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Sucking with VK 45.02 B on Live Oaks - replay analysis request


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LuckyStarr #1 Posted Feb 20 2019 - 16:31

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Had a frustrating game in a VK 45.02 B recently. Lived till the end of the battle, did zero damage. I think I know what I did wrong - assigned higher threat rating to O-Ho than it deserves, which lead me to hiding more than I should have, then peeking into M103 at an unfavorable angle and taking a shot because I didn't want to expose my side to O-Ho and instead exposed it to M103. I did try to follow and support the ally M103, but he was always one step ahead of me and he did OK in this game, unlike yours truly.

 

I'd be grateful for advice on how I should have behaved differently to make at least some impact on the game, but more importantly, I want to identify the flaws in my judgement. How can I improve my thought process to avoid such annoying situations? What would be the correct line of reasoning that would lead me to proper decisions instead of the ones I made?

 

http://wotreplays.eu/site/4784799#live_oaks-luckystarr-vk_45_02_p_ausf_b


Edited by LuckyStarr, Feb 20 2019 - 16:31.


Projectile_Misfired #2 Posted Feb 20 2019 - 16:37

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This replay link isn't working for me.



LuckyStarr #3 Posted Feb 20 2019 - 16:39

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View PostPanman69, on Feb 20 2019 - 17:37, said:

This replay link isn't working for me.

 

Sorry, the link is fixed now.

NiteDog #4 Posted Feb 20 2019 - 17:03

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Send your replay request to Guido1212. 

Projectile_Misfired #5 Posted Feb 20 2019 - 17:24

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Let me preface this by stating that I don't consider myself a Heavy tank player, so, if someone else gives you dissenting advice from mine, take their's.

First, from my experience, the meta on Live Oaks has shifted from a city battle to the railroad battle. However, being in a slowish Heavy and seeing 3 arty on the enemy team, I too would have probably taken the city route.

Second, although it would've been nice to  punch a round into one of those Lights, stopping in the middle of an open field is the last thing you want to do. You gave up over 700hp and didn't even fire a shot.

Third, when you finally got to the city, you stopped by the M103. I would have just continued on. Then, I would have had my choice as to which building to use as cover.

Fourth, I would have moved over to the other side of the church that your M103 teammate was at. You had, I think it was a T10, further behind you to stop the O-HO from flanking you. Then, you would've had better shots on the enemy M103.

Fifth, yes. That poke you did on the M103 was a mistake. Your tank, according to Tanks.gg, is designed for side-scrapping. You could've knocked down that building closest to you to give you room to maneuver into a a better position. When you poked out, you gave him a nice easy shot onto the side of your tank. Also, as mentioned in my 'third' observation, had you led the charge when getting to the city, you could've taken the spot your M103 teammate had which would've given you even better side-scrapping options.

At that point, the game was pretty much over and all that was left was clean-up. The O-HO was stuck waiting to get one last shot off. And, when your other teammates showed up to flank the M103 and 704, had you not again followed your M103 teammate, you may have been able to get one or two more shots on them.

 

But, like I said before, I'm not really a Heavy tank player, so with the exception of my 'second' observation, the others are what I think you could have improved. But, regardless of what tank you're in, you should never stop in the middle of an open field right at the beginning of a match....especially once you're spotted. If you want to take the shot, take it on the move. It may be less accurate, but it also leaves you as being a moving target which is harder, even when leading, to hit.



_Zero___ #6 Posted Feb 20 2019 - 17:31

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View PostPanman69, on Feb 20 2019 - 17:24, said:

Let me preface this by stating that I don't consider myself a Heavy tank player, so, if someone else gives you dissenting advice from mine, take their's.

First, from my experience, the meta on Live Oaks has shifted from a city battle to the railroad battle. However, being in a slowish Heavy and seeing 3 arty on the enemy team, I too would have probably taken the city route.

Second, although it would've been nice to  punch a round into one of those Lights, stopping in the middle of an open field is the last thing you want to do. You gave up over 700hp and didn't even fire a shot.

Third, when you finally got to the city, you stopped by the M103. I would have just continued on. Then, I would have had my choice as to which building to use as cover.

Fourth, I would have moved over to the other side of the church that your M103 teammate was at. You had, I think it was a T10, further behind you to stop the O-HO from flanking you. Then, you would've had better shots on the enemy M103.

Fifth, yes. That poke you did on the M103 was a mistake. Your tank, according to Tanks.gg, is designed for side-scrapping. You could've knocked down that building closest to you to give you room to maneuver into a a better position. When you poked out, you gave him a nice easy shot onto the side of your tank. Also, as mentioned in my 'third' observation, had you led the charge when getting to the city, you could've taken the spot your M103 teammate had which would've given you even better side-scrapping options.

At that point, the game was pretty much over and all that was left was clean-up. The O-HO was stuck waiting to get one last shot off. And, when your other teammates showed up to flank the M103 and 704, had you not again followed your M103 teammate, you may have been able to get one or two more shots on them.

 

But, like I said before, I'm not really a Heavy tank player, so with the exception of my 'second' observation, the others are what I think you could have improved. But, regardless of what tank you're in, you should never stop in the middle of an open field right at the beginning of a match....especially once you're spotted. If you want to take the shot, take it on the move. It may be less accurate, but it also leaves you as being a moving target which is harder, even when leading, to hit.

 

For the most part i agree with all that was said here. You were the equivalent of a top tier heavy. You should have bullied city a bit more. (I always go city if there is arty because i get focused so hard otherwise). What you should have done is put yourself in position to trade with one tank and not two and then proceeded to trade (preferably in your favor) to make it through the battle. 

LuckyStarr #7 Posted Feb 20 2019 - 17:55

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Thanks for the replies! Yeah, stopping in the field was a poor decision even by my standards, don't know why I thought at the time it's a good idea. As for the city, I felt pinned down and unable to move as soon as I parked on the corner next to our M103, but in reality that feeling doesn't seem to have been justified. In the worst case, I could have taken a shot in exchange for a better position...

Augustus_Sohn #8 Posted Feb 20 2019 - 19:28

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I am not great, but this looked like (quite) a few games I have had.

 

The whole time I watched I was saying "Get aggressive." and thinking about all the times I have watched myself play very sparingly in big heavily armored tanks that can take a good hit and still keep on ticking. So while you were playing very passive, the rest of the team was playing quite aggressively, leaving you behind. It happens once in a while, especially in big slow heavies like the VKB. I have found that I end up playing games like that when I start to get tilted, because I was getting worried about dying too quick.

 

My advice (only because it has worked for me) is that when you have a game like this, step away for a bit. Go play a tank of a completely different type to try and shake your brain up. Like I said, it has worked to help get my brain out of the fog.


Edited by Augustus_Sohn, Feb 20 2019 - 19:28.


The_Pushok #9 Posted Feb 24 2019 - 20:28

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I did not think it was that bad at all, despite the zero damage. You calculated a strategy and won the battle, rolled them pretty much. I find the better my team is, the less damage I do usually, lol. Also, you did zero damage, but your heavy sitting there also impacted the enemy's strategy as well.

 

You could have been more aggressive in the city is about all you could have done, when you were next to the main road, you should have either crossed to start flanking them as they were hiding behind buildings, or you should have crossed the main road further down at one line, then go east. But going into it, looked more like expecting a hard push from them. Stuff happens.

 

Only critique (which I also do, lol), was stopping in the open field concerning yourself with that light. You are just exposing yourself for no reason, you cut your slow heavy too close to center, you need to go up one line to minimize your chance of being spotted. With those artys, you are a sitting duck really, all they need is for you to be spotted once and they can guess easily where to fire, because you are slow and they know you are heading to the city. If you can fire on the move fine, or have an obstacle that you are near for cover fine, but stopping like that, would recommend not doing it.

 

Edit; went and read other responses, agree with them and forgot about when you stopped next to that other tank when you first got to the city, given nothing was spotted yet, I would have continued on into the city to get a good position or something, even if just to find where the enemy is.


Edited by The_Pushok, Feb 24 2019 - 20:32.


LuckyStarr #10 Posted Feb 24 2019 - 20:59

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Thanks, all good points.

The only sad thing is I feel I still may repeat the same mistakes should similar circumstances arise. Guess the best I can do is keep this game fresh in my memory and recognize similar situations, then I can recall your advice and stick to it. Changing patterns of thinking is hard.






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