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How to make arty playable, and some general game changes

Arty Rebalance Premium Ammunition Marks of Excellence

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panzer1_14 #1 Posted May 13 2019 - 01:52

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Now before I begin my talk of madness regarding everyone's favorite cancer (arties), I first wanted to highlight a few ideas for General Game changes that would make the game a lot more enjoyable.

Here's a list of changes I think would be met well by the community.

1. Marks of Excellence

  • The first MoE turns gold (or silver in the case of the Swedish vehicles) when 500,000 damage has been done in the tank
  • The second MoE turns gold/silver when 50 Epic Medals OR 500 Battle Hero Medals have been won in that tank
  • The third MoE turns gold/silver when 1000 games have been played in the tank
  • *Marks of Excellence must first be earned in order to turn gold and the order in which the missions are completed doesn't matter. For example, if playing 1000 games is done before 500000 damage, than the first mark will still turn gold/silver
  • Mark of Excellence progress can be reset

2. Premium Ammunition - In an effort to put an end to annoying sealclubbers/statpadders loading full APCR/HEAT, tanks can only carry up to 25% of their ammunition capacity's worth of premium ammunition. Premium tanks are allowed to carry 50%, and the Pz II J is exempted from this.

 

Now, for the arty changes. These changes were conceptualized with two main objectives in mind.

  • To make arty enjoyable to play and less vulnerable, and
  • To make arty less annoying to the enemy team while maintaining effectiveness.

For starters, all arty-related mechanics will revert back to update 9.17. AKA- No stun mechanic, AP rounds, more HE damage and penetration, and so on. However, the key difference is that all artillery shells, including HE and premium rounds, will have a rate of penetration drop-off over distance. Unlike other vehicles, arty will also be affected by a damage drop-off over long ranges, with any round that isn't HE being able to do only 50-60 % of its base damage at a distance of 800+ meters.

 

For more details regarding the rate of penetration and damage drop-off, please see the attached screenshot of two excel charts showing the penetration drop-off on the left, and the damage drop-off on the right. Note that if the shell name is highlighted yellow, it is a premium shell.

All base damage stats for arties pre-9.18 will remain unchanged, however arty will no longer have premium HE shells. Furthermore, arties may only use up to 50% of their ammunition loadout for AP and premium ammunition.

 

Lasty, a change to the tracer mechanics is in order, as arties with a high rate of fire (low-mid tier arties almost all have relatively rapid-firing guns) would often have their RoF hampered by the need to relocate upon firing. To remedy this, their tracers will be only 50% as visible* as they were in update 9.17. However, any arty with a RoF of less than 4 will have the following parameters applied to its tracers:

  • 1st shot after relocating will have 50% visibility*
  • 2nd shot (if no relocation after the 1st shot) will have 100% visibility
  • 3rd shot (if no relocation after the 2nd shot) will have 200% visibility

*Visibility is a parameter that modifies the width of the tracer and the time for which it lingers. For example, 200% visibility means that a tracer will be twice as wide and will be visible for twice as long as it would've been in update 9.17.

 

Hopefully, these changes would make arty more enjoyable/less ulcer-inducing and would make the game as a whole better. Let me know what you think of my ideas!

 

Attached Files

  • Attached File   Arty Pen and Damage Drop-Off Chart.png   261.98K


The_Illusive_Man #2 Posted May 13 2019 - 02:18

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Block Quote

 1. Marks of Excellence

  • The first MoE turns gold (or silver in the case of the Swedish vehicles) when 500,000 damage has been done in the tank
  • The second MoE turns gold/silver when 50 Epic Medals OR 500 Battle Hero Medals have been won in that tank
  • The third MoE turns gold/silver when 1000 games have been played in the tank
  • *Marks of Excellence must first be earned in order to turn gold and the order in which the missions are completed doesn't matter. For example, if playing 1000 games is done before 500000 damage, than the first mark will still turn gold/silver
  • Mark of Excellence progress can be reset

 

Like this, but get rid of the last bit. Its alot of work to three mark tanks. So resetting it would make that worthless.

 

Block Quote

 2. Premium Ammunition - In an effort to put an end to annoying sealclubbers/statpadders loading full APCR/HEAT, tanks can only carry up to 25% of their ammunition capacity's worth of premium ammunition. Premium tanks are allowed to carry 50%, and the Pz II J is exempted from this.

 

Missed the reason gold is fired entirely. The issue isnt the spam, its the root issue. IE: 3 tier MM combined with tanks with little to no weakpoints.

 

Block Quote

 Now, for the arty changes. These changes were conceptualized with two main objectives in mind.

  • To make arty enjoyable to play and less vulnerable, and
  • To make arty less annoying to the enemy team while maintaining effectiveness.

For starters, all arty-related mechanics will revert back to update 9.17. AKA- No stun mechanic, AP rounds, more HE damage and penetration, and so on. However, the key difference is that all artillery shells, including HE and premium rounds, will have a rate of penetration drop-off over distance. Unlike other vehicles, arty will also be affected by a damage drop-off over long ranges, with any round that isn't HE being able to do only 50-60 % of its base damage at a distance of 800+ meters.

 

Interesting, but I dont see how it would make arty more interesting, nor how it would make it less annoying.

 

Block Quote

Lasty, a change to the tracer mechanics is in order, as arties with a high rate of fire (low-mid tier arties almost all have relatively rapid-firing guns) would often have their RoF hampered by the need to relocate upon firing. To remedy this, their tracers will be only 50% as visible* as they were in update 9.17. However, any arty with a RoF of less than 4 will have the following parameters applied to its tracers:

  • 1st shot after relocating will have 50% visibility*
  • 2nd shot (if no relocation after the 1st shot) will have 100% visibility
  • 3rd shot (if no relocation after the 2nd shot) will have 200% visibility

*Visibility is a parameter that modifies the width of the tracer and the time for which it lingers. For example, 200% visibility means that a tracer will be twice as wide and will be visible for twice as long as it would've been in update 9.17.

 

Nope. Arty should be visible when it fires. Its a large gun after all...



stalkervision #3 Posted May 13 2019 - 03:13

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Op you actually have some valid ideas.

stalkervision #4 Posted May 13 2019 - 04:05

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Imo give arty better sights,mobility and health and let it duke it out with its attackers every once and a while.

usma79south #5 Posted May 13 2019 - 04:12

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This reminds me of something I've bn wanting to suggest to make the arty experience more "interesting," for everyone -

I've heard that early on in Tanks, arty shells had similar pen to other tanks at their tier -

now while I can see that that may hv given them an unfair advantage at distance,

now arty is significantly disadvantaged at close battle - once discovered, arty may hv one shot, then done, contr. to by long load times.

I say make close battle more "interesting" by increasing arty pen within 100 meters.

Say double pen inside 100 m, triple pen inside 50 m, and 4x pen within 25 m (since arty's bn given large dispersion factors, poor aiming).

Sounds more interesting...

 



usma79south #6 Posted May 13 2019 - 04:24

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Maybe another option wd be to gv arty some AP shells w tier-comparable pen, but no splash/stun,

mainly to be used in close battle defense?



Rawrlynn #7 Posted May 13 2019 - 05:06

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View Postusma79south, on May 13 2019 - 04:24, said:

Maybe another option wd be to gv arty some AP shells w tier-comparable pen, but no splash/stun,

mainly to be used in close battle defense?

 

would hurt people just getting arty as intuition is needed for a fast switch. 

View Postusma79south, on May 13 2019 - 04:12, said:

This reminds me of something I've bn wanting to suggest to make the arty experience more "interesting," for everyone -

I've heard that early on in Tanks, arty shells had similar pen to other tanks at their tier -

now while I can see that that may hv given them an unfair advantage at distance,

now arty is significantly disadvantaged at close battle - once discovered, arty may hv one shot, then done, contr. to by long load times.

I say make close battle more "interesting" by increasing arty pen within 100 meters.

Say double pen inside 100 m, triple pen inside 50 m, and 4x pen within 25 m (since arty's bn given large dispersion factors, poor aiming).

Sounds more interesting...

 

 

also damage should be increased the closer targets are also, I.E. face blast is full damage + RNG  multiplier...  arty would still be hindered by reload, and movement speeds... but it would reduce the arty rushes that happen in the first few minutes.  

GeorgePreddy #8 Posted May 13 2019 - 05:22

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Funny stuff... make arty better... funny.

 

 

 

 

 

 



stalkervision #9 Posted May 13 2019 - 06:03

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Better to train players how to play in a arty rich environment.



stalkervision #10 Posted May 13 2019 - 06:11

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a very good way is to play arty and learn to dodge in coming arty once your spotted. Arty player's will always Target other arty  players once your spotted.



scHnuuudle_bop #11 Posted May 13 2019 - 08:37

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Nothing needs changing. 

 

It has gone from a boring vehicle, over powered, with 25% accuracy and occasional near orgasmic 2500HP shots.

The lowered damage, increased accuracy and the stun made it into an enjoyable part of the game.

 

All of a sudden, no more random killer from above. The teammates dictate targeting, the  interpretation of this alone is a riot.

No more tunnel vision, focused in with the strategic view. The entire mini map becomes more important. 

No XP unless you are actually helping the team. 

 

Not sure what the MOE means, I assume something to do with missions.

 

Tracers, shortening them and localizing them also has added to the challenge.

I now have to know and be looking at a small area, they can't be caught out of the corner of the eye arching over from the other side of the map.

 



usma79south #12 Posted May 13 2019 - 14:13

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View PostRawrlynn, on May 13 2019 - 04:06, said:

 

would hurt people just getting arty as intuition is needed for a fast switch. 

 

also damage should be increased the closer targets are also, I.E. face blast is full damage + RNG  multiplier...  arty would still be hindered by reload, and movement speeds... but it would reduce the arty rushes that happen in the first few minutes.  

 

I wd like the option of AP shells for close defense, esp. w faster reloading (mid-tier) arty - occas. I know when I'm going to hv to defend close, and do hv time to switch to AP shells.

 

I LIKE IT - dmg incr for closer targets, to reduce that initial "arty rush"



usma79south #13 Posted May 13 2019 - 14:19

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"Not sure what the MOE means, I assume something to do with missions. "

 

MOE - Marks of Excellence to acknowledge a player's good performance in a tank:  https://console.worl...-of-excellence/



Laser_Beam #14 Posted May 15 2019 - 11:35

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How to make arty playable, and some general game changes

 

But we don't want arty to be playable.

 

When the top hvy tank can be 1 shot by arty..... this is a BS mechanic.  Just remove the arty.



DrDraco #15 Posted May 15 2019 - 15:34

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I like playing arty; and yes, they can annoy the heck out of me when I'm tanking; but that's war ;-) 

 

For me, the biggest annoyance playing arty is that some months ago MM started initial setup sticking the arty in a group off to one side, with the rest of the team somewhere else; or right out in the open, with a long, slow drive to any kind of cover. Of course, at the same time they released the fast-moving cockroach vehicles... WoT people: fix the "sitting duck" settings please!



JABowders #16 Posted May 23 2019 - 13:52

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Good and valid points, may I offer one additional rework for arty to make it more playable...

 

I would like to see the option of HIGH angle attack added. Yes under normal circumstances you always fire at lowest elevation, this reduces the chances of being spotted via Counter Artillery Radar (not an issue in WoT) but it also reduces Time Of Flight (TOF). 

Due to the terrain the Artillery should have the Option to switch from the default LOW Angle to HIGH Angle attack, (say with the "X" key) this will allow Artillery to attack targets snug up against terrain features that LOW Angle Attack fails to allow engagement. See Image. The addition of HIGH Angle would be the Advantage.

 

The Disadvantage for this ability should be just as in real life, a longer TOF. The round has to travel farther through the air even though the direct line of distance to the target is shorter. allowing the Targets the opportunity to relocate from the target area. 

 

And lastly with the most recent re-balance of Artillery the cost of fighting with an Indirect Fire Platform is not cost effective. The Monetary and Experience reward for playing Artillery has not been adjusted to reflect an adjusted cost of use in line with the Direct Fire platforms. Simply stated, you are more likely to lose money with Artillery even if you are High Scorer on your team. 

 

Battle On!   

Attached Files

  • Attached File   High Low angle fire.png   77.79K


WhineMaker #17 Posted May 23 2019 - 15:53

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View PostLaser_Beam, on May 15 2019 - 02:35, said:

How to make arty playable, and some general game changes

 

But we don't want arty to be playable.

 

When the top hvy tank can be 1 shot by arty..... this is a BS mechanic.  Just remove the arty.

 

Don't like arty in games... :arta:

 

Just for you, WG has an arty free tank game... :ohmy:

 

Can you say "WoT Blitz"?

 

Sure you can... :P



scHnuuudle_bop #18 Posted May 23 2019 - 20:50

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A class that has the SLOWEST loading times, the SLOWEST traverse times, the SLOWEST aiming times. The LONGEST shell flight times. The LOWEST accuracy of any class in the game.

It has had its spotting cut to almost being useless, it's visibility increased and the damage potential lowered greatly. Many of the crew skills cannot be used, they have the thinnest armour.

These changes with the addition of the stun is what makes the class fun. I can actually hit things 40% of the time instead of ALWAYS 25% or worse.

When I damage and stun the enemy, I need to consider the team, not my points. That is secondary and depends on the first.

The 9.18 change is what convinced me to begin spending money. Instead of being a random killer, I must depend on and support my team.

 

Marks of Excellence.

Not really required

Spoiler

 

Premium ammunition, another thing not required

Spoiler

 

Drop off power, what does that even mean? After all, 1 kilometer, to some people seems like 25 kilometers.

 

And now this weird suggestion.

Make arty less annoying..

Spoiler

 

What you want is a bunch of changes that have NOTHING

Spoiler

If these morons do not want to get shot by artillery, SPG's do not need editing. The victim has to figure out how not to get shot. Not hamper the shooter, just because the victim wants to continue to park and shoot.

 

People play it, therefore it is playable. There are always players in the queue, so it is popular. Players always request support in game, so it is useful.

Nothing needs changing, it is just fine the way it is.

 

Now limiting TD's to two per team, that sounds like an idea.


Edited by scHnuuudle_bop, May 23 2019 - 21:04.





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