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ThePigSheFlies #61 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 18:13

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View PostHurk, on Jun 04 2018 - 00:38, said:

come on pig, you know for them its easier to not have pref mm to deal with. they have valid reasons to want to get rid of it. 

 

the issue to me isnt getting rid of pre-mm, its how they are going about it.  Frankly, if i were WG, i would cash out everyone with gold for all premium MM tanks, and remove them from the game. then slowly reintroduce them over time after putting some serious effort into determining if its even worth it. 

 

for example, the Type 59 can drop right in to the game as a non-pref tank, since its already better than the tech tree t-34-2

 

meanwhile, tanks like the KV-5, T-14, Churchill III, etc, do not fit as easily, since their big reason for pref mm is having an absolutely crap gun.  I would consider down-tiering most of them.

and then there is the TOG II.... yea... that will be fun at tier 5. 

 

but other tanks like the T26-e4, well, if it goes standard matching, it needs to be a better armored, slower pershing... not an ideal fix. because it cannot shine vs tier 10s at all, the armor is useless by that point. 

 

but things like the IS-6 black and T-34 black, etc... introduce the premium camo like they did for the warhammer BDR, and let people keep the black paint. 

 

a gold cash out might be viable if they didn't insist on artificially holding down the supply of premium tanks by only offering many of them in the premium shop - most, typically bundled...

 

even if they cashed us out by giving us a "premium shop store credit" it wouldn't work because all too often the majority of times, the premium shop only has bundled options...

 

it also doesn't address multiple other issues. 

  • many tank collectors already have all of the premiums they need/want
  • point me to the tech tree tier 8 russian premium heavy tank trainer - I don't want to trade a kv5 for a lowe, unless wargaming is going to introduce international crew training abilities to premium tanks...


the_Deadly_Bulb #62 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 18:28

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View PostDomoSapien, on Jun 04 2018 - 09:04, said:

¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Just trying to be friendly and helpful. Sorry if me trying to be optimistic offended you, but what I said was genuine. I sincerely appreciate the support of all our players, as I know all too well how difficult it can be to fit premium purchases into one's budget when trying to, say, make ends meet in college like I was when I started playing. Buying a T34, for example, because I couldn't afford to keep buying Premium every month but needed credits for my Jagdpanther II, was a very big and difficult decision for me.

I'm sorry you feel that was a patronizing response, because it came from the heart. I understand you're passionate about the game that you know and love, just as I am. If shooting a bit of negativity my way is a productive outlet, I'm happy to receive that negativity. I'm also happy to add your feedback or your suggestions to my feedback reports. 


 

 

I've spent in excess of $3k on this game.

To thank me your intent is to [edited]my PMM tanks.

 

Not 1 cent more.

ESAD.

 

Take that message to your "Global Team"


 

Don't forget to tell them this is from a player widely considered a shill for WG



SpectreHD #63 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 18:34

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View PostDomoSapien, on Jun 05 2018 - 01:04, said:

¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Just trying to be friendly and helpful. Sorry if me trying to be optimistic offended you, but what I said was genuine. I sincerely appreciate the support of all our players, as I know all too well how difficult it can be to fit premium purchases into one's budget when trying to, say, make ends meet in college like I was when I started playing. Buying a T34, for example, because I couldn't afford to keep buying Premium every month but needed credits for my Jagdpanther II, was a very big and difficult decision for me.

I'm sorry you feel that was a patronizing response, because it came from the heart. I understand you're passionate about the game that you know and love, just as I am. If shooting a bit of negativity my way is a productive outlet, I'm happy to receive that negativity. I'm also happy to add your feedback or your suggestions to my feedback reports. 

 

I get where you are coming from but you need to read the atmosphere. Many, many here, at least on the forums, are not optimistic not just with this issue but the game as a whole. From the news statement from the Perfecting Preferential Premiums, it clearly stated that the MM itself was causing the MM problems. It would be far easier for WG to give a special step for preferential MM premiums to not always have the MM find tier 9 vehicles all the time. Heck, the MM for ALL tanks need to give a more or less same amount of same tier, +-1, and +-2 matches. It is the MMs fault that it always wants to find 3/5/7 match.

 

But the guys at Minsk can't recognise this or maybe the other region office are just not communicating this enough to Minsk.

 

Despite that, you guys are still selling more of premiums that supposedly causing the issues with the MM. So the players are getting mixed signals. Do we believe that article that preferential premiums are the root of the problem (while the article stating it is the MM doing the foul up) while the morons in marketing are selling more of these preferential premiums and the permanent pref MM vehicles are still left in the Premium shop and in game?

 

To tell you the truth after all this years I can never tell what communicated to me is truth or not. This whole situation of the article telling us one thing, and the actions of the marketing and sales team telling us another. While making ridiculous bundles.

 

It is okay to want to be optimistic. But the state of the game doesn't warrant it (population shrinking, balance is fubar,) and that is why you see some not liking your post and view it as patronising. 

 

View PostThePigSheFlies, on Jun 05 2018 - 01:13, said:

 

a gold cash out might be viable if they didn't insist on artificially holding down the supply of premium tanks by only offering many of them in the premium shop - most, typically bundled...

 

even if they cashed us out by giving us a "premium shop store credit" it wouldn't work because all too often the majority of times, the premium shop only has bundled options...

 

it also doesn't address multiple other issues. 

  • many tank collectors already have all of the premiums they need/want
  • point me to the tech tree tier 8 russian premium heavy tank trainer - I don't want to trade a kv5 for a lowe, unless wargaming is going to introduce international crew training abilities to premium tanks...

 

This. WG needs to finally release ALL premiums into the tech tree. It used to be like this. A new premium vehicle would be released and for one patch cycle, it stayed in the premium shop and when the next patch comes, that premium gets put into the ingame respective nation tree. If WG is afraid of certain OP premiums like the Defender/252 as to why they are rarely seen, WG needs to grow a pair and just nerf them. Maybe it will force WG to rethink how they balance vehicles because their current process evidently isn't working.

 

Minsk needs to think long and hard how they want to proceed with their plan because it seems most do not like it.


Edited by SpectreHD, Jun 04 2018 - 18:37.


DomoSapien #64 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 18:47

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View Postthe_Deadly_Bulb, on Jun 04 2018 - 11:28, said:

 

I've spent in excess of $3k on this game.

To thank me your intent is to [edited]my PMM tanks.

 

Not 1 cent more.

ESAD.

 

Take that message to your "Global Team"


 

Don't forget to tell them this is from a player widely considered a shill for WG

 

I don't pay attention to politics, be they forum politics or otherwise. I care about facts. I don't know who considers you a shill, nor do I know what you're implying with quotes around "Global Team" but you can easily provide the same feedback without having to resort to personal insults and profanity.

I'm just trying to help you, man. I personally don't want to do anything to your PMM tanks, nor do I personally have the power to do anything to your PMM Tanks, one way or another. 

So you're welcome to continue with the insults or you could let me know what you would like to see as an acceptable alternative to the most recently proposed plan of action; that way I can make sure that's expressed in my next report. I'm not kidding when I'm saying that I've been making note of each and every comment I've come across regarding sentiment around recent policy decisions. So whaddaya say, can we try and turn this into a constructive dialogue?

ShookYang #65 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 18:56

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View PostDomoSapien, on Jun 04 2018 - 09:47, said:

 

So you're welcome to continue with the insults or you could let me know what you would like to see as an acceptable alternative to the most recently proposed plan of action; that way I can make sure that's expressed in my next report. I'm not kidding when I'm saying that I've been making note of each and every comment I've come across regarding sentiment around recent policy decisions. So whaddaya say, can we try and turn this into a constructive dialogue?

Make upgrading pref mm tanks to non-pref mm with buffs an option that we can opt out of.  If we prefer to keep our pref mm tanks as is, let us.  That means no buffs and still have pref mm, with the expectation that WG will stop trying to fix matchmaking for pref mm tanks.



SpectreHD #66 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 19:01

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View PostDomoSapien, on Jun 05 2018 - 01:47, said:

 

I don't pay attention to politics, be they forum politics or otherwise. I care about facts. I don't know who considers you a shill, nor do I know what you're implying with quotes around "Global Team" but you can easily provide the same feedback without having to resort to personal insults and profanity.

I'm just trying to help you, man. I personally don't want to do anything to your PMM tanks, nor do I personally have the power to do anything to your PMM Tanks, one way or another. 

So you're welcome to continue with the insults or you could let me know what you would like to see as an acceptable alternative to the most recently proposed plan of action; that way I can make sure that's expressed in my next report. I'm not kidding when I'm saying that I've been making note of each and every comment I've come across regarding sentiment around recent policy decisions. So whaddaya say, can we try and turn this into a constructive dialogue?

 

I think he is just highlighting that he has been a WG supporter that others on the forums have gone as far and labelled him a shill. Even then he does not like the decision to alter the PMM vehicles.

 

He is also not insulting anyone. The "[edited]" in his post is just him showing how discontent he is. The profanity was not directed at any individual.

 

View PostShookYang, on Jun 05 2018 - 01:56, said:

Make upgrading pref mm tanks to non-pref mm with buffs an option that we can opt out of.  If we prefer to keep our pref mm tanks as is, let us.  That means no buffs and still have pref mm, with the expectation that WG will stop trying to fix matchmaking for pref mm tanks.

 

No, WG should still alter the MM. They got themselves into this mess with their wonderful 3/5/7 template even as tanks are more or less balanced within their same tier. So they should alter the MM, not only for preferential MM tanks even after whatever change the implement and players still keeping their original PMM vehicles, but for all tanks to not always be bottom tier MOST of the time.

dont_ping_me #67 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 19:03

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View PostDomoSapien, on Jun 04 2018 - 12:47, said:

 

I don't pay attention to politics, be they forum politics or otherwise. I care about facts. I don't know who considers you a shill, nor do I know what you're implying with quotes around "Global Team" but you can easily provide the same feedback without having to resort to personal insults and profanity.

I'm just trying to help you, man. I personally don't want to do anything to your PMM tanks, nor do I personally have the power to do anything to your PMM Tanks, one way or another. 

So you're welcome to continue with the insults or you could let me know what you would like to see as an acceptable alternative to the most recently proposed plan of action; that way I can make sure that's expressed in my next report. I'm not kidding when I'm saying that I've been making note of each and every comment I've come across regarding sentiment around recent policy decisions. So whaddaya say, can we try and turn this into a constructive dialogue?

 

Since you want to know what we would consider an acceptable alternative to the PMM changes, here are my demands/suggestions. Feel free to put them in your feedback report so that the development team can ignore them.

 

 

1) Fix the current MM system. 4tankers produced a video that suggested changing MM to 5/5/5 (among other changes). If that worked out as suggested, I would be fine with the removal of PMM status on my PMM tanks (so long as they get some buffage). The main reason people have their pitch forks out is because they are sick and tired of their premium tanks always being bottom tier. So changing our PMM tanks to always see tier 10 tanks is a major kick in the nads.

2) If you don't fix the current MM, I want my PMM tanks to remain as PMM tanks, but they still need to be buffed to be competitive. They are generally unplayable (or unprofitable) since the MM change a year ago.

3) If you really insist on removing their PMM status, I either want a) a full refund (in actual cash - yes I know that is not practical), b) The option to change to another equivalent tank (which is a problem for me since I have them all, or c) Give me a free BIA crew for each one as compensation for losing their PMM status.



commander42 #68 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 19:11

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View PostHurk, on Jun 01 2018 - 15:09, said:

yes, but normal doesnt apply to wot. the playerbase is considerably older on average and spends more. thats why i was wondering if he had some specific released data on the subject.

 

anecdotal but, I know that some people on the forums have said they have spent thousands.  Most people who spend on the game will not spend that much, there are many many people who haven't spent any, and a lot of people who have contributed a small amount, and then the outliers who spend 4(or more..) digits on the game

Whisky_A_Go_Go #69 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 19:13

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I love when the "Admin" post a bunch of elitist, snobbish, condescending crap and when he gets called on it he tries to play the victim and post more elitist, snobbish, condescending crap.

 

Well done, bud.

 

Look, we all know who you are. We all know you got this gig as a thankless addition to other crap already on your plate. We all know you're also part time which is why you're not here often enough to follow a conversation, let alone be able to comment intelligently in it.

 

We know a lot more than you think, so the least you can do is not shell out baseless lip service.

 

The fact is we've complained about the same things for 6 years. You are the 39th community admin I've seen here. You wont be the last.

 

All of you do the same exact thing: deflect, detract and make hollow promises.

 

To be frank, it would be in your best interest to stop posting altogether and let us move on to Admin number 40 just for kicks and grins and an absolute lack of anything better to do.



Kehox #70 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 19:21

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View PostDomoSapien, on Jun 04 2018 - 12:47, said:

can we try and turn this into a constructive dialogue?

 

with PMM change( as exemple )  ... trying to make something constructive ... when the opposite party doesnt answer or clarify the situation( Ex: not giving the entire list of the tank we could/can trade-in after your main post about the change befor it gettin out of hand and go agaisnt the forum/politic rules...) ( and not gettin lock ) ( i got a warning for giving my feedback about the extravaganza and it was justify to tell you that you are not honest ) ... exemple num2 : the extravaganza event ... many customer asked information about shipping/tax/any hidden cost/Exact Model of the CPU .. and i got ask to contact Intel and they cant answer because they arent the compagny that made the event.. )

 

the day that WG will be honest with there customer ... mayby you will be more respected.... if you want to stay in your crap ... stay in it.. dont try to pull the customer in your hole.


Edited by Kehox, Jun 04 2018 - 19:22.


DomoSapien #71 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 19:50

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View PostShookYang, on Jun 04 2018 - 11:56, said:

Make upgrading pref mm tanks to non-pref mm with buffs an option that we can opt out of.  If we prefer to keep our pref mm tanks as is, let us.  That means no buffs and still have pref mm, with the expectation that WG will stop trying to fix matchmaking for pref mm tanks.


I think one of the concerns would be that segmenting players into Pref/Non-Pref matchmaking pools would place even more strain on the matchmaker than prior, resulting in long queue times for one of these groups of players, and the potential for drastically imbalanced matches. But perhaps there is a way to account for this! Thank you for the suggestion.
 

View PostSpectreHD, on Jun 04 2018 - 12:01, said:

 

I think he is just highlighting that he has been a WG supporter that others on the forums have gone as far and labelled him a shill. Even then he does not like the decision to alter the PMM vehicles.

 

He is also not insulting anyone. The "[edited]" in his post is just him showing how discontent he is. The profanity was not directed at any individual.

 

 

No, WG should still alter the MM. They got themselves into this mess with their wonderful 3/5/7 template even as tanks are more or less balanced within their same tier. So they should alter the MM, not only for preferential MM tanks even after whatever change the implement and players still keeping their original PMM vehicles, but for all tanks to not always be bottom tier MOST of the time.


Personally, I think it's disrespectful to call someone a shill for expressing support regarding something they enjoy. By that same logic I think it's unfair to ignore someone's feedback simply because they are upset and don't express it in the politest way. I understand where he's coming from and I genuinely want to hear what his suggestions would be to best address the situation. I genuinely don't know if Pref MM vehicles are having such a drastic impact on the 3/5/7 MM template or if that was simply poor wording on our part, but I want to make sure I can make my report as comprehensive and clear as possible. That means the largest possible volume of citations for all feedback points. The more people that express a particular position, the more examples of that I can include in the report.

View PostLesser_Spotted_Panzer, on Jun 04 2018 - 12:03, said:

 

Since you want to know what we would consider an acceptable alternative to the PMM changes, here are my demands/suggestions. Feel free to put them in your feedback report so that the development team can ignore them.

 

 

1) Fix the current MM system. 4tankers produced a video that suggested changing MM to 5/5/5 (among other changes). If that worked out as suggested, I would be fine with the removal of PMM status on my PMM tanks (so long as they get some buffage). The main reason people have their pitch forks out is because they are sick and tired of their premium tanks always being bottom tier. So changing our PMM tanks to always see tier 10 tanks is a major kick in the nads.

2) If you don't fix the current MM, I want my PMM tanks to remain as PMM tanks, but they still need to be buffed to be competitive. They are generally unplayable (or unprofitable) since the MM change a year ago.

3) If you really insist on removing their PMM status, I either want a) a full refund (in actual cash - yes I know that is not practical), b) The option to change to another equivalent tank (which is a problem for me since I have them all, or c) Give me a free BIA crew for each one as compensation for losing their PMM status.

All interesting suggestions! I am genuinely curious to see how a 5/5/5 template would play out, and I'd definitely be interested in testing something like that out. I think some Pref tanks are in a better place than others, and it would have to be done carefully but usually they are only lacking in certain parameters. Slight buffs to these parameters (for example, the IS-6's penetration values) might be a great way to do it. I agree that a cash refund would be pretty impractical, but honestly the free BIA crew as compensation sounds pretty reasonable to me as a player. 

View Postcommander42, on Jun 04 2018 - 12:11, said:

 

anecdotal but, I know that some people on the forums have said they have spent thousands.  Most people who spend on the game will not spend that much, there are many many people who haven't spent any, and a lot of people who have contributed a small amount, and then the outliers who spend 4(or more..) digits on the game

Certainly, with every free to play game there are some players who spend a loooot of money. And it's difficult to balance the needs of the players who have spent quite a bit on the game, make sure they feel like they're appreciated for the overwhelming financial support they have given our product, but make sure that all players are treated fairly, and players who spend less aren't treated as second-class citizens simply because they can't afford to dish out a bunch of cash on tanks.

View PostWhisky_A_Go_Go, on Jun 04 2018 - 12:13, said:

I love when the "Admin" post a bunch of elitist, snobbish, condescending crap and when he gets called on it he tries to play the victim and post more elitist, snobbish, condescending crap.

 

Well done, bud.

 

Look, we all know who you are. We all know you got this gig as a thankless addition to other crap already on your plate. We all know you're also part time which is why you're not here often enough to follow a conversation, let alone be able to comment intelligently in it.

 

We know a lot more than you think, so the least you can do is not shell out baseless lip service.

 

The fact is we've complained about the same things for 6 years. You are the 39th community admin I've seen here. You wont be the last.

 

All of you do the same exact thing: deflect, detract and make hollow promises.

 

To be frank, it would be in your best interest to stop posting altogether and let us move on to Admin number 40 just for kicks and grins and an absolute lack of anything better to do.

 

To be frank, I wasn't aware that "without folks like you, I wouldn't have this cool job so thanks!" was snobbish, elitist, and condescending. I'm genuinely doing my best to be as honest and understanding as I can. After all, I've been part of this community since well before I started working with Wargaming (just 1 year less than you, actually), and I accepted this job/moved to Texas because I'm confident that our team will be able to make a positive difference in the community. I haven't promised anything other than the promise that I will compile all of your feedback. I'm not a developer, and I don't have the ability to directly implement your suggestions, but I do what I can. 

I would disagree, based on what you've said so far I'd actually say you don't know me at all. I encourage you to read my meet the staff post and actually get to know me instead of wildly drawing inferences that don't exist. I'd be more than happy to platoon up, run some battles and chat with you on teamspeak so we can get to know eachother better and clear up any misunderstandings between us :) Feel free to send me an invite in-game! 


To everyone who has provided suggestions and feedback, thank you for taking the time to provide those! I appreciate all your passion, as well as your creative thinking. World of Tanks is something that, for better or for worse, we all know and love. With every relationship, there are ups and downs, and with every relationship, communication is key. I want to do everything I can to improve that communication, and I can personally promise you all that I'm adding all your feedback to my next report immediately after clicking that "post" button. You guys rock <3 Please keep the suggestions coming! 

the_Deadly_Bulb #72 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 20:11

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View PostDomoSapien, on Jun 04 2018 - 09:47, said:

 

I don't pay attention to politics, be they forum politics or otherwise. I care about facts. I don't know who considers you a shill, nor do I know what you're implying with quotes around "Global Team" but you can easily provide the same feedback without having to resort to personal insults and profanity.

I'm just trying to help you, man. I personally don't want to do anything to your PMM tanks, nor do I personally have the power to do anything to your PMM Tanks, one way or another. 

So you're welcome to continue with the insults or you could let me know what you would like to see as an acceptable alternative to the most recently proposed plan of action; that way I can make sure that's expressed in my next report. I'm not kidding when I'm saying that I've been making note of each and every comment I've come across regarding sentiment around recent policy decisions. So whaddaya say, can we try and turn this into a constructive dialogue?

 

The term "Global Team" is in reference to a previous post by Cabbage Mechanic where I first read it.

Please reference post #1 http://forum.worldoftanks.com/index.php?/topic/578659-changes-to-vehicles-with-preferential-matchmaking-notes-on-trade-in/#topmost

Maybe read each others posts?

 

Here's an example of the kind of response the community is waiting for:

 

Players, we have been made aware of your sincere and vocal protest against our intended changes to PMM Premium tanks.

We've heard you.

Having given this issue further consideration and due to the overwhelming negative response to this proposal we are now announcing the discontinuation of the proposal to remove/re-balance PMM Premiums.

 

PMM Premiums will be left as they were sold.

 

Going forward we will endeavour to make changes to MM to facilitate a better player experience, rather than changing items paying customers have purchased.

 

We are currently considering a reprogramming of MM to include provisions to make 1/3 of all matches same tier, 1/3 of all matches 2 tiers and 1/3 of all matches 3 tiers.

Our inflexible position on 3/5/7 as the preferred template has been identified, along with our preoccupation with +2/-2 MM as the true problem with the current MM.

 

Given the success of Frontline we can see no realistic alternative to increasing the frequency of single tier and 2 tier matches for all tiers in any effort to improve the player experience.

 

Thank You for your patience and continued patronage.

 

 

Hope this is clear enough for you.

FYI, when it comes to insults no one meets or matches WG's treatment of its own customers.

Your organisation takes the cake when it comes to "wiping with the hand that feeds you". :facepalm:


 



__WarChild__ #73 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 20:23

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What we have hee-yar...is a failure...to communicate (Cool Hand Luke)

 

First, let me address this:

View PostDomoSapien, on Jun 04 2018 - 11:47, said:

I don't pay attention to politics, be they forum politics or otherwise. I care about facts. I don't know who considers you a shill, nor do I know what you're implying with quotes around "Global Team" but you can easily provide the same feedback without having to resort to personal insults and profanity.


I'm just trying to help you, man. I personally don't want to do anything to your PMM tanks, nor do I personally have the power to do anything to your PMM Tanks, one way or another. 

So you're welcome to continue with the insults or you could let me know what you would like to see as an acceptable alternative to the most recently proposed plan of action; that way I can make sure that's expressed in my next report. I'm not kidding when I'm saying that I've been making note of each and every comment I've come across regarding sentiment around recent policy decisions. So whaddaya say, can we try and turn this into a constructive dialogue?

 

the_Deadly_Bulb is one of the best allies Wargaming NA has.  He is incredibly supportive of new players.  He is patient, kind (isn't this from the Bible?), etc.  Additionally, he spends a lot of money on this game, not just for himself, but for other players as well.  He is a wise man and therefore ANYTHING he says should be taken to heart and given full consideration. I have nothing but respect and admiration for the_Deadly_Bulb.  :honoring:

 

 

 

Second, Wargaming NA has hired a bunch of new folks and I am impressed with their NA moxie, i.e. willingness to engage in conversations with the playerbase.  This is especially true since EVERY word they type will be used against them by the hundreds/thousands of viewers on the Forums - just check out some of the recent rant videos citing NA moderator responses.  Keep in mind that Wargaming is many different things and not just different companies like WoT and WoWS.  Wargaming RU is very different from Wargaming NA.  The people we deal with are Wargaming NA folks who are mostly American and have empathy for our plight here.  People like MeatheadMilitia, Bted72, TragicLoss, etc. are some of the well known public faces of WG here and I don't think anyone can say they're not decent, nice, good-hearted people.  I don't know Cabbage or Domo or KRZY, but they appear to WANT to respond to us to help keep the NA playerbase informed and somewhat content.  But they are hamstrung by a Wargaming RU company that is secretive, a little sneaky, and in a COST-SAVINGS mode currently - i.e. eliminating entire Seattle office, moving CA to TX, etc.

 

The future of Wargaming, especially here in NA seems a bit sketchy to me at the moment.  There is tremendous frustration and anger over PMM, MM and the lack of response out of Cypress.  NA Staff are well aware of this but are relatively powerless to deal with anything of significance.  I believe that they WANT to respond to us, but are given strict guidelines and fed Memos of Understanding from the home office (the equivalent of Kool-Aid) that they are required to disseminate.  Like their mothers taught them, when they don't have anything good to say, they keep it to themselves. (And if they talk out of turn, Wargaming will kill them apparently - just watch Meathead's WoT Weekly from 2 weeks ago).

 


The point is, we should be thankful and respectful to the Wargaming NA staff and do our best not to put them into the middle of the fray with Wargaming RU.  If they get out of line, then they should be chastised for it like anyone.  But most of what has been said so far I do not believe is as negative as many people are taking it.  Cut them some slack and hopefully they will continue to try and keep us updated on the things that are ahead.  We ALL want Wargaming NA to be successful :great:

 

 

Happy Tanking!

 

__WarChild__

 

 

PS - Got ninja'd by the_Deadly_Bulb while typing this... :sceptic:



Whisky_A_Go_Go #74 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 20:29

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View PostDomoSapien, on Jun 04 2018 - 13:50, said:

To be frank, I wasn't aware that "without folks like you, I wouldn't have this cool job so thanks!" was snobbish, elitist, and condescending.

 

It is. So is the way you just put it.

 

You're a complete failure as an Admin. Seriously. Just stop posting.



_Kradok_ #75 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 20:50

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Domo...

 

I appreciate all the comments... but you've still failed to answer the question...

 

If PMM tanks are the problem for MM, then why are you still selling them?

 

Can we get an answer for this?  All the 'compiling of data" doesn't really do squat to answer that for us...



__WarChild__ #76 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 21:10

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View Post_Kradok_, on Jun 04 2018 - 13:50, said:

Domo...

 

I appreciate all the comments... but you've still failed to answer the question...

 

If PMM tanks are the problem for MM, then why are you still selling them?

 

Can we get an answer for this?  All the 'compiling of data" doesn't really do squat to answer that for us...

 

He cannot even begin to answer this question.  You should know that and you shouldn't ask him.

Tennessee_Devildog #77 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 21:19

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I just wanted to add my 2 cents.  I had a blast playing Frontline and hope to see it again in the near future. :)

_Kradok_ #78 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 21:22

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View Post__WarChild__, on Jun 04 2018 - 15:10, said:

 

He cannot even begin to answer this question.  You should know that and you shouldn't ask him.

 

So...he's "monitoring the thread".... oh, sorry...."compiling data"...

 

Reminds me of that LifeLock commercial... "I'm not a security guard, I'm a security monitor... I don't really DO anything here, I just monitor whether you're getting robbed....oh, you're getting robbed"

 

I know damn well he can't answer this. 

 

BUT he CAN say whether or not the questions have been pushed further up the chain (you know, while compiling and monitoring) and what the response there has been, if nothing at all.  Deflecting the question or ignoring it because I'm supposed to know he can't answer it to begin with is an academic debate at best.  It's STILL deflection, and it has been noticed.  I don't think I'm being insulting OR asking too much here.

 

I'd prefer to hear "I can't answer that, but I've passed that question on more than once, and yeah, it puzzles me too...but thus far, I've heard nothing from corporate" You know...something like that?   

 

Communication, TRUE and ACTUAL communication, is a 2-way street. 

 

FWIW - I didn't ask HIM to come here in an official capacity, he did that.  BUT I will use HIS position in that official capacity to ask questions, or follow up on questions, he's ignored from others. 

 

IMO Holding people accountable isn't being "mean".


Edited by _Kradok_, Jun 04 2018 - 21:22.


DomoSapien #79 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 22:10

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View Postthe_Deadly_Bulb, on Jun 04 2018 - 13:11, said:

 

The term "Global Team" is in reference to a previous post by Cabbage Mechanic where I first read it.

Please reference post #1 http://forum.worldoftanks.com/index.php?/topic/578659-changes-to-vehicles-with-preferential-matchmaking-notes-on-trade-in/#topmost

Maybe read each others posts?

 

Here's an example of the kind of response the community is waiting for:

 

Players, we have been made aware of your sincere and vocal protest against our intended changes to PMM Premium tanks.

We've heard you.

Having given this issue further consideration and due to the overwhelming negative response to this proposal we are now announcing the discontinuation of the proposal to remove/re-balance PMM Premiums.

 

PMM Premiums will be left as they were sold.

 

Going forward we will endeavour to make changes to MM to facilitate a better player experience, rather than changing items paying customers have purchased.

 

We are currently considering a reprogramming of MM to include provisions to make 1/3 of all matches same tier, 1/3 of all matches 2 tiers and 1/3 of all matches 3 tiers.

Our inflexible position on 3/5/7 as the preferred template has been identified, along with our preoccupation with +2/-2 MM as the true problem with the current MM.

 

Given the success of Frontline we can see no realistic alternative to increasing the frequency of single tier and 2 tier matches for all tiers in any effort to improve the player experience.

 

Thank You for your patience and continued patronage.

 

 

Hope this is clear enough for you.

FYI, when it comes to insults no one meets or matches WG's treatment of its own customers.

Your organisation takes the cake when it comes to "wiping with the hand that feeds you". :facepalm:


 

Sorry, appears I was drawing an inference that wasn't there as well. I got a bit confused because the quotation marks typically implies sarcasm, but the term Global Team was being used literally in this case. 

To clarify, CabbageMechanic is one of my Supervisors. I am a Community Coordinator, not a Manager. Making those types of responses is moreso in his wheelhouse. Making official statements regarding controversial policy is not something I am always able to do, but reporting on sentiment is indeed. I try to do whatever I can, even when I can't do much. I really do apologize if that is, in your opinion, me deflecting or not taking ownership of the issue, but I am not the only member of this team and I can't overstep my boundaries. So in this case I can't give you the type of response you would like to receive, if that's supposed to be an official policy statement.

 And I appreciate the clarification as well! I apologize for the misunderstanding but text is not the most efficient way to convey tone. We do indeed have a global team, namely the leadership team at Wargaming HQ in Cyprus, as well as the development team in Minsk!

View Post__WarChild__, on Jun 04 2018 - 13:23, said:

What we have hee-yar...is a failure...to communicate (Cool Hand Luke)

 

First, let me address this:

 

the_Deadly_Bulb is one of the best allies Wargaming NA has.  He is incredibly supportive of new players.  He is patient, kind (isn't this from the Bible?), etc.  Additionally, he spends a lot of money on this game, not just for himself, but for other players as well.  He is a wise man and therefore ANYTHING he says should be taken to heart and given full consideration. I have nothing but respect and admiration for the_Deadly_Bulb.  :honoring:

 

 

 

Second, Wargaming NA has hired a bunch of new folks and I am impressed with their NA moxie, i.e. willingness to engage in conversations with the playerbase.  This is especially true since EVERY word they type will be used against them by the hundreds/thousands of viewers on the Forums - just check out some of the recent rant videos citing NA moderator responses.  Keep in mind that Wargaming is many different things and not just different companies like WoT and WoWS.  Wargaming RU is very different from Wargaming NA.  The people we deal with are Wargaming NA folks who are mostly American and have empathy for our plight here.  People like MeatheadMilitia, Bted72, TragicLoss, etc. are some of the well known public faces of WG here and I don't think anyone can say they're not decent, nice, good-hearted people.  I don't know Cabbage or Domo or KRZY, but they appear to WANT to respond to us to help keep the NA playerbase informed and somewhat content.  But they are hamstrung by a Wargaming RU company that is secretive, a little sneaky, and in a COST-SAVINGS mode currently - i.e. eliminating entire Seattle office, moving CA to TX, etc.

 

The future of Wargaming, especially here in NA seems a bit sketchy to me at the moment.  There is tremendous frustration and anger over PMM, MM and the lack of response out of Cypress.  NA Staff are well aware of this but are relatively powerless to deal with anything of significance.  I believe that they WANT to respond to us, but are given strict guidelines and fed Memos of Understanding from the home office (the equivalent of Kool-Aid) that they are required to disseminate.  Like their mothers taught them, when they don't have anything good to say, they keep it to themselves. (And if they talk out of turn, Wargaming will kill them apparently - just watch Meathead's WoT Weekly from 2 weeks ago).

 


The point is, we should be thankful and respectful to the Wargaming NA staff and do our best not to put them into the middle of the fray with Wargaming RU.  If they get out of line, then they should be chastised for it like anyone.  But most of what has been said so far I do not believe is as negative as many people are taking it.  Cut them some slack and hopefully they will continue to try and keep us updated on the things that are ahead.  We ALL want Wargaming NA to be successful :great:

 

 

Happy Tanking!

 

__WarChild__

 

 

PS - Got ninja'd by the_Deadly_Bulb while typing this... :sceptic:


Thanks WarChild, I appreciate the kind words! I wouldn't say we are hamstrung by our global organization, as every part of our organization is working to improve our communication and transparency. It's a work in progress, and it's no easy task but I have a lot of confidence in all our teams moving forward. And I have no doubts as to the_Deadly_bulb's positivity in the community, he/she simply took me by surprise because I'm familiar with acronyms, including the meaning of that one in particular, and wasn't sure why it was directed at me personally.

 

Really didn't mean any offense by my initial comment, I was trying to help direct a frustrated player to a cost-effective alternative to the expensive bundles included with the T14 sale, and include a quick thank-you for the folks who support our game and literally provide me with a livelihood. 


The offer still stands, if you'd like to platoon up and get to know me better, I always accept any and all friend requests, and I'm happy to answer whatever questions I reasonably can. If being human and actually trying to have a conversation with you is indicative of failure, I'd rather be a failure and have meaningful conversations than selectively read and reply only to comments that are positive. Even if you don't have anything nice to say, and all the feedback is negative, it's still possible to rationally explain your position without resorting to insults. I simply ask that you treat others the way you would like to be treated.
 

View Post_Kradok_, on Jun 04 2018 - 13:50, said:

Domo...

 

I appreciate all the comments... but you've still failed to answer the question...

 

If PMM tanks are the problem for MM, then why are you still selling them?

 

Can we get an answer for this?  All the 'compiling of data" doesn't really do squat to answer that for us...

 

This is information that I quite literally do not have at my disposal. As soon as we find out what exactly is going on with Preferential Matchmaking, I should hopefully have an answer for that question. 

 

So, my personal take on it is this: I think the language in the article wasn't the greatest, because it suggests that pref MM tanks are the only issue with Matchmaking. That's not true, there are quite a few issues: you have games of 30 players each, with 5 different classes, classes that are divisible into subclasses, from 11 different nations, with mechanics unique to certain nations, and different maps that favor different classes above others (Prokhorovka vs. Himmelsdorf), furthermore some classes and subclasses are weighted differently than others (ie: the way the number of SPG's in a battle is limited.) In addition, players can leave the battle as soon as their vehicle is destroyed, meaning MM can't accurately predict how many vehicles it'll have at its disposal when forming a match. I can't claim to know precisely how each match is formed, but I know that there are tons of different variables it needs to account for: pref MM is just one of them. It adds strain to the matchmaker, versus being the sole burden and only cause for the lack of top-tier matches. By that logic the magic formula to being top-tier would therefore be playing tier IX exclusively, and I've had plenty of tier X games in my tier IX vehicles.

On the other hand, it never hurts to gather as much feedback as possible. Believe me, I understand that selling pref MM tanks despite the recent controversy is also a controversial move. Gathering more feedback to illustrate the volume & significance of sentiment, as well as urgency of this issue should theoretically expedite the process of getting that information, however. I'm not monitoring the thread, I'm doing my best to answer your questions with the information I have.

Like I said, I don't want to speculate because speculation leads to misinformation. I'd rather be honest with you and tell you that I don't know than start guessing and end up making promises on behalf of an organization that's much bigger than just little old me. Yes, the question has in fact been raised in a feedback report, I have not received any information regarding the question, and I don't think you're being mean at all (maybe a bit heavy on the sarcasm side, but definitely not mean :) ) On the contrary that's much more polite than some of the stuff I saw when I was working in CS :P

 



__WarChild__ #80 Posted Jun 04 2018 - 22:22

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Was typing a response to Kradok when I got ninja'd again but by Domo this time.  :sceptic:

 

 

I don't really have anything further to add to this conversation, but I really do appreciate Domo trying to get his message across.  His information and ability to respond is controlled by others. Our frustration lies with the decisions and/or lack of information from those "others."  Domo is just the messenger doing the best he can.

 

Don't shoot the messenger!

 

:justwait:

 

PS - "others" does not mean anyone in NA.

 


Edited by __WarChild__, Jun 04 2018 - 22:31.





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