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Maegenwulf #21 Posted Jul 08 2018 - 20:20

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View PostMfezi, on Jul 08 2018 - 16:13, said:

 

Stooges need to realize that there are other whose opinions as to what constitutes an enjoyable game may differ from theirs. If you don't agree, that's fine - no need to insult them just because they have different expectations  from the game.

 

Here is the rub though skippy.  The guys who LIKE the game, SUPPORT the game, and make positive posts on the forums ARE DOING IT RIGHT.  Morons who dislike the BASIC UNDERLYING DESIGN of the game but still continue to play, and continue to make useless whine posts on the forum DAILY are the stooges here.  THEY are the ones who are spending their time, money and (obviously limited) intellect on a game THAT THEY COMPLAIN ABOUT DAILY.

 

So, GTFO STOOGE.  Go find a game you DO like, Checkers perhaps?

 

ROFL, different expectations?  Are you stoned kid?  The game is what it is, if you have any "expectation" that you are playing a different game, you need more meds.


Edited by Maegenwulf, Jul 08 2018 - 20:22.


PhantomLogo #22 Posted Jul 08 2018 - 20:21

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View PostGeorgePreddy, on Jul 08 2018 - 15:54, said:

He calls players who enjoy the game "stooges",  people who know SBMM would be a tragic mistake and players who have a generally positive attitude about WoT... "stooges".

 

How original and insightful.

 

Mfezi, on Jul 08 2018 - 16:13, said:

 

Stooges need to realize that there are other whose opinions as to what constitutes an enjoyable game may differ from theirs. If you don't agree, that's fine - no need to insult them just because they have different expectations  from the game.

 

What a wholesome dose of hypocrisy!

 

Game needs work for sure but not in the way Mfezi is stating.

 


Edited by PhantomLogo, Jul 08 2018 - 20:22.


Mfezi #23 Posted Jul 08 2018 - 20:47

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View PostMaegenwulf, on Jul 08 2018 - 21:20, said:

 

Here is the rub though skippy.  The guys who LIKE the game, SUPPORT the game, and make positive posts on the forums ARE DOING IT RIGHT.  Morons who dislike the BASIC UNDERLYING DESIGN of the game but still continue to play, and continue to make useless whine posts on the forum DAILY are the stooges here.  THEY are the ones who are spending their time, money and (obviously limited) intellect on a game THAT THEY COMPLAIN ABOUT DAILY.

 

So, GTFO STOOGE.  Go find a game you DO like, Checkers perhaps?

 

ROFL, different expectations?  Are you stoned kid?  The game is what it is, if you have any "expectation" that you are playing a different game, you need more meds.

 

I forgot to add patronizing - sorry about that sunshine!!!

I've obviously got under your skin, but hey - nobody said that a stooges job was gonna be easy! :)

 

 


Edited by Mfezi, Jul 08 2018 - 20:56.


elshanko #24 Posted Jul 09 2018 - 02:50

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View PostStrachwitzPzGraf, on Jul 08 2018 - 13:02, said:

As far as players quitting ... don't know... but what is true is the numbers playing on a daily basis on the NA server are down since FL ended.

 

During FL I would see 20-23K players during prime times... yesterday, Saturday, Schools/colleges all out -- the MOST I saw on the server was 17K (and mostly 15-16K) that's a big drop in population. That number has been in decline since FL ended.  How low can it go?

 

So what did FL have that random doesn't?

1. Larger map area

2. One level MM (still had "unbalanced" teams)

3. respawn -- mitigating the issues of #2 team imbalances

4. a fantastic economy that, in virtually all cases (good team or bad), gave you a healthy set of credits and other items

5. VARIETY VARIETY VARIETY -- tactics were needed, team play was needed, you could approach each game with something new (if you wanted)

 

FL will be back, but it cannot come too soon for me.

 

well one thing that fl did was to prove that random mm is rigged brorken something be cause u can play in 1 tier or -1+ games so for what ever reasen we are stuck wihis system i belive that thay spend so much time and coin the worse mm ever that thay do not want to omit its busted

_Tsavo_ #25 Posted Jul 09 2018 - 03:09

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In actuality, WarGaming's main office would probably take a print out of NA forum opinions and use them as toilet paper.  I doubt we're even a blip on the radar.

JellyFishBob_ #26 Posted Jul 09 2018 - 03:13

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FL is the tragic mistake    :great:

Unicorn_ #27 Posted Jul 09 2018 - 08:02

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View PostGeorgePreddy, on Jul 08 2018 - 15:54, said:

He calls players who enjoy the game "stooges",  people who know SBMM would be a tragic mistake and players who have a generally positive attitude about WoT... "stooges".

 

Ron Copeland. One of the biggest stooges, and that's why he's offended. :P

EmperorJuliusCaesar #28 Posted Jul 09 2018 - 08:04

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View PostBogart1943, on Jul 08 2018 - 10:12, said:

Entertaining read.  You just need top make one correction.  Change the HQ to Minsk.  WG is a Belarus company who does it's banking in Cyprus.  As to the post itself?  Not bad, WGNA is a pimple on the buttocks of WG as a whole so I wouldn't expect much. 

 

It's the propaganda there they call news, everything bad is "Russia's fault".



TheGame_ #29 Posted Jul 09 2018 - 16:59

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View PostMfezi, on Jul 08 2018 - 12:33, said:

I think WG has heard me.... 60% winrate this session!. Maybe it's a bribe?.... :)

 

​that defines some of my worst sessions. 

 

typically I stay between 65-80% sessions.

 

Protip: learn how to play. you win more.



MacDaddyMatty #30 Posted Jul 09 2018 - 17:22

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I like the game warts and all.

 

I think SBMM for players in tournaments, and limited use for Clans in Advances would work,

but would be an utter failure in the random matches.


 

Guess that makes me a stooge.


 


 

I've been called worse by better.

:honoring:


Edited by MacDaddyMatty, Jul 09 2018 - 17:23.


VileTasteOfDeath #31 Posted Jul 09 2018 - 17:28

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Most of the people complaining about the MM are WT stooges paid (with in game goodies) to steal customers from WG.  It's painfully obvious and we can disregard their disingenuous claims.

Edited by VileTasteOfDeath, Jul 09 2018 - 17:29.


RingoMcHarrison #32 Posted Jul 09 2018 - 17:40

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If you tried as hard at the game as you try on the forums you'll be way above that 45% wr by now.

Mfezi #33 Posted Jul 09 2018 - 17:43

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View PostVileTasteOfDeath, on Jul 09 2018 - 18:28, said:

Most of the people complaining about the MM are WT stooges paid (with in game goodies) to steal customers from WG.  It's painfully obvious and we can disregard their disingenuous claims.

 

WT?....

MacDaddyMatty #34 Posted Jul 09 2018 - 17:54

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View PostMfezi, on Jul 09 2018 - 11:43, said:

 

WT?....

 

The other tank game?

 

That introduced SBMM?

 

And lost most of their playerbase because of it?

 



Mfezi #35 Posted Jul 09 2018 - 18:04

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View PostMacDaddyMatty, on Jul 09 2018 - 18:54, said:

 

The other tank game?

 

That introduced SBMM?

 

And lost most of their playerbase because of it?

 

 

The only other game of this type that I have played is World of Warships which I found most enjoyable!....

 



EmperorJuliusCaesar #36 Posted Jul 10 2018 - 02:05

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View PostMacDaddyMatty, on Jul 09 2018 - 08:22, said:

I like the game warts and all.

 

I think SBMM for players in tournaments, and limited use for Clans in Advances would work,

but would be an utter failure in the random matches.


 

Guess that makes me a stooge.


 


 

I've been called worse by better.

:honoring:

 

So the casuals that play randoms deserve the current ABSOLUTE TRASH MM, but those that compete deserve fair battles.

My oh my......just wow.

 

Take a look folks.......right here.



EmperorJuliusCaesar #37 Posted Jul 10 2018 - 02:10

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View PostMacDaddyMatty, on Jul 09 2018 - 08:54, said:

 

The other tank game?

 

That introduced SBMM?

 

And lost most of their playerbase because of it?

 

 

They lost their playerbase because many were just trying the game out to begin with to see if it was better than the game they were currently playing.  Many found it lacking or not any better and so left to stick with games they already had TIME and MONEY invested in.

The only people that would leave because of SBMM are those that are AFRAID of a fair fight.  I.E. Pretty pathetic people.



Hurk #38 Posted Jul 10 2018 - 02:54

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View PostEmperorJuliusCaesar, on Jul 09 2018 - 18:10, said:

They lost their playerbase because many were just trying the game out to begin with to see if it was better than the game they were currently playing.  Many found it lacking or not any better and so left to stick with games they already had TIME and MONEY invested in.

The only people that would leave because of SBMM are those that are AFRAID of a fair fight.  I.E. Pretty pathetic people.

fair fights arent always fun. they can be very grinding. especially when you are a good player. verity is what makes a game, not strict play matching. 

I've played plenty of games with SBMM. it did not add to most of them. especially games that already had anti snowball mechanics built in. 

the few games it helped the most were those with long match times... 45 minutes of fail in DOTA 2 is not fun. even with anti-snowball, its rare to actually recover from a good team. 

 

but then there was hearthstone... its a card game... i love card based games. i alpha and beta tested dozens of them including magic the gathering, legend of the five rings, star trek, etc.  here is this game that i absolutely love the mechanics, but HATE the skilled based matching. 

 

because in that game my "skill" with a all stock deck was high enough, i was eventually placed against people using 10+ legendary cards in their decks. its absolutely no fun at all to play against someone with a ~2 to 1 advantage in cards over you. its flattering, but its also insulting. i did not see it as a challenge to be risen up to, but rather as a failure of the system to find me a "real" challenger. .

 

Now, that said, its not the same in wot... you cannot pay to win, but you can suck and force a player like me to have to carry you in an attempt to "balance" the teams when there arent enough people of my skill level available to form a match. also matches with a lot of green/blue on both teams tend to either be very fast or very campy. because everyone doesnt screw up a lot. and when someone does make a mistake, its usually punished severely. 

 

no. i dont want every match to be a slug fest. neither do i want every match to be a cake walk. i do want variety though. 



riot_evo #39 Posted Jul 10 2018 - 03:07

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View PostMfezi, on Jul 08 2018 - 17:22, said:

Any stooge who feels insulted, please let me know and I will publicly apologise!...

 

I'm butt hurt. I don't identify as a stooge, as today I identify as the bitter bucolic. I want my apology and tomorrow we'll see what I identify as.

EmperorJuliusCaesar #40 Posted Jul 10 2018 - 04:05

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View PostHurk, on Jul 09 2018 - 17:54, said:

fair fights arent always fun. they can be very grinding. especially when you are a good player. verity is what makes a game, not strict play matching. 

I've played plenty of games with SBMM. it did not add to most of them. especially games that already had anti snowball mechanics built in. 

the few games it helped the most were those with long match times... 45 minutes of fail in DOTA 2 is not fun. even with anti-snowball, its rare to actually recover from a good team. 

 

but then there was hearthstone... its a card game... i love card based games. i alpha and beta tested dozens of them including magic the gathering, legend of the five rings, star trek, etc.  here is this game that i absolutely love the mechanics, but HATE the skilled based matching. 

 

because in that game my "skill" with a all stock deck was high enough, i was eventually placed against people using 10+ legendary cards in their decks. its absolutely no fun at all to play against someone with a ~2 to 1 advantage in cards over you. its flattering, but its also insulting. i did not see it as a challenge to be risen up to, but rather as a failure of the system to find me a "real" challenger. .

 

Now, that said, its not the same in wot... you cannot pay to win, but you can suck and force a player like me to have to carry you in an attempt to "balance" the teams when there arent enough people of my skill level available to form a match. also matches with a lot of green/blue on both teams tend to either be very fast or very campy. because everyone doesnt screw up a lot. and when someone does make a mistake, its usually punished severely. 

 

no. i dont want every match to be a slug fest. neither do i want every match to be a cake walk. i do want variety though. 

"Hurk" statement(in case he tries to change it):

"fair fights arent always fun. they can be very grinding. especially when you are a good player. verity is what makes a game, not strict play matching. 

I've played plenty of games with SBMM. it did not add to most of them. especially games that already had anti snowball mechanics built in. 

the few games it helped the most were those with long match times... 45 minutes of fail in DOTA 2 is not fun. even with anti-snowball, its rare to actually recover from a good team. 

but then there was hearthstone... its a card game... i love card based games. i alpha and beta tested dozens of them including magic the gathering, legend of the five rings, star trek, etc.  here is this game that i absolutely love the mechanics, but HATE the skilled based matching. 

because in that game my "skill" with a all stock deck was high enough, i was eventually placed against people using 10+ legendary cards in their decks. its absolutely no fun at all to play against someone with a ~2 to 1 advantage in cards over you. its flattering, but its also insulting. i did not see it as a challenge to be risen up to, but rather as a failure of the system to find me a "real" challenger. .

Now, that said, its not the same in wot... you cannot pay to win, but you can suck and force a player like me to have to carry you in an attempt to "balance" the teams when there arent enough people of my skill level available to form a match. also matches with a lot of green/blue on both teams tend to either be very fast or very campy. because everyone doesnt screw up a lot. and when someone does make a mistake, its usually punished severely. 

no. i dont want every match to be a slug fest. neither do i want every match to be a cake walk. i do want variety though. 

 

 

My Response:

EXACTLY what I've been saying, "skilled" players don't want fair fights.

 

"Skilled" players don't want to have to fight each other, they want to fight mostly average players.  I see it daily.  A blue will take his tank to the opposite side than where it's needed to avoid the other blue on the enemy team, and when he sees him, goes to the back to the other side to farm the average players.

 

The farming of average players is why this game is having problems with player retention. 

 

Even with balanced teams, you'd have variety, but there wouldn't be so many auto-wins and auto-losses.  There's no anti-snowball effects here, so most games wouldn't be drawn out slugfests, but more would be. 

 

That's what most average players want, fair fights that are actual fights and not walkover wins or getting wiped in 3-4 mins.

 

Thanks for clearly stating why "skilled" players don't want fair fights, many of us already knew, but you clearly stated it.






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