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Premium tank crew transfers w/o penalty


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HellsB3lls #1 Posted Jul 13 2019 - 19:08

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Not sure I understand all the subtleties of crew transfers to premium tanks with no penalty.

I've got the T5 TD, SU-85 with 6th sense, and working toward the SU-100. If I had the premium TD, SU-100Y, could I transfer the SU-85 crew to the prem Su-100Y with no penalty? And then transfer the crew from Su-100Y to SU-100 with no penalty? Then use the prem SU-100Y to train up a new crew to put back into the SU-85 with no penalty?



FrozenKemp #2 Posted Jul 13 2019 - 19:18

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Not quite.  You could put the SU-85 crew into the SU-100Y without retraining them to it, and they would be able to work it properly. That's it. They would still "officially" be tied to the SU-85, so you could not transfer them to the SU-100 without penalty. 

ImUsingTheForce #3 Posted Jul 13 2019 - 19:26

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   A crew trained to the SU85 can be put in ANY soviet premium TD with no penalty. The SU100 is not a premium hence there would be a penalty.

The 100Y of course, would incur no penalty due to its premium status. Learning the intricacies of Crew Exp is how you get to 8+ skill crews but personally...I would just take the penalty and use the same crew in all 3 and retrain them to the highest tier NON premium TD you play the most. I am nearly to the 9th skill on my French Light Driver. The crew is still going to gain Exp no matter what you use them in...even a Light Crew in an Artillery for instance.

   Training a crew to a Premium Tank specifically is a waste because they should always be trained to a Non Premium for versatility and flexibility with regard to Crew Exp mechanics.



Hellsfog #4 Posted Jul 13 2019 - 19:26

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You can move crews from any tank of the same nation and class into a premium tank of the same nation and class (assuming the crew roles line up) without retraining them but not the reverse.  So you could move a crew from a russian TD (tech tree or premium) into any premium russian TD assuming the crew roles (driver, loader, radioman etc) line up. 

HellsB3lls #5 Posted Jul 13 2019 - 19:27

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Ok, I thought that might be too much to hope for.

So, to train a crew to 100% for the SU-100, I would need to start them off in the SU-100Y, and then I could move them to the SU-100 without penalty?

Or do I need to start them in the SU-100, then move to the prem SU-100Y for training, then back to the SU-100?



Hellsfog #6 Posted Jul 13 2019 - 19:30

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You need to start your crew in the tech tree tank.

 

Tech tree tank to premium = good.

Premium tank to premium tank = good

Premium tank to tech tree tank = no bueno


Edited by Hellsfog, Jul 13 2019 - 19:31.


HellsB3lls #7 Posted Jul 13 2019 - 19:31

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View PostHellsfog, on Jul 13 2019 - 13:26, said:

You can move crews from any tank of the same nation and class into a premium tank of the same nation and class (assuming the crew roles line up) without retraining them but not the reverse.  So you could move a crew from a russian TD (tech tree or premium) into any premium russian TD assuming the crew roles (driver, loader, radioman etc) line up. 


Does that mean that, once they're trained in the premium, you have to pay the penalty to move them back to their original non-premium tank?

ETA: I think you already answered this but I just want to make sure I'm absolutely clear on how this works.


Edited by HellsB3lls, Jul 13 2019 - 19:33.


Hellsfog #8 Posted Jul 13 2019 - 19:31

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View PostHellsB3lls, on Jul 13 2019 - 13:31, said:


Does that mean that, once they're trained in the premium, you have to pay the penalty to move them back to their original non-premium tank?

 yes

 

BUT only if you retrain them for the premium. 

 

As another example: I can move any of my russian medium crews, assuming the roles line up, into a T34-85m without retraining them. If I retrain a crew specifically for the T34-85M, I cannot move that crew to any tech tree tank without a penalty. I could move that crew another premium tank without penalty, however. 


Edited by Hellsfog, Jul 13 2019 - 19:35.


ImUsingTheForce #9 Posted Jul 13 2019 - 19:33

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View PostHellsB3lls, on Jul 13 2019 - 19:27, said:

Ok, I thought that might be too much to hope for.

So, to train a crew to 100% for the SU-100, I would need to start them off in the SU-100Y, and then I could move them to the SU-100 without penalty?

Or do I need to start them in the SU-100, then move to the prem SU-100Y for training, then back to the SU-100?


 There would be no point to making the 100Y their "primary" vehicle due to its Premium status...you would only be penalizing that crews ability to use a separate NON premium TD with no penalty.

Approach it from the long term ultimately, where do you want to put this crew? 



MiddleAgedNoob #10 Posted Jul 13 2019 - 19:38

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View PostImUsingTheForce, on Jul 13 2019 - 13:26, said:

 .I would just take the penalty and use the same crew in all 3 and retrain them to the highest tier NON premium TD you play the most. I am nearly to the 9th skill on my French Light Driver. The crew is still going to gain Exp no matter what you use them in...even a Light Crew in an Artillery for instance.

 

 

While this is true, there is a substantial cost.  From the wiki:

 

Block Quote

 If a crew member is in a vehicle of a different Type as that in which he/she has their Vehicle Competence, and the vehicle is not a premium vehicle, he/she will take a 50% penalty to their current Training Level. For example, an 80% Training Level will be reduced by 50% to 40%, while a 100% level would be reduced to 50%.

 

and

 

Block Quote

 In a new non-premium vehicle of a different Type as that in which he/she has their Vehicle Competence, a Penalty will apply and the crewman would earn 75% less experience per battle than he/she normally would.

 

https://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Crew#Bonuses_and_Penalties

 

GLHF

 



ImUsingTheForce #11 Posted Jul 13 2019 - 19:47

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View PostMiddleAgedNoob, on Jul 13 2019 - 19:38, said:

 

While this is true, there is a substantial cost.  From the wiki:

 

 

and

 

 

https://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Crew#Bonuses_and_Penalties

 

GLHF

 

 I am aware of the penalties but this will be good information for the uninitiated. Learning to exploit every aspect of Crew Exp can be somewhat of a daunting task. My sole concern is having 1 crew for each line/disciplne...ie Russian Heavy....Russian Medium....French Light....American TD....Italian Medium. Penalties aren't going to make you a better LT driver than me generally.....Its more about knowing what line to take to limit my exposure to a given point of potential contact. I am willing to forego a momentary penalty in order to have that crew closer to the next % point.



dunniteowl #12 Posted Jul 13 2019 - 20:07

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You've got some good information.  Though it might not be all stated in the clearest of terms.

 

 

Premium Tank:  Can hold ANY Tech Tree Crew Member in it, though ONLY Crew who are trained to a tank OF THE SAME CLASS can operate the Premium without a penalty for not being trained to that tank.   This is WHAT Premium Tanks are FOR.

 

Tech Tree Tank:  Crew HAS to be trained to tank to operate it without a penalty.  Penalties are in addition to Crew Qualification.  If your crew is not at 100% qualification for their tank they simply do not operate at full capability.

 

If you take a Crew from a Tech Tree Tank and move it into a Premium of the same class you DO NOT TRAIN THEM TO THE PREMIUM, leave them trained for their tank.

 

You must train a crew to its Tech Tree Tank or operate at a penalty.  The penalty is listed above.  These penalties would remove ability from your crew in addition to them not being fully qualified.

 

Don't do that.



OvO



heavymetal1967 #13 Posted Jul 13 2019 - 20:20

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Nothing major, but one other FYI.

 

If you put a crew into a premium and one of the crew that you put it in has a "borrowed" secondary skill trained on it and the premium has the actual crew slot for that skill then it won't work.  No penalty on the base proficiency or earnings.  But just something to know.

 

For example.  My higher tiered Chinese lights have Situational Awareness trained on the loaders as there's no radioman and the loaders do radio duties.

 

If I stick those crews in the Type 62 premium no problem as it has the same crew layout - no radioman and the loader has radio duties. 

 

But when I stick them into the Type 64 their SA won't work, because that tank has a Radioman and SA is a radioman skill.

 

Edit:  I'm guessing it would work on a borrowed skill that wasn't assigned to the same position.  For example if there was a premium Chinese light where the commander had radio duties.  I'm guessing a loader's SA still wouldn't work.  Is there any layouts where this possibility exists even?   TIA for anyone that knows for sure.


Edited by heavymetal1967, Jul 13 2019 - 20:23.


CedricMacLaren #14 Posted Jul 13 2019 - 21:17

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You are correct. The Loader’s SA would only work in a vehicle where the Loader functions as the Radio Operator. 

GeorgePreddy #15 Posted Jul 13 2019 - 21:22

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View PostImUsingTheForce, on Jul 13 2019 - 15:26, said:

 Learning the intricacies of Crew Exp is how you get to 8+ skill crews...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 



HellsB3lls #16 Posted Jul 13 2019 - 22:13

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So, this is what (I think) I've learned from this thread, when trying to train a crew for a non-premium tank:

  1. Move non-prem tank crew to premium tank (same class) for training. DO NOT train to premium tank. Move crew back to previous non-prem tank after training - NO PENALTY
  2. Move non-prem tank crew to premium tank (same class) for training. DO train to premium tank. Move back to previous (or different) non-prem tank after training - PAY PENALTY
  3. Purchase premium tank with 100% crew (with or without skills), move the crew to non-prem tank of same class OR other class - PAY PENALTY
  4. Purchase premium tank with 100% crew (with or without skills), move the crew to ANOTHER PREMIUM tank - NO PENALTY

 

That's big news to me that you shouldn't train a crew to the premium tank, else a penalty will be incurred when moving back to original tank. I think I've been bitten (and wondered why) about that before. I just assumed you had to train the crew to the premium tank in order to have them advance their training in the premium.

 

Also good to know about the problem with the borrowed secondary skills as well.

 

As an aside, I also find it amazing (annoying, costly) that a crew completely forgets their training on a previous tank, once they've been trained on a different tank.

 

 



dunniteowl #17 Posted Jul 14 2019 - 00:23

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I think you MOSTLY have it.  Sorry, my earlier post would have been more complete, except I had to suddenly take a journey to visit a friend who I don't get too many chances to see and had to close quickly.

 

First, this is important for you to know all the way around, however, in this case, it will cover the bulk of your questions.  It comes from:

 

                Crew -- Global Wiki

 

This is linked to show up at Crew Management.  Most of what you should know to answer these questions are in there.

 

 

You have a tank.  It has to have a crew.  You recruit said crew and train it FOR that tank.  This is the normal Tech Tree way.  If you move your crew to a new Tech Tree Tank and Do Not Train them, they operate that tank, even of the same class, at a penalty.  When you spend 20K credits per Crew to Regimental Training, they will be 75% Crew (if new) or, 90% of their Previous Qualification (if your crew is under 85%, you might as well get a new crew when paying credits).  This is for a Tank of the Same Class.  A New Class the above number drops from 90% of their previous qualification to 80% for credits.

 

If you train with 200 Gold per crew, they train to the new tank with full levels as if they were always there at the new tank.  That's Tank Academy Level training.

 

This keeps going on through the tech tree as you bring your crews up from lower tier tanks to upper tier tanks.  Okay, we all pretty much know that.

 

Now.  Premium tanks can be had with and without crew.  The ones that come with crew are Pre-Trained to the Premium.  They are usually something like a 0 Skill BIA crew.  These are probably the only crew I would immediately train to a Tech Tree Tank with 200 Gold per Crew.  

 

Reason:  Premium Tanks allow ANY crew of the SAME CLASS of tank in the Nation Line to play/train in that tank with NO PENALTY for NOT BEING TRAINED.  In fact, they operate as if they are in their nice comfy proper tech tree tank, PLUS they get the Premium 1.5X along with any other things you might be running.


This is the true value of a Premium Tank.  It can Accept ANY SAME CLASS Crew at no penalty so you don't have to train them to the Premium to play in it.

 

Simply placing, in your example, the SU-85 Crew into the SU-100Y would be fine.  However, taking them from the Premium and then plopping them into the SU-100 Tech Tree Tank would still require you to train them on that tank or operate it at a penalty as described in the above links.

 

Tech Tree Tier IV  --> Tech Tree Tier V:  Train the crew to the new tank.

Tech Tree Tier IV --> Premium Tier VI: Place them in and play, no training required.

 

At no time will placing a crew in a Premium Tank automatically make them able to operate a Tech Tree Tank they are not trained for without a penalty.  It does not rub off.

 

 

Hope that helps.


GL, HF & HSYBF!

OvO


Edited by dunniteowl, Jul 14 2019 - 00:25.





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