they aren't already.


Edited by Robert_Skera, May 26 2018 - 10:18.


24_inch_pythons #29 Posted May 26 2018 - 12:14

    Major

  • Players
  • 22853 battles
  • 4,238
  • [-P-] -P-
  • Member since:
    03-28-2012

View PostRageSimulationInProgress, on May 25 2018 - 17:22, said:

The Match Maker Algorithm is the problem and if they ACTUALLY WANTED TO FIX THE GAME it would also be the solution, think about it would it not be easier to fix that then changing all of these pref mm tanks and trying to "balance" them all? YES IT WOULD. But that is not what wargaming wants. I know it. WE ALL KNOW IT.

 

They are getting exactly what they want when people believe they are genuinely trying to fix the MM with this little idea of theirs.

 

P.S. Here's a good question if they are genuine about this then why are they trying EXTRA hard to sell these pref mm tanks right now instead of doing the right thing and pulling them out of the store until they figure out what they are doing...?

 

 You're right, of course. They should stop selling Pref MM premiums. They should have done that three years ago when they came out publicly that Pref MM tanks were causing problems with the MM. I addressed that in the first post of the thread. As to why I think it's happening... I think that like any company Wargaming probably has different departments in charge of different areas with very poor control overhead. So I assume that whatever department is in charge of the MM has no control over what is being sold in the Premium shop. And the department that is in charge of the premium shop is told by Wargaming to make as much money as possible so they keep selling whatever they damn well please. Either that or Wargaming really believes that people are going to be so blown away by the buffed pref premiums that they aren't going to care that they bought it today and tomorrow it gets changed. Neither is really a good corporate culture and the second possibility is probably downright stupid... but again, my guess is it's the fact of different departments given different goals / not working together on a single problem.

RageSimulationInProgress #30 Posted May 26 2018 - 12:22

    Private

  • -Players-
  • 13145 battles
  • 4
  • [-TBS-] -TBS-
  • Member since:
    07-02-2015

View PostRobert_Skera, on May 26 2018 - 10:15, said:

 

Problem is you would still be bad in a -0/+0 MM.  Baddies are going to get rolled no matter what the MM does.  Ive rolled the T9 portion of an enemy team in a KV-5 while the rest of my team, T9's included, died to the enemy T8's.

 

Tiers are not what is broken with MM, inconsistent player skill is.  Player stats need to be accounted for in the MM if they aren't already.

 

I have to agree with this and i will be the first to admit i am at best a decent player, don't really care to be better, all i want out of this game is... FUN.

 

REMEMBER FUN IN VIDEO GAMES? yeah i know such a concept

 

but seriously for a game where the devs and players alike are SO obsessed with STATISTICS (over fun) you would think it would occur to someone to use the BUILT-IN PLAYER RATING SYSTEM to help the MM be more even on a team to team basis. I think it would help, if done right of course... add the PR# into the MM calculations...? Just a thought...

 

Most random battles these days are an easy one sided victory for the team that got most of the better players regardless of the tanks on the field.

 

I personally don't even enjoy being on the winning side of these battles, I want a fun battle that takes a little skill and forethought to win, or even a loss that came down to the other team fighting harder and smarter rather than just being stacked with unicums.



JimmyJimboJimBob #31 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 19:46

    Corporal

  • Players
  • 23782 battles
  • 20
  • [VIPR] VIPR
  • Member since:
    02-22-2012
What about the rest? The KV-5 is only the first tank to be remodeled. They fully intend to remove ALL preferential MM tanks from the game starting with this one. This is just the first step.

Ich_bin_Hass #32 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 20:14

    First lieutenant

  • Players
  • 74937 battles
  • 760
  • [ALL] ALL
  • Member since:
    04-30-2011

Ok my friends. The whole issue here is said to be wait times. LOL  I remember when you could wait a minute and a half to get into a battle long ago. I remember when battles use to time out to a draw long ago. Oh not only that. But Pref tanks screw up the MM as it searches for more T9's.  I remember when you could get dropped into a battle with up too TEN, I repeat TEN SPG's per side. Now since WoT's has screwed the MM so bad you can face up too TEN TD's per side. Now, it's Preferential MM Tanks that's the problem. The reason we have all this trouble is WoT's don't care what it's paying customer wants or feels when they get SCREWED. They cater too the big clans and most of those are based out of Europe or Russia. Why do you think that the NA servers have been hemorrhaging subscribers and players for the last three years. Because North American players don't matter.

 

  Face it people. Wargames will not treat those that paid real money for these items fairly. FORGET IT. Either pay your 2000 gold and SHUT UP. Or ! Just keep the tanks in the garage not to be seen again. Oh ! Don't EVEN pay for anymore premiums. Because if they were such trouble in the first place ? WHY ARE THEY STILL PEDDLING THEM. 



dcfan #33 Posted Jun 11 2018 - 21:42

    Corporal

  • Players
  • 8762 battles
  • 27
  • Member since:
    01-02-2014

View PostVampiresbane, on May 25 2018 - 09:47, said:

 

Your statement oversimplifies the issue.  That 1 pref mm tank doesn't really mess it up for 29 tanks.  All the tier 8 and tier 9 tanks of those 29 tanks listed may have only been in queue for 10 secs.  That's up to 23 tanks that got +1/-1 mm because you queue'd.  I'd wager those players would much rather play +1/-1 vs 8's and 9's than be in a battle vs 8,9, and 10's.

 

Do yourself a favor.  Get a stopwatch.

1. Click battle in a tier 8.

2. Record the time to get in.

3. Click battle in a perf tier 8.

4. Record the time to get in.

5. Click battle in a tier 10.

6. Record the time to get in.

 

Now compare all three.  I'd be willing to bet 5g that the order of longest queue times are: tier 10, tier 8 pref, tier 8.  Now compare the raw times for the pref 8 to the reg 8.  Anecdotally, I'd reason your reg tier 8 tanks take anywhere from 10 seconds to 45 seconds to find a match during prime time.  Your pref 8 tanks probably take anywhere from 30 secs to 90 seconds to find a match during prime time.

 

Now do you think most players would rather keep their pref mm tanks and deal with a minute longer queue?  I believe so.  I would and still do.  I still play my WZ-111, 112, and Super Pershing.  Having pref mm is why the majority of us bought those tanks to begin with.

 

I did exactly this and got these results. Hardly scientific BUT: tier ten Super Conq:  1:08 and 1:20

                                                                                                  pref MM Jagitg 88:  :47 and :07 (top tier both games!!)

                                                                                                  tier eight T-34-2: :19 (tier 9 battle)

                                                                                                  tier eight STA-1: :39 (tier 10 battle)

This was just this afternoon, in the central time zone between noon and 3pm



Nonamanadus #34 Posted Jun 12 2018 - 02:25

    Major

  • Players
  • 28102 battles
  • 3,782
  • [HBG] HBG
  • Member since:
    02-02-2013

The talk about pref premiums messing with MM is pure sewage, if anything you would see those 1.4% tanks flooding the tier VIIs & VI queues. 

 

Computers are really good at sorting numbers and data, so if Wargaming is having difficulty organizing the numbers then they should hire smarter programmers. At most players with pref tanks would experience a slightly longer wait time to get into a match, probably the same time limit experienced by arty players (in fact when you are loading into a match Wargaming advises you with a message that the wait times might be a bit longer). 

 

 



Strategist1776 #35 Posted Aug 10 2018 - 20:22

    Private

  • Players
  • 4782 battles
  • 6
  • Member since:
    09-18-2013

You know what I say to all this Hoopla if you can't play the KV-5 in any matchmaking you probably dont know how to use it. I can play it in tier 10 all day and bounce tier 10 HEAT without issues from a JdpzE100 its fun to watch other people waste their money at my KV-5. I could care less about all the other things that has everyone else riled up its only because you guys stopped having fun and started worring about your WN8 more than playing the game as for thats all it is A GAME                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        

                                                                                                                                                                                  


Edited by Strategist1776, Aug 10 2018 - 20:23.





1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users