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Option to play battles with no artillery


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dunniteowl #161 Posted Oct 28 2018 - 03:01

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View Postmrmojo, on Oct 25 2018 - 20:33, said:

 

 

100% happy to apologize if you can show where your arguments in the final answer are contained in your previous comments throughout this thread.

 

Look if you're uninterested, fine, I'll just drop out of the thread.

 

I've had enough.

 

Send my regards to claudius, the most eloquent of your comrades.

 

 

 

You are simply not worth the effort.  Troll is troll.

 

 

Good Bye.



mrmojo #162 Posted Oct 28 2018 - 03:31

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So you can't. (Note: this is a statement not a question.)

Fly away little pontificating owl.

n4cer67 #163 Posted Nov 07 2018 - 20:52

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View PostRickEdwards, on Oct 10 2018 - 07:43, said:

The part where you said people should have play with arty if they ever had it on their garage makes no sense because, like I said, it used to be fun and not that cancerous, so it doesn't make sense to punish people who played it when it was acceptable but now recognize that it has become ultra-cancerous. You're just grasping at straws to find an argument because you know the vast majority of players would absolutely sell off their arty if it meant all no arty games.

 

Makes perfect sense. If they've EVER had an SPG it should be counted, not just if they currently have it in the garage. LOL, only thing cancerous are the nerfers and people claiming the majority would sell off their Arties. Every player should play what they like and for those that don't like SPG's there are plenty of other games.

n4cer67 #164 Posted Nov 07 2018 - 21:01

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View PostRickEdwards, on Oct 09 2018 - 21:28, said:

There's a huge difference being arty focused... Especially on maps like prok-i-wont-even-try-to-spell-it where there is no cover so arty can hit you wherever you go. A red lining td cannot do that and you can hide behind buildings from everything but arty, which just shoot the ground by the building to hit you for like 300 damage...

 

Focus fire is focus fire, it doesn't matter who's doing it. Never seen an SPG hit the ground near someone and do 300 damage.

n4cer67 #165 Posted Nov 07 2018 - 21:09

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View PostKingofDragons, on Oct 21 2018 - 13:17, said:

Do you guys enjoy the Type 5s Derp that always does damage ?  If you say YES !! than you will enjoy Arty since the Top 24 out of 25 vehicles in the * Penetration Rate * category are Arty... 

 

Do you guys enjoy vehicles that . in the top 25 ,  have a  363% and 1017% damage ratio which means 3.6 to 10.1 times its own hitpoints in damage on the average ? 

 

Do you guys enjoy vehicles with the best survival rates ? ...22 out of 25 are Arty... Along with this rate comes longer battle durations / lifetime duration...

 

If WG announced they were coming out with a vehicle that had a 95-98% penetration rate could do 3.6 to 10 times its own hitpoints in damage and would survive 50-60% of battles on the average players would freak and call it OP !!!   

 

Stats do not lie.. Arties are OP...

 

 

 

 

 

We enjoy a game where players can use the vehicle of choice without poor sports running to the forums every time they get damaged or destroyed.  SPG's are far from OP.

n4cer67 #166 Posted Nov 07 2018 - 21:14

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View PostNudnick, on Oct 23 2018 - 08:47, said:

 

The arty guys know they'd have endless queue times because the majority of players would choose no arty games.

 

If that's true let all the arty hater go play the other arty free games. Would be a win win for everyone excpet when the other games die they'll come back to WOT.

RickEdwards #167 Posted Nov 08 2018 - 00:16

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View Postn4cer67, on Nov 07 2018 - 21:01, said:

 

Focus fire is focus fire, it doesn't matter who's doing it. Never seen an SPG hit the ground near someone and do 300 damage.

 

Wow, if you really have never seen an arty do 300 damage with a splash, you had to have never played a game above tier 6. If that is the case, you can keep your tier 6 cancer and let the big boys talk about the higher tiers, which you apparently know nothing about.

n4cer67 #168 Posted Nov 08 2018 - 00:59

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View PostRickEdwards, on Nov 07 2018 - 17:16, said:

 

Wow, if you really have never seen an arty do 300 damage with a splash, you had to have never played a game above tier 6. If that is the case, you can keep your tier 6 cancer and let the big boys talk about the higher tiers, which you apparently know nothing about.

 

Sorry kid but i've played above tier 6 and have never seen 300 splash damage. If only the big boys are allowed to talk then you have to leave the room because you definitely don't know anything because the only way someone could get 300 splash damage is if more than one SPG is firing on them at the same time. Even 300 splash damage is done at tier 9 or 10 it still means nothing because 300hp is a drop in the bucket considering the amount of HP the target has and the amount of reload time.

Edited by n4cer67, Nov 08 2018 - 01:11.


RickEdwards #169 Posted Nov 08 2018 - 02:33

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View Postn4cer67, on Nov 08 2018 - 00:59, said:

 

Sorry kid but i've played above tier 6 and have never seen 300 splash damage. If only the big boys are allowed to talk then you have to leave the room because you definitely don't know anything because the only way someone could get 300 splash damage is if more than one SPG is firing on them at the same time. Even 300 splash damage is done at tier 9 or 10 it still means nothing because 300hp is a drop in the bucket considering the amount of HP the target has and the amount of reload time.

 

Arties at tier 10 splash for more than 300 rather often, and I've looked at your tanks; you do not have any tier 10s. You have an ST-I as your highest. Also, over a third of your 17k battles are at tier 5. As for 300 being a "drop in the bucket," 300 damage is around 15% of the total hp for a tier 10 medium; maybe not a huge amount, but definitely a significant amount, especially considering that there is no actual way to counter-play an arty shooting at you. Even hiding behind a building, the arty can shoot to the side of it and splash you. Zig-zagging and driving evasively doesn't work either; the splash is simply too large to avoid.



n4cer67 #170 Posted Nov 08 2018 - 20:47

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View PostRickEdwards, on Nov 07 2018 - 19:33, said:

 

Arties at tier 10 splash for more than 300 rather often, and I've looked at your tanks; you do not have any tier 10s. You have an ST-I as your highest. Also, over a third of your 17k battles are at tier 5. As for 300 being a "drop in the bucket," 300 damage is around 15% of the total hp for a tier 10 medium; maybe not a huge amount, but definitely a significant amount, especially considering that there is no actual way to counter-play an arty shooting at you. Even hiding behind a building, the arty can shoot to the side of it and splash you. Zig-zagging and driving evasively doesn't work either; the splash is simply too large to avoid.

 

Ok, so you're going to whole stat stalker route huh? My ST-1 is highest because I don't spend all day playing games. You call SPG players cancer but you have some that are tier 9 & 10 so it's confusing to me as to why someone would call themselves cancer but I guess being a nerfer it does make you cancer. You have over 1700 (1041 in your object 261) battles in your T8+ SPG's so I guess you got tired of the extremely long reload and poor accuracy so now you're concentrating on your other tanks and now you want to guarantee yourself a participation award by wanting games without SPG's in them. It's up to the SPG's on your team to do counter battery unless you have some scouts that actually do their job and go in after the enemy SPG's. SPG's can't counter a direct attack from other units so no big deal about the others not being able to counter the SPG's. Splash still means nothing because that's how the SPG rounds are intended to work. 

RickEdwards #171 Posted Nov 08 2018 - 23:20

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View Postn4cer67, on Nov 08 2018 - 20:47, said:

 

Ok, so you're going to whole stat stalker route huh? My ST-1 is highest because I don't spend all day playing games. You call SPG players cancer but you have some that are tier 9 & 10 so it's confusing to me as to why someone would call themselves cancer but I guess being a nerfer it does make you cancer. You have over 1700 (1041 in your object 261) battles in your T8+ SPG's so I guess you got tired of the extremely long reload and poor accuracy so now you're concentrating on your other tanks and now you want to guarantee yourself a participation award by wanting games without SPG's in them. It's up to the SPG's on your team to do counter battery unless you have some scouts that actually do their job and go in after the enemy SPG's. SPG's can't counter a direct attack from other units so no big deal about the others not being able to counter the SPG's. Splash still means nothing because that's how the SPG rounds are intended to work. 

 

Im glad you brought this all up; I was an arty player; WAS. After the changes, it is now both less fun to play AND less fun to play against. I miss my 261 greatly; even before the change it basically hit every shot, assuming you led correctly. But thats the thing: you actually had to hit the target; theres just no longer any skill required; no challenge. They broke the mechanic by making it too easy to play while making it uncounterable; before, fast tanks we're actually hard to hit close enough to to damage, but that is no longer the case.

 

As for counter arty, anyone with half a brain moves after they fire at high tiers so they don't get countered. Also, scouts' job is not to sui-scout enemy arty and you thinking it is shows you have no clue how to play scout tanks. There is no actual counter-play to arty anymore.



Omega_Weapon #172 Posted Nov 09 2018 - 02:17

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View PostRickEdwards, on Nov 08 2018 - 17:20, said:

As for counter arty, anyone with half a brain moves after they fire at high tiers so they don't get countered. Also, scouts' job is not to sui-scout enemy arty and you thinking it is shows you have no clue how to play scout tanks. There is no actual counter-play to arty anymore.

 

You kill the enemy tanks spotting you, and arty can't do much. Where that is not feasible, minimize your exposure (cover and concealment) and you try to throw the arty off by moving unpredictably. That is how arty can be countered. Not really rocket science.

AZandEL #173 Posted Nov 09 2018 - 02:52

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View Postruar, on Oct 01 2018 - 01:23, said:

We all know artillery is a hotly debated issue.  People love it, people hate it, and the class as a whole has been changed and redesigned more than any other class in the game.  Ultimately there will never be a happy medium simply because artillery works so much differently than every other class.

 

I think in the end the only way to keep both pro-arty and anti-arty players happy is to have the option to play matches with no artillery allowed in the que.  People who dislike artillery will be able to play against tanks without all of the animosity and frustration that artillery brings to a match.

 

People who like artillery will be able to play matches with artillery and this would even allow artillery to be made more fun since the people in those matches are the ones who have no problems adapting and adjusting to the artillery mechanic.  More than likely the cap will have to be removed which will allow even more artillery into the match which will cut down on the wait times for people who do enjoy artillery.

 

I haven't been able to find any downside to having a toggle option.  After all, the pro-arty people have assured us that the anti-arty are a minority of the players so there won't be that many people in the no-arty que.  In fact, the wait times will probably be longer since so few people actually dislike artillery.

 

So having a toggle is win/win for everyone involved.  

 

How about some more option buttons: no corridor maps, no 600x600 maps. no e25s, no Defenders, no platoon members, no gold rounds, no tanks out of my tier. Honestly if you all are so butthurt about this one issue go play Blitz that has no arty. 

RickEdwards #174 Posted Nov 09 2018 - 03:23

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View PostOmega_Weapon, on Nov 09 2018 - 02:17, said:

 

You kill the enemy tanks spotting you, and arty can't do much. Where that is not feasible, minimize your exposure (cover and concealment) and you try to throw the arty off by moving unpredictably. That is how arty can be countered. Not really rocket science.

 

Soooo camping is the counter to arty; fun. Cover is a joke when arty just shoots the side of it to splash you for 300-400 damage. Also, some maps effectively have no cover.

 

As for moving unpredictably; it worked pre-change, but arty splash is so large now, you have very little hope of avoiding it.



Dirizon #175 Posted Nov 09 2018 - 03:32

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View Postn4cer67, on Nov 07 2018 - 15:39, said:

 

We enjoy a game where players can use the vehicle of choice without poor sports running to the forums every time they get damaged or destroyed.  SPG's are far from OP.

 

Who says artillery is overpowered?

Artillery performs rather poorly.

 

Everyone that does reasonably well at the game, says the same.

However, what they do say, is arty is unfair.

Like a guy sitting on the bench, but still allowed to take 3-pointers.

Get your things straight.  op =/= unfair

 



VooDooKobra #176 Posted Nov 09 2018 - 04:33

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View PostDirizon, on Nov 08 2018 - 19:32, said:

 

Who says artillery is overpowered?

Artillery performs rather poorly.

 

Everyone that does reasonably well at the game, says the same.

However, what they do say, is arty is unfair.

Like a guy sitting on the bench, but still allowed to take 3-pointers.

Get your things straight.  op =/= unfair

 

 

and when did games start having to be fair?  would you want to play shooters with an option to play without sniper rifles because they are unfair to those playing with SMG?  or maybe without bazookas?  noob tubes? 

Omega_Weapon #177 Posted Nov 09 2018 - 05:34

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View PostRickEdwards, on Nov 08 2018 - 21:23, said:

 

Soooo camping is the counter to arty; fun. Cover is a joke when arty just shoots the side of it to splash you for 300-400 damage. Also, some maps effectively have no cover.

 

As for moving unpredictably; it worked pre-change, but arty splash is so large now, you have very little hope of avoiding it.

 

View PostRickEdwards, on Nov 08 2018 - 21:23, said:

 

Soooo camping is the counter to arty; fun. Cover is a joke when arty just shoots the side of it to splash you for 300-400 damage. Also, some maps effectively have no cover.

 

As for moving unpredictably; it worked pre-change, but arty splash is so large now, you have very little hope of avoiding it.

 

Winning is fun. If camping helps you win, go for it. If not winning is more fun for you, then sit still in the open a lot.

 

With the increased splash its not so much about avoiding now, as it is minimising. Taking several splash hits before you die is better than getting taken out in 1 or 2 direct hits. The longer you stay alive the better.



Dirizon #178 Posted Nov 09 2018 - 05:51

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View PostVooDooKobra, on Nov 08 2018 - 23:03, said:

 

and when did games start having to be fair?  would you want to play shooters with an option to play without sniper rifles because they are unfair to those playing with SMG?  or maybe without bazookas?  noob tubes? 

 

ln most first person shooters, sniper rifles and their holders, are still susceptible to return fire. Regardless of how ineffective it may be, a person with a Beretta 94 can still see and shoot someone with a G3 rifle. ln world of tanks, artillery is all but protected from virtually all return fire, and is not even that fearful of counter battery fire that much either.

At any rate, world of tanks has tactics, vision range, unified team effort - among all other classes. Artillery is apart from this, and largely acts as a single sided support multiplier

 

TDs and Light tanks, the other support vehicles, can also receive the argument that they mooch off of other classes success. Well, LTs and TDs still have a max draw that they are able to shoot at. LTs and TDs still can be used in pushes, and share damage with team mates / focus out enemy tanks. AT15, or E4, can still sidescrape in a city like a heavy tank. All these points, simply come to the conclusion, artillery is an unfair class that does its own thing, 0NLY with the help of allies. lt is a parasite. lt is not a symbiotic tank for the team

 

 

 

 



n4cer67 #179 Posted Nov 09 2018 - 06:56

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View PostDirizon, on Nov 08 2018 - 20:32, said:

 

Who says artillery is overpowered?

Artillery performs rather poorly.

 

Everyone that does reasonably well at the game, says the same.

However, what they do say, is arty is unfair.

Like a guy sitting on the bench, but still allowed to take 3-pointers.

Get your things straight.  op =/= unfair

 

 

There is no such thing as fair. Poor sports constantly whine about SPG's instead of just enjoying the game and letting everyone play what they want. Every player will have good and bad games unless you want WOT to grant you special parameters in game allowing you to always win and never take damage. Any class in this game can be considered unfair to one or more of the other classes. To use your analogy of basketball it's like one team with short players that suck so bad they can't even make a free throw demanding the officials bench the tall players of an opposing team along with all the players that made 2 and 3 pointers during pre-game warm ups. 

Edited by n4cer67, Nov 09 2018 - 07:32.


texflash #180 Posted Nov 10 2018 - 00:06

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Let the people who don't want to play with artillery pay for the privilege with Gold . That ought to make WoT some cash , and provide an out for the hopeless artillery haters . 

In Real Life : 1) Artillery would be firing from 3 to 20 km away .

                            2) The trajectory of shells in this game is closer to mortars than real artillery .

                    3) Artillery fires  in groups of 3 to 8 vehicles .

                    4) The chances of one artillery hitting an individual tank is quite small .

Just sayin' .






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