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ImBonzo #1 Posted Apr 03 2019 - 04:58

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My suggestions to make this game a bit less frustrating for the AVERAGE player. The theme will of this post will blatantly be "throw the noobs (me) a bone".

 

1) MM should factor in player rating (not driven by it, but in the algorithm). Why should an entire team of average-and-less players face a platoon of very good players, PLUS additional good-to-very good players? Play the singles against the platoon and then sprinkle the poor players in the mix.

 

2) I completely agree with the_Deadly_Bulb and his suggestion to make allies more able to flip your tank upright. He suggests you get close, use the L key and "presto," you have used the cables and wenches to upright your friend, with all of the realism of repairing tracks, engines, etc. Flipping should not be an up to 14:58 minute death sentence.

 

3) Fix the track repair problem (as I see it). Tracks (and perhaps engines, etc.) should not be able to be repaired while in motion. Level the playing field; get rid of the effectiveness of illegal auto-repair mods. The fastest recorded human reactions are in the .25 second range. I have timed repairs faster than that. The driver must be made AWARE of the tracking before that .25 sec. or slower reaction time kicks in. And players like myself can practice all I can and/or "git gud", but my reactions are and will always be average or worse. Make repairing tracks a minimum of, say, 0.5 seconds (faster than average, but eliminates mods, etc.). You don't like getting hit after being tracked? "Git gud" and avoid getting tracked. ;-)  Perhaps make the tracks a bit less fragile at the same time.

 

4) Make Campaign goals more reachable for the lowly. Two examples: a) "earn the Ace Mastery Badge 3 times". It could take me months to do that. A unicum might do it in a couple of dozen games in a day.  Perhaps, if you are average (1 sigma), earn it twice. Better than 1 sigma, 3 times. Worse? Once. b) "Assist and do 7000 hp damage in a LT."  For us losers, that requires an amazing amount of luck and a tier 10. So, it influences those who should never play at tier 10 (arguably me) to play a lot at tier 10, making it less fun for those who "belong" there. How about a sliding scale for the tier played...like 4K at tier 7, 5K at tier 8, and so on?

 

4.a.) Winning as a part of the goal requirement. You good players probably cannot understand how frustrating (the game is supposed to be FUN, after all) this requirement is. Let's face it. If a bozo like me is top player/Top Gun/best scout/etc., then that necessarily means the rest of the team played worse than I, which mean we probably sucked and lost. See the Catch-22 here? Now, as what to do about it? I have no idea. I'll leave that to someone much smarter than I.

 

5) The rich get richer. Reward tanks go to the good players, well, as an award for good play. Cool. I'm fine with that. Until those tanks come on the battlefield and beat the brains out of us seals. Again, I am trying to address the frustrations of the average. Could there be a lottery for those tanks, so those of us who would NEVER otherwise drive those tanks would have some (very minimal) chance to do so? Perhaps with restrictions...like a minimum of "x" (2500?) games in the same tier or higher as the reward tank, and one lottery entry for each 250 or 500 games over that minimum. Make the occasional noob happy. I purpose that there wouldn't be enough rewarded (or allowed to be purchased?) to frustrate the good players with noobs driving them. Let's face it...I own a Maus. And I suck. Noobs can drag a team down in whatever they drive. It would be in the same spirit as the "A well deserved reward" campaign.

 

Oh, and thanks WG for the goofy and fun camo options. That was a good idea.



cKy_ #2 Posted Apr 03 2019 - 05:11

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I disagree with the campaign missions and reward tanks. I think that they should be rewards for pure skill. That way the good players are aptly rewarded for said skill, and average players have something to encourage them to make the effort to improve. 

ShutUp_Karl #3 Posted Apr 03 2019 - 05:42

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View PostImBonzo, on Apr 02 2019 - 22:58, said:

My suggestions to make this game a bit less frustrating for the AVERAGE player. The theme will of this post will blatantly be "throw the noobs (me) a bone".

 

1) MM should factor in player rating (not driven by it, but in the algorithm). Why should an entire team of average-and-less players face a platoon of very good players, PLUS additional good-to-very good players? Play the singles against the platoon and then sprinkle the poor players in the mix.

 

2) I completely agree with the_Deadly_Bulb and his suggestion to make allies more able to flip your tank upright. He suggests you get close, use the L key and "presto," you have used the cables and wenches to upright your friend, with all of the realism of repairing tracks, engines, etc. Flipping should not be an up to 14:58 minute death sentence.

 

3) Fix the track repair problem (as I see it). Tracks (and perhaps engines, etc.) should not be able to be repaired while in motion. Level the playing field; get rid of the effectiveness of illegal auto-repair mods. The fastest recorded human reactions are in the .25 second range. I have timed repairs faster than that. The driver must be made AWARE of the tracking before that .25 sec. or slower reaction time kicks in. And players like myself can practice all I can and/or "git gud", but my reactions are and will always be average or worse. Make repairing tracks a minimum of, say, 0.5 seconds (faster than average, but eliminates mods, etc.). You don't like getting hit after being tracked? "Git gud" and avoid getting tracked. ;-)  Perhaps make the tracks a bit less fragile at the same time.

 

4) Make Campaign goals more reachable for the lowly. Two examples: a) "earn the Ace Mastery Badge 3 times". It could take me months to do that. A unicum might do it in a couple of dozen games in a day.  Perhaps, if you are average (1 sigma), earn it twice. Better than 1 sigma, 3 times. Worse? Once. b) "Assist and do 7000 hp damage in a LT."  For us losers, that requires an amazing amount of luck and a tier 10. So, it influences those who should never play at tier 10 (arguably me) to play a lot at tier 10, making it less fun for those who "belong" there. How about a sliding scale for the tier played...like 4K at tier 7, 5K at tier 8, and so on?

 

4.a.) Winning as a part of the goal requirement. You good players probably cannot understand how frustrating (the game is supposed to be FUN, after all) this requirement is. Let's face it. If a bozo like me is top player/Top Gun/best scout/etc., then that necessarily means the rest of the team played worse than I, which mean we probably sucked and lost. See the Catch-22 here? Now, as what to do about it? I have no idea. I'll leave that to someone much smarter than I.

 

5) The rich get richer. Reward tanks go to the good players, well, as an award for good play. Cool. I'm fine with that. Until those tanks come on the battlefield and beat the brains out of us seals. Again, I am trying to address the frustrations of the average. Could there be a lottery for those tanks, so those of us who would NEVER otherwise drive those tanks would have some (very minimal) chance to do so? Perhaps with restrictions...like a minimum of "x" (2500?) games in the same tier or higher as the reward tank, and one lottery entry for each 250 or 500 games over that minimum. Make the occasional noob happy. I purpose that there wouldn't be enough rewarded (or allowed to be purchased?) to frustrate the good players with noobs driving them. Let's face it...I own a Maus. And I suck. Noobs can drag a team down in whatever they drive. It would be in the same spirit as the "A well deserved reward" campaign.

 

Oh, and thanks WG for the goofy and fun camo options. That was a good idea.

 

Did someone have a bad day playing a video game.....  Somebody get junior their pacifier......
 

If I had a dollar every time someone whined that they want a "Skill Based Match Making"   Heck I'd buy war gaming....
To put it as bottom line and simple as possible as to why it will more or less NEVER FRACKIN HAPPEN...  There isn't enough players on the NA or EU at any given time. Even if you combined the two... There just isn't enough players.
 

As for the rest well  TLDR...  Except for the part of having either self righting tanks, that would be nice, never happen though.



Lucid_Nonsense_1 #4 Posted Apr 03 2019 - 05:47

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View PostImBonzo, on Apr 03 2019 - 04:58, said:

 

3) Fix the track repair problem (as I see it). Tracks (and perhaps engines, etc.) should not be able to be repaired while in motion. Level the playing field; get rid of the effectiveness of illegal auto-repair mods. The fastest recorded human reactions are in the .25 second range. I have timed repairs faster than that. The driver must be made AWARE of the tracking before that .25 sec. or slower reaction time kicks in. And players like myself can practice all I can and/or "git gud", but my reactions are and will always be average or worse. Make repairing tracks a minimum of, say, 0.5 seconds (faster than average, but eliminates mods, etc.). You don't like getting hit after being tracked? "Git gud" and avoid getting tracked. ;-)  Perhaps make the tracks a bit less fragile at the same time.

 

 

 

How do you know they aren't just using premium consumables? For audio stimulus many people exceed 0.1s reaction time. Because data has to travel both ways to the server, if your ping is ~50ms, you can easily get a situation where the repair appears almost instantaneous to other players. I play with 200ms + ping, most of the times the repairs look instantaneous at my end; if someone has higher ping than you, that can happen with sub 100 ping. 

 

PS. I 100% agree that OP reward tanks should be limited to clanwars etc; having them in pubbies just makes the average skilled player feel seal-clubbed. WG is literally driving people away with this BS. OR, have rare tanks as rewards, but make them balanced - crazy thought, I know. 

Ditto MM adjusting for skill; way overdue and wouldn't be hard to implement.


Edited by Lucid_Nonsense_1, Apr 03 2019 - 05:51.


Playz4Free #5 Posted Apr 03 2019 - 08:15

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View PostImBonzo, on Apr 03 2019 - 04:58, said:

My suggestions to make this game a bit less frustrating for the AVERAGE player. The theme will of this post will blatantly be "throw the noobs (me) a bone".

 

1) MM should factor in player rating (not driven by it, but in the algorithm). Why should an entire team of average-and-less players face a platoon of very good players, PLUS additional good-to-very good players? Play the singles against the platoon and then sprinkle the poor players in the mix.

     Random queue is random, skill based MM will not prevent blowouts and roflstomps. If you want skill based fighting go play ranked, they should have three performance based tiers next season.

2) I completely agree with the_Deadly_Bulb and his suggestion to make allies more able to flip your tank upright. He suggests you get close, use the L key and "presto," you have used the cables and wenches to upright your friend, with all of the realism of repairing tracks, engines, etc. Flipping should not be an up to 14:58 minute death sentence.

      They have considered it and thought of implementing an indicator for flipped, but that is not a this year thing afaik.

3) Fix the track repair problem (as I see it). Tracks (and perhaps engines, etc.) should not be able to be repaired while in motion. Level the playing field; get rid of the effectiveness of illegal auto-repair mods. The fastest recorded human reactions are in the .25 second range. I have timed repairs faster than that. The driver must be made AWARE of the tracking before that .25 sec. or slower reaction time kicks in. And players like myself can practice all I can and/or "git gud", but my reactions are and will always be average or worse. Make repairing tracks a minimum of, say, 0.5 seconds (faster than average, but eliminates mods, etc.). You don't like getting hit after being tracked? "Git gud" and avoid getting tracked. ;-)  Perhaps make the tracks a bit less fragile at the same time.

   There is no need to force a timer limit, and it would punish those with a fast reaction time. If someone is using an illegal mod, they will get banned.

4) Make Campaign goals more reachable for the lowly. Two examples: a) "earn the Ace Mastery Badge 3 times". It could take me months to do that. A unicum might do it in a couple of dozen games in a day.  Perhaps, if you are average (1 sigma), earn it twice. Better than 1 sigma, 3 times. Worse? Once. b) "Assist and do 7000 hp damage in a LT."  For us losers, that requires an amazing amount of luck and a tier 10. So, it influences those who should never play at tier 10 (arguably me) to play a lot at tier 10, making it less fun for those who "belong" there. How about a sliding scale for the tier played...like 4K at tier 7, 5K at tier 8, and so on?

   No. They are a performance based system, you just need to strive to improve to complete them. Bad players don't get a break and get them made easier, they are not a participation system, but a skill system.

4.a.) Winning as a part of the goal requirement. You good players probably cannot understand how frustrating (the game is supposed to be FUN, after all) this requirement is. Let's face it. If a bozo like me is top player/Top Gun/best scout/etc., then that necessarily means the rest of the team played worse than I, which mean we probably sucked and lost. See the Catch-22 here? Now, as what to do about it? I have no idea. I'll leave that to someone much smarter than I.

   Campaign missions are end game type content, you have all the time in the world of tanks to complete them and improve till you do. Keep playing and improving is the answer on what to do about it.

5) The rich get richer. Reward tanks go to the good players, well, as an award for good play. Cool. I'm fine with that. Until those tanks come on the battlefield and beat the brains out of us seals. Again, I am trying to address the frustrations of the average. Could there be a lottery for those tanks, so those of us who would NEVER otherwise drive those tanks would have some (very minimal) chance to do so? Perhaps with restrictions...like a minimum of "x" (2500?) games in the same tier or higher as the reward tank, and one lottery entry for each 250 or 500 games over that minimum. Make the occasional noob happy. I purpose that there wouldn't be enough rewarded (or allowed to be purchased?) to frustrate the good players with noobs driving them. Let's face it...I own a Maus. And I suck. Noobs can drag a team down in whatever they drive. It would be in the same spirit as the "A well deserved reward" campaign.

    If you are referring to clan wars tanks, no. The whole part about them being a reward for participating in clan wars is defeated if you can get them without participating in clan wars. IF (seriously stressing the if) they ever retired a tank from the reward tank list and it becomes unobtainable completely, then I could see it being offered in something like the bond shop for people to get like the retired tier tens, but as long as it is a clan wars reward it should NEVER be obtainable outside of clan wars participation.

Oh, and thanks WG for the goofy and fun camo options. That was a good idea.

 



ImBonzo #6 Posted Apr 03 2019 - 08:38

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View PostcKy_, on Apr 02 2019 - 20:11, said:

I disagree with the campaign missions and reward tanks. I think that they should be rewards for pure skill. That way the good players are aptly rewarded for said skill, and average players have something to encourage them to make the effort to improve. 

 

I'm sure any high-rated player would agree with you. This is the classic haves vs. have-nots.  But, this was created as a game, not a tournament. Average players already have incentive to play better- not to suck. I was suggesting ways in which I, as a sucker, would find this game more appealing. Catering "especially" to the highly skilled will continue to frustrate the masses and cause them to quit, bot, or just do stupid things in games (yolo, TK, etc.) because it really doesn't matter. I know you guys don't like that. And neither do I. The more that quit, the fewer you'll fave to seal club and queues will lengthen...the game will die.

I know I will never get better. Both because of the Catch-22 rule, wherein if I am in the top 3, it means my team sucked. Plus I have physical limitations and the effects of old age (losing eyesight, slowing reflexes, etc.), but I would still like to enjoy the game and have an actual chance to complete missions...eventually. Remember the reward is only a somewhat crappy tank...pixels.

I dunno. Maybe I spent too much time referring youth soccer. Everybody gets a trophy...but they also have more fun.



ImBonzo #7 Posted Apr 03 2019 - 09:11

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View PostLucid_Nonsense_1, on Apr 02 2019 - 20:47, said:

 

How do you know they aren't just using premium consumables? What does this have to do with reaction time? Pressing one button for a lg. repair kit, or programming a mouse to click 4+5 is the same to the human.

For audio stimulus many people exceed 0.1s reaction time.  Where did you get your data? The mean RTs for sprinters at the Beijing Olympics were 166 ms for males and 189 ms for females, but in one out of 1,000 starts they can achieve 109 ms and 121 ms, respectively. And that is a highly trained elite athletes knowing a SINGLE option stimulus is about to come, then they get both audio and visual (strobe). Your tracks coming off is a scientifically slower go/no stimulus. You do not know ahead of time which stimulus you will receive, tracks, engine, bounce, which means you have to select the correct response. And the audio response is rather lengthy by the crew member.

Because data has to travel both ways to the server, if your ping is ~50ms, you can easily get a situation where the repair appears almost instantaneous to other players. I play with 200ms + ping, most of the times the repairs look instantaneous at my end; if someone has higher ping than you, that can happen with sub 100 ping. Not going to argue this. I am not educated well enough to not stick my foot in my mouth.

I should say, though, that the players I most suspect of using mods or other dubious means are the "tomatoes" and "oranges" who repair in the blink of an eye. If they were that fast at reacting, wouldn't they be much better? Snapping shots, etc.?

 

PS. I 100% agree that OP reward tanks should be limited to clanwars etc; having them in pubbies just makes the average skilled player feel seal-clubbed. WG is literally driving people away with this BS. OR, have rare tanks as rewards, but make them balanced - crazy thought, I know. 

Ditto MM adjusting for skill; way overdue and wouldn't be hard to implement.

Thank you for commenting. I appreciate intelligent and polite response.



ImBonzo #8 Posted Apr 03 2019 - 09:23

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View PostShutUp_Karl, on Apr 02 2019 - 20:42, said:

 

Did someone have a bad day playing a video game.....  Somebody get junior their pacifier......

Did you actually read my post? I admit to being an old fart, probably old enough to be your father if not grandfather. 

And why do you feel the need to try to show your superiority by making a attempt at an insult? Do you also beat your chest like a fricking gorilla when you walk into a crowded room? Or drop and show your red [edited]to everyone like a baboon?
 

If I had a dollar every time someone whined that they want a "Skill Based Match Making"   Heck I'd buy war gaming....
To put it as bottom line and simple as possible as to why it will more or less NEVER FRACKIN HAPPEN...  There isn't enough players on the NA or EU at any given time. Even if you combined the two... There just isn't enough players. 

Did you actually read my post? I suggested it be part of the algorithm. Not "based." See my examples. Just distribute crappy players like us after balancing the good/great players first. And my hypothesis is that if things continue as they are, frustrating players with poor play results like us, that there will be even fewer players.
 

As for the rest well  TLDR...  Except for the part of having either self righting tanks, that would be nice, never happen though.

​It seems you didn't read much of it at all...

Nice try at trolling, though.



ImBonzo #9 Posted Apr 03 2019 - 09:43

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View PostPlayz4Free, on Apr 02 2019 - 23:15, said:

There is no need to force a timer limit, and it would punish those with a fast reaction time. If someone is using an illegal mod, they will get banned.

um, we get no data from WG supporting that. We get words. And it is my belief, especially when one sees an otherwise lousy player react with (or exceed) the speed and prowess of an elite athlete, I have to say "hmmm."

And, what is wrong with a minimum limit, anyway? It is already a joke that you aren't out of the game if tracked (yes, I know it is an arcade game, not RL). Is there any reason WG cannot change the rules? They do frequently. I am merely SUGGESTING an idea to please the masses. Most of us, I would bet, do not even have the average reaction times of a single stimulus (go!) in healthy, physically active college-aged males (0.2 sec.). I will be hated by the elitists. 

 

Thanks for your thoughtful response.

 



cKy_ #10 Posted Apr 03 2019 - 10:18

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View PostImBonzo, on Apr 03 2019 - 20:43, said:

um, we get no data from WG supporting that. We get words. And it is my belief, especially when one sees an otherwise lousy player react with (or exceed) the speed and prowess of an elite athlete, I have to say "hmmm."

And, what is wrong with a minimum limit, anyway? It is already a joke that you aren't out of the game if tracked (yes, I know it is an arcade game, not RL). Is there any reason WG cannot change the rules? They do frequently. I am merely SUGGESTING an idea to please the masses. Most of us, I would bet, do not even have the average reaction times of a single stimulus (go!) in healthy, physically active college-aged males (0.2 sec.). I will be hated by the elitists. 

 

Thanks for your thoughtful response.

 

 

How would that please the masses? You do realise that it's possible to be expecting to be tracked, and as a result able to repair them quite easily, right?



Pipinghot #11 Posted Apr 03 2019 - 11:53

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View PostImBonzo, on Apr 02 2019 - 22:58, said:

1) MM should factor in player rating (not driven by it, but in the algorithm). Why should an entire team of average-and-less players face a platoon of very good players, PLUS additional good-to-very good players? Play the singles against the platoon and then sprinkle the poor players in the mix.

You say that your suggestions are for the "AVERAGE" player, but SBMM would do nothing for average players, they'd still be average, they'd still have an average Win Rate. Change the MM does nothing to average player and it does nothing for them. So if you really are concerned about the average player, then SBMM would be a completely useless.

View PostImBonzo, on Apr 02 2019 - 22:58, said:

2) I completely agree with the_Deadly_Bulb and his suggestion to make allies more able to flip your tank upright. He suggests you get close, use the L key and "presto," you have used the cables and wenches to upright your friend, with all of the realism of repairing tracks, engines, etc. Flipping should not be an up to 14:58 minute death sentence.

Yes. The current system for righting tanks is pretty useless, considering that we can repair tracks in just seconds it should also be possible to right a tank in just seconds.

View PostImBonzo, on Apr 02 2019 - 22:58, said:

3) Fix the track repair problem (as I see it). Tracks (and perhaps engines, etc.) should not be able to be repaired while in motion. Level the playing field; get rid of the effectiveness of illegal auto-repair mods. The fastest recorded human reactions are in the .25 second range. I have timed repairs faster than that. The driver must be made AWARE of the tracking before that .25 sec. or slower reaction time kicks in. And players like myself can practice all I can and/or "git gud", but my reactions are and will always be average or worse. Make repairing tracks a minimum of, say, 0.5 seconds (faster than average, but eliminates mods, etc.). You don't like getting hit after being tracked? "Git gud" and avoid getting tracked. ;-)  Perhaps make the tracks a bit less fragile at the same time.

This is wrong for multiple reasons:

1) 0.25 is the average, not the fastest

2) It's only the average for visual stimuli. The averages for audio and touch are significantly faster.

3) "...my reactions are and will always be average or worse"  Well that's your problem, don't ask them to change the game just to coddle you for being average or worse.

4) The difference between fixing tracks in 0.25 or 0.5 seconds is essentially meaningless, it's just a tiny, tiny part of the game. No one has a better or worse win rate because of their reaction time fixing tracks, and no one out here is buffing their win rate by using a track repair mod. If you think track repairs are making a difference in this game then there is a whole lot about WoT that you are missing out on.

5) "I have timed repairs faster than that."  No you haven't, you're just imagining it. You get the vague feeling that someone is repairing their tracks "too fast" and then you falsely describe that as 'timing it', that's a bunch of bunk. Unless you can provide a replay with slow motion and a stop-clock that demonstrates someone repairing tracks extra fast you're suffering from a bad case of confirmation bias.

6) "Make repairing tracks a minimum of, say, 0.5 seconds (faster than average" Again, no, that's significantly slower than the average response time, twice as long as the average.

View PostImBonzo, on Apr 02 2019 - 22:58, said:

4) Make Campaign goals more reachable for the lowly. Two examples: a) "earn the Ace Mastery Badge 3 times". It could take me months to do that. A unicum might do it in a couple of dozen games in a day.  Perhaps, if you are average (1 sigma), earn it twice. Better than 1 sigma, 3 times. Worse? Once. b) "Assist and do 7000 hp damage in a LT."  For us losers, that requires an amazing amount of luck and a tier 10. So, it influences those who should never play at tier 10 (arguably me) to play a lot at tier 10, making it less fun for those who "belong" there. How about a sliding scale for the tier played...like 4K at tier 7, 5K at tier 8, and so on?

Disagree. This is a game that opens every bit of content to every player, and you're complaining about skill rewards? Every player in the game has access skirmishes, every player in the game has access to Clan Wars, every player in the game has access to extra game modes like Front Lines. Nothing in this game is behind a paywall, even 100% free players can enjoy every single bit of content this game has to offer without ever paying a penny. There's nothing wrong with reserving a few goals in the game for people who put in the time and effort to get good enough to earn them.

View PostImBonzo, on Apr 02 2019 - 22:58, said:

5) The rich get richer. Reward tanks go to the good players, well, as an award for good play. Cool. I'm fine with that. Until those tanks come on the battlefield and beat the brains out of us seals. Again, I am trying to address the frustrations of the average. Could there be a lottery for those tanks, so those of us who would NEVER otherwise drive those tanks would have some (very minimal) chance to do so? Perhaps with restrictions...like a minimum of "x" (2500?) games in the same tier or higher as the reward tank, and one lottery entry for each 250 or 500 games over that minimum. Make the occasional noob happy. I purpose that there wouldn't be enough rewarded (or allowed to be purchased?) to frustrate the good players with noobs driving them. Let's face it...I own a Maus. And I suck. Noobs can drag a team down in whatever they drive. It would be in the same spirit as the "A well deserved reward" campaign.
Rewards tanks are not as good as you're implying. The main reason that they "beat the brains" out of other players is that they're earned by people who are already good. It's not the tanks that are making the players good, its that the good players are driving them. Even if WG made every "noob happy" by giving them reward tanks they's still be noobs, no matter what tank they're driving. What you're really asking is for WG to give you a tank without you actually having to earn it as a reward, which defeats the entire point of reward tanks in the first place. I sort of understand why you're asking, because you want them and you don't plan to ever earn them, but c'mon that's a pretty selfish request.

_Tsavo_ #12 Posted Apr 03 2019 - 12:24

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Generally disagreeable to the entire post.   Skill based, influenced, integrated, what have you, would treat specific players differently than others. 

 

The game is not built around a minimum requirement for time being tracked before a kit can be used.   This effectively punishes quick reaction times as others are unable to react as quickly.  I've poked corners holding down the key for my large repair kit and hardly slow down when prepared to do so. 

 

 

Tank flipping assistance might be doable but I don't often encounter flipped allies and the risk to taking a teamkill hit is there currently if you try.   I'd consider it a rather low priority.

 

CW reward tanks should remain behind the wall of competitive  PvP performance, although more accessible CW times could be considered, so long as you have winners and losers because it is a competition and participation rewards are not needed. 

 



Pipinghot #13 Posted Apr 03 2019 - 12:36

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View PostImBonzo, on Apr 03 2019 - 03:43, said:

View PostPlayz4Free, on Apr 02 2019 - 23:15, said:

There is no need to force a timer limit, and it would punish those with a fast reaction time. If someone is using an illegal mod, they will get banned.

um, we get no data from WG supporting that. We get words.

If you don't trust WG to tell the truth and ban people for using illegal mods, why are you playing their game? If you think they're going to lie about banning cheaters then it doesn't matter whether they implement a timer or not, you're still playing a game from people who you've just called a bunch of liars. If WG doesn't can cheaters, then they encourage cheaters, and if they're a company that encourages cheaters it's silly to expect them to make a change to game mechanics that would prevent (what you think is) people cheating.

 

What you're basically saying is, "Hey WG you're a bunch of liars who encourage cheating, so you should make a change to your game that would prevent cheating." Surely you have to see that this is a pretty silly thing to ask.

View PostImBonzo, on Apr 03 2019 - 03:43, said:

And it is my belief, especially when one sees an otherwise lousy player react with (or exceed) the speed and prowess of an elite athlete, I have to say "hmmm."
Again, confirmation bias. Provide some evidence or it's all in your head.

View PostImBonzo, on Apr 03 2019 - 03:43, said:

And, what is wrong with a minimum limit, anyway?

That's already been answered. If people are better at reacting then you are, it's wrong to punish them.

View PostImBonzo, on Apr 03 2019 - 03:43, said:

It is already a joke that you aren't out of the game if tracked (yes, I know it is an arcade game, not RL).

No it's not a joke, that's an absurd argument. This is a game with 15 minute battles, it's a game where you don't have to worry about infantry, don't have to worry about mines and tank traps, don't have to worry about air power, you can magically raise a crew member from the dead like you're a shaman with god-like powers, and yet you think that track repair is too fast. You're having a bad case of target fixation, getting all wrapped up in one tiny issue that isn't even really an issue to begin with.

View PostImBonzo, on Apr 03 2019 - 03:43, said:

I am merely SUGGESTING an idea to please the masses.

No you're not, you're suggesting a change to please yourself and maybe (just maybe) a couple of other people. Look around the forums, there are many topics with hundreds or thousands of threads each, and yet nothing about people repairing tracks "too quickly". This nothing that "the masses" care about, it's specific to you, and your reasons for suggesting it are selfish based on your personal reaction time.

View PostImBonzo, on Apr 03 2019 - 03:43, said:

Most of us, I would bet, do not even have the average reaction times of a single stimulus (go!) in healthy, physically active college-aged males (0.2 sec.). I will be hated by the elitists.

Nah... it's more like you'll make 99.9% of everybody roll their eyes at you for belaboring a non-issue.



ShutUp_Karl #14 Posted Apr 03 2019 - 21:43

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View PostImBonzo, on Apr 03 2019 - 03:23, said:

Did someone have a bad day playing a video game.....  Somebody get junior their pacifier......

Did you actually read my post? I admit to being an old fart, probably old enough to be your father if not grandfather. 

And why do you feel the need to try to show your superiority by making a attempt at an insult? Do you also beat your chest like a fricking gorilla when you walk into a crowded room? Or drop and show your red [edited]to everyone like a baboon?

ROFLMAOPIP.....   That is rich,  you are dealing with a Gulf War Vet here BUBBA... so if you have the idea that YOU could be my father or Grandfather then wow for an 85 to 117 year of schmuck  your reflexes are good

 

If I had a dollar every time someone whined that they want a "Skill Based Match Making"   Heck I'd buy war gaming....
To put it as bottom line and simple as possible as to why it will more or less NEVER FRACKIN HAPPEN...  There isn't enough players on the NA or EU at any given time. Even if you combined the two... There just isn't enough players. 

Did you actually read my post? I suggested it be part of the algorithm. Not "based." See my examples. Just distribute crappy players like us after balancing the good/great players first. And my hypothesis is that if things continue as they are, frustrating players with poor play results like us, that there will be even fewer players.
I actually didn't have to read past the first few sentience's.  It was another whine how match maker isn't what was sold to us with the 3/5/7 creation.  Well Tah Dahhhhhhhhh    you only had to wait less than 24 hours as of your original posting and here it is.  No it isn't what YOU want it is what can be done for this time around.  Instead of crying for a skill based MM, how about, Ping Based.  To be generous say those who have 300 or less (this is to accommodate the odd spikes at peak internet times. damn you Netflix) They are in one group and the others with 301 and Higher are put in the other Here is a Nickle's worth of advice, IF you don't already have a google accnt. start one. Get on You Tube and subscribe to Dez Gamez as well as World of Tanks North America. Dez does a outstanding job keep us players up to date.  IF that isn't in your time then
go to the main WoT web site for news and other updates.
 

As for the rest well  TLDR...  Except for the part of having either self righting tanks, that would be nice, never happen though.

​It seems you didn't read much of it at all...   I think I covered that.

 

View PostImBonzo, on Apr 03 2019 - 03:23, said:

Nice try at trolling, though.   LOL I wasn't even beginning to troll, YET I can see that I perhaps made you feel like a whiny little prepubescent.

 

 


Edited by ShutUp_Karl, Apr 03 2019 - 21:46.


ImBonzo #15 Posted Apr 04 2019 - 01:32

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View Post_Tsavo_, on Apr 03 2019 - 03:24, said:

Generally disagreeable to the entire post.   Skill based, influenced, integrated, what have you, would treat specific players differently than others. 

I was using me as an example of the bottom half of players (fitting). It is easy to disagree from above. Perhaps you discuss with others with talent, I hang around with us in the scum. I have presented what I think will encourage us baddies to continue playing, and enjoy the game a bit more. If you're a highly ranked player, I am sure you don't care too much how MM works out. If a high rank player does, then it is a bit hypothetical. I have seen PLENTY of highly rated players complain in-game when they get stuck with the likes of us. I have seen many (curiously enough mostly from one of 2 clans) get so frustrated, they TK us.

 

The game is not built around a minimum requirement for time being tracked before a kit can be used.   This effectively punishes quick reaction times as others are unable to react as quickly.  I've poked corners holding down the key for my large repair kit and hardly slow down when prepared to do so. It appears I didn't clearly state my idea (not that it will change your mind): the idea was that you can press your repair as fast as possible (not wait) and have the repair kick-in at the minimum time. I threw out 0.5 seconds as a bit of an equalizer, so I guess you could call that a "punishment". It could be 0.2, 0.25, 0.33...whatever. 

But, I am thinking of it from the bottom (me) up. I/we want to be encouraged, or at least not as discouraged, to continue to play and have fun.  And I KNOW the game is not based around a minimum requirement for many repairs, health, etc. I was suggesting WG might consider it.

Seriously, I am not trying to be an donkey (many would argue it comes naturally), but what effect would a minimum repair time have on you? How often do you think it would make a difference? Especially when playing those of us who cannot aim, shoot (a reaction time thing I would NEVER propose changing), drive straight, strategize (sp?), etc.? 

 

 

Tank flipping assistance might be doable but I don't often encounter flipped allies and the risk to taking a teamkill hit is there currently if you try.   I'd consider it a rather low priority.

 

CW reward tanks should remain behind the wall of competitive  PvP performance, although more accessible CW times could be considered, so long as you have winners and losers because it is a competition and participation rewards are not needed. 

 

My basic premise is that we cannot all be pro soccer players, or tennis players, or artists. But, the little victories (County champion, State ranked, Club tourney winner) keep those of us struggling in the game. It is my observation that match-ups in other games, sports, etc. are segregated somewhat by talent so that everyone has reachable goals (like club champ). WG does not have the player pool nor probably the computing power without ridiculous queues to segregate, so I have suggested a small change to more level the playing field.

 

Thank you for your polite and thought-provoking discourse.



ImBonzo #16 Posted Apr 04 2019 - 02:00

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View PostPipinghot, on Apr 03 2019 - 03:36, said:

If you don't trust WG to tell the truth and ban people for using illegal mods, why are you playing their game? If you think they're going to lie about banning cheaters then it doesn't matter whether they implement a timer or not, you're still playing a game from people who you've just called a bunch of liars. If WG doesn't can cheaters, then they encourage cheaters, and if they're a company that encourages cheaters it's silly to expect them to make a change to game mechanics that would prevent (what you think is) people cheating.

 

What you're basically saying is, "Hey WG you're a bunch of liars who encourage cheating, so you should make a change to your game that would prevent cheating." Surely you have to see that this is a pretty silly thing to ask.

I am saying no such thing. Please do not speak for me. And I would trust WG to tell the truth, should they chose to say something. The fact is they have not provided anything but very vague info on bans in years. I do believe they are addressing cheaters and illegal mods, but they are not perfect. This suggestion would eliminate or severely limit the market for an auto-repair mod....at least for tracks. 

 

Again, confirmation bias. Provide some evidence or it's all in your head.

I have. To WG. They took action on at least one.

 

That's already been answered. If people are better at reacting then you are, it's wrong to punish them.

 

No it's not a joke, that's an absurd argument. This is a game with 15 minute battles, it's a game where you don't have to worry about infantry, don't have to worry about mines and tank traps, don't have to worry about air power, you can magically raise a crew member from the dead like you're a shaman with god-like powers, and yet you think that track repair is too fast. You're having a bad case of target fixation, getting all wrapped up in one tiny issue that isn't even really an issue to begin with. 

Your use of the word "magically" suggests, and I infer, that you think raising from the dead is a bit silly. I think "insta-track" (and engine) repair is a bit silly, too. Am I not allowed my opinion? I think it is silly one can repair tracks before loss of momentum even stops the tanks. It is also a game in which you can be on your side for almost the entire game, but immediately repair items and raise crew members from the dead.

 

No you're not, you're suggesting a change to please yourself and maybe (just maybe) a couple of other people. Look around the forums, there are many topics with hundreds or thousands of threads each, and yet nothing about people repairing tracks "too quickly". This nothing that "the masses" care about, it's specific to you, and your reasons for suggesting it are selfish based on your personal reaction time.

Nah... it's more like you'll make 99.9% of everybody roll their eyes at you for belaboring a non-issue.

Based on the amount of comment in forums and especially in in-game chat, instant repairs  (and health, and OP arty), it is a large issue. I say "the masses" because I count myself in the poorer player block of less than 51% winners. And in the games with these folks is when I hear it. And complaints of  "hacks" in general. We, the starving, huddled masses. And we are not the only ones complaining. Many, all the way up to the best players call us who dare point out such things whiners. A minimal time repair would eliminate one point of contention.

Selfish? Yeah. But for a group. Perhaps as selfish as great players wanting the status quo, with their boots on the necks of the proletariat? :-) 

 



ImBonzo #17 Posted Apr 04 2019 - 02:23

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View PostShutUp_Karl, on Apr 03 2019 - 12:43, said:

ROFLMAOPIP.....   That is rich,  you are dealing with a Gulf War Vet here BUBBA... so if you have the idea that YOU could be my father or Grandfather then wow for an 85 to 117 year of schmuck  your reflexes are good

 

Yep. The gorilla it is. Walks into the room (thread) and proclaims [I am] a Gulf War Vet here BUBBA. ie: I am a [edited]and you are not (BUBBA). 

Why do you feel the need? Small hands?

 

 LOL I wasn't even beginning to troll, YET I can see that I perhaps made you feel like a whiny little prepubescent.

 

I think by definition, starting a reply with an insult (or attempted insult) makes one a troll. Continuing thru the reply with the air of "you're an idiot" and "I can't even waste my valuable time reading this", AND TAKING THE TIME to actually write that in an effort to put down another confirms the troll-ness. Look in a mirror. There is no need to be hostile. There is no reason not to have a respectful discourse. Do you see it as a victory if you had made me feel like "a whiny little prepubescent"? Do you pull wings of off butterflies? Are you itching to respond by calling me a "snowflake?" What a sad life, if so.

 



Lucid_Nonsense_1 #18 Posted Apr 04 2019 - 02:40

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View PostImBonzo, on Apr 03 2019 - 09:11, said:

ow do you know they aren't just using premium consumables? What does this have to do with reaction time? Pressing one button for a lg. repair kit, or programming a mouse to click 4+5 is the same to the human.

For audio stimulus many people exceed 0.1s reaction time.  Where did you get your data? The mean RTs for sprinters at the Beijing Olympics were 166 ms for males and 189 ms for females, but in one out of 1,000 starts they can achieve 109 ms and 121 ms, respectively. And that is a highly trained elite athletes knowing a SINGLE option stimulus is about to come, then they get both audio and visual (strobe). Your tracks coming off is a scientifically slower go/no stimulus. You do not know ahead of time which stimulus you will receive, tracks, engine, bounce, which means you have to select the correct response. And the audio response is rather lengthy by the crew member.

 

Thank you for commenting. I appreciate intelligent and polite response.

 

Just a quick follow up; the reason premium is going to be a lot quicker is that there is no decision involved. It's press X, not X then another number; even if you set up so that you need to double tap 5 to repair tracks - because the audio signal doesn't distinguish between different modules, your brain will spend some time processing; even if it's faster than you consciously are aware. My undergrad degree is in cognitive psych. followed by grad work programming the GUIs for dept. experiments involving computers. A trained subject can get a response time for audio stimuli sub 0.2s easily and even sub 0.1 is possible. It's been a few years ago, and it really varies with stimuli, task loading etc; so I'm not going to trawl for the exact numbers; they are not something I can recall of the top of my head - but I can point you in the right direction if you want...



ShutUp_Karl #19 Posted Apr 04 2019 - 05:35

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View PostImBonzo, on Apr 03 2019 - 20:23, said:

 

 

Wow you are thick.... a multitude of people have stated that your thoughts and desires of this subject are worthy of a tin foil Chapeau... But you keep arguing when LOGIC is profoundly staring you in the face that you have to poo poo anyone who disagrees with you. And that is sad, really & truly sad.  Have you ever considered Psychiatric Counseling?  This maybe the onset of dementia, well you do admit that you are "an old fart."  I am not being a troll here, this is to serious of a subject.

ImBonzo #20 Posted Apr 04 2019 - 08:16

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View PostShutUp_Karl, on Apr 03 2019 - 20:35, said:

 

Wow you are thick.... a multitude of people have stated that your thoughts and desires of this subject are worthy of a tin foil Chapeau... But you keep arguing when LOGIC is profoundly staring you in the face that you have to poo poo anyone who disagrees with you. And that is sad, really & truly sad.  Have you ever considered Psychiatric Counseling?  This maybe the onset of dementia, well you do admit that you are "an old fart."  I am not being a troll here, this is to serious of a subject.

 

Hmmm. 6 = a multitude. That's the same math that got us the biggest inauguration in history last time. I see no call for a tinfoil chapeau. Show me an example. And while you're at it, show me a "poo poo". Actually, several agree on at least a point or two, certainly not all. I see no logic that you allude to; logic, as in "if, then". Most respondents above merely stated their side, which is what the forum is about. I read and considered all of their comments thoughtfully, and with the exception of you, who seems to troll this thread to throw insults and call names, responded to their comments in kind. As is done in most civil debate and discussion.  They were civil in their responses, I responded civilly. Perhaps I expanded on what I thought. Perhaps I did not.You, however, are the exception. You just can't seem to get past the deep-rooted need to display your self-indulgent "superiority" over those you believe weak (thick? dementia? Really?) and suppress opposing ideas by through bullying. Of the "multitudes" (your word) thus far, you seem to be the only one to delight in that approach. Have you considered Counselling? Your apparent need to be the dominant male is troubling.

Oh, and you should have used "too."







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