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Medium Rebalance

#Asterisk #500mBenchline

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Canadian_Mano #1 Posted Apr 23 2019 - 18:59

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Seems as though we have been baboozled yet again, as WG has decided to for some reason, use 500m as the base for Pen and velocity values, which leads to VERY interesting data

 

STB-1

232mm Pen at 500m, would correlate well with the 50 100s 100mm, as they both fire AP as standard, 232@ 100m, 205mm@500m, leading to a 100m Pen of 249mm with AP, a 7mm reduction overall.

Heat would remain the same at 330mm throughout.

 

Shell velocity is also calculated at 500m, 1050 m/s for AP, 950 m/s for HEAT, however, no data exists in game that tells us Shell velocity, and no information exists about how WG models velocity loss over range.

 

 

Leo 1

 

278mm pen@500m, with AP, now we know AP loses less over range than Most APCR, so that will likely end up being 286-290mm@100m

with APCR 315mm@500m, this would likely end up being around 330-340mm@100m, depending on which style of APCR it's modeled after.

 

AMX 30B

 

264mm@500m would be ~275mm@100m

HEAT stays the same, 330mm throughout.

 

 


Edited by Canadian_Mano, Apr 23 2019 - 19:04.


Canadian_Mano #2 Posted Apr 23 2019 - 19:09

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Now, on the Off chance, however slight that WGNA staff is wrong, and the listed values are in fact the 100m baselines that we know and feel ambivalent about, most of the current planned changes do not address any of the existing issues with those tanks, IE, STB-1 having super upsidedown trash gun softstats and accuracy, the Leo 1 just being a remarkably bad platform for current meta, and how abysmal map design is, funnelfunnelfunnelfunnelfunnel, yeah! How the AMX30B has a tumor that makes the T110E5 look meta, with trash pen, and how the 430U has a better armour profile than most T10 Heavies.

Edited by Canadian_Mano, Apr 23 2019 - 19:10.


Plays_With_Matches #3 Posted Apr 23 2019 - 19:43

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They certainly left some details out of the article. I was really looking forward to some rebalancing for the Leo but they have a bullet mentioning a reduction in Power to Weight ratio but no numbers...  And that cupola on the 30B could really use a nip and tuck!

strengthpro67 #4 Posted Apr 23 2019 - 19:53

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So the Leo 1 is being streamlined as an 'agile sniper' yet the Power to weight is nerfed and reverse is nerfed, so getting to speed, (if you ever reach top speed) takes longer and climbing hills takes longer, net result; you gave with one hand took away with the other.. ( how are you people this stupid).  YOU changed out the ammo so that, as a LONG RANGE sniper you get the worst ammo to do it with. Again; give with one hand take away with the other, this is the typical BS with the German line, oh look we gave you a rare German buff.. but took it away somewhere else so F you. ( now i think you're less stupid and just have some nationally ingrained inferiority complex over German Engineering. )

Canadian_Mano #5 Posted Apr 23 2019 - 19:58

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View Poststrengthpro67, on Apr 23 2019 - 14:53, said:

So the Leo 1 is being streamlined as an 'agile sniper' yet the Power to weight is nerfed and reverse is nerfed, so getting to speed, (if you ever reach top speed) takes longer and climbing hills takes longer, net result; you gave with one hand took away with the other.. ( how are you people this stupid).  YOU changed out the ammo so that, as a LONG RANGE sniper you get the worst ammo to do it with. Again; give with one hand take away with the other, this is the typical BS with the German line, oh look we gave you a rare German buff.. but took it away somewhere else so F you. ( now i think you're less stupid and just have some nationally ingrained inferiority complex over German Engineering. )

 

I don't mean to burst your bubble, but at T10 most APCR is analagous to AP, in that it loses very little pen over distance. Leo 1 currently only loses 10mm between 100-500m

Edited by Canadian_Mano, Apr 23 2019 - 19:59.


YANKEE137 #6 Posted Apr 23 2019 - 20:07

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The Germans are cursed. Claus Kellerman did a video years ago where a KV-2 out sniped a Leopard 1. I hope he does a sequel once these alleged buffs go live.

strengthpro67 #7 Posted Apr 23 2019 - 20:22

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View PostCanadian_Mano, on Apr 23 2019 - 18:58, said:

 

I don't mean to burst your bubble, but at T10 most APCR is analagous to AP, in that it loses very little pen over distance. Leo 1 currently only loses 10mm between 100-500m

yet we see WG making buffs or nerfs of 3-5mm of pen and it making a huge difference from their stand point, so 10mm, ( currently) is a large amount and frankly the LEO 1 was pretty much unplayable at T10 once spotted. zero armour, terrible cammo rating ( as a low armor med) and didn't' have enough ability to disengage once spotted. Now it's worse. They could have left the gun alone just fine thank you, i was doing well with it , but they ignored the MAIN thing wrong with it, suitability in a modern meta.



Plays_With_Matches #8 Posted Apr 23 2019 - 20:24

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View PostYANKEE137, on Apr 23 2019 - 14:07, said:

The Germans are cursed. Claus Kellerman did a video years ago where a KV-2 out sniped a Leopard 1. I hope he does a sequel once these alleged buffs go live.

 

Did you see him crash his Leo 1 a few weeks ago on a rock for 700HP+ :teethhappy:

Plays_With_Matches #9 Posted Apr 23 2019 - 20:26

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View Poststrengthpro67, on Apr 23 2019 - 14:22, said:

yet we see WG making buffs or nerfs of 3-5mm of pen and it making a huge difference from their stand point, so 10mm, ( currently) is a large amount and frankly the LEO 1 was pretty much unplayable at T10 once spotted. zero armour, terrible cammo rating ( as a low armor med) and didn't' have enough ability to disengage once spotted. Now it's worse. They could have left the gun alone just fine thank you, i was doing well with it , but they ignored the MAIN thing wrong with it, suitability in a modern meta.

 

It feels very much underpowered, I think it would have been ok with a mobility buff. I am not looking forward to the nerf to the reverse speed or power to weight ratio. 

YANKEE137 #10 Posted Apr 23 2019 - 21:08

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View PostPlays_With_Matches, on Apr 23 2019 - 20:24, said:

 

Did you see him crash his Leo 1 a few weeks ago on a rock for 700HP+ :teethhappy:

 

Must have been a Russian Rock.

Bear5639 #11 Posted Apr 23 2019 - 22:29

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 Typical WGNA devs, They are going down the crapper soon the whole staff is going to be as bad as the map development team!!!! what they should do is stop pumping out prem tanks, and new tech lines, FOCUS on fixing what is wrong with the tanks already in game then go from there once they are fixed!!!

RickEdwards #12 Posted Apr 23 2019 - 22:35

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I think you misunderstood the changes; the STB's 100 m pen will stay as it is now, but just drop off slightly faster over distance. For the Leo and 30b, the pen at 100 m is increasing, with the drop off rate (presumably) staying the same. Same for the Leo's new APCR; 315 mm at 100 m.

 

Also, I highly doubtful they bother to have velocity drop off on the game.



Panzerkind #13 Posted Apr 23 2019 - 23:38

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Buff my 50M

 

Give it more DPM. 



SteelRonin #14 Posted Apr 23 2019 - 23:42

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View PostPlays_With_Matches, on Apr 23 2019 - 16:24, said:

 

Did you see him crash his Leo 1 a few weeks ago on a rock for 700HP+ :teethhappy:

 

hahahaha that was epic hahha

 

EDIT: Btw, the rebalance is pointless if they do not touch the armor and the weakspots......for example, of the soviet tanks..


Edited by SteelRonin, Apr 23 2019 - 23:46.


Nonamanadus #15 Posted Apr 23 2019 - 23:45

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How does this effect premium vehicles?

 



Canadian_Mano #16 Posted Apr 24 2019 - 01:22

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View PostNonamanadus, on Apr 23 2019 - 18:45, said:

How does this effect premium vehicles?

 

 

Absolutely NOT AT ALL

Avalon304 #17 Posted Apr 24 2019 - 01:27

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View PostCanadian_Mano, on Apr 23 2019 - 10:59, said:

Seems as though we have been baboozled yet again, as WG has decided to for some reason, use 500m as the base for Pen and velocity values, which leads to VERY interesting data

 

STB-1

232mm Pen at 500m, would correlate well with the 50 100s 100mm, as they both fire AP as standard, 232@ 100m, 205mm@500m, leading to a 100m Pen of 249mm with AP, a 7mm reduction overall.

Heat would remain the same at 330mm throughout.

 

Shell velocity is also calculated at 500m, 1050 m/s for AP, 950 m/s for HEAT, however, no data exists in game that tells us Shell velocity, and no information exists about how WG models velocity loss over range.

 

 

Leo 1

 

278mm pen@500m, with AP, now we know AP loses less over range than Most APCR, so that will likely end up being 286-290mm@100m

with APCR 315mm@500m, this would likely end up being around 330-340mm@100m, depending on which style of APCR it's modeled after.

 

AMX 30B

 

264mm@500m would be ~275mm@100m

HEAT stays the same, 330mm throughout.

 

 

 

500m isnt the base pen! Its the penetration fall off because the standard round was changed from APCR to AP. The base penetration is still 258. Only the STB-1 makes reference to the 500m mark the other are their base pen at 100m. This isnt a hard concept. Theres even a note under the STB-1s stats that says: "Please Note: The penetration at 100m is not changing, the decrease is for penetration fall off over distance."

 

EDIT: Also where are you even getting that the shell velocity is calculated at 500m... thats not implied anywhere on that stat card, and as far as Im aware shell velocity doesnt change in this game at range. 

 

And for the record the STB-1's current penetration at 500m is 248mm of penetration, while its 100m penetraion is stil 258mm.

 

Since this new shell is AP with 258mm we get ot enjoy way better effective penetration too because that 5 degrees of normalization is a thing.


Edited by Avalon304, Apr 24 2019 - 01:34.


Canadian_Mano #18 Posted Apr 24 2019 - 01:28

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View PostAvalon304, on Apr 23 2019 - 20:27, said:

 

500m isnt the base pen! Its the penetration fall off because the standard round was changed from APCR to AP. The base penetration is still 258. Only the STB-1 makes reference to the 500m mark the other are their base pen at 100m. This isnt a hard concept. Theres even a note under the STB-1s stats that says: "Please Note: The penetration at 100m is not changing, the decrease is for penetration fall off over distance."

 

So they edited the article for the 3rd time?

But AP loses less over distance than APCR, why would they give it among the absolute worst pen at range?


Edited by Canadian_Mano, Apr 24 2019 - 01:36.


danfred #19 Posted Apr 24 2019 - 01:35

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WG does not really care about balance. If they did they would have never introduced Wheelies.

Chad_Moldenhauer #20 Posted Apr 24 2019 - 01:40

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They made the Leo 1 worse...way to go WG

 






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