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Chinese Type 59 Seems a Hollow Crown


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Ebonsilk #1 Posted May 19 2019 - 18:33

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During the retro 0.7.0 event I managed to try out the Type 59.  From what I understand, the Type 59 was nerfed sometime during the period between 0.7.0 to today's current release.  The Type 59 though fun was no Jedi with a lightsaber versus a pack of stormtroopers.  Also since then, there have been a number of tanks, both regular and premium, that grossly overshadow the Type 59 at Tier 8.  Insomuch as new vehicles have seemingly eclipsed and outmoded the Type 59, is it still the tank everyone strives for in high-achievement competitions or is it just a 'feather in the cap' tank that one plays for giggles?  Its seems that given the slow obsolescence of this rig, a better, more competitive premium needs to be introduced as a high-prize tank and the 59 put out to pasture in the Premium Shop.  Not that I'd buy it if it were.  I'm just seeing this tank as the 'carrot' on some of these competitions and I get the feeling its like handing someone a Honda Accord for winning the LeMans Grand Prix.

the_dude_76 #2 Posted May 19 2019 - 20:04

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It's called the "hype" 59 for a reason...

death_stryker #3 Posted May 19 2019 - 21:11

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View PostEbonsilk, on May 19 2019 - 10:33, said:

a better, more competitive premium needs to be introduced as a high-prize tank

And here is the crux of the issue. The Type 59 isn't even a bad tank, but just because it's no Defender or Progetto 46, it's not good enough for you. I hope you can see for yourself why this kind of attitude is horrible for the longevity of the game.

 

You clearly have no clue about the history of the Type 59, and why it is so coveted by many players. In short, the tank's rarity, as well as its souvenir status, make it a highly desirable collector's tank. If you are not somewhat of a tank collector or a veteran of the Type 59's heyday, there is indeed little value in it for you.



Ebonsilk #4 Posted May 19 2019 - 22:03

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View Postdeath_stryker, on May 19 2019 - 21:11, said:

And here is the crux of the issue. The Type 59 isn't even a bad tank, but just because it's no Defender or Progetto 46, it's not good enough for you. I hope you can see for yourself why this kind of attitude is horrible for the longevity of the game.

 

You clearly have no clue about the history of the Type 59, and why it is so coveted by many players. In short, the tank's rarity, as well as its souvenir status, make it a highly desirable collector's tank. If you are not somewhat of a tank collector or a veteran of the Type 59's heyday, there is indeed little value in it for you.

 

The longevity of the game is keeping paying interest in the game.  No company stays in business on esoteric aesthetics of good game play; it requires revenue in the form of cash flow.  Keeping obsolete outmoded tanks as prize vehicles does NOT generate interest, far from it, it makes those that already have this tank less interested in competing and those that don't have it wondering why they'd put so much effort into something that has seen its star descend.  If the Type 59 is the reward for a difficult achievement, I'm not going to bother.  If I get bored, I'll take my money and go play War Thunder.  WGN needs to revisit this outmoded old rig and replace it with something more people will strive to attain.



Harvester_0f_Sorrow #5 Posted May 19 2019 - 22:54

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Well you cant just charge in and expect to be bulletproof lol. I see people do this all the time and just facepalm. You have to play its strengths, I do not have one but I wish I did man.

Nutzo #6 Posted May 20 2019 - 17:39

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Hype 59 was from a time where preferential meant something, it's a average medium nowadays and other than bringing it out to show off it's really nothing special



FastForward7 #7 Posted May 21 2019 - 05:08

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View PostNutzo, on May 20 2019 - 17:39, said:

Hype 59 was from a time where preferential meant something, it's a average medium nowadays and other than bringing it out to show off it's really nothing special

 

While I don't own one (I sort of wish I would have bought one) this makes sense. I hardly ever see them anymore, and I play tiers 7-9 almost exclusively. If there were out there in any numbers, I'd be bumping into them regularly. If the Type-59 were still part of today's meta, it would be played. It's probably been the victim of power creep, like everything else from the early days.

Ape_Drape #8 Posted Jun 10 2019 - 17:43

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View PostFastForward7, on May 21 2019 - 05:08, said:

 

While I don't own one (I sort of wish I would have bought one) this makes sense. I hardly ever see them anymore, and I play tiers 7-9 almost exclusively. If there were out there in any numbers, I'd be bumping into them regularly. If the Type-59 were still part of today's meta, it would be played. It's probably been the victim of power creep, like everything else from the early days.

 

It's not just a victim of power creep, it got an [edited]whoopin with the nerf bat first.

favrepeoria #9 Posted Jun 12 2019 - 03:47

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I bring it out in frontlines but it really is only worthwhile as credit grinder. It is about equal to a T-44. It just isn’t made as a tier 8.5 like the more recent vehicles. This was a legit tier 8 at a time when pref mm 8s were tier 7.5.

Xumos #10 Posted Jun 12 2019 - 19:24

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With the changes to the match maker, preferred match making seems quite a bit less valuable. When I play my pref. mm tanks they just feel like nerfed T8s with little to no advantages in random battles. Keep in mind you still meet T9s, which in my opinion are T10s with one or two low attributes. 

Grampy #11 Posted Feb 04 2020 - 05:44

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For anyone planning to spend real money for a premium tank, the Type 59 is the Poster Child for how WG screws you over. Originally sold as a very desirable tier 8 tank- and it was  (and I bought mine when first offered) it has been nerfed, nerfed, and nerfed again until now it is a really lame piece of junk. It pens almost nothing, and everything else in tier 8 pens it handily. It still makes great credits, but that is all it has going for it. So if you need a tank that harvests credits, the Type 59 is a great tank. For all other purposes; it is mediocre at best, and WG is marketing it entirely on it's reputation.
Buyer beware.

Grampy #12 Posted Feb 04 2020 - 06:17

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Just now was in a 6/7/8 tier game, my Type 59 could not pen a Cromwell. Really? A tier 8 could not pen a tier 6 using AP? (I refuse to use spremium ammo in a tank that is already behind the power curve!)
Going back to my original premise - if you need to make credits, Type 59 is a money maker. 
If you want to win games? Don't waste your money.

THEFOXFIRE #13 Posted Feb 04 2020 - 17:33

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That tank was incredibly op due to 2 things:

  1. Gold ammo actually required you to buy it with gold back then
  2. 3 tier MM

So, you had a tier 9 tank, the best of it's tier (t-54) at a lower tier.

Unless you were a tier 8 TD, most shots bounced from its turret or upper plate.

Then you had the horrible MM that put 5 Type 59s on the same team, so they would usually rampage one side before even some left the spawn.

Closest tank today to the old type-59 would be the 430 and 430U.

They all have decent mobility, Excellent armor and decent gun.



thehelmsman #14 Posted Feb 06 2020 - 16:14

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As previously mentioned, most of the Type 59's allure is its status as relative unobtainium, as well as its near-mythical reputation as a complete pubstomper. It certainly deserved that reputation way back in the day, when it was introduced, but the game has evolved considerably since and now Type 59 is not nearly as powerful as it used to be. Gold rounds are much more prevalent. Autoloaders and fast, high-pen mediums are common. Superheavies are now a thing. If Type 59 didn't have preferential matchmaking, it would be an utter pile of junk.

Having said that, the buffs turned it into a pretty decent all-around tier 8, which neither excels nor suffers particularly in any one category. It's fast, pretty nimble, and has troll armor, adequate view range, passable gun handling and gun depression, and okay DPM (less than more recent offerings, but historically competitive with older tier 8 mediums). The only bad thing about it is the lackluster AP penetration, which sometimes makes shooting tier 8s and especially 9s a frustrating experience, but it's not that much worse than T-44 (which is considered to be one of the best tier 8 mediums) in this regard, and never has to deal with tier 10s. It also still makes a TON of credits if you can avoid dabbing that 2 key.

Essentially, it's a slightly worse T-54 Mod 1 in terms of capability, but it has preferential MM to compensate for this.

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Ape_Drape #15 Posted Feb 13 2020 - 04:59

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The main thing leading to the myth of the Type 59's OPness was that back in the day, there were so many of them. Literally packs of feral Type 59s everywhere, as far as the eye could see.

They could bounce shots, had great mobility, and a pretty good gun.

Then WG nerfed every aspect of this tank...

They nerfed the armor and the gun. Now this tank only bounces shots in the bad way... The shots you take at other tanks, that is if the shot comes within a country mile of where you aimed. Every shot taken at you pens. You will only bounce tier 6es in the EXTREMELY RARE BATTLES YOU ARE TOP TIER.

The mobility nerf was very uncalled for and made worse by WG's poor excuse for "physics".

After all that, then you can add power creep.

 

This tank is a shadow of what it once was. It isn't fun to play anymore. Maybe if you could still get wolfpacks of this tank you might have some fun battles but, most of the Type 59 owners are probably long gone from this game.



Trakks #16 Posted May 08 2020 - 10:57

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The T-34-3 is supposed to come pretty close to the Type 59 and is a lot easier to get. 

thehelmsman #17 Posted May 13 2020 - 04:58

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T-34-3 is basically a Type 59 but worse, because the gun is much less reliable. Hitting for 390 on a tier 8 medium is theoretically really nice, but the bad penetration and atrocious gun handling mean it's actually really hard to put the 122 to work most of the time in the modern fast-paced meta. Plus, the introduction of autoreloaders and tier 8s that hit for 360 per shot, of which there are now quite a few, has considerably eroded the competitive advantage of hitting for 390.

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