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Clan Wars Map Imbalances

Clan Wars Map Global Imbalance

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SodiumChIoride #1 Posted Jul 11 2018 - 19:23

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With the announcement of Clan Wars Season 9, I've noticed that the North American Server just doesn't get any love when it comes to the layout of the Map. We always seem to get the least amount of Provinces, combined with a starvation of the Player-base, seems to only really cater to the Top 5 Clans. Give the smaller clans something to work with, why should the little leagues be thrown into the same hell as the national teams?. As much as I like the idea of Clan Wars being reserved as End-Game content, I don't feel it is right to alienate the majority of the population simply due to terrible management.

 

North American Server: (Link)
The Tier X front (for the Tier 10-8 vehicles) will include 128 provinces. Landing provinces will be about 16% of the total number of all provinces within the front.

With a Active player-base of about 18k players.

 

European Server: (Link)
The Tier VIII front (for Tier VIII vehicles) will include 300 provinces. Landing provinces: ~ 25% of the total number of all provinces within the front.

The Tier X front (for Tier X vehicles) will include 250 provinces. Landing provinces: ~16% of the total number of all provinces within the front.

With a Active player-base of about 73k players.

 

Russian Server: (Link)

The Tier X front (for Tier X vehicles) will include 622 provinces

With a Active player-base of about 415k players.
 

Asia Server: (Link)
The Tier VIII front (for Tier VIII vehicles) will include 60 provinces. Landing provinces will comprise ~ 30% of the total number of all provinces within the front.

The Tier X front (for Tier X vehicles) will include 120 provinces. Landing provinces will comprise ~ 30% of the total number of all provinces within the front.

With a Active player-base of about 10k players.

 

Not only do we have the lowest amount of Provinces when compared with other servers, we are also excluded from taking part in Tier VIII Clan Wars. For goodness sake, even the Asia server is cared for more than ours. This trend of not opening up the map to more provinces isn't just something new with Season 9, it's been this way for the last 5 or so Seasons. Hell, soon enough Wargaming NA might as well say that if your clan rating isn't in the top 10 then you're not qualified to take part since we all know that out of the 128 provinces at least 30% of them will be controlled by Mahou alone. 

 

The North American server is dying in terms of player-base, and Wargaming isn't doing anything to stop it. I haven't seen a single advertisement about the game in years, nor have I seen any commitment from the Staff about wanting to grow the player-base. It's all been just another quest for more money and eventually people will slowly not give a damn. Wargaming, please change your stance on the Clan Wars map layouts, even if you cannot change it for Season 9 as I know it's quite too late, at least attempt something different for Season 10.

 

If anyone has any thoughts about what was shown above in plain text, or if you just want to call me out on whining, please feel free as that is exactly what I'm doing. I just don't want to watch the game burn when I know there is a really good number of players that enjoy it.

If you're wondering where I got the player-base numbers, please refer to these sources: This or That.

 



RogerClark #2 Posted Jul 11 2018 - 19:34

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Yeah, the smaller clans are getting the short end of the shaft. I think bringing back tier 8s would solve that if they have a way to keep the top clans in tier 10. On EU they way they are doing that is by making the tier 8 gold payout very small compared to tier 10s, so everyone wants to compete at 10 and those who can't compete at 10 can still compete at 8.

Devildog8 #3 Posted Jul 11 2018 - 19:35

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yeah its like beating your head against the wall, we stayed out of the arms race because of what you say above, not worth the time or energy, season 8 tho we fared better than we did the season before got a little gold, still with 5-10 clans running the board it becomes a sideshow, would love to see tier 8s, we all know not going to happen, so we began another season where being named cheeseburger is the food of the day. whatcha going to do, WG sure dont care about what we think.  

BabA_YA6A #4 Posted Jul 11 2018 - 19:37

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You not whining you just telling as it is and that the NA server always has an will be the red headed step child of wargaming.

 



dominator_98 #5 Posted Jul 11 2018 - 20:02

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The real problem is that NA is already so dead. MAHOU can field as many 3500+ wn8 teams as the rest of the server combined, so they’ll just monopolize any area they choose. That leaves the blue/green clans fighting the remaining purple clans for what little scraps are left. 

 

If they put a limit of 5 provinces per clan in place, it would allow more clans to hold land and fight around the edges while MAHOU defends the five highest paying provinces from 200IQ.

 

We need at least 25% landing provinces as well. Last season my clan held about 5 of the lesser provinces over the course of 10 days and we fought maybe 10 battles defending them because we were bordered almost entirely by YOUJO and 200IQ, who were too busy defending their big chunks of map to push into us. That may have been different if there was more incentive to take a landing and push off it as well.

 

Honestly I’d like to see a tier 10 map with tier 6-8 levels of payout as a sandbox for the smaller clans to compete in. Tier 6-8 CW just rewards the clan who bought the best premium tanks and the different meta + team size doesn’t help you learn.



SodiumChIoride #6 Posted Jul 11 2018 - 21:04

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View Postdominator_98, on Jul 11 2018 - 20:02, said:

The real problem is that NA is already so dead. MAHOU can field as many 3500+ wn8 teams as the rest of the server combined, so they’ll just monopolize any area they choose. That leaves the blue/green clans fighting the remaining purple clans for what little scraps are left. 

 

If they put a limit of 5 provinces per clan in place, it would allow more clans to hold land and fight around the edges while MAHOU defends the five highest paying provinces from 200IQ.

 

We need at least 25% landing provinces as well. Last season my clan held about 5 of the lesser provinces over the course of 10 days and we fought maybe 10 battles defending them because we were bordered almost entirely by YOUJO and 200IQ, who were too busy defending their big chunks of map to push into us. That may have been different if there was more incentive to take a landing and push off it as well.

 

Honestly I’d like to see a tier 10 map with tier 6-8 levels of payout as a sandbox for the smaller clans to compete in. Tier 6-8 CW just rewards the clan who bought the best premium tanks and the different meta + team size doesn’t help you learn.

 

Limiting clans to only hold a certain number of land will only force clans like Mahou to split up into a bunch of smaller Mahou2, Mahou3, etc. Players will always find ways to work around the rules.

dominator_98 #7 Posted Jul 11 2018 - 21:39

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View PostSodiumChIoride, on Jul 11 2018 - 14:04, said:

 

Limiting clans to only hold a certain number of land will only force clans like Mahou to split up into a bunch of smaller Mahou2, Mahou3, etc. Players will always find ways to work around the rules.

 

Thus ending MAHOU's reign on the server, as less active clans like G and VILIN will be viable because they will only need to field one team. You won't need to join a clan that can field 4 teams to get the most out of CW.

SodiumChIoride #8 Posted Jul 11 2018 - 21:51

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View Postdominator_98, on Jul 11 2018 - 21:39, said:

 

Thus ending MAHOU's reign on the server, as less active clans like G and VILIN will be viable because they will only need to field one team. You won't need to join a clan that can field 4 teams to get the most out of CW.

 

I meant more for the purpose of just spreading out and holding a bunch of land and then coming together once the season is over. Split but still under the same command if that makes sense.

dave_292 #9 Posted Jul 11 2018 - 22:13

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There is a limit this time. "Province income limit is 15."

Venom1413 #10 Posted Jul 11 2018 - 22:51

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I admit it does get frustrating watching Mahou sit on half the map. However, clan wars is a competition. In a competition, the best team is supposed to win. I don't whine and cry about it because Mahou is extremely talented and if they have 100 active players with 3500 wn8, then they deserve to win. Theyre the best for a reason, and any changes made to help mid-level clans negates a portion of the competition. I ran the map for FATE in season 8 and at one point we had 12 provinces. Its not impossible to do, you just have to hit the right place at the right time. It also helps to have good diplomacy :)

_Promote_Synergy_ #11 Posted Jul 12 2018 - 17:58

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View Postdominator_98, on Jul 11 2018 - 20:39, said:

 

Thus ending MAHOU's reign on the server, as less active clans like G and VILIN will be viable because they will only need to field one team. You won't need to join a clan that can field 4 teams to get the most out of CW.

 

HEY. We can field two teams, like 2-3 times a year lol.

 

Mahou will still reign strong. They will still read the map like a boss and act accordingly.



SodiumChIoride #12 Posted Jul 12 2018 - 19:42

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View Post_Promote_Synergy_, on Jul 12 2018 - 17:58, said:

 

HEY. We can field two teams, like 2-3 times a year lol.

 

Mahou will still reign strong. They will still read the map like a boss and act accordingly.

 

Mahou still reign strong, and all power to them for growing to that point. I'm not putting anything against them, the problem is with WarGaming's setup of Clan Wars on the North American Server. Their insistence of limiting the map to a single tier, along with the lowest amount of provinces only spoon feeds the Top 5 Clans gold. Unfortunately people are picking on Mahou (my included) only because they are best at exploiting Wargaming's stupidity.

_Promote_Synergy_ #13 Posted Jul 12 2018 - 21:02

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View PostSodiumChIoride, on Jul 12 2018 - 18:42, said:

 

Mahou still reign strong, and all power to them for growing to that point. I'm not putting anything against them, the problem is with WarGaming's setup of Clan Wars on the North American Server. Their insistence of limiting the map to a single tier, along with the lowest amount of provinces only spoon feeds the Top 5 Clans gold. Unfortunately people are picking on Mahou (my included) only because they are best at exploiting Wargaming's stupidity.

 

They read into all the rules and how the map works. You can't fault them for taking every advantage that they can find and use it to their best ability. More clans need to do that... You can't hope for the top clans to continually face Mahou night after night. We did that for a few weeks straight when they had 30k gold locked up, didn't really work since they could field the same amount of teams that us, OTTER, and -G- could get together.



Bavor #14 Posted Jul 14 2018 - 23:59

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View PostSodiumChIoride, on Jul 11 2018 - 13:23, said:

With the announcement of Clan Wars Season 9, I've noticed that the North American Server just doesn't get any love when it comes to the layout of the Map. We always seem to get the least amount of Provinces, combined with a starvation of the Player-base, seems to only really cater to the Top 5 Clans. Give the smaller clans something to work with, why should the little leagues be thrown into the same hell as the national teams?. As much as I like the idea of Clan Wars being reserved as End-Game content, I don't feel it is right to alienate the majority of the population simply due to terrible management.

 

Tier 6 and 8 clan wars were a failure on the NA server because they were intended as a stepping stone for clans to move up to tier 10 clan wars.  Instead most clans stayed in tier 6 and 8 and never moved up.  Also tier 8 clan wars started to be dominated by mostly tier 8 premium tanks.  It became pay to win in some instances.

 

Block Quote

 North American Server: (Link)

The Tier X front (for the Tier 10-8 vehicles) will include 128 provinces. Landing provinces will be about 16% of the total number of all provinces within the front.

With a Active player-base of about 18k players.

 

18,000 players and 128 provinces  18,000/128 = 141 active players per province.

 

Block Quote

European Server: (Link)

The Tier VIII front (for Tier VIII vehicles) will include 300 provinces. Landing provinces: ~ 25% of the total number of all provinces within the front.

The Tier X front (for Tier X vehicles) will include 250 provinces. Landing provinces: ~16% of the total number of all provinces within the front.

With a Active player-base of about 73k players.

 

73,000 players and 550 total provinces.  73,000/550 = 133 active players per province.

 

Block Quote

Russian Server: (Link)

The Tier X front (for Tier X vehicles) will include 622 provinces

With a Active player-base of about 415k players.

 

415,000 active players and 622 provinces.  415,000/622 = 667 active players per province.

The RU server has closer to 600K-700K active players in the winter months based on data from other sites.

 

Block Quote

Asia Server: (Link)

The Tier VIII front (for Tier VIII vehicles) will include 60 provinces. Landing provinces will comprise ~ 30% of the total number of all provinces within the front.

The Tier X front (for Tier X vehicles) will include 120 provinces. Landing provinces will comprise ~ 30% of the total number of all provinces within the front.

With a Active player-base of about 10k players.

 

10,000 players and 180 total provinces. 10,000/180 = 56 active players per province.

 

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Not only do we have the lowest amount of Provinces when compared with other servers, 

 

When you look at active players per province, we are similar to the EU server, much better off than the RU server, and the only server that seems to get a great deal is the Asia server.

 

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 we are also excluded from taking part in Tier VIII Clan Wars. 

 

Tier 8 clan wars is overrated.  As I stated above, it started to become dominated by tier 8 premium tanks and it was rarely used as a stepping stone to tier 10 clan wars.  Also tier 8 clan wars failed to teach clans how to play in tier 10 clan wars because it wasn't 15 tanks per team.  So the strategies and tactics and tank compositions didn't carry over.

 

Also tier 8 clan wars because the land of clans who weren't quite good enough to hold land for more than a few days on the tier 10 map, so they would drop down to tier 8 and bully the clans who can't ever compete on the tier 10 map to make themself feel good about beating up on weaker clans.

 

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For goodness sake, even the Asia server is cared for more than ours. 

 

The Asia server needs all the help it can get to keep its players active.  In some previous clan wars seasons and campaigns their tier 10 competition wasn't 15 tanks per team.  They were limited to 7 or 10 tanks per team at tier 10.

 

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This trend of not opening up the map to more provinces isn't just something new with Season 9, it's been this way for the last 5 or so Seasons. Hell, soon enough Wargaming NA might as well say that if your clan rating isn't in the top 10 then you're not qualified to take part since we all know that out of the 128 provinces at least 30% of them will be controlled by Mahou alone. 

 

I've been in clans that weren't in the top 10 that held land on the map for extended periods of time in recent seasons.  You are exaggerating a little.  Any clans in the top 30 can hold land.  The issue isn't the number of provinces as it is that the NA server player population has drastically decreased in the past few years.

 

When the NA server had more active players, clans in the top 40 or 50 could hold land at least for a little while.  Now that the NA server population is rather low, you are limited to the top 25 or 30 clans holding land.

 

Also, due to the declining active player population, the players in Mahou, OTTER, -G- and VILIN represent the portion of the active player population that was the top 10 clans a few years ago.  Compare what percentage of land those clans can hold in a normal season to the top 10 clans a few years ago.

 

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The North American server is dying in terms of player-base, and Wargaming isn't doing anything to stop it. I haven't seen a single advertisement about the game in years, 

 

I see World of Tanks TV commercials all the time when I'm visiting people who still have regular cable TV.  I use streaming services myself so I don't see their advertisements on TV unless I'm at work or at someone else's place.

 

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nor have I seen any commitment from the Staff about wanting to grow the player-base. 

 

The South American (LATAM) server was an attempt at growing the player base.  The players from South America were very vocal about the awful ping playing on the NA servers.

 

However it hasn't seemed to work as intended because very few players from South America want to play on it because the player population is low.  If Wargaming had an incentive for the players in South America to play on that server, maybe the player population would increase because they may be able to recruit other gamers and friends to play.

 

Just because they haven't said anything on the forums about wanting to grow the player base doesn't mean they aren't trying to do so.  Most companies don't disclose their marketing strategies.

 

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It's all been just another quest for more money and eventually people will slowly not give a damn. Wargaming, please change your stance on the Clan Wars map layouts, even if you cannot change it for Season 9 as I know it's quite too late, at least attempt something different for Season 10.

 

There is the province income limit this season.  Also there is a limit on active landing applications per clan after the first day to 6.  ALso clans need 90 members to be eligible for 6 landing applications.

 

Block Quote

If anyone has any thoughts about what was shown above in plain text, or if you just want to call me out on whining, please feel free as that is exactly what I'm doing. I just don't want to watch the game burn when I know there is a really good number of players that enjoy it.

If you're wondering where I got the player-base numbers, please refer to these sources: This or That.

 

I doubt that bringing back tier 8 clan wars or adding more provinces will help significantly.  Clan Wars 2.0 killed off the NA server population long ago when Wargaming refused to listen to feedback from the active NA server clan wars clans about CW 2.0. 

 

Outside of the top few clans, you can work a few extra hours at a minimum wage job and after taxes, buy more gold than many top 10 clan members earn in a month of clan wars since Clan Wars 2.0 was released.  If you aren't doing clan wars for the fun of doing clan wars and doing it for the gold, then you are probably wasting your time. The amount of gold per time invested is pretty poor. There are so many more way to earn money to buy gold that take up a lot less time than playing clan wars. 



StainlessRat #15 Posted Today, 11:43 AM

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View PostBavor, on Jul 14 2018 - 17:59, said:

Outside of the top few clans, you can work a few extra hours at a minimum wage job and after taxes, buy more gold than many top 10 clan members earn in a month of clan wars since Clan Wars 2.0 was released.  If you aren't doing clan wars for the fun of doing clan wars and doing it for the gold, then you are probably wasting your time. The amount of gold per time invested is pretty poor. There are so many more way to earn money to buy gold that take up a lot less time than playing clan wars. 

 

This... 1,000 times this. 

CW is fun to do, but it's a time sink. Sitting around waiting for battles to pop etc. 

Advances are where the real fun is. 50 minutes and no sitting around waiting to see if you're getting a bye the next round so you can sit around even longer.

 

We do both, but most members enjoy the Advances much more than CW.







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